Matt Hammill (-160) vs Tito Ortiz (+144)

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  • lasker
    SBR MVP
    • 01-27-10
    • 1683

    #1
    Matt Hammill (-160) vs Tito Ortiz (+144)


    With all due respect to Tito Ortiz, this line is a joke. I'm entirely serious when I say Matt Hammill should be around -400. No offense, Tito. Actually on second thought, offense.

    Whether you love or hate him (or better yet, haven't cared about him in ages), Tito Ortiz has not been relevant in years. The last time he beat an opponent not named Ken Shamrock was by razor-thin split decision to Forrest Griffin, back in April of 2006. In case you didn't get the memo, Ken Shamrock should have retired approximately one decade ago.

    I honestly don't know what Ortiz is still doing in the UFC. Why did Dana White bring him back? He is not UFC caliber anymore. He is not an intelligent man, to put it nicely, and has not evolved as a fighter (beyond improving his cardio) since his original UFC appearances. It's not age catching up with him. He's about as good as he's always been. It's just that he was never really that good, and the evolution of MMA passed him by years ago. In the early days of the UFC, it was enough to be a better-than-average wrestler and win via pure ground 'n pound. That is rarely enough anymore. Ortiz is a slightly better than average wrestler with good cardio (though he didn't show it in his last fight), good submission defense, and world-class excuses. That's it. That's all he has to offer.

    Matt Hammill may never be a top-5 fighter in the Light Heavyweight division, but he is a difficult fight for anyone. Unlike Tito Ortiz he is intelligent, humble, and his life story is an inspiration to many. But enough of that. The point is that Hammill is twice the wrestler Tito Ortiz could wish to be. And when Tito Ortiz cannot get his opponent to the mat, he loses. This is worth repeating: when Tito Ortiz faces a superior wrestler, he loses. He has no plan B, no secret weapon, no answer. Zip. Nada. He just loses.

    Look at what happened against Randy Couture. Tito Ortiz, who was inexplicably the favorite going into that fight, was outwrestled and dominated and literally spanked. Look what happened against Chuck Liddell both times. Chuck Liddell is a superior wrestler, he just uses his wrestling defensively. Look what happened against Lyoto Machida, whom he could not take down. Obviously, there's no shame in losing to guys like Couture, Liddell and Machida. And yes, it would be wrong to include Hammill up there with those names. But Matt Hammill is stylistically a nightmare matchup for Ortiz, and to me it indicates that the UFC is wisely using Tito's name recognition to build up other fighters at his expense. Hammill's inspirational story (they just filmed a movie about his life) as well as his popularity from the Ultimate Fighter make him an ideal opponent to profit from this.

    Hammill is one of the best wrestlers in his division. He is a three-time Division III National Champion. At the Deaflympics, he is a silver-medalist in Greco-Roman wrestling and a gold-medalist in freestyle wrestling. On the Ultimate Fighter he showed how he can stuff takedowns with no hands. Mark Munoz was unable to take him down in their (admittedly short) fight, and I have already written a blog detailing Munoz' elite wrestling pedigree. Munoz was supposed to have a decided wrestling advantage in that fight, but it didn't show. Tito Ortiz will not be able to take Matt Hammill down. And if by some fluke he manages to do so, he will not be able to keep him there for very long. Hammill's strength is often noted and he is the much stronger fighter here. Ortiz hasn't changed his training methods in years, he hasn't shown us anything new in years, and it will be the same-old same-old this time.

    Matt Hammill has two clear roads to victory. If he is able to take Tito Ortiz down without exerting too much energy in his attempts, the fight will be decided from those takedowns alone (a la Couture-Ortiz). However, I don't think he will look to take this fight to the ground. Hammill has been a little too content with his standup over the years, but in this case he has every right and reason to believe that his standup is superior. This not because of his technique as much as his serious power in both his hands and feet, something Ortiz lacks. Hammill also has an excellent chin. He is going to stuff Ortiz' takedown attempts and hurt him on the feet. He'll also hurt him with uppercuts from the clinch, as his dirty boxing is very good. If he's smart, he'll throw in one or two takedowns after he has Ortiz hurt. Ortiz will have no answers. He might be able to survive, but that will be his main accomplishment.

    I think there's a good chance the fight goes to decision, since Ortiz is difficult to finish, but if it does rest assured that Hammill will have his hands raised at the end. Hammill by TKO is a very real possibility as well. Hammill is superior in every area of the game. Perhaps their jiu-jitsu is a wash, but it shouldn't play a factor anyway. Hamill has the distinct advantage in wrestling and on the feet. He is 8-2 in the UFC -- even if you don't count his "win" over Jon Jones, he was infamously robbed of a decision against Bisping. Ortiz is winless in his last four fights.

    I think I can tell you exactly how this fight is going to go. Hammill will utterly dominate Ortiz en route to a unanimous decision victory. Then he will give an excited post-fight interview in which it will be a bit hard to understand what he's saying. Then Ortiz will grace us with a brand new litany of excuses, a promise that he'll be back better than ever, and some snyde comment about how proud he is that his "friend" and "student" (from the Ultimate Fighter) is doing so well and how happy he is to have "helped" him get this far. And then, if God is merciful, Tito Ortiz will be cut from the UFC. For good.
    Last edited by lasker; 07-28-10, 01:16 PM.
  • Vaughany
    SBR Aristocracy
    • 03-07-10
    • 45563

    #2
    Completely agree! Would be massively shocked if Tito pulled off the win!
    Comment
    • JuicedUp
      SBR MVP
      • 01-20-10
      • 3396

      #3
      I have no confidence in Tito. Hammill is going to handle him.
      Comment
      • Chairib
        SBR Wise Guy
        • 03-08-10
        • 917

        #4
        I'm leaning towards Hammil right now but Tito's going to be a tougher opponent for him than Jardine. Tougher by how much is going to be up to debate, as Matt had a broken hand coming into his previous fight and Tito hasn't been healthy since UFC 40?
        Comment
        • lasker
          SBR MVP
          • 01-27-10
          • 1683

          #5
          We'll see, but I don't think Tito will be a tougher opponent for him than Jardine.
          Comment
          • Vaughany
            SBR Aristocracy
            • 03-07-10
            • 45563

            #6
            Originally posted by lasker
            We'll see, but I don't think Tito will be a tougher opponent for him than Jardine.
            Yee Hamill isnt going to have to worry about leg kicks which he has been susceptible to in past as evident in the Franklin fight and Jardine fight to some extent.
            Comment
            • Chairib
              SBR Wise Guy
              • 03-08-10
              • 917

              #7
              Originally posted by Vaughany
              Yee Hamill isnt going to have to worry about leg kicks which he has been susceptible to in past as evident in the Franklin fight and Jardine fight to some extent.
              smh
              Comment
              • Vaughany
                SBR Aristocracy
                • 03-07-10
                • 45563

                #8
                Originally posted by Chairib
                smh
                Does Ortiz have great muay thai? Does he use leg kicks effectively?
                Comment
                • Chairib
                  SBR Wise Guy
                  • 03-08-10
                  • 917

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Vaughany

                  Does Ortiz have great muay thai? Does he use leg kicks effectively?
                  sigh
                  Comment
                  • Vaughany
                    SBR Aristocracy
                    • 03-07-10
                    • 45563

                    #10
                    Originally posted by Chairib
                    sigh
                    Ah yes that proves me wrong! Jardine landed 16 out of 20 leg kicks against Hamill...the only aspect of the fight that Jardine clearly beat Hamill at. Against Forest Griffin, Ortiz land ZERO out of 1 leg strike attempts as opposed to Grffin's 12 out of 15. Against Machida he connected with 2 out of 4 leg strikes.
                    Comment
                    • vassman86
                      SBR MVP
                      • 03-11-08
                      • 1042

                      #11
                      lasker, I completely agree with you, that's a ridiculously good price for Hammill in this fight.
                      Comment
                      • shady610
                        SBR MVP
                        • 01-12-06
                        • 1570

                        #12
                        dont bet on tito until he gives you a reason to
                        Comment
                        • sundin4prez
                          SBR MVP
                          • 03-09-10
                          • 1970

                          #13
                          im going to be taking tito..... he looked decent in the griffen fight except for the 3rd where he totally shut down...
                          Comment
                          • Vrakas
                            SBR Wise Guy
                            • 02-27-10
                            • 627

                            #14
                            tito can only beat one man ,the worlds most dangerous man.dana come on you are paying tito $500.000 per fight but you could probably get ken for a $100 bucks.
                            Comment
                            • Kaladarus
                              SBR MVP
                              • 11-11-09
                              • 1876

                              #15
                              There's no chance Tito can fully recover from his surgery in such a short time frame. Many fighters getting the same surgery have taken 2-4x the time off to recover. No matter what Tito says he wont be at 100% if the fight happens on the proposed date. At 100% Tito has a decent shot, but at anything else this is an easy win for Hammil.
                              Comment
                              • squallsquall
                                SBR Sharp
                                • 05-24-09
                                • 273

                                #16
                                I've been pretty amazed by this line as well... Tito is as much of a has-been as anyone in the sport.
                                Comment
                                • GoldRush7
                                  SBR MVP
                                  • 04-27-09
                                  • 2014

                                  #17
                                  this one is going to be a snoozer
                                  Comment
                                  • lasker
                                    SBR MVP
                                    • 01-27-10
                                    • 1683

                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by GoldRush7
                                    this one is going to be a snoozer
                                    To each his own. I personally never tire of seeing Tito Ortiz get beaten up.
                                    Comment
                                    • snake11eyes
                                      SBR Wise Guy
                                      • 07-28-10
                                      • 618

                                      #19
                                      I have to agree with most here that Hamill is a way better fighter. I think he's better in every aspect of the game. So for the Hamill line to only be -150 it almost feels like a "trap bet." Usually on what I determine is a trap fight I won't play or put a small play on the opposite fighter.
                                      Comment
                                      • vassman86
                                        SBR MVP
                                        • 03-11-08
                                        • 1042

                                        #20
                                        Hammil will out wrestle Tito the entire fight; similar to how Rashad controlled Rampage for the entire fight.
                                        Comment
                                        • Pabinator
                                          SBR MVP
                                          • 10-04-09
                                          • 1238

                                          #21
                                          Tito has been done for a while, Hammil all the way here
                                          Shut your mouth when you talk to Me!
                                          Comment
                                          • Dad
                                            SBR Posting Legend
                                            • 11-26-08
                                            • 23245

                                            #22
                                            Hammil gonna retire Tito.
                                            Comment
                                            • stefan084
                                              SBR MVP
                                              • 07-21-09
                                              • 1490

                                              #23
                                              i don't get this line either--seems fishy
                                              Comment
                                              • vassman86
                                                SBR MVP
                                                • 03-11-08
                                                • 1042

                                                #24
                                                This line is like Bluefin Tuna: tasty! Hammil all the way via deaf man rage! lol jks.
                                                Comment
                                                • squallsquall
                                                  SBR Sharp
                                                  • 05-24-09
                                                  • 273

                                                  #25
                                                  What exactly is fishy? You think the fight is rigged? Lol.
                                                  Comment
                                                  • GoldRush7
                                                    SBR MVP
                                                    • 04-27-09
                                                    • 2014

                                                    #26
                                                    Originally posted by lasker
                                                    To each his own. I personally never tire of seeing Tito Ortiz get beaten up.
                                                    Well to play off of that, the last time he really got his ass kicked was by chuck a few years ago. His last few fights have been snoozers. Split decision vs forrest. Couldn't figure out machida. I guess you could say the last minute of that fight was exciting but the rest was a snoozefest.
                                                    Comment
                                                    • bacon22
                                                      SBR Sharp
                                                      • 07-09-10
                                                      • 292

                                                      #27
                                                      I say hamil wins in 2 rounds by knock out.
                                                      Comment
                                                      • ufcmma36
                                                        SBR MVP
                                                        • 02-22-10
                                                        • 1065

                                                        #28
                                                        Tito will shock u... he is back and will win...I hope.lol
                                                        Comment
                                                        • PorkyPig
                                                          SBR Sharp
                                                          • 08-05-09
                                                          • 257

                                                          #29
                                                          Hammil via DEC
                                                          Comment
                                                          • cooldavid3169
                                                            SBR Hustler
                                                            • 06-19-10
                                                            • 92

                                                            #30
                                                            Dont forget Hammiill had staph who knows what kind of affect that had on him. Tito's life is falling apart neither one will impress us. Hammill should have knocked out Glass Joe. Tito should have retired after the 3rd Shammy fight and gone to TNA wrestling. But I actually like Tito by triangle/armbar.
                                                            Comment
                                                            • KCJMAC
                                                              SBR High Roller
                                                              • 08-03-10
                                                              • 133

                                                              #31
                                                              I don't know if anyone caught HDNet's MMA Live last week, but Tito was interviewed and he had a lot to say about Hamill (transcript from Bloody Elbow http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2010/8/7/...to-ortiz-calls):

                                                              "He's been babied his whole life coming from being deaf of course and he's going to be babied after when I knock him out."

                                                              "He's slow; he's like a big slow ox. I'm going to pick him apart and I know his corner can't really tell him what to do and show him the mistakes he does."

                                                              "I've noticed he's deaf, so he has a soft head, you hit him with more and more shots. You people don't know this. Watch how Franklin knocked him out quick."

                                                              "You hit them with soft shots because their equilibrium, they don't have no equilibrium. And you hit them with shots and you hit them with small shots, I'm not looking' for big shots. I'm looking' for small shots. Little small shots and by the second, middle of the third round you're going to see someone going to sleep and I'll snuggle him."
                                                              I think this kind of talk is a big tactical mistake for Tito. Hamill seems like a loyal, emotional guy, and I could see him having some trouble fighting a former coach/mentor. (There is some precedent for this, see UFC 88: Franklin vs Hamill.) But I think Tito's inflammatory words have eliminated any chance of that.

                                                              8 units on Hamill at -160 on Bodog.
                                                              Comment
                                                              • Tree Rollins
                                                                SBR MVP
                                                                • 12-16-09
                                                                • 3968

                                                                #32
                                                                Hopefully Tito's cracked skull has healed.
                                                                Comment
                                                                • lasker
                                                                  SBR MVP
                                                                  • 01-27-10
                                                                  • 1683

                                                                  #33
                                                                  Originally posted by Tree Rollins
                                                                  Hopefully Tito's cracked skull has healed.
                                                                  Nobody knows yet, including Tito. If he wins against Hammill, it's healed, but if he loses it's obviously still cracked.
                                                                  Comment
                                                                  • clarkd32
                                                                    SBR Wise Guy
                                                                    • 09-15-06
                                                                    • 863

                                                                    #34
                                                                    tito will lose and then claim he is injured again... yawn.
                                                                    Comment
                                                                    • Tree Rollins
                                                                      SBR MVP
                                                                      • 12-16-09
                                                                      • 3968

                                                                      #35
                                                                      Originally posted by lasker
                                                                      Nobody knows yet, including Tito. If he wins against Hammill, it's healed, but if he loses it's obviously still cracked.
                                                                      Exactly.
                                                                      Comment
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