[shari91]

I don't think he can keep up this level. He's clearly the best in the world but I don't think he'll win the next three. and I'd feel the same way even if you told me Federer and Nadal wouldn't win them. There are enough threats.

I think barring injury he can. I've never seen shots like his before. And his head is screwed on straight. Guy backs himself no matter.

I won't be fading him again. Lost too much money last year thinking he'd eventually crash but the guy never did. Until he does it's bet or pass.

[Cheme82]

Since he did not make it to the finals in one slam than it lowers his last year that significantly?Nadal was not even close to Novaks season last year. Novak made it this year and already won the Australian Open. Hell he probably will win Wimbledon and the US Open too.It's not easy to win all 4 in the same year but I will take Novak to do it over Nadal.

Doesn't matter that he won the AO, once you lose one (like today) it is all over and you have to start again. So as of right now, Rafa is closer to doing it. And until the joker wins the FO (which won't happen with a healthy Nadal around), he will never do it. So wait and pray that Rafa gets hurt and his career is over before the joker because that's the only way it could happen. Then again, by then Novak won't be as young and I hope someone else comes along to negate him the win on clay.

[Cheme82]

I will take winning the 3 other slams than just owning clay any day. Also Novak is just starting to get really good and already made the french open final this year after only dominating last year. I'm sure he has plenty of time to get better. Does not make final than makes final, what's to say he wont win it next year.

Me too. But Rafa has done both of those, the joker only one.

[Demonata]

1) You fuked up again, even if you ignore the clay wins, Nadal is 2-3 on slams against Novak. And all 3 wins for Novak came in the middle of his awesome year. Like I said, that year is over. Nadal is playing better tennis right now.
2) I never said he wasn't good, I said he looks fruity out there in the court. Just look at some of his pictures during matches, half the time he is stretching as if getting ready to receive a huge kok, the other half it looks like he's "a la seconde".
3) You were trying to prove my statement wrong, in order to do that you need to first understand what I wrote, you didn't.
4) Obviously you do. You said "To prove you wrong, which I did". Except, you didn't.
5) I missed this one.
6) Novak's dream year is over, he "found" his game and dominated last year, that is over now. He is still world class, but not as dominant as he was last year.
7) See #1
8) I never said he deserved to win it, I said he should have won it. Rafa felt pressure because he was playing a guy that had beat him so many times in grand slam finals recently and they forced them to play in conditions that benefited the other guy. He went from complete control of the match to complete unraveling.
9) For the joker to be the best ever he needs to have about 4 more years of the kind of domination he had last year. Not gonna happen.
10) If we take away Rafa's wins in clays, and Novak's wins in hard courts (which by the way is half the amount of wins we are taking away from Rafa). Rafa is still up 2-1 ... Enough said.

If we get the same final matchup would you lake to make a wager on the Wimbledon final?

You obviously have a personal vendetta against Djokovic.

I definitely would make a wager if it's the same matchup at Wimbledon but I don't even see Nadal making it to the final. I see Djokovic but Nadal is going to get upset in the earlier rounds. That's what my gut it telling me.

[Cheme82]

[QUOTE=yisman;15035270]I disagree. Over the course of the tournament, you can see how Novak was the best player by how easily he handled Federer and Murray, two elite hard court players. Rafa didn't beat any top players. Speaking of retirements, Rafa didn't complete all his matches either. His first round opponent retired in the second.



You obviously have some personal animus here.

By the way, Murray has beaten Djokovic five times, thrice in finals.[/QUOTE]

Rafa had no chance at playing against top players because he got hurt, that's my point. His first round opponent retired after being down 6-0, 5-0. Novak's opponent retired after a 6-2 first set. So Rafa won almost twice as many games and didn't lose any, and the joker lost 2 in about half as long as Rafa played.

Shame on the joker that he's let Butt-head beat him in what's supposed to be his strong court. Rafa of course is unbeaten on clay against that loser. Which proves my point, Rafa is untouchable on clay.

[Demonata]

Anybody winning 2 majors is an amazing year. But Novak has no shot at beating Nadal at the French Open in good conditions. His one shot (just because of momentum) would have been last year's tournament and he couldn't even make it to the finals.

So Djokovic plays his first amazing year and you expected him to dominate in every major even clay? How many majors did Nadal even win last year? Enough said.How can you say when top 3 players play eachother ina final that they have no shot?

[Cheme82]

Thanks for your valuable information. I just do not understand one thing, why do you pronounce them as grass and hard court but say French instead of clay ???
Because you are French? or what?
Both Madrid and Rome were made of clay last year, when Joker was toying with Rafa, but i assume they are not counted for clay because of their location outside of France???

Because I was talking about majors and there are 2 of them played on hard court, so instead of saying Australian, Wimbledon, and U.S. Open, I just said grass and hard court.

[Demonata]

Doesn't matter that he won the AO, once you lose one (like today) it is all over and you have to start again. So as of right now, Rafa is closer to doing it. And until the joker wins the FO (which won't happen with a healthy Nadal around), he will never do it. So wait and pray that Rafa gets hurt and his career is over before the joker because that's the only way it could happen. Then again, by then Novak won't be as young and I hope someone else comes along to negate him the win on clay.

If somehow Nadal beats Djoker in another slam this year than he might be closer. Novak doesn't make the final last year but makes final this year. Who's to say he couldn't be even better on clay next eyar? HE just started dominating and seems to be getting better and better on clay.

You just hate Djokovic so what you say against him does not hold much meaning. I actually like most tennis players in the top 10. Espcially like the big 3. You have blind hate.

[Cheme82]

Noone had informed you about this until now???
Dropping a set has no meaning. If you know what i mean

He was trying to say that even if Rafa had not gotten hurt Novak would have won the final. I was pointing out that up until the point when Rafa got hurt, he was having a better tournament than Novak.

[Demonata]

Me too. But Rafa has done both of those, the joker only one.

Djokovic played way better than Nadal overall last year and if he wins Wimbledon and US Open or only 1 with none fore Nadal anotehr better year for Novak.

[Cheme82]

Nadal slightly better than Joker on clay but its getting very close to dead even

I read this post and was about to start typing a response but then I saw it was you.

[Demonata]

[QUOTE=Cheme82;15035562]

I disagree. Over the course of the tournament, you can see how Novak was the best player by how easily he handled Federer and Murray, two elite hard court players. Rafa didn't beat any top players. Speaking of retirements, Rafa didn't complete all his matches either. His first round opponent retired in the second.



You obviously have some personal animus here.

By the way, Murray has beaten Djokovic five times, thrice in finals.[/QUOTE]

Rafa had no chance at playing against top players because he got hurt, that's my point. His first round opponent retired after being down 6-0, 5-0. Novak's opponent retired after a 6-2 first set. So Rafa won almost twice as many games and didn't lose any, and the joker lost 2 in about half as long as Rafa played.

Shame on the joker that he's let Butt-head beat him in what's supposed to be his strong court. Rafa of course is unbeaten on clay against that loser. Which proves my point, Rafa is untouchable on clay.

So now Novak is a loser?

[Demonata]

He was trying to say that even if Rafa had not gotten hurt Novak would have won the final. I was pointing out that up until the point when Rafa got hurt, he was having a better tournament than Novak.

So Rafa was playing harder opponents than Novak? The opponents get harder the more rounds you progree so who's to say Nadal would of even made the final.

[Cheme82]

You obviously have a personal vendetta against Djokovic.

I definitely would make a wager if it's the same matchup at Wimbledon but I don't even see Nadal making it to the final. I see Djokovic but Nadal is going to get upset in the earlier rounds. That's what my gut it telling me.

Sorry you feel that way, I merely state the facts. If we get the same final again, we'll make it happen.

[Cheme82]

So Djokovic plays his first amazing year and you expected him to dominate in every major even clay? How many majors did Nadal even win last year? Enough said.How can you say when top 3 players play eachother ina final that they have no shot?

He won 1 major. And yes, neither Federer nor the joker can beat Nadal at the French Open. He can beat them in the other surfaces, he's proved it. When either one of them proves they can do the same to Nadal at the French let me know.

[Cheme82]

If somehow Nadal beats Djoker in another slam this year than he might be closer. Novak doesn't make the final last year but makes final this year. Who's to say he couldn't be even better on clay next eyar? HE just started dominating and seems to be getting better and better on clay.

You just hate Djokovic so what you say against him does not hold much meaning. I actually like most tennis players in the top 10. Espcially like the big 3. You have blind hate.

It's not blind hate bro, I said Nadal is closer to doing it. Nadal can do it as early as the AO next year, Novak's earliest possible time to do it is next year in June, that's 5 months after Rafa. So who is closer?

[Cheme82]

Djokovic played way better than Nadal overall last year and if he wins Wimbledon and US Open or only 1 with none fore Nadal anotehr better year for Novak.

True, 2>1

[Cheme82]

[QUOTE=Demonata;15035682]

So now Novak is a loser?

Nope, he's a great player. The loser is Murray. Rafa is not unbeaten in clay against Novak, he's lost to him twice, he's 12-2 against him on clay.

[Goat Milk]

if it wasn't for Nadal, Federer would have what like 24 majors.

[Cheme82]

So Rafa was playing harder opponents than Novak? The opponents get harder the more rounds you progree so who's to say Nadal would of even made the final.

Never said his opponents were harder, I said up until the time he got hurt his results had been better than Novak's.

[Cheme82]

if it wasn't for Nadal, Federer would have what like 24 majors.

Yup, and if it wasn't for Novak, Nadal would probably have as many as Federer.

[shari91]

As of this moment the best chance is Nadal to hold all 4 titles. Solely because Novak's never won the French and Fed won't win all 3 of the other Slams or beat Nadal now on clay. He's won all 4 and Novak hasn't so that's that. Until Djoko wins the French - even if he doesn't win any other title that same year - we shouldn't even debate it as we have no proof that he can win on clay in 5 sets. This was Nadal's 7th French Open title. Good luck beating him.

[shari91]

if it wasn't for Nadal, Federer would have what like 24 majors.

Yup, and if it wasn't for Novak, Nadal would probably have as many as Federer.

haha yep on both

But that's what's made this great! And then Djoko's stepped up. Could you imagine if it was just Fed and Serena for 10yrs running? It was bad enough when they had the domination they did. Them plus Tiger made both sports seriously boring for a long time. I love seeing these champions scrap it out.

[yisman]

Shame on the joker that he's let Butt-head beat him in what's supposed to be his strong court. Rafa of course is unbeaten on clay against that loser. Which proves my point, Rafa is untouchable on clay.

No, he's not untouchable on clay. He's the best, but he loses on clay as well.

Rafa had no chance at playing against top players because he got hurt, that's my point.

And my point is he didn't beat anybody, so saying what he would've done is pure speculation. He didn't get the chance to face the top players, so he might've lost, he might've won. All we have to go on is what happened, and what happened was Djokovic dominating two of the top four players in the world.

Nope, he's a great player. The loser is Murray. Rafa is not unbeaten in clay against Novak, he's lost to him twice, he's 12-2 against him on clay.

Exactly, he's not untouchable on clay.

[Demonata]

Man first he calls novak a loser and now he says he didnt. That he said murray was a loser.djokovic has not played nadal many matches at the french opwn so you cant say he dominates novak there

[Cheme82]

As of this moment the best chance is Nadal to hold all 4 titles. Solely because Novak's never won the French and Fed won't win all 3 of the other Slams or beat Nadal now on clay. He's won all 4 and Novak hasn't so that's that. Until Djoko wins the French - even if he doesn't win any other title that same year - we shouldn't even debate it as we have no proof that he can win on clay in 5 sets. This was Nadal's 7th French Open title. Good luck beating him.

Shari's support proves I'm right. She is a woman after all, and we all know they are smarter than us dudes.

[Demonata]

You have said some truly stupid things and she has given support to both sides. Its debatable if women are smarter than men. guys smarter at certain things and vice versa.

[shari91]

You have said some truly stupid things and she has given support to both sides. Its debatable if women are smarter than men. guys smarter at certain things and vice versa.

I've given support to both sides because my stance stands: Novak is the superior player but until he beats Nadal on clay over 5 sets there should be no debate. And I highly doubt if Novak can win 7 Slam titles at one tournament like Nadal has. Think about that. He's won 7 frickin times. That's insane. Like beyond our comprehension.

I hope Djoko takes the time off to adjust to his game to clay. Just like Nadal did just to adjust his game to Djoko period. No grandfather dying, no crappy weather. Just adjust his game.

Because I promise you: An adjusted Nole vs a normal French Open Nadal will equal one of the best finals we'll ever see. But right now Nadal is superior at this particular tournament

[Demonata]

I've given support to both sides because my stance stands: Novak is the superior player but until he beats Nadal on clay over 5 sets there should be no debate. And I highly doubt if Novak can win 7 Slam titles at one tournament like Nadal has. Think about that. He's won 7 frickin times. That's insane. Like beyond our comprehension.

I hope Djoko takes the time off to adjust to his game to clay. Just like Nadal did just to adjust his game to Djoko period. No grandfather dying, no crappy weather. Just adjust his game.

Because I promise you: An adjusted Nole vs a normal French Open Nadal will equal one of the best finals we'll ever see. But right now Nadal is superior at this particular tournament

I would take overall grand slam wins over just winning one over and over again any day. More impressive to win different ones than only dominate one. I think what Djokovic did last year was pretty insane too.

Djoker will always have trouble beating Nadal on clay just because that's Nadals best. I would take Djokovic in any other tournament any day though.

Djokovic has gotten better last two years on clay. Made final this year even. I wouldn't be surprised if he won the next French Open.

[quarterback]

what a match. the rain delay helped nadal alot.

[manutd19]

Funny how some people here are downgrading nadal as if he's a murray. On grass and hard court, he has been playing some fantastic tennis just that presently djoko is mentally stronger than him. Nadal loses his cool, composure easily, to me that's the difference. He knows he can beats djoko on those surface and get frustrated when things are not going his way. I don't believe djoko is better than him tennis-wise and am not saying he's better. Those two are the finalist in wimbledon for me, and unlike most of you, am not giving it to djoko easily. He's playing the same nadal that fought federer in this same wimbledon 2008 i think. His problem with djoko is that he can't accept this guy his on his level or playing better at the moment, so when he is losing points to him, he get frustrated. He knew federer was better then so he always maintained his cool and thought of ways of fighting back but not against djoko. If he can settle this mental problem, i can see him back to that no 1 spot.

[Demonata]

Funny how some people here are downgrading nadal as if he's a murray. On grass and hard court, he has been playing some fantastic tennis just that presently djoko is mentally stronger than him. Nadal loses his cool, composure easily, to me that's the difference. He knows he can beats djoko on those surface and get frustrated when things are not going his way. I don't believe djoko is better than him tennis-wise and am not saying he's better. Those two are the finalist in wimbledon for me, and unlike most of you, am not giving it to djoko easily. He's playing the same nadal that fought federer in this same wimbledon 2008 i think. His problem with djoko is that he can't accept this guy his on his level or playing better at the moment, so when he is losing points to him, he get frustrated. He knew federer was better then so he always maintained his cool and thought of ways of fighting back but not against djoko. If he can settle this mental problem, i can see him back to that no 1 spot.

Who's ever better wins. You cant say all the winners Novak gets is because Nadal is not mentally there. Novak gets a lot of winners on hard courts because he is better presently than Nadal. Wimbledon will show a lot.