1. #1
    Plaza23
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    Strange story. He took these casinos for $8+ mils in Baccarat and the casino refused to play. Claims he and his partner were "edge sorting" despite the casino agreeing to use the deck that Ivey requested.

    Working with another gambler, a Chinese woman named Cheng Yin Sun, Ivey arrived at various casinos to which he had wired money ahead of time. The pair had a list of demands about the game that the casinos were all too happy to accommodate. Perhaps because the game relies on chance, baccarat players are notorious for believing in luck and rituals. Further, as Sun told the New York Times Magazine in an article last summer, Asian players are also viewed in the industry as superstitious.

    So when the pair specified certain conditions, the casinos always obliged. In this case, as recounted in court documents, the conditions they asked for were “(1) a private area or ‘pit’ in which to play; (2) a casino dealer who spoke Mandarin Chinese; (3) a guest [Sun] to sit with him at the table while he played; (4) one 8-deck shoe of purple Gemaco Borgata playing cards to be used for the entirety of each session of play; and (5) an automatic card shuffling device to be used to shuffle the cards after each shoe was dealt, which retained the orientation of each card that Sun requested to be turned.” Again, these conditions might have tipped off a counterparty knowledgeable about gambling (like a casino!) that something was up. But again, Borgata agreed to everything.

    They did not agree out of the goodness of their hearts. Casinos love to indulge high-rollers because they know that the longer a player spends at the table, the more money he will lose. So they allowed the requests, and thereby exposed themselves to Ivey and Sun’s advantage: the cards in question had a minute flaw. It was just a 1/32 of an inch deviation in the pattern on the back, but Sun had trained herself to spot the tiny variation. By getting the dealer to rotate certain cards before adding them back into the deck, she and Ivey could more accurately figure out which way to bet the next time around.


    The practice, known as “edge sorting,” did not violate any of the rules of baccarat, nor did it conflict with the terms agreed upon by the casino and the gamblers. Nevertheless, Borgata cried foul and sued, claiming Ivey and Sun “knowingly engaged in a scheme to create a set of marked cards and then used those marked cards to place bets based on the markings.”


    http://thefederalist.com/2017/01/13/...inos-big-fail/
    Last edited by Plaza23; 01-13-17 at 01:48 PM.

  2. #2
    rizespor
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    He should be sued. What he did was tantamount to cheating.

  3. #3
    jjgold
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    He cheated

    Guy a scamming scum

    Owes everyone in Vegas big money

  4. #4
    RangeFinder
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    Ivy is a shark. No secret around the Vegas circles. He'll use any edge he can possibly find, cheating or not.

    That is old news though, happened a few years back.

  5. #5
    RetiredinPunta
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    what is edge sorting. DIdn't read the article.

    and if its cheating then why did the casino used the deck that he requested. if he had lost, they would have taken the loss with no problem, doyou think they would have given back the money?

  6. #6
    Plaza23
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    Quote Originally Posted by RetiredinPunta View Post
    what is edge sorting. DIdn't read the article.

    and if its cheating then why did the casino used the deck that he requested. if he had lost, they would have taken the loss with no problem, doyou think they would have given back the money?
    I had never heard of edge sorting before either, but it's apparently when some decks of cards have very slight differences on the back of the cards, and a player with a trained eye can spot them and know what the card really is. I'd think if you could really do this it would come in handy in poker where knowing someone else's cards is the entire key to the game. Since Ivey and his partner asked for a specific deck to play with, maybe this deck is one of those decks that can be "edge sorted"?

  7. #7
    rizespor
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    Edge sorting is just a fancy way of saying marked cards. What Ivey noticed (and what the casino did not notice) is that certain decks had an asymmetrical design on the backs of the cards that made it possible to differentiate whether a card was high or low. They way they did that was requesting the dealer to rotate all high cards so they were in unison and doing the same for low cards but in opposite direction. After a few times through the deck, they would then be able to tell whether a card was high or low before it was dealt and thus bet accordingly

  8. #8
    krk1030
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    So if they never paid him his money, what exactly is the lawsuit seeking?

  9. #9
    RudyRuetigger
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    never heard of him, whats his username here?

  10. #10
    rizespor
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    Quote Originally Posted by krk1030 View Post
    So if they never paid him his money, what exactly is the lawsuit seeking?
    Probably all the money he won (stole) off them and already paid out before they noticed his cheating.

  11. #11
    RangeFinder
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    Quote Originally Posted by rizespor View Post
    Probably all the money he won (stole) off them and already paid out before they noticed his cheating.
    They never paid him. He is suing the establishment.

  12. #12
    DISTROYA
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    if the casino is stupid enough to accommodate that absurd request to play with a specific deck/brand, they deserve to get taken.

  13. #13
    YoungGambler
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    Quote Originally Posted by RetiredinPunta View Post
    what is edge sorting. DIdn't read the article.

    and if its cheating then why did the casino used the deck that he requested. if he had lost, they would have taken the loss with no problem, doyou think they would have given back the money?

    Exactly. The reason casino followed all the requests was cause they probably knew in upper management they can call cheating if they lose and if ivey loses they get that $$$. Call it a subtle free roll for the asshole casinos.

  14. #14
    jtoler
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    Isnt this story at least 3 years old or was it another story involving Ivey and keno.

  15. #15
    jjgold
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    Ivy a known thief

    When your a compulsive gambler you pull stunts like this

    I hope he ends up in street broke..5 years away I hear
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  16. #16
    Ralphie Halves
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    Quote Originally Posted by jtoler View Post
    Isnt this story at least 3 years old or was it another story involving Ivey and keno.
    First thing I thought too, since he's been doing this for over a decade.

    Yet major casinos, casinos who recognize Phil Ivey, are still falling for it.

  17. #17
    rizespor
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    Quote Originally Posted by DISTROYA View Post
    if the casino is stupid enough to accommodate that absurd request to play with a specific deck/brand, they deserve to get taken.
    Not an uncommon request, especially among high stakes baccarat players. Casinos will bend to their every whim and superstition since they (the players) are essentially donating money to them (the casino) in the long run

    Ivey cheated plain and simple. Was it smart? Yes, but cheating nonetheless

  18. #18
    big joe 1212
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    OLD news

  19. #19
    OTL
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    Ivy should put his smarts and creativity towards something that would benefit society, rather than coming up with new ways to scam casinos.

  20. #20
    l7ustin
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    A true man of genius.

    Haters gonna hate

    Racist penetrates

  21. #21
    Cuse0323
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    So, what happened in the end?

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