[StackinGreen]

Wondering if they are worthwhile and if someone is using them for the Derby this year.

Thanks

[BGboothA]

Wondering if they are worthwhile and if someone is using them for the Derby this year.

Thanks

I have never used them, and obviously I am biased.

But with a website that looks like that and the only samples I can get are from 2006.

how good could they be?

[StackinGreen]

They are good as performance figures, I've heard, but you still have to be a 'capper to win.

It seems they help you eliminate horses or undeserving favorites better than pointing towards a winner. That can be very valuable.

[mikemca]

If you are going to try sheets you should use thorograph not ragozin. Ragozin operates under a huge fallacy that the track never changes during a day. This is a very big mistake especially on wet days or drying out track days and pretty much every day. I would rate thorograph #2 among pp providers but the problem with sheets in general is that they are loaded with ground loss which isn't always a negative on some tracks and also is much more relevant around 2 turns. Which is why imo they are great for turf routes and very good for dirt routes. When it comes to sprint races there are better pps for free. My list would be

1-TimeformUS
2-Thorograph
3-DRF





Everyone else

[StackinGreen]

Interesting. Do they admit they don't do intra-day track normalizations or variants? Just wondering.

Is Timeform free?

[mikemca]

I think Timeform is free if you use TVG to bet but I don't. Still the $69 they charge for unlimited monthly pps is the best value there is. I have been using the guy that does their figures since he made his own home made figures and sold them for $200 a year. He got such a great reputation that Timeform hired him to be their Chief figuremaker when they opened their US division a couple years ago. He is the best there is imo because he is so OCD about it. He dissects every race over and over and then he even goes back and checks how every runner ran in their next couple races to see if he got the race right and if not will flag it for review. It's like anything else , usually the best people at a given job are the people that truly love what they do. Touting over ...I don't vouch for many people but he is one.


Yeah Rags theory has been for decades that the track doesn't change. Besides the thing that made Rags great 3/4 decades ago was Ragozin himself. Like I said someone who truly loves what they do and are obsessed with it. But he has nothing to do with them anymore. That is one thing that separates Thorograph from them. Jerry Brown makes the figs for Tgraph after starting with Rags 20 some years ago. I think one of the biggest reasons he left and went on his own was his disagreement with their stance on this. He has done extensive studies to prove that the track does change very frequently with even a subtle difference.

[cutchemist42]

Yeah Craig at timeformus is great, he also posts at another forum (Im pretty sure its him behind the username) and gives great insights. I stick with Bris, but always check out the timeform free races every day.

Also, might sound dumb, but the one thing I dislike about timeform is the colour palette for reading.

[mikemca]

Yeah Craig at timeformus is great, he also posts at another forum (Im pretty sure its him behind the username) and gives great insights. I stick with Bris, but always check out the timeform free races every day.

Also, might sound dumb, but the one thing I dislike about timeform is the colour palette for reading.

Yeah he is CJ and agree with not liking the (interface?) very much of TFUS but it's the figs that count so I deal with it.

[StackinGreen]

Anyone gonna gave DRF PPs for Friday and/or Saturday?

I posted last BC on friday and saturday, just wondering if we can keep the good vibes going

[BGboothA]

Anyone gonna gave DRF PPs for Friday and/or Saturday?

I posted last BC on friday and saturday, just wondering if we can keep the good vibes going

I will have the Brisnet PPs w/ Comments as that is what I usually use, but they are not out yet last I checked.

[Laz]

I use sheets daily.
One of the tools I implement into my handicapping each day along with watching replays and using formulator.

[Laz]

Anyone gonna gave DRF PPs for Friday and/or Saturday?

I posted last BC on friday and saturday, just wondering if we can keep the good vibes going

I will post both days when they come out.

[StackinGreen]

I will post both days when they come out.

Thanks. I intend to get some of our peeps in a rotating schedule if we can. I'm more than happy to get a few races days here and there, like last Breeder's Cup Friday and Saturday. Let's all enjoy.

Cheers, now on to some winners!

[Laz]

OAKS DAY

http://www1.drf.com/drfDownloadPastPerformance.do?TRK=CD&CY=USA&DATE=01&RACE=99

[StackinGreen]

Laz, you have to use the upload tool/attach file (.pdf) here for us to get it. Thanks.

[StackinGreen]

Also, if you guys think it a good idea, I'll start a new thread where we can go on big race days/weekends to hook each other up with various PPs. I can call it Big Race cards or something of the sort. Sound good?

[Laz]

Laz, you have to use the upload tool/attach file (.pdf) here for us to get it. Thanks.

Sorry Stackin, can you give me a little further instruction on how to do that (comp illiterate I guess)

[StackinGreen]

Sure Laz.

In the lower left hand corner you have to click "Reply to Thread" (Green button) to make a full, proper reply with all the options (as opposed to the quick reply which is just an abbreviated version). The new page that comes up has all of the options and icons for each, including a paper clip, to the right of the smily face icon. If you hover over it, it'll say "attachments". Click on it. It'll bring up a browse function for you to select whatever folder you have placed the .pdf in. Upload it and we'll see it on your next post, with whatever message you put in the body. I hope that makes it simple(r).

[Laz]

You learn something new everyday....I've always clicked quick reply all these years.

Thanks Stackin and let's all get some winners this weekend!

[StackinGreen]

Thanks Laz. Are you going to post 5/2 as well?

What do you think about the new thread that says Big Race days that we can all look to (and contribute to)? Shall I make it?

[JayTris07]

Laz, thank you for the PPs.

StackinGreen, great idea I'm in.

[StackinGreen]

Ok, I'll create the thread tomorrow. As for Friday's races at CD, what do you think of race 9? I'm trying to differentiate the 2-3-8-11-12. 2,11, and 12 ran 2-1-3 in the last race, the Shakertown. Any thoughts on these or Heitai vs Good Deed (2/2 at CD)? I saw undrafted run at the BC at SA last year, Wes Welker's horse.

[Heppy10]

I like the 12 and 9 as long shot

[JayTris07]

I'm on the 10 Power Alert. I don't know what happened last race except maybe he didn't like the grass which was labeled GOOD. If he gets FIRM turf then there if enough speed in the race for him to close into.

[JayTris07]

Ex, Tri's 10 with 7-8-11

[Laz]

Yes boys I will post Derby day when they come out as well....enjoy and good luck

[Laz]

Thanks Laz. Are you going to post 5/2 as well?

What do you think about the new thread that says Big Race days that we can all look to (and contribute to)? Shall I make it?

Great idea

[mcaulay777]

I use to do the Equiform figures from Cary Fotias.Used the pace numbers for a few years they were very good.Cary past away a few years back and I do not know if they are still out there.Met Cary at the 09 breeders cup and then kept in touched after that until he passed very nice man rip.

[StackinGreen]

I'm on the 10 Power Alert. I don't know what happened last race except maybe he didn't like the grass which was labeled GOOD. If he gets FIRM turf then there if enough speed in the race for him to close into.

I saw that and just recommended that you don't sleep on Undrafted, Welker's #12

[Laz]

I put up 2 threads with Oaks and Derby DRF PPs guys

[StackinGreen]

I put up 2 threads with Oaks and Derby DRF PPs guys

Cool, I'll make the new thread. From now on let's get contributions from all via rotation. Looking forward to those as well as picks into the future from everyone. Also, any training notes or insights from those you respect would be even better.

Best of luck to all

[mikemca]

Bad race for sheets

Thorograph and pretty sure Rags loved Upstart who finished 18th of 18.

Also tossed Dortmund and Pharoah