Jim Webb (Democrat) has it right on affirmative action...

[itchypickle]

Just saw a story on Senator Jim Webb (D) of Virginia calling for an end to affirmative action programs since they discriminate against working class whites.

Bravo Senator...Bravo! The debate mentioned the absurdity of giving favor to people from Asian and latin nations who have come here in the last 40 years....based solely on skin color over whites assuming that ALL whites are affluent and have more choices.

Thoughts everyone??

[BigdaddyQH]

He is absolutely correct. "Affirmative Action" was just another term for "Reverse Discrimination". It was a huge success in Los Angeles, putting that City in bankruptcy. Now the citizens of Los Angeles arepaying dearly for allof this "Affirmative Action".

[DwightShrute]

He is absolutely correct. "Affirmative Action" was just another term for "Reverse Discrimination". It was a huge success in Los Angeles, putting that City in bankruptcy. Now the citizens of Los Angeles arepaying dearly for allof this "Affirmative Action".

This

[GonzosDirtyTrail]

This is a very difficult issue. As a member of a multi-racial family, and a white man, I feel I understand both sides. There is no easy solution, as all of the empirical evidence we have proves that discrimination is still pervasive in our culture, yet we all want the meritocratic American ideals to be the law of the land. It is a fact that there are places in this country where affirmative action is essential to ensure that members of minority races receive fair consideration. It is also a fact that most of the country is racially heterogeneous, and people do get a fair shake for the most part.

But, as a manager in a good company, I know first hand how much easier it is to fire a young white man than it is to fire an older black woman.

Suffice it to say, I support state and local governments handling the issue of affirmative action, largely because of the vast cultural differences throughout different parts of the country. We will never find a perfect Federal solution.

Thinking of this reminds me of when my little sister (who's black) was told by one of her cheer teammates "You shouldn't be with your white mommy, you should be with your black mommy." My sister told her that she'd prefer to be with her white mommy even if she had a choice, and that if that was her attitude, she wasn't going to be invited to her birthday party. (The kiss of death on a cheer team) I love that my little brothers and sisters are able to take pride in their heritage and in the family that we've built, and that their presence teaches other folks to ignore the color of peoples' skin.

[curious]

...as all of the empirical evidence we have proves that discrimination is still pervasive in our culture,

This is an out and out lie. REVERSE discrimination is pervasive in our culture, but I travel extensively and I work in lots of different companies and I almost never see discrimination. People that are skilled are hard to find, no company can afford to pass on someone because of their ancestry.

The racism that I see that is most pervasive comes from the professional racists like Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, the NCAAP, and all those other "drop the race card every time a minority doesn't get there way".

I don't believe that "all" the empirical evidence proves that discrimination is still pervasive in our culture. I think that a bunch of rabble rousing loud mouths and their allies in the left wing nut job media keep up the Fantasy that this is so for their own self aggrandizement. If Jackson, Sharpton, the NAACP, et al didn't have the race card to play they would be completely superfluous and they don't have any other way to make money since the only thing they know how to do is be a professional racist.

[DrunkHorseplayer]

Why doesn't anyone complain about the lack of affirmative action programs in the fields of airline pilot and heart surgeon?

[BigdaddyQH]

Well said gentlemen. The minorities will keep the race card in play for as long as they can, knowing that it is the only way they can get jobs that they DO NOT deserve. They know that they can not compete on a level playing field for jobs, because they lack education, intelligence, and talent compared to whites on a general basis. So they want whites to face a much tougher test than minorities when competing for these jobs. This is "Reverse Discrimination" at it's best,and this is what the scum like Jackson and Shaprton preach. This is what they stand for. Facts are facts. If anyone in here tries to tell me that the average I.Q. and educational level of minorities in general is the same than that of whites in general, they are totally out of their minds. I run a small company, and I could care less what color or sex my employees are. All I care about is results. If they can not produce, their tails are fired. If they use drugs, their tails are fired. If they are arrested for felonies, theft, or a drug realted offense, and convicted, they are fired. It is that simple.

[DwightShrute]

this is how I see it..

yes there was discrimination in the past and it was wrong. Blacks not being able to attend the same schools, separate washrooms etc etc.

Hopefully as a society we have learned from that so that we never allow that kind of discrimination ever again. Me and my generation weren't involved back then but we shouldn't be discriminated based on what happened in the past because if we are, then it's still discrimination. It's political correctness gone bad with the pendulum swinging too far the other way.

I remember in the 80's and the NDP government took office in British Columbia. They fired the entire Ferry Board of 12 people and hired 6 men and 6 women. There had to be an equal number of minorities, Chinese, East Indian and so on. I am a simple guy, to me the right way is to hire the 12 best people for the job. I don't care if the 12 best qualified people for the job are all Japanese women for example. Just hire the best because if you don't, then the poor guy that was next in line to get that or any other job with be discrminated by losing out because of quotas.

Imagine if afirmative action played into your favorite sport? Suddenly the governement legislated we had to have at least one Irish woman on a NHL roster or a Orthodox Jewish Rabbi must take up an NFL roster?

[GonzosDirtyTrail]

This is an out and out lie. REVERSE discrimination is pervasive in our culture, but I travel extensively and I work in lots of different companies and I almost never see discrimination. People that are skilled are hard to find, no company can afford to pass on someone because of their ancestry.

The racism that I see that is most pervasive comes from the professional racists like Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, the NCAAP, and all those other "drop the race card every time a minority doesn't get there way".

I don't believe that "all" the empirical evidence proves that discrimination is still pervasive in our culture. I think that a bunch of rabble rousing loud mouths and their allies in the left wing nut job media keep up the Fantasy that this is so for their own self aggrandizement. If Jackson, Sharpton, the NAACP, et al didn't have the race card to play they would be completely superfluous and they don't have any other way to make money since the only thing they know how to do is be a professional racist.

Your response is filled with errors:

• Associating my argument with those of Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson does not invalidate it. There is no "guilt by association" with logic and facts. As annoying and douchy as those two are, there are times when even they are right. (Though I hate to admit it)
• Erroneously referring to an argument as a "lie" without any evidence other than your personal experience is also illogical. The empirical evidence for modern discrimination is vast, you just don't seem to understand that discrimination has evolved just as humanity as evolved. It does not exist so much in the forms we see in our history classes, but is now more subtle, politically correct, and institutionalized.
• Your belief that discrimination does not exist is, admittedly, based upon your own personal experience. It would be more appropriate for you to say "I haven't experienced discrimination in my life or community, therefore I think these laws are superfluous and harmful." This may very well be correct within your community, as there are millions where discrimination is nonexistent; however, there are still places where these laws are necessary, which is the basis for my opinion that this is an issue for state and local governments, not the federal government.

[Carseller4]

Webb is not even due for re-election till 2012. Guess he is starting his move to the center a few years early. Most Democrats wait until about 9 months out to do this.

[curious]

Your response is filled with errors:

• Associating my argument with those of Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson does not invalidate it. There is no "guilt by association" with logic and facts. As annoying and douchy as those two are, there are times when even they are right. (Though I hate to admit it)
• Erroneously referring to an argument as a "lie" without any evidence other than your personal experience is also illogical. The empirical evidence for modern discrimination is vast, you just don't seem to understand that discrimination has evolved just as humanity as evolved. It does not exist so much in the forms we see in our history classes, but is now more subtle, politically correct, and institutionalized.
• Your belief that discrimination does not exist is, admittedly, based upon your own personal experience. It would be more appropriate for you to say "I haven't experienced discrimination in my life or community, therefore I think these laws are superfluous and harmful." This may very well be correct within your community, as there are millions where discrimination is nonexistent; however, there are still places where these laws are necessary, which is the basis for my opinion that this is an issue for state and local governments, not the federal government.

You didn't make an argument, you made a statement of fact, you said:
"all of the empirical evidence we have proves that discrimination is still pervasive in our culture"

This is an out and out lie.

I notice that you don't apply the same standards that you set for me to yourself. You didn't quote any evidence you just said that "ALL the evidence...proves that discrimination is still pervasive in our culture" but you didn't supply any of this evidence.

[GonzosDirtyTrail]

You're right about me not posting examples, Curious. Here's a good source:

http://www.eeoc.gov/

Check the newsroom section.

[Andy117]

IF you run your company right, the best candidates should get jobs, shouldn't be based on race, sex, religion or anything else.

[itchypickle]

IF you run your company right, the best candidates should get jobs, shouldn't be based on race, sex, religion or anything else.

Yep!

[Data]

http://www.eeoc.gov/

Bingo.

A race card is an invaluable tool in lawyers' (read, parasites') arsenal. Here we have a whole government agency doing a fine job of professional extortionists. The high paying parasites help the low paying parasites, that is the main purpose of the whole scheme. Yes, there must be occasional real cases but bullshit overwhelms.

There are too many trial lawyers in this country. They are huge Democratic Party contributors because they need the laws to help them to go after businesses.

What do you think is in common in health care and protecting people against discrimination? There are money to be had by small and big parasites while everyone else is paying for this (it is clear that you and I pay for this, no?). A lazy bum got his ass fired? He is a discrimination victim. Here is one of the "health care" schemes which illustrates this principle.

A small parasite gets into a car accident, sometimes on purpose. The pro's (there are pro's) always have a number of people involved (sometimes both cars!). Then, they go to a big parasite who sues the insurance company. At the same time he sends all those people to a doctor who gives all nine yards of treatment to all those "traumatized" patients. The doctor gets pretty penny from the insurance company and does not forget the lawyer who sent those patients his way.

This system feeds too many parasites. They going to do all they can that it stays the same. Meanwhile, you and I are keep paying for this.

[subs]

i watched a documentary once in england on the BBC. a black man with a hidden camera tries to get a medium level job. 5 minutes later a white man tries to get the same job.

the black man did not even get an application form, the white man did. guess the %

20% ?

40% ?

60% ?

80% ?

it was a staggeringly racist 90% +

i just don't understand it when people say here is no racism.