OKAY,HERE IT IS ..the most controversial subject on the Planet !

[losturmarbles]

My specific question is what "bear arms" mean. You are implying it means guns as in pistols, rifles, assault weapons. I'm in favor of 2nd amendment. My question is why can't I chose to bear arms of my choice (hand grenades, bombs, missiles, mines) to defend myself or my property and I'm limited to only guns per your interpretation.

the interpretation is irrelevant. restrictions on weapons come from state statutes, (or suppose to).

if youre looking for an answer from the second amendment, maybe look at supreme court cases and how they interpret it.

[ABEHONEST]

Willie Bee is Johnny Carson and the Monkey is Ed McMahon and all I can say is "you are correct sir"

Pavy, Onner whether he is liked or not he is part of the SBR family and just thought everyone would like to see him there! He sounded so sure of going originally?

And you Mr. Abehonest or Dishonest, after you've looked under all the stones, could you please crawl under the biggest one for a few days and we'll call you when we need you. Thank you!

PS I don't like or own guns, but to me the bad guys will always find a way to get them and some people feel more secure (I can't blame them) with owning one! I feel there has to be a way that the process of letting people who are qualified to purchase one should be the correct length of time to substantiate their proper credentials! I know the store owner must want to sell that gun today and the owner wants it as fast as possible, but tough luck my friend! You just have to wait! I probably not informed enough to give a qualified opinion but this is how we feel with what we have today!

Hello fellow monkey !
You keep referring to "WE" ,who is we ?
And that other "Big" monkey[Willie Bee,is he that big?]
must be blind ?
I have given in "explicit' detail [again],why America has to freeze gun sales and forbid individual ownership !
Read the posts again boys .
You want to shoot guns,go to the rifle ranges,there are still plenty out
there.

I have aleady mentioned several times ..let the bad guys have their guns while they can,but if the Government of the Ol USA would pass the a resounding gunlaw,like ,"the shot heard around the world",NO ONE would dare go near a gun,or any weapon used for taking human life!
Our Government has "pussed" out on what is really needed in our society to stay safe at home or in the streets !

It's like the Government is intimidated by the NRA[national rifle association] !

There are appropriate punishments for taking human life,and one of the worst ways to die is to be "shot to bits" !
And that's exactly what is happening in AMERICA each day .
Each day we average 1 "handgun" murder for each State in America !
Did you get your quota today TEXAS,how about you ILLINOIS,or CALIFORNIA ? You bet they did,you can even set your clock by it !
These are homicides,so don't confuse these murders with suicides .

Somewhere ,somehow, a law will eventually pass, forbiding "deadly weapons" to be owned by private citizens . Those being of course ,handguns ,rifles,are anything more powerful than those two.
This Law ,when finally implemented will work !

Unfortunately ,Uncle Sam ,like I said ,has pussed out,and has shown no will...even to take on the NRA,and with that glaring weakness ,the majority of other gun-lover's meanwhile ,are feeling smugly contented,and being extremely arrogant with their gun ownership !

What are handguns and rifles,and shotguns for anyway?
Are they not for the owner's ,in one word,recreation ?
Then you don't need them at home ,you go to the recreational area's and fire those weapons .

I rest my case !
[you know I am right ]

[losturmarbles]

[ABEHONEST]

WILLE BEE !
Come on back and let's see if I can answer ...whatever that question was ...I didn't answer ?

[CashMoney]

so where does law enforcement derive their rights?

This is not a serious question is it???

[losturmarbles]

This is not a serious question is it???

should be simple enough to answer then huh?

you assert that law enforcement need guns, that they have the right to have guns.

so where does "the law" get it's rights from?

i know this is something your government school never covered, but why would government institutions educate you any more than to the point where you will be a obedient government subject. why would they teach you about rights and the proper role of government, when that would clearly undermine their real agenda.

[losturmarbles]

WILLE BEE !
Come on back and let's see if I can answer ...whatever that question was ...I didn't answer ?

abe he's only asked you like 3 times now and you keep deflecting or ignoring it. i think wb is tired of playing with you.

[Willie Bee]

the 2nd amendment says:
A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

it doesnt say you have a right to own weapons, not directly anyway.

So then when the Constitution begins with, "We the people," the 'people' it's referring to is the states' militia? Or does it mysteriously switch from the 'people' being the entire citizenry to the militia's by the second amendment?

[ABEHONEST]

LOOKING FOR WILLIE BEE ?
And you ,Lostmarbles,make a statement in plain English,or get out of the debate !

[losturmarbles]

So then when the Constitution begins with, "We the people," the 'people' it's referring to is the states' militia? Or does it mysteriously switch from the 'people' being the entire citizenry to the militia's by the second amendment?

that's a bit of a stretch willie, youre talking about the preamble.

the militias was/is "the people" anyway.

point being the 2nd amendment doesnt grant you the right to own firearms, it only protects that right. sorry if i was ambiguous about that.

[Leverage]

....

[ABEHONEST]

DAMN !
I temporally rest my case !

[Willie Bee]

that's a bit of a stretch willie, youre talking about the preamble.

the militias was/is "the people" anyway.

point being the 2nd amendment doesnt grant you the right to own firearms, it only protects that right. sorry if i was ambiguous about that.

Well all I can say after reading this is at least one of us is confused. Are you saying that if you're NOT a member of a militia, you're not "the people?"

Secondly, I'm very unclear just how my right to own a firearm is protected, yet that doesn't necessarily mean I can own a firearm?

[losturmarbles]

Well all I can say after reading this is at least one of us is confused. Are you saying that if you're NOT a member of a militia, you're not "the people?"

Secondly, I'm very unclear just how my right to own a firearm is protected, yet that doesn't necessarily mean I can own a firearm?

no. if i implied that, i'm sorry.

the constitution doesnt grant you rights. it spells out rights that you have in a free society with the intention of preserving those rights and preventing government from taking them away.

no one said you can't own a firearm, and the constitution prevents anyone from doing so.

[CashMoney]

should be simple enough to answer then huh?

you assert that law enforcement need guns, that they have the right to have guns.

so where does "the law" get it's rights from?

i know this is something your government school never covered, but why would government institutions educate you any more than to the point where you will be a obedient government subject. why would they teach you about rights and the proper role of government, when that would clearly undermine their real agenda.

No I said that a person should not have a gun unless they are in law enforcement. Law enforcement, meaning enforcing the laws of the land. Rights are derived from the law not the other way around. Asking where the "law" gets its rights from is a rhetorical question.

[dodger33]

anytime you take guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens you are putting them in danger because the people that get theirs illegally will still have guns and they are the ones that steal, murder, etc. think of it this way...if you are a criminal and are going to rob someone would you rather them have a gun or not have a gun... its as simple as that.

[losturmarbles]

No I said that a person should not have a gun unless they are in law enforcement. Law enforcement, meaning enforcing the laws of the land. Rights are derived from the law not the other way around. Asking where the "law" gets its rights from is a rhetorical question.

so what government school can you proudly claim to be a graduate from?

rights are derived from the law? :shruggs:

sounds like you would be a fan of serfdom.

the law gets its right from the individual. you are born with inalienable rights. like a right to life. all of your rights are extensions of your natural right to life. you were born with the right to defend your person, your property. the law is the organization of the natural right of lawful defense. it is the substitution of a common force for individual forces. and this common force is to do only what the individual forces have a natural and lawful right to do.

sorry you have it backwards, the rights of "the law" are derived only from the individual, not itself.

[ABEHONEST]

anytime you take guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens you are putting them in danger because the people that get theirs illegally will still have guns and they are the ones that steal, murder, etc. think of it this way...if you are a criminal and are going to rob someone would you rather them have a gun or not have a gun... its as simple as that.

I totally disagree !
If the Supreme Court and our Government will ever get a "set" ,the Law against buying or using a gun involving a crime,criminal's wouldn't dare get close too a gun !

I would push for gun laws so extreme that no thug would want to carry one !

A law such as GUILLOTINING the individual intentionally causing a death with a gun,would be an excellent start !

[losturmarbles]

abe move to china. their government will gladly satisfy your desire of strict gun laws.

[ABEHONEST]

abe move to china. their government will gladly satisfy your desire of strict gun laws.

No ,I don't want to move to CHINA ,I just want their gun laws to move HERE !

[losturmarbles]

lol fair enough.