Askren made the kid look like a fool out there....rising up and chanting USA USA...tossing him to his back one handed while in full mount LOL....gimme a break here....be honest....kid never had a chance....
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So you disagree ("No"), but agree ("He may be interested in him, but...")? Thank you for sharing (hedging).Originally posted by Rubber Guard
Again, casual MMA fans like, and Dana sees the value in, a heel (particularly one that wins). Askren's next contract (regardless of size, proportion, length, monetary value) will be in the UFC. Like I said the first time.Comment -
Agree!!Originally posted by On2TheNext1Comment -
Chad Cooper, who covered the event and interviewed Bellator CEO Bjorn Rebney after the show reported it first on Twitter:
Chad Cooper @thechadcooper
Ben Askren has zero fights left under current Bellator contract...
The fact that Askren has come to the end of his contract is very telling. It's common in MMA for promotions to renegotiate contracts prior to the final fight on the contract. So, it would seem either Bellator didn't offer enough in previous negotiations or Askren didn't care what they had to offer.
While it's still very possible that Askren chooses to re-sign with Bellator of his own accord, it will be interesting to see if he learns from the mistakes of former Bellator Lightweight champ Eddie Alvarez. Alvarez is currently involved in a lawsuit over "matching rights" that's not likely to resolve until late-2014 unless he decides to settle. If Askren tries to get out of Bellator without waiting out the matching period, he could find himself in a similar situation.Comment -
Interesting Originally posted by PunisherINDComment -
Bubba Jenkins fuucked shiit up!Comment -
Askren is in another dimension wrestling wise. Nightmare matchup for anyone. Would love to see him fight Ellenburger or Kosheck.Comment -
ASU brings the HEAt!Originally posted by Vaughany
Bubba Jenkins fuucked shiit up!Comment -
Daamn! I thought he did better than his line suggested when I watched the fight, but he sure looks like a +1400 underdog now!Originally posted by VaughanyComment -
Maybe. I don't know Bellator's level of interest. I guess it is low as they haven't even talked about a re-up. I'm just saying the UFC isn't gonna go hunt him down to sign him. They had much more interest in Alverez even after losing to Chandler than they will in the undefeated Askren.Originally posted by On2TheNext1
Askren isn't much of a heel too me. He says a couple crazy things and that is it. The only way he is a heel is similar to Fitch. No one likes him because he is a boring ass fighter. When Dana looks at Askren I highly doubt he sees $$$.Comment -
Hes not really that boring any more, his wrestling is just on such a high level now he can actually use it to finish people. He would likely get eaten up in the UFC though.Comment -
Askren's wrestling is great, but his setups for his takedowns are awful. His double and single-legs are pretty bad too. If he gets a hold of you he'll drown you in canvas, but in modern MMA, distance and spacing are more important to takedown defence than a good sprawl. I figured that if Koreshkov was going to beat Askren, he'd be shrugging him off while retreating. Instead, he tried to sprawl and reverse, which is the worst possible thing you can do against Askren. He obviously studied no tape on Askren, nor did any serious work on his wrestling. If you sprawl against Askren, he can still take you down, he does it all the time. Once he gets a hold of you, he's one of the best guys in the world at dragging you down, but how does he get a hold of Rory MacDonald? Or Jake Ellenberger? Hell, BJ Penn might have a decent chance against Askren.Comment -
He should learn some bjj and he could be a finisher. Koreshkov gave him his neck so often and so blatantly I felt like it was going to be called a work by some people if he did get the choke...Comment -
He does work it. He is a brown belt. I think he had trouble becaus koreshkov kept his chin down consistently. Plus askren was content beating on him. It wasnt like the guy had much of a chance to get up let alone win.Comment -
You keep saying things like this. What does it even mean?Originally posted by mmaedComment -
Exactly why i see him getting devoured in the UFC. Heiron was stuffing him left and right. Also why I felt Korenskov had a good chance, but he fought like an idiot.Originally posted by MD
Ellenburger or Kos would eat him alive.
He's just too unathletic. He definitely can work on his takedown game though, timing and footwork. He just hasn't needed it yet, except against Heiron, whos TDD is overrated in my book.Comment -
I hate koscheck, but I would root my ass of for him against askrenComment -
I think Askren is a really athletic guy actually, he just doesn't look it when he fights because of his style.
Definitely don't think he's going to be a great MMA fighter at this rate, though. He is improving, but is it enough? He has a great wrestling game, but not a great MMA game, or even a great MMA wrestling game. The best MMA fighter he's beat is probably Douglas Lima at this point, and Lima has always had some TDD issues. I would love to see the lines for Askren vs Fitch though.Comment -
yeah he'd just dive from like 5 yards out and just sit their at Koreshkovs mercy, Koreshkov was dumb enough to sprawl and then try and take Askrens back at one point! Instead of re-setting. Askren took a good knee as well early in 2nd or 3rd round, after sloppy shot he went straight in to it but just smiled and continued hanging on to Koreshkov's leg! Apparently Koreskov didnt work with any wrestlers at all during camp and it showed!Originally posted by MDComment -
yeah he's more like a Matt Hughes type character, not much personality, more of the high-school jock thing about him with superiority complex! Not as bad as Hughes though, that guy just annoys the fuuck out of me!Originally posted by Rubber GuardComment -
He's not unathletic (no one is at this level), but he's far from as athletic as Ellenburger, Kos or Hendricks or many of the other top echelon (i hate that word) guys. Not that fast either.Comment -
I'd consider him more athletic than Ellenburger for sure. Dunno about Hendricks or Kos. At this point, Kos has started to lose a lot of his edge, so possibly. Hendricks is a freak athlete all-round though, one of the most athletic guys in that division. Possibly even the most athletic. Other than Matt Riddle of course.Originally posted by mirinquadsComment -
And future champ Matt BrownComment -
Originally posted by Rubber Guard
Well, what constitutes "hunting him down?" The UFC is the only game in town when we're talking potential earn. They're not in a position to have to pursue anyone. Dana acts indifferent towards a lot of free agents until he signs them.
I assure you the lack of interest isn't coming from Bellator's side of the negotiating table. It's a foregone conclusion, Bellator knows it, Askren knows it, Dana knows it. They're preemptively avoiding the Alvarez situation.
Heel is subjective, I just read a lot of pissy comments about his attitude, he does that arrogant/cocky put on in interviews, and his actions in the cage the other night. He's not as polished as Chael, but he's not gonna go rote response "I had a good training camp, opponent X is a tough guy or he wouldn't be in the UFC" stuff. He'll tell Koscheck he sucks and create a stir.
If Dana doesn't see $ then he won't sign him.Comment -
You euros don't know nothing bout that funk style wrasslin. I get the impression some of you think it's a nickname/commentary on his hair or something
Funk wrestlers aren't power double guys, but they apply constant pressure, chain together attempts, thrive off scrambles, take risks. Much more entertaining than MMA wrestling of old. Askren's done quite a few interviews about it and if you ignore the arrogance he says some intelligent stuff about MMA grappling. He may get KTFO with a plethora of better strikers in the UFC, but I expect he'll be successful if he takes smart fights and progresses slowly.Comment -
Understand what it is perfectly well thanks, changes nothing about what we were saying about him having bad setups tho for mmaOriginally posted by On2TheNext1You euros don't know nothing bout that funk style wrasslin. I get the impression some of you think it's a nickname/commentary on his hair or something
Funk wrestlers aren't power double guys, but they apply constant pressure, chain together attempts, thrive off scrambles, take risks. Much more entertaining than MMA wrestling of old. Askren's done quite a few interviews about it and if you ignore the arrogance he says some intelligent stuff about MMA grappling. He may get KTFO with a plethora of better strikers in the UFC, but I expect he'll be successful if he takes smart fights and progresses slowly.Comment -
Disagree. Ellenburger was pulling some incredibly impressive athletic moves of on Heiron to keep from getting taken down. Don't think Askren has the potential to do that at all. Kos and Hendricks is in another league also. Their ability to translate their athleticism and some wrestling technique into covering distance and punching hard, is also something Askren seems unable to do. Could be that he hasn't trained it of course. He isn't that fast either, and most of his takedowns come from techinque and chaining attempts together, not raw strength / athletic power, as Next pointed out.Originally posted by MD
Can't Disagree on Riddle though, he should be light heavyweight champ right now, if not for the unfair cutComment -
I think we're defining "athletic" differently. You don't have to be explosive to be athletic. His body responds perfectly to pretty much everything he attempts to do with it, and he never has any problems applying power or speed in any sort of direction or situation. He's freakishly strong in areas that other people aren't, I'd consider him pretty athletic. How many people can honestly take a guy down after he sprawls? Askren's done it in multiple fights. It's absolutely absurd to even think about in modern MMA.Originally posted by mirinquadsComment -
I don't get that impression when you insist he has poor setups, but continues to get guys down (with ease).Originally posted by VaughanyComment -
Because he does.Originally posted by On2TheNext1Comment -
What constitutes a poor setup?Originally posted by MDComment -
Either a setup that is ineffectual or telegraphed, or no setup at all, as in Askren's case. He generally walks towards his opponents with his arms out like a zombie and dives at them.Originally posted by On2TheNext1Comment -
How many of Askren's setups are ineffectual? Do not result in a takedown?Originally posted by MD
Perhaps you just aren't, as I initially implied, familiar with the subtlety/difference in his style of wrestling compared to traditional MMA grappling.
You're critiquing style, bro. There are no style points. There is takedown or stuffed, there is no style. Yoda said something along those lines.Comment -
There is no "traditional" MMA grappling, given that it's an infantile sport, and Askren is competing in MMA, not wrestling. In MMA, he does not have good setups. You're saying that because Askren is getting takedowns, his setups are good, which is nonsense. It has nothing to do with style. I said the same before the Ellenberger fight; Ellenberger is a garbage striker, but he can knock out a lot of people. It's not that he doesn't have "style", it's that he has bad striking technique. Askren doesn't get takedowns because of his setups, which are bad, he gets takedowns because once he gets a hold of someone, he's freakishly strong in positions that others are not, and is very persistent. He rarely even sets up his takedowns.Originally posted by On2TheNext1Comment -
look at the guys he's facing. And Koreshkov managed to sprawl at least once, but was dumb enough to then continue grappling in stead of letting go and backing up and circling. He also caught Askren with a knee to the face when Askren did a sloppy telegraphed shot. We aren't saying he isnt a good wrestler, he's an amazing "funky" wrestler, but when he was wrestling he didnt have to worry about getting kneed in the face!Originally posted by On2TheNext1Comment
