betdsi cancels clemson bets due to alleged bad line?

[LVHerbie]

They had Clemson listed at -7.5 instead of -9.5 this morning which are largely worthless points. They left it up 4:53 AM Pacific till to 2:34 PM according to SBRodds so I'm sure I'm not the only who bet it.

Heritage will sell you those points for 17 cents (from -9.5 -108 to -7.5 -125) and wasn't close to being an arb with Miami being 9 cents worse (+7.5 +101) on their pull down menus. Not sure about pinnacle because they are down for maintenance ATM but doubt it was an arb there because I only made a normal sized bet on it.

I usually see a couple bad lines a week which I just ignore because I don't want to get freerolled but this one didn't seem like anything really special.

[4nic8ing]

If it isnt a scalp it really should just fall under "stale" or "slow" move. I am guessing some low level individual slapped 50 cent move since it was 2 pts and deemed it bad line. I would think you will get the play reinstated with a little help from SBR. Best of luck.

[LVHerbie]

If it isnt a scalp it really should just fall under "stale" or "slow" move. I am guessing some low level individual slapped 50 cent move since it was 2 pts and deemed it bad line. I would think you will get the play reinstated with a little help from SBR. Best of luck.

It wasn't a stale or slow move as the market had been at 9.5 for several days when they moved to 7.5 but, since betdsi has left bookmaker, this isn't the first "weird" move I seen them make against the wider market just the first they canceled on me.

It moved a little at pinnacle since this morning but it still not scalp on the pull down menus pricing as the other side now priced at +7.5 +109. Hell at pinnacle price's this morning SBR's half point calculator shows the bet as having a negative edge of .68%.

I'm not giving up my account number for the little bit of equity I would now have in the bet so unless SBR wants to get them restore all the bets they cancelled I'm guess I'm stuck eating it. Mostly just annoyed that they would canceled it as, although I do line shop, I don't hit obvious bad lines. Since it was up over 9 hours, I'm guessing they didn't cancel the bets till they realized they were now stuck with a large position they didn't like.

[LVHerbie]

Actually it might have been up for almost a whole day as just realized it was time stamped twice at 7.5 for some reason. Likely every (square such as myself) that had a slight lean toward Clemson and saw it hit that shit.

11/29 02:34 PM	+9½ -110	-9½ -110
11/29 04:53 AM	+7½ -110	-7½ -110
11/28 03:53 PM	+7½ -110	-7½ -110
11/27 07:47 AM	+9½ -110	-9½ -110

[SBR Forum]

They had Clemson listed at -7.5 instead of -9.5 this morning which are largely worthless points.

Thank you for sharing. As you pointed out, DSI was in line with the market at 9.5 on 11/26, so moving two full points off market to -7.5 -110 would appear to be an error and not being asleep at the wheel. If you spot a move you think is borderline or possibly an error, a good practice would be to ask a supervisor before wagering.

[bubba]

obviosuly shouldnt be cancelled. cancelled a line should be for obvious major errors. this is neither obvious nor major

[RoyBacon]

They had Clemson listed at -7.5 instead of -9.5 this morning which are largely worthless points. They left it up 4:53 AM Pacific till to 2:34 PM according to SBRodds so I'm sure I'm not the only who bet it.

Heritage will sell you those points for 17 cents (from -9.5 -108 to -7.5 -125) and wasn't close to being an arb with Miami being 9 cents worse (+7.5 +101) on their pull down menus. Not sure about pinnacle because they are down for maintenance ATM but doubt it was an arb there because I only made a normal sized bet on it.

I usually see a couple bad lines a week which I just ignore because I don't want to get freerolled but this one didn't seem like anything really special.

Did you hit it at your average bet? It is obviously scalpable btw. If you hit for your avg bet and you're a regular then they should let it stand. IMHO its a bad line.

[4nic8ing]

Thank you for sharing. As you pointed out, DSI was in line with the market at 9.5 on 11/26, so moving two full points off market to -7.5 -110 would appear to be an error and not being asleep at the wheel. If you spot a move you think is borderline or possibly an error, a good practice would be to ask a supervisor before wagering.

It is about 6 cents from the 8.5 to 9.5 with Pinny and then maybe 7 cents from the 8.5 to 7.5 as an approximation. You can't judge it based off the 2 pt move if those numbers between the move have little value. I would think a bad line has to at least represent a scalp and this isn't the case. How is the bettor supposed to know if the book hasn't written big money on the one side and is attempting to get buyback with the move?

LV has already stated he has no intention of giving his account ID up so it obviously isn't that big of a deal. I just think for future purposes there should be some sort of guideline to determine what is a bad line. Didn't Pinnacle have an article years ago stating that 7% off market is considered a bad line? Using that criteria there is no way this play would have been deleted.

[Optional]

obviosuly shouldnt be cancelled. cancelled a line should be for obvious major errors. this is neither obvious nor major

Obviously not a bad line to who?? Someone who has never bet before.

Even the OP says he knows it was an erroneous line. The discussion was about should it stand anyway.



Given the cancel was so far before the match and you can still get the bet in and buy those points if you want them, it seems kind of academic really? Unless I am missing something?

[bubba]

Obviously not a bad line to who?? Someone who has never bet before.

Even the OP says he knows it was an erroneous line. The discussion was about should it stand anyway.



Given the cancel was so far before the match and you can still get the bet in and buy those points if you want them, it seems kind of academic really? Unless I am missing something?

if this line is cancelled there may as well only be 1 set of lines that all sportsbooks follow and all linked together. Every book should have the same line on every event. The reason bad lines are cancelled is to protect the books. They dont need protection in this case. The one who needs protection in this case is the player.

[bubba]

Obviously not a bad line to who?? Someone who has never bet before.

Even the OP says he knows it was an erroneous line. The discussion was about should it stand anyway.



Given the cancel was so far before the match and you can still get the bet in and buy those points if you want them, it seems kind of academic really? Unless I am missing something?

your point of being cancelled well in advance is fair. however this line doesnt warrant being cancelled. much better than being cancelled after the game (1000 times better) but7.5 to 9.5 in football? i mean, thats basically saying almost any bet can be cancelled unless a line is static from opening to close

[Optional]

your point of being cancelled well in advance is fair. however this line doesnt warrant being cancelled. much better than being cancelled after the game (1000 times better) but7.5 to 9.5 in football? i mean, thats basically saying almost any bet can be cancelled unless a line is static from opening to close

Yeah it's not a very big error. Would not have broken the book. Maybe they would not have bothered cancelling closer to the game.

If I was a manager in there I am pretty sure there would be no question in my mind that it should have been cancelled though. Mainly because it appears to be an input error or glitch and it was so far ahead of game time.

If DSI start cancelling bets willy nilly they wont get a free pass on that.

[fried cheese]

Thank you for sharing. As you pointed out, DSI was in line with the market at 9.5 on 11/26, so moving two full points off market to -7.5 -110 would appear to be an error and not being asleep at the wheel. If you spot a move you think is borderline or possibly an error, a good practice would be to ask a supervisor before wagering.

according to sbr odds they offered -7.5 on the 26th, 27th, and 28th going back and forth between that and -9.5. if that is accurate then there is no way this should be cancelled for a bad line.

[TheMoneyShot]

Seemed like a fair line to me. Line movement seems automated. DSI's fault. Not the client's.

Pinnacle opened up with -5.5 and stayed at -6.5 for awhile.

DSI bitching about -7.5?

It's not a bad line.



Note: Yes I know the line is around -8.5 -9 -9.5 at the moment. The oddsmakers are playing the merry-go-round game. Do they even know wtf their doing? Why is it the client's fault? DSI is clearly responsible... and should honor the wager.

[indio]

They had Clemson listed at -7.5 instead of -9.5 this morning which are largely worthless points. They left it up 4:53 AM Pacific till to 2:34 PM according to SBRodds so I'm sure I'm not the only who bet it.

I'm not trying to insult you or pick a fight, but if you think 8 and 9 are largely "worthless" points in a college football game, perhaps you should consider a different hobby to gamble on, because the difference between 7.5 and 9.5 for a college football game is HUGE. I'm not even saying you're wrong about your complaint, just that those are two very important margin numbers in college ball.

[LVHerbie]

Thank you for sharing. As you pointed out, DSI was in line with the market at 9.5 on 11/26, so moving two full points off market to -7.5 -110 would appear to be an error and not being asleep at the wheel. If you spot a move you think is borderline or possibly an error, a good practice would be to ask a supervisor before wagering.

Calling to verify every time I saw a 17 cents off-market number instead of deciding if I wanted to place a bet or not wouldn't leave much time to sleep. Leaving up such a number that you don't want action on for almost 24 hours seems far closer to being asleep at the wheel than making a simple error IMO.

[LVHerbie]

I'm not trying to insult you or pick a fight, but if you think 8 and 9 are largely "worthless" points in a college football game, perhaps you should consider a different hobby to gamble on, because the difference between 7.5 and 9.5 for a college football game is HUGE. I'm not even saying you're wrong about your complaint, just that those are two very important margin numbers in college ball.

Heritage will let you buy those points for 17 cents. Buying a half point off the a 7 is 16 cents. My point was that it is absurd that those should be treated differently in consideration to what is and isn't labeled a bad line.

[LVHerbie]

Pinnacle currently has Raiders at -7.5 -107 while heritage is at -9 -105 (which they want 16 cents to get to 7.5). Which book is it my responsible to call to verify the line so I don't have to sweat it being labeled a bad line?

[4nic8ing]

For some reason people have made the assumption that since you don't want to be identified and burn your out that you are wrong and the book is justified in this. I find it comical that there are probably 1000+ arbitrage opportunities daily with -110/-110 or higher offerings that never get questioned as bad lines but your wager here is deemed that being off 17 cents.

DSI was asleep at the wheel or their automove is calibrated incorrectly. Either way it is on them and no way should your play be deleted.

[JAKEPEAVY21]

[TheMoneyShot]

DSI not paying a man 24k he's owed. And now nitpicking lines with another individual. Can it get anymore uglier with this book?

[RoyBacon]

If a $100 player popped this for $3k mid week I think the book is fine to cancel it. It is an error. But as others have correctly said this is not a big enough off number to fall on ones sword.

The $24k stiff job and poor line management & customer service may all be correlated.

[Bluehorseshoe]

Pinnacle currently has Raiders at -7.5 -107 while heritage is at -9 -105 (which they want 16 cents to get to 7.5). Which book is it my responsible to call to verify the line so I don't have to sweat it being labeled a bad line?

Exactly. Two points is nothing.

[bubba]

Exactly. Two points is nothing.

these 2 points is much less than half a run in a baseball total. if you bet under 9.5 on a baseball game, does anyone really think its appropriate for a book to say "we meant to do 9 -110, all wagers are cancelled"? really? if yes, where is the line drawn? the bad line rule is supposed to be used for obvious errors. its in place to protect the book when they actually make a mistake. i place dozens of wagers a day (never bet a "bad line") and many of my wagers every day will be 5-10 cents or better at 1 book over another. they are never cancelled. nor should this be.

[bubba]

Exactly. Two points is nothing.

im agreeing with u. if thats not clear. haha

[temple2010]

it's 7.5 now again- with some other books at 9.5??? WTf is going on

[temple2010]

now off the board- what a mess

[cyclingbettor]

DSI not paying a man 24k he's owed. And now nitpicking lines with another individual. Can it get anymore uglier with this book?

One person has a payout issue and a line was cancelled? I can think of uglier, yes, but that's just me I guess...

ps - Does someone have a link to the thread that describes the payout issue? I would be curious to read up on that some more. (Yes, I did try searching, and yes I presumably suck at searching because I wasn't able to find it, so any help would be appreciated). Cheers.

[bubba]

it says there total is 47.5. pinnacle is 46. is that a bad line??????

A bad line shouldnt be something the book gets to pick and choose.

[4nic8ing]

Obviously not a bad line to who?? Someone who has never bet before.

So if a person takes +3.5 (-113) when the market is +3.5 (-130) is that worthy of canceling? Or is your main sticking point the optics of this since it is 2 points?

[bubba]

So if a person takes +3.5 (-113) when the market is +3.5 (-130) is that worthy of canceling? Or is your main sticking point the optics of this since it is 2 points?

or what if a dog is +1050 instead of +1000. 50 points!!! bad line. cancel all wagers.

[indio]

Heritage will let you buy those points for 17 cents. Buying a half point off the a 7 is 16 cents. My point was that it is absurd that those should be treated differently in consideration to what is and isn't labeled a bad line.

According to oddsportal, Pinnacle is offering Clemson -7.5 at -120 (54.55% market probability) and Clemson -9.5 at -104 (50.98% market probability). A difference of 3.57%, which mirrors how many Div1a CFB games landed on 8 or 9 this year (3.45%).

Once again, the difference between 54.55% and 50.98% is HUGE. As a poker player, I can tell you that that exact win % amount playing $100 heads up matches for 1 years worth of hard work (1,000 matches a month with high rake of 4.76% and no rakeback) is the difference between making a $60,000 profit and losing $36,000.

The fact that you cavalierly shrug off "17 cents" (which is an inaccurate perception anyway) as almost nothing is a microcosm of why square gamblers lose and why they have no concept of markets, margins, or any of the basic standards of them.

Just to reiterate, nothing of what I say means I disagree with your initial complaint. In a competitive market of various pricings and market moves, a bookmaker offering a price that's not an "obvious" bad line (like having the wrong team favored or missing a digit) entices the player to wager there and possibly miss the chance to bet his desired price somewhere else, or cost him in other ways, and while the bookmaker does have the right to declare it a bad line long before the game starts (so it's not a freeroll of the player, which is a different animal), that same bookmaker really should not be so quick to make that declaration on a market which has bounced around between 7.5 and 9.5 at many outlets, as it's poor customer service if that happens frequently. Considering there are only a few college football games this weekend, and they're going to have large volume and fan interest, somebody who's job it is to have prices listed on the software should never be asleep at the wheel so to speak, in any decent shop.

[bubba]

According to oddsportal, Pinnacle is offering Clemson -7.5 at -120 (54.55% market probability) and Clemson -9.5 at -104 (50.98% market probability). A difference of 3.57%, which mirrors how many Div1a CFB games landed on 8 or 9 this year (3.45%).

Once again, the difference between 54.55% and 50.98% is HUGE. As a poker player, I can tell you that that exact win % amount playing $100 heads up matches for 1 years worth of hard work (1,000 matches a month with high rake of 4.76% and no rakeback) is the difference between making a $60,000 profit and losing $36,000.

The fact that you cavalierly shrug off "17 cents" (which is an inaccurate perception anyway) as almost nothing is a microcosm of why square gamblers lose and why they have no concept of markets, margins, or any of the basic standards of them.

Just to reiterate, nothing of what I say means I disagree with your initial complaint. In a competitive market of various pricings and market moves, a bookmaker offering a price that's not an "obvious" bad line (like having the wrong team favored or missing a digit) entices the player to wager there and possibly miss the chance to bet his desired price somewhere else, or cost him in other ways, and while the bookmaker does have the right to declare it a bad line long before the game starts (so it's not a freeroll of the player, which is a different animal), that same bookmaker really should not be so quick to make that declaration on a market which has bounced around between 7.5 and 9.5 at many outlets, as it's poor customer service if that happens frequently. Considering there are only a few college football games this weekend, and they're going to have large volume and fan interest, somebody who's job it is to have prices listed on the software should never be asleep at the wheel so to speak, in any decent shop.

nobody is arguing that the difference between 7.5 and 9.5 is nothing. the question is if its reason for cancelling a contract. a wager is a contract and should only be cancelled for major errors. not a 3% error.

[NSN21]

No way in hell this should be canceled. An error would be pk. Or Miami -7.5. This is neither.

[cyclingbettor]

is your main sticking point the optics of this since it is 2 points?

From my perspective, it's definitely the optics of a 2 point difference in the spread that make it not totally surprising to me that the line was cancelled. In this particular case, the 2 points aren't worth that much, so perhaps it shouldn't have been cancelled. I'm just not totally surprised that it was, if all somebody was looking at was the difference in point spread. (Although 5Dimes cancelled a wager on me that was 16 points off (+119 vs +103), so crap happens sometimes. Not that I was particularly impressed with that cancellation either).

At the risk of asking a silly question, I assume that the op has contacted DSI regarding this, and they refused to change it? And/or opened a complaint with SBR? Because once something like this has occurred, trying to resolve it via customer support is often a fruitless exercise...