5dimes fraudulently denies btc payout (later granted but banned from future payout)

**hockey216** · 05-23-16, 06:44 PM

rules listed on their public website funding methods tab says YOU CAN CASHOUT 5K/EVERY WEEK FOR FREE EVEN IF NEVER DEPOSIT WITH BITCOIN

Becky fraudulently told me that only bitcoin exclusive depositors can cashout with bitcoin and tried to deny my payout (later granted, but BANNED ME!)

they lied about rules! typed up paragraph rule that ISN'T ON SITE (and lied about how it is on site). and they banned me for just getting 3 small payouts with bitcoin...

whats next, getting banned from getting check payouts if you dont exclusively deposit with checks?

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http://www.5dimes.eu/PopUpsFromChart/bitcoin.html

**Optional** · 05-23-16, 06:50 PM

She told you this at the start of the conversation;

Becky: your deposit/payout pattern doesnt please us
Becky: the idea of making bitcoin deposits available to all customers
Becky: has the purpose of converting our clients into bitcoin depositors
Becky: our goal wasnt to become your cheapest bitcoin exchange service

You may not like that but it's a reasonable business policy and clearly explained to you.

**hockey216** · 05-23-16, 07:09 PM

Originally posted by Optional

She told you this at the start of the conversation;

Becky: your deposit/payout pattern doesnt please us
Becky: the idea of making bitcoin deposits available to all customers
Becky: has the purpose of converting our clients into bitcoin depositors
Becky: our goal wasnt to become your cheapest bitcoin exchange service

You may not like that but it's a reasonable business policy and clearly explained to you.

They still have to honor the written payout rules that they CHOOSE to publish on their site and offer:

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Bitcoin

How to deposit funds to your 5Dimes account using Bitcoin (BTC)

Bitcoins (BTC) are a form of digital public money; in essence, electricity converted into long strings of code that have a monetary value. You can now deposit to 5Dimes using this method.
The minimum deposit amount accepted in BTC is the equivalent of $25. The maximum deposit amount in the cashier is the equivalent of $10,000. You may choose to do multiple $10,000 transactions or contact the Epay department for details on higher single transaction deposit amounts. The average of the current Bid and Ask prices from www.bitstamp.net will be used for all currency conversions with USD. If Bitstamp is not available, then in order the following sites will be used as a replacement: www.bitfinex.com, www.okcoin.com. Management reserves the right to change the BTC conversion website used at any time without prior notice.
In order to process a deposit via Bitcoin, please login to our cashier section and go to the Deposit page.Click on the Bitcoin logo and enter the desired deposit amount in either currency, USD or BTC, then click submit.
Use the Bitcoin Address that will be displayed to send the funds. Once you complete the deposit to the address displayed to you in the deposit page, the transaction will be automatically submitted for confirmation. There are no fees associated with this deposit method. Remember, you must request a new Bitcoin Address for every deposit made.
Your deposit will be credited shortly after, taking up to 40 min to be completed. If the amount you send is less than the amount you had entered to request the Bitcoin Address, your deposit will be delayed by at least 15 minutes more on top of the regular confirmation time.
If your deposit is sent within 15 minutes of generating the bitcoin address, the currency exchange rate at that time will be applied for the USD conversion when crediting your sports account. If the deposit is processed after the 15 minute period, the currency exchange rate available when depositing will be the one applied for the USD conversion.
Wagering is not available in the Bitcoin currency. All BTC transactions are converted to USD when credited to your sports account.
Please contact Customer Support via Live Help to confirm availability of this deposit option.

How to redeem funds from your 5Dimes account using Bitcoin (BTC)

All Bitcoin payouts must be submitted through the cashier online and will be verified via email to address on file by our Epay department. If the payout is not verified via email within 24-48 hours, the payout will be cancelled.
The minimum payout amount that may be requested through the online cashier is $50, the maximum amount is $10,000. Higher amounts may be available, for more information contact the Epay Department.
If you EXCLUSIVELY deposited using Bitcoin, there is no limit on the amount you can request as a payout via Bitcoin. Bitcoin payouts are free of charge and subject to availability.
This payout method is always "Subject to availability". Always check with our Customer Service Staff to confirm availability to have your BTC payout processed. You may need to choose an alternate method for your withdrawal. Alternate withdrawal options will incur in a fee if not processed within the free/discounted time frame.
Customers, who have not exclusively deposited with Bitcoins or have not deposited with Bitcoins at all, are allowed one Bitcoin payout every 7 days for up to $5,000. Bitcoin payouts are free of charge and subject to availability.
The average of the current Bid and Ask prices from www.bitstamp.net will be used for all currency conversions with USD at the time the payout is processed. If Bitstamp is not available, then in order the following sites will be used as a replacement: www.bitfinex.com, www.okcoin.com. Management reserves the right to change the BTC conversion website used at any time without prior notice.

For more assistance please contact our Customer Service Staff via Live Help or call 1-800-430-5896 FREE.

**hockey216** · 05-23-16, 07:12 PM

Becky Fraudulently recited the following as being rule on site when it wasn't:

"Payouts via Bitcoins have been made available to all customers with the objective of converting our clients into Bitcoin exclusive depositors. Customers who continue to request Bitcoin payouts and then deposit using methods other than Bitcoin, may be subject to the removal of this payout method or restricted to Bitcoin deposits only. Remember, Bitcoin payouts are free of charge but subject to availability."

The real rules verbatim from their rules page are above, which are very contrary to what Becky states in chat.

**TheMoneyShot** · 05-23-16, 07:19 PM

Yes, I read the 5D BTC info a few days ago. It clearly states... if you don't exclusively use BTC you are still allowed 1 free PO every 7 days. Please use chat for availability first.

I see where you're pissed off hockey216 but it's their business. 5D always changes info/rules... no matter what their webpage says.

**Optional** · 05-23-16, 07:33 PM

Originally posted by hockey216

They still have to honor the written payout rules that they CHOOSE to publish on their site and offer:

It sounds like Becky thinks that she did that, by repeating over and again the subject to availability bit.

I'd probably just get back on to her and say that I'd like to do the two consecutive deposits by btc to get approved for payouts that way again personally.

**Plaza23** · 05-23-16, 07:42 PM

Maybe you should start depositing in Bitcoins if you want the unlimited option of withdrawing in them?

**hockey216** · 05-23-16, 08:35 PM

if i deposit and get NO BONUS and wager 2-3x rollover, why am i not elligible to cashout?

Why do i deserve to get banned from payouts simply for requesting a withdrawal?

i wagered at least 2-3x and got 0 bonus. I've lost gazillion times this amount over last 5y...

Why should i have to pay rediculous $80 fee for check that takes weeks to get in the mail and is international and takes WEEKS to clear?

i deserve to get banned from payouts because i won a tiny amount? what a joke.

**hockey216** · 05-23-16, 08:38 PM

Originally posted by Plaza23

Maybe you should start depositing in Bitcoins if you want the unlimited option of withdrawing in them?

I didn't ask for unlimited. Withdrawal was under 5k.

Site says free withdrawals under 5k permitted every week even for those that don't deposit bitcoin (does say subject to availability, but if bitcoin is available, why should someone be banned from payouts simply for requesting withdrawal?)

**Plaza23** · 05-23-16, 08:50 PM

Originally posted by hockey216

I didn't ask for unlimited. Withdrawal was under 5k.

Site says free withdrawals under 5k permitted every week even for those that don't deposit bitcoin (does say subject to availability, but if bitcoin is available, why should someone be banned from payouts simply for requesting withdrawal?)

Because 5dimes only wants to payout in bitcoins what players deposit in bitcoins.

If 5dimes ends up paying out more in bitcoins, than what players end up depositing - then 5dimes ends up with bitcoin shortages and would have to go get bitcoins themselves. They obviously don't want to do that.

**hockey216** · 05-23-16, 10:58 PM

Originally posted by Plaza23

Because 5dimes only wants to payout in bitcoins what players deposit in bitcoins.

If 5dimes ends up paying out more in bitcoins, than what players end up depositing - then 5dimes ends up with bitcoin shortages and would have to go get bitcoins themselves. They obviously don't want to do that.

as of week ago, only way to cashout same amount was check ($80 fee and takes WEEKS to get $ because they send international checks that take forever to clear the bank; wire limit was 5k just lowered last few days and is also $80 fee plus banks add another $50).

If i dont get bonus and do 2-3x rollover, why should i get extorted $80 every time and have to wait weeks or get extorted $130 for wire? every time now because im banned from bitcoin just bc i made 3 tiny payouts?

I've paid so much $ in fees over year and have lost so much $. I have also gotten NO bonuses.

What sportsbooks bans core losing players who are 5y customers for making a 3rd small payout of 1 method?

Their website rules said they permit payouts, yet they banned me and refused to honor THEIR OWN TERMS.

"Customers, who have not exclusively deposited with Bitcoins or have not deposited with Bitcoins at all, are allowed one Bitcoin payout every 7 days for up to $5,000."

**Snoman** · 05-23-16, 11:03 PM

In their own terms though, didn't they say "subject to availability."? I can see how what they've written is slightly misleading and frustrating, I don't think books should be able to get away with greasiness like that. On the flip side though, if your money is more important than being right, then do what Optional suggested and ask to do the 2 btc deposits to become a btc exclusive customer and then get your withdrawals instead of shouting just to be right.

**hockey216** · 05-23-16, 11:12 PM

yes it is subject to availability, however, when you click "check bitcoin availability" link on funding methods tab, it says available.

So if it IS available according to their site up to 50k, why can't i withdrawal just a few grand?

their site says availability status is yes up to 50k and i was banned for requesting few grand.

Why am i banned?

To the 5D shill above talking about bitcoin shortage... if your site says you are available to pay up to $50k in bitcoin when your p2p limits are under a thousand, i don't think you're short on bitcoin.

"
Epay Withdrawals Availability

Bitcoin : OPEN $10,000 up to $50,000 (lesser amounts available through the online cashier)"

**hockey216** · 05-23-16, 11:22 PM

they paid, but its not fair that i got banned from future payout. i just requested withdrawal after depositing (Getting no bonus) and made 2-3x rollover. why cant i withdrawal?

**ParlayKing1986** · 05-23-16, 11:35 PM

Sucks but it's not going to change..they should make it clear that if you never deposit with btc that you will eventually not be allowed to withdraw via btc.

**mtneer1212** · 05-24-16, 12:21 AM

I kinda agree with 5dimes here..... they didn't fraudulently do anything here, which the OP keeps claiming. If he wants to cash out bitcoin exclusively, he should deposit that way. Most books try to pay you back the same way you deposited.... You can't expect 5dimes to exhaust their bitcoin arsenal for one customer, if he doesn't replenish the bitcoin holdings for 5dimes on his deposits.

**Plaza23** · 05-24-16, 03:38 AM

Originally posted by mtneer1212

I kinda agree with 5dimes here..... they didn't fraudulently do anything here, which the OP keeps claiming. If he wants to cash out bitcoin exclusively, he should deposit that way. Most books try to pay you back the same way you deposited.... You can't expect 5dimes to exhaust their bitcoin arsenal for one customer, if he doesn't replenish the bitcoin holdings for 5dimes on his deposits.

Yep exactly. I agree with 5dimes policy although I do think they should change their advertising so as to not mislead players.

They should say they allow Bitcoin withdrawals but only if you've deposited in bitcoins.

They could run out of bitcoins real quick if they let anyone take withdrawals that way.

**Legions36** · 05-24-16, 10:49 AM

Lol side with the book on this with those misleading terms. I understand exactly what happened 5dimes just changed rules to try and power trip.

**SBR Forum** · 05-24-16, 12:22 PM

Originally posted by mtneer1212

I kinda agree with 5dimes here..... they didn't fraudulently do anything here, which the OP keeps claiming. If he wants to cash out bitcoin exclusively, he should deposit that way. Most books try to pay you back the same way you deposited.... You can't expect 5dimes to exhaust their bitcoin arsenal for one customer, if he doesn't replenish the bitcoin holdings for 5dimes on his deposits.

Agreed, the policy is clear and the explanation the player received from the manager was logical. If you value the out and you like redeeming your funds through BTC, why not change up your deposit method so that you can continue to use BTC for payouts which you prefer doing to begin with? It looks like you're borrowing trouble.

**Legions36** · 05-24-16, 12:58 PM

All I know is it's petty as hell for 5dimes to try and enforce this after he even rolled over more than what was expected of him. I would have done the same then I would have been pretty angry to get singled out after going by there rules. These books just don't know when to chill out. 5dimes is known to single out people so it's expected of them. GL op trying to get these people to understand but I know cause they tried something on me years ago. And what is SBR here for when they should talk to them and try to help u out to get a clear answer so this doesn't happen to other people as well, cause I would have been fooled as well from reading this rule. I'm sure they made u feel like a crook to from this process when u did nothing wrong.

**cloverfield** · 05-24-16, 01:14 PM

Originally posted by SBR Forum

Agreed, the policy is clear and the explanation the player received from the manager was logical. If you value the out and you like redeeming your funds through BTC, why not change up your deposit method so that you can continue to use BTC for payouts which you prefer doing to begin with? It looks like you're borrowing trouble.

90% of the players think it's a "book vs. player" thing and will always look for reasons to bitch and moan.

this is nothing new. of course the information that Becky gave him is logical, but he doesn't want to hear it because it's "posted on their site". Becky told him that they don't like his pattern of deposits/withdrawals. Hopefully they just make a note on his account and the next time he tries it, they can throw the "we told you already and it's clearly documented in the chat logs" at him and be done with it.

They probably don't run into too many people with this problem for them to update their whole policy on it. You always have some people who will take advantage or try to circumvent policies. It's obviously not a one off thing and it seems to be more of a pattern with this particular player.

**5918mike** · 05-24-16, 01:21 PM

Unfortunately it's a fluid process and always subject to availability and changes in rules. When they started processing bitcoin they had the rule that you had to deposit, then they slowly relaxed the rule as people began using it more. Eventually they will have to tighten it back up if people aren't depositing or they have a run of withdrawals that deplete their bitcoins. One thing I've learned is to roll with the changes, be patient as most books will do what they can to work with you.

**RonPaul2008** · 05-24-16, 01:33 PM

I think most or all of the major usa facing books have a service that accepts the bitcoin and gives the book the cash as well as the other way around. It sounds like 5Dimes does it all themselves.

**relaaxx** · 05-24-16, 04:43 PM

Originally posted by Optional

She told you this at the start of the conversation;

Becky: your deposit/payout pattern doesnt please us
Becky: the idea of making bitcoin deposits available to all customers
Becky: has the purpose of converting our clients into bitcoin depositors
Becky: our goal wasnt to become your cheapest bitcoin exchange service

You may not like that but it's a reasonable business policy and clearly explained to you.

abusing policy will get you in trouble every time. the rules work for customers who don't abuse them.

**hockey216** · 05-24-16, 07:12 PM

Originally posted by mtneer1212

Most books try to pay you back the same way you deposited.... You can't expect 5dimes to exhaust their bitcoin arsenal for one customer, if he doesn't replenish the bitcoin holdings for 5dimes on his deposits.

books offer variety of cashout methods and in my experience, they haven't banned any payout methods when same cc deposit method used every time. Customers usually deposit their same way (card or p2p), and use variety of cashout methods. What's next, refusing check payouts because customer didn't deposit with check?

bitcoin is only deposit method that forces consumer to pay a fee. Pretty much 0 customers in industry pay a fee for depositing. Not only do books never charge fees on deposits, but some even refund deposit fees. They even offer bonuses. Why would a consumer choose to pay a fee to deposit when every method of deposit is free at every book in industry?

Regarding the fraud allegation: fraud is a misrepresentation of fact that causes person to suffer damages.

The misrepresentation of fact is their website funding methods tab wrongfully stating, "Customers, who have not exclusively deposited with Bitcoins or have not deposited with Bitcoins at all, are allowed one Bitcoin payout every 7 days for up to $5,000."

The damages are the recurring $80 fees i have to pay every time now to cashout with check/wire.

Fraud is proven by above 2 lines.

They took my payout privilege away when i was abiding by the terms posted on their website, so i feel that suffering $80 in damages every time i cash out due to their website misrepresenting their payout policy is unfair.

for their website to accurately represent their policy, it should say you get banned when cashout bitcoin 3x without depositing bitcoin, not that you can do it every 7 days for up to 5k even if you don't deposit.

Their payout policy is clearly misrepresented on their website.

they banned my payout privileges when i was following their rules, and now i have to get extorted $80 in fees every time i cash out.

**dhristov211** · 05-24-16, 07:25 PM

5dimes not a bank!

**cloverfield** · 05-24-16, 09:18 PM

Originally posted by hockey216

blah blah

their payout policy seems to be working for the other 99% of the people who play there and post here.

stop trying to take advantage of their rules and you wont have an issue.

just because you type 200 lines to say the same thing over and over doesn't make it any different. you understand the SPIRIT of the rule and fail to understand their point of view. I'm glad they banned you from doing it going forward so they dont remove it for everyone else.

**Kindred** · 05-24-16, 10:47 PM

So 5dimes is a deposit only book now?

**Kindred** · 05-24-16, 10:49 PM

Originally posted by cloverfield

stop trying to ~~take advantage of their rules~~ request payouts and you wont have an issue.

Fixed it for ya

**Plaza23** · 05-24-16, 11:04 PM

Originally posted by hockey216

bitcoin is only deposit method that forces consumer to pay a fee.

That is not true. Every deposit I have made there with a card had a 1.5% processing fee on it. The Bitcoin deposits were a bit less than that. But I'm fairly certain every deposit I have ever made there charged a fee to process it.

If I wanted to deposit $50 using a card, it would always cost me $51.50 or something like that.

**Memento** · 05-24-16, 11:19 PM

Originally posted by hockey216

they paid, but its not fair that i got banned from future payout. i just requested withdrawal after depositing (Getting no bonus) and made 2-3x rollover. why cant i withdrawal?

Surely you have been banned from circle and coinbase...because you are clearly purchasing BTC. I assume you are betting -100000 favs or something like that offered by 5dimes. These guys have screwed me more ways than anyone on bad lines, but this is a legit excuse to stop paymet.

**Kindred** · 05-25-16, 05:00 PM

Originally posted by Plaza23

That is not true. Every deposit I have made there with a card had a 1.5% processing fee on it. The Bitcoin deposits were a bit less than that. But I'm fairly certain every deposit I have ever made there charged a fee to process it.

If I wanted to deposit $50 using a card, it would always cost me $51.50 or something like that.

Those fees should be just the foreign tx fees from your cc not from 5dimes. If 5dimes is charging that fee they should be telling customers upfront. Most cc and banks charge a foreign transaction fee, mine are 3%

**Kindred** · 05-25-16, 05:08 PM

Originally posted by Memento

Surely you have been banned from circle and coinbase...because you are clearly purchasing BTC. I assume you are betting -100000 favs or something like that offered by 5dimes. These guys have screwed me more ways than anyone on bad lines, but this is a legit excuse to stop paymet.

Why would you say he is banned from Circle? All you have to do is say you are buying BTC to trade shitcoins like ether ect.
And while I agree the OP is over reacting it's not really legit to change the rules that are clearly written on the website. However they did send the payout BTC honoring the rules and informed the player that going forward he would have to deposit using BTC in order to get payouts in BTC.
Only thing they did was try to not pay him in BTC even though he was eligible according to the website, but then did pay him once he called them out on it so really not an issue. And as long as they informed him that going forward he is no longer able to then they obviously aren't being fradulent.
That said it's sad when people are telling other gamblers to not try and "take advantage of their rules" are you kidding me? He's not angle shooting he's just not depositing in the most profitable way (for 5dimes) . it's like people have gone mad and feel the need to defend their sportsbook..books don't need fanboy shills especially not 5dimes which is dong pretty good profit wise I'd imagine lol

**Memento** · 05-25-16, 06:08 PM

Originally posted by Kindred

Why would you say he is banned from Circle? All you have to do is say you are buying BTC to trade shitcoins like ether ect.
And while I agree the OP is over reacting it's not really legit to change the rules that are clearly written on the website. However they did send the payout BTC honoring the rules and informed the player that going forward he would have to deposit using BTC in order to get payouts in BTC.
Only thing they did was try to not pay him in BTC even though he was eligible according to the website, but then did pay him once he called them out on it so really not an issue. And as long as they informed him that going forward he is no longer able to then they obviously aren't being fradulent.
That said it's sad when people are telling other gamblers to not try and "take advantage of their rules" are you kidding me? He's not angle shooting he's just not depositing in the most profitable way (for 5dimes) . it's like people have gone mad and feel the need to defend their sportsbook..books don't need fanboy shills especially not 5dimes which is dong pretty good profit wise I'd imagine lol

Certainly not defending 5dimes given my run-ins with that operation in recent years, but OP is clearly treating them as an exchange rather than a sportsbook. Like if deposit using cc to build up reward points. Gamblers that constantly cycle deposits and withdrawals in the shortest allowable time frame are not friends of a book. It makes no sense to do that unless you have ulterior motives.