VegasDave loses another argument against me?

[daggerkobe]

VD claimed Sanchez needed to sit out this season and learn because he started only 1 season in college. I disagreed. I said he was talented and mature enough to start immediately.

Today vs. Houston:

15-26 207 YDS 1 TD

Jets up 17-0.

[jjgold]

He looks sharp as a blade

I am surprised

[daggerkobe]

18-31 272yds 1 TD 1 INT

I say he's ready.

[VegasDave]

Can you pull up that thread? I don't remember definitively saying SANCHEZ HAD TO SIT, I'm pretty sure I was just saying it is good for some young quarterback's development.

He looked great!

[Chi_archie]

I nominate Sanchez for the Hall of Fame? what are we waiting for? what more proof do we need?








by the way I think Ryan Leaf even looked decent his first two game in the NFL

[onthewhat]

Vegas Dave seems to lose a lot

[daggerkobe]

[wtf]

vd how much you PRETEND bet this weekend?

dont want to upset your family with all this fake losing

[BadNina]

I can't help but love a guy who uses the initials of Veneral Disease.

[tacomax]

VegasDave loses another argument against me?

What are the odds that Dave actually gives a shit?

[VegasDave]

What are the odds that Dave actually gives a shit?

Very high man. Very high. I'm extremely torn here. Do I...

Root FOR a USC alum that I was a big fan of while he was QBing at my alma mater who is now QBing on my father's favorite team?

Or do I root AGAINST him to "win the argument", which was basically me saying he could probably benefit from a year learning the ropes on the bench?

Hmmm...

FVCK MARK SANCHEZ!

Me winning this argument > Sanchez having a nice start to what I hope is a long and successful career.

[Chi_archie]

fvck em

[tacomax]

Dave, when he said you said Sanchez needed to sit out this season I think he's referring to this thread where you specifically said Sanchez didn't need to sit out this season.

Sanchez on the other hand is a lot more raw. While he definitely has the tools to have some success in the league, he only played in 17 games in his college career, and was only the full time starter for one season. He's more of a project type of guy that could use the seasoning and learning curve of a year on the bench, especially with a team like New York where the fans will demand perfection right from the get go.

Please show me where I made the assertion that they NEED TO SIT TO SUCCEED.

I didn't.

Plenty of QBs that sat their first year have gone on to have great careers and others have gone on to have terrible careers. Same goes for players that started from day one.

It should be taken on a case by case basis, and what is best for the player. Tons of things factor in. Obviously, all we can do is speculate from what we know from these guys in college whether we believe a year on the bench would do them good or wouldn't. It is all just speculation and educated guessing; its pretty baseless.

My opinion on these two guys based on my observations is just that; an opinion. It is no more "preposterous" then anyone else's opinion. And considering I watched every single game of Mark Sanchez's career, I don't see why I can't have an opinion on whether he is pro ready out of the gate or not.

[sickler]

Someone was busted

[tacomax]

Someone was busted

Not only busted - that is sad enough. But even sadder - he put a note in his (obviously full to the brim) diary to remind himself to start a thread here on September 13th if Mark Sanchez had a half decent first game.

Having said that, it sure as shit beats ordering 6 pounds of pens for $20 and having nothing better to do in your life than fukkin' counting each one of them.

http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/expired-deals/951315/

Ordered this few months ago and received about 285 pens.

That's still a lot of pens. Waitaminnit.... you counted them?!

Well, since I posted the deal I felt obligated to go the extra mile and let everyone know exactly what they were getting.

Plus I had a feeling they would short-change me thinking no one actually counts them. LOL

Please note that Kobedagger and daggerkobe may not be the same person. They just have similar usernames and have sported identical avatars in the past.

[Bread]

Brutal

[Mudcat]

Excellent thread.

I can sometimes get down on myself for this and that, but when I see something like this which is so sad on so many levels, it makes my life seem utterly fantastic.

[tacomax]

Excellent thread.

I can sometimes get down on myself for this and that, but when I see something like this which is so sad on so many levels, it makes my life seem utterly fantastic.

How many pens did you get, Mudcat? I'm thinking over 290. No wonder you're so fukkin' smug these days.

[Deuce]

Sanchez is prob smartest QB to come out of USC. That being said Leinhart sucks, David Booty will be a back up his entire career, Palmer has best arm.

[daggerkobe]

Originally Posted by VegasDave
Sanchez on the other hand is a lot more raw. While he definitely has the tools to have some success in the league, he only played in 17 games in his college career, and was only the full time starter for one season. He's more of a project type of guy that could use the seasoning and learning curve of a year on the bench, especially with a team like New York where the fans will demand perfection right from the get go.


This reminds me of when Mr Owl proved me "wrong" that OPEC wasn't cutting production while raising prices by posting a chart that showed OPEC was indeed cutting production while raising prices.

[daggerkobe]

Excellent thread.

I can sometimes get down on myself for this and that, but when I see something like this which is so sad on so many levels, it makes my life seem utterly fantastic.

When I'm feeling down, I just reminisce about being a mod here 10 years ago.

[durito]

Since Sanchez's college team could have beat the Raiders, surely he can start for the Jets.

[VegasDave]

So just to recap...

- I say he could probably benefit from a year on the bench
- You say he's ready to go
- I say that it's just my opinion, as it is yours, "obviously, all we can do is speculate from what we know from these guys in college whether we believe a year on the bench would do them good or wouldn't. It is all just speculation and educated guessing; its pretty baseless."
- Sanchez has a nice first game
- I "LOSE ANOTHER ARGUMENT AGAINST YOU"?

Refresh my memory, what was the first argument I lost against you?

[wtf]

vd can i borrow some pretend money, need to buy a new pretend car

thanks

[VegasDave]

vd can i borrow some pretend money, need to buy a new pretend car

thanks

I'm betting real money this season. Keep the 2008 jokes rolling though, they really are a stitch.

[daggerkobe]

1. VD says Raiders will win at least 8 games last season. I say 4 or 5 at most.

DK +1

2. DK says VD will not win more than 10 units in baseball after reading his MLB preview which are full of naivety. VD says no way, he will triple down on the "OVER 10".

DK +2

3. VD says DuMarcus Russell will be a STUD QB in the NFL. DK says DuMarcus will be a BUST. DuMarcus throws for less yards, lower completion % & TDs than Joey Harrington in their 2nd full seasons.

DK +3

4. VD says bet Purdue ML or Oregon -13 because no way Purdue covers the spread. DK laughs at this horrible advice and bets Purdue +13.

DK +4

DK +4 VD 0


There are many more but I didn't bookmark them like Mr Owl does.

[VegasDave]

1. VD says Raiders will win at least 8 games last season. I say 4 or 5 at most.

DK +1

At least? I did say I saw them going 8-8, I never said they'd win at least 8 games. I knew 4-5 was a very realistic possibility.

2. DK says VD will not win more than 10 units in baseball after reading his MLB preview which are full of naivety. VD says no way, he will triple down on the "OVER 10".

DK +2

Where the hell did I say I would "triple down" that I'd be over 10 units?!!?

3. VD says DuMarcus Russell will be a STUD QB in the NFL. DK says DuMarcus will be a BUST. DuMarcus throws for less yards, lower completion % & TDs than Joey Harrington in their 2nd full seasons.

DK +3

Uh, "DuMarcus" hasn't played in two full seasons yet. Last season was his first. I never said he was going to be a stud, ever. I just said it was too early to call him a bust.

4. VD says bet Purdue ML or Oregon -13 because no way Purdue covers the spread. DK laughs at this horrible advice and bets Purdue +13.

DK +4

I could be wrong obviously, but I think Purdue wins outright or Oregon wins by two TD's. Not really seeing Oregon win a close one here.

That's me saying there is NO WAY? "I could be wrong obviously" = no way?

You live in some kind of fantasy world, man. Misquoting people and bending everything everyone says is certainly a great way to win tons of "arguments" on the internet.

[daggerkobe]

VD.... your double-talk doesn't work on me.

You predicted at least 8 wins for the Raiders. Inserting a "I could be wrong" after every one of your predictions doesn't change the fact that you were pretty adamant that I was wrong when I predicted they'd win just 4 or 5 games.

Are you seriously going to deny that you didn't say you got the "OVER" when I posted 10o/u on your MLB winnings?

Remember this? http://forum.sbrforum.com/players-ta...ml#post1695776

Last season was DuMarcus Russell's 2nd FULL SEASON in the league. Are you going to dispute this too? I didn't say he started both season, although he started some games in his rookie season. But according to you, sitting and watching helps a rookie QB develop faster than playing, so he should've been better than Joey Harrington in his 2nd season, wouldn't you agree?

Again, you said to bet Purdue ML or Oregon -13 because no way Purdue covers the spread. Adding the "I could be wrong" after each and every prediction doesn't change the fact that your prediction was wrong. If you didn't feel that strongly about it you wouldn't have created a seperate thread for it. I mean If Brandon Lang said "I could be wrong" after each crappy pick he gives out, will that absolve him of his terrible picks? Uh, no.

I mean you are quickly becoming the Crazyl of excuses. Like when he loses bunch of tennis picks but refuses to count them in his record because they were not in his "official thread". Just like you refusing to take responsibility for your wrong predictions and your followers losing $$$$ because you keep pointing to the "I could be wrong" disclaimer as if that matters.

[konck]

vd how much you PRETEND bet this weekend?

dont want to upset your family with all this fake losing

When I was in Vegas during the Bash....VD was in the sportsbook betting a lot....

WTF you probably sit home yanking it during the weekends have fun

[daggerkobe]

Doesn't matter if he bet. What matters is HOW MUCH was he betting?

Even poor people gamble when they're in Vegas. Usually at 5¢ slots and $1 blackjack tables.

[VegasDave]

VD.... your double-talk doesn't work on me.

You predicted at least 8 wins for the Raiders. Inserting a "I could be wrong" after every one of your predictions doesn't change the fact that you were pretty adamant that I was wrong when I predicted they'd win just 4 or 5 games.

Are you seriously going to deny that you didn't say you got the "OVER" when I posted 10o/u on your MLB winnings?

Remember this? http://forum.sbrforum.com/players-ta...ml#post1695776

Last season was DuMarcus Russell's 2nd FULL SEASON in the league. Are you going to dispute this too? I didn't say he started both season, although he started some games in his rookie season. But according to you, sitting and watching helps a rookie QB develop faster than playing, so he should've been better than Joey Harrington in his 2nd season, wouldn't you agree?

Again, you said to bet Purdue ML or Oregon -13 because no way Purdue covers the spread. Adding the "I could be wrong" after each and every prediction doesn't change the fact that your prediction was wrong. If you didn't feel that strongly about it you wouldn't have created a seperate thread for it. I mean If Brandon Lang said "I could be wrong" after each crappy pick he gives out, will that absolve him of his terrible picks? Uh, no.

I mean you are quickly becoming the Crazyl of excuses. Like when he loses bunch of tennis picks but refuses to count them in his record because they were not in his "official thread". Just like you refusing to take responsibility for your wrong predictions and your followers losing $$$$ because you keep pointing to the "I could be wrong" disclaimer as if that matters.

First of all, I was WRONG about Purdue. I was WRONG about the Raiders winning 8 games. I'm not making any excuses about things I was wrong about. I'm wrong about just about 50% of the things I post. I'm just wondering how you are saying that me having an opinion on something and you having a different opinion = you winning argument.

I've NEVER claimed to be a great capper, I've always just given it my best and kept an honest record. When I'm wrong, I'm wrong.

The term FULL SEASON generally does mean as a starter when used in discussion, so clearly we just use that phrase differently. I obviously can't offer any more proof that Jamarcus won't be a bust; he may very well be. I'm just saying one season as the starter is too early to tell. Plus, you are comparing apples and oranges with him and Harrington. On a team with great success running the ball, he isn't asked to throw nearly as much.

Jamarcus's 2nd season (1st as starter):

198/368, 53.8%, 2423 yards, 13 TD, 8 INT, 77.1 QB rating

Harrington's 2nd season:

309/554, 55.8%, 2880 yards, 17 TD, 22 INT, 63.9 QB rating

Harrington threw the ball a LOT more, and made a lot more bad decisions too, thus the lower QB rating. Want to compare the two? Lets extrapolate Russell's stats to if he would have thrown the ball 550 times;

296/550, 53.8%, 3622 yards, 19 TD, 12 INT

Like I said, apples and oranges.

I don't "make excuses", when I lose I lose. And I feel strongly about every pick I make. But when you put bullshit words in my mouth like "Vegas Dave says there is no way Purdue covers", it pisses me off. Its fvcking sports. I've never guaranteed anything or said anything was a lock, and I sure as hell wouldn't say "THERE WAS NO WAY" something could happen, because in sports, anything can happen.

You want to pat yourself on the back for all the times you were right and I was wrong? Go ahead, I'm sure it's happened a million times. But don't put words in my mouth that I never said.

[Immortality]

But when you put bullshit words in my mouth like "Vegas Dave says there is no way Purdue covers", it pisses me off. Its fvcking sports. I've never guaranteed anything or said anything was a lock, and I sure as hell wouldn't say "THERE WAS NO WAY" something could happen, because in sports, anything can happen.

You want to pat yourself on the back for all the times you were right and I was wrong? Go ahead, I'm sure it's happened a million times. But don't put words in my mouth that I never said.

Dave

You are a good guy. You should not get upset over anything Dagger the douche says.

[daggerkobe]

First of all, Dave..... opinions can certainly be wrong. If someone opinioned that you couldn't jog a mile without first collapsing but you jog 1.5 miles, wouldn't that person be proven wrong?

And what do you think sports picks are? Opinions. No one can see in to the future, so everyone that posts a pick is stating their OPINION... otherwise we would all mortgage our homes and become millionaires.

Pretty much everything related to sports and sportsbetting is an OPINION. And when two people disagree, usually one is RIGHT and the other is WRONG. Just like when two teams play each other, one wins and the other loses usually (unless it's soccer and sometimes NFL).

And when we disagree about something (Raiders, DuMarcus Russell, etc.) we have had some heated exchanges where you think you are right and I think I am right. We usually frustrate each other because you strongly believe in your opinion as I do mine. So the only way to decide the disagreement is via facts/results which have almost always favored my side, which is why I feel the way I do.

But what frustrates me about you is that when you are wrong, you always point to the lame "But I could be wrong" disclaimer. When you do that all you're doing is invalidating your opinions and picks. I mean why bother posting your opinions/picks if everytime you're wrong, you just invalidate them like you didn't really mean it. At least stick to them with 100% conviction..... right or wrong. Don't be like CrazyL who proclaims himself #1 tennis capper then when he loses he makes up an idiotic rule where the losses don't count because he didn't post them in his "official thread." At least have the courage to stick to your opinion and admit when you were wrong.

As far as DuMarcus Russsell..... the fact that the Raiders didn't even trust him enough to let him throw the ball in his 2nd FULL SEASON should tell you something. I don't remember another team drafting a QB #1 overall and then being afraid to use them. It's not surprising really, since I had heard that the true football people in the organization (certainly NOT Al) were dead set against drafting DuMarcuss because they had serious doubts about his ability to read coverages.

And btw, I am NOT rooting against DuMarcus. As a Raiders fan, I HOPE he proves me wrong. I hope he passes for 4,000 yds, completing 60% and 35 TDs and leads them to a Super Bowl victory. But it will NEVER happen.

[VegasDave]

But what frustrates me about you is that when you are wrong, you always point to the lame "But I could be wrong" disclaimer. When you do that all you're doing is invalidating your opinions and picks. I mean why bother posting your opinions/picks if everytime you're wrong, you just invalidate them like you didn't really mean it. At least stick to them with 100% conviction..... right or wrong. Don't be like CrazyL who proclaims himself #1 tennis capper then when he loses he makes up an idiotic rule where the losses don't count because he didn't post them in his "official thread." At least have the courage to stick to your opinion and admit when you were wrong.

Like I said, I ALWAYS mean it. But it's also true that I COULD BE WRONG. I see what you are saying, but I also think it is irresponsible to say THIS WILL HIT I GUARANTEE IT when you can't promise anything like that. I make my opinions and stand by them, I don't lean back on the "I said I could be wrong!" The only reason I brought that up is because you quoted me as essentially saying something was a lock, when I never did.

Don't know where the Lou comparisons come from. I don't self-tout like Lou does, and I don't backtrack on my opinions either. I've never said I was the best capper ever at anything, and even with my philosophy picks which I'm very confident in, I don't talk nearly the shit he does. It's not my style. I always keep an accurate record no matter what happens, and don't have any loopholes regarding what counts and what doesn't.

Anyway, you are a cool dude man. Seems like most of our differences are based on mis-communication as we just word things differently or whatever. So it goes.

Obviously we both want to see Jamarcus and Sanchez do well, and we both want to see eachother win and make lots of money. We just may disagree on a few points along the way .

[daggerkobe]

No, I never said you called it a lock or guarantee. But anyways... No hard feelings.
I still like you, Dave.


Go Raiders & Sanchez.