Donk's ELO Point Spread System

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  • Notorious_Donk
    SBR MVP
    • 03-29-11
    • 2689

    #1
    Donk's ELO Point Spread System
    Last year I closely followed point spreads generated by FiveThirtyEight and decided to continue this year. For those of you who don't know, FiveThirtyEight is a website that does countless numbers of projections including NFL. They have an Elo point spread system where they generate a point spread for every NFL game based on team skill level, previous games, and locations of each game.

    Since I like to crunch numbers when I get bored, I decided to compare the Elo point spreads with the closing odds from Vegas. As a result, I created 3 types of wagers based on the system. I was not planning on posting the results of this system anytime soon, however, after 3 weeks of NFL I actually have some interesting results. Here are the three types of wagers...

    FOX: name derived from FiveThirtyEight's logo; this wager is when Elo has the same projected winner as Vegas, but Elo has a larger spread
    PIG: first three-letter animal I could think of; this wager is when Elo has the same projected winner as Vegas, but has a smaller spread than Vegas.
    DOG: named because this wager is technically the underdog; this wager is when Elo and Vegas have different projected winners based on the spread.

    If this is confusing right now, I promise there will be much more clarity once the results are posted. Again, this system was only created because I got bored one night and simply started crunching numbers. I have created a few "systems" in the past, including a MLB first inning system being very successful. However, I have also had some systems completely flop.

    As of now, this system is being entirely used for tracking but feel free to tail if you would like. Depending on how the system progresses throughout the season, I may lay down real wagers. Questions, comments, and concerns are more than welcome. Without further ado...
  • Notorious_Donk
    SBR MVP
    • 03-29-11
    • 2689

    #2
    WEEK 1

    ELO VEGAS PLAY FOX/PIG/DOG W/L
    DEN -2.5 CAR -3 DEN DOG W
    BAL -1 BAL -3 BUF PIG L
    HOU -5 HOU -5.5 - - -
    NYJ -0.5 CIN -1 NYJ DOG PUSH
    PHI -6.5 PHI -3.5 PHI FOX W
    GB -5 GB -3.5 GB FOX W
    MIN -6 MIN -2.5 MIN FOX W
    NO -3 NO -3 - - -
    KC -10 KC -6.5 KC FOX L
    ATL -5.5 ATL -2.5 ATL FOX L
    SEA -10.5 SEA -10.5 - - -
    IND -2 IND -2.5 - - -
    DAL -1.5 NYG -1 DAL DOG PUSH
    ARI -3 ARI -9 NE PIG W
    PIT -1 PIT -2.5 WSH PIG L
    SF -1 LA -2.5 SF DOG W


























    FOX: 3-2 - 60%
    PIG: 1-2 - 33.3%
    DOG: 2-0 - 100%

    2 pushes
    4 no plays
    Comment
    • Notorious_Donk
      SBR MVP
      • 03-29-11
      • 2689

      #3
      WEEK 2
      FOX: 5-3
      PIG: 1-2
      DOG: 2-0

      YTD
      FOX: 8-5 - 61.5%
      PIG: 2-4 - 33.3%
      DOG: 4-0 - 100%

      ELO VEGAS PLAY FOX/PIG/DOG W/L
      BUF -2 pk BUF FOX L
      BAL -2 BAL -4.5 CLE PIG L
      PIT -4 PIT -3 PIT FOX W
      WSH -4 WSH -3.5 - - -
      KC -1.5 pk KC FOX L
      NE -10 NE -6 NE FOX W
      NYG -3.5 NYG -4 - - -
      CAR -9 CAR -12.5 SF PIG L
      DET -10 DET -6 DET FOX L
      SEA -5 SEA -5.5 - - -
      ARI -9 ARI -7 ARI FOX W
      OAK -3 OAK -4 ATL PIG W
      DEN -9.5 DEN -6 DEN FOX W
      SD -4.5 SD -3 SD FOX W
      MIN -2 GB -2 MIN DOG W
      PHI -0.5 CHI -3 PHI DOG W
      Comment
      • Notorious_Donk
        SBR MVP
        • 03-29-11
        • 2689

        #4
        Week 3

        week 3
        fox: 3-0
        pig: 6-3
        dog: 1-0

        ytd
        fox: 11-5 - 68.75%
        pig: 8-7 - 53.3%
        dog: 5-0 - 100%

        elo vegas play fox/pig/dog w/l
        ne -6 ne -1 ne fox w
        ari -3 ari -5.5 buf pig w
        bal -3.5 bal -2 bal fox push
        mia -5 mia -10 cle pig w
        den -0.5 cin -3.5 den dog w
        gb -5.5 gb -6.5 det pig l
        car -4.5 car -6.5 min pig w
        oak -1 oak -1.5 - - -
        nyg -4 nyg -3.5 - - -
        tb -0.5 tb -3.5 la pig w
        sea -8.5 sea -10.5 sf pig l
        kc -5 kc -3 kc fox w
        pit -1.5 pit -4 phi pig w
        ind -2.5 ind -1.5 ind fox w
        dal -5 dal -6.5 chi pig l
        no -1 no -3 atl pig w
        Comment
        • Notorious_Donk
          SBR MVP
          • 03-29-11
          • 2689

          #5
          The dashes in the table represent a 'no play', because the Elo and Vegas spreads are too close to determine a clear projection. Here are the YTD results after 3 weeks of NFL...

          FOX: 11-5 - 68.75%
          PIG: 8-7 - 53.33%
          DOG: 5-0 - 100% (!!)

          After an eye test and before I actually calculated the numbers, I initially thought the FOX plays would have the best success but the DOG plays have been on fire. I'm looking forward to Sunday.
          Comment
          • Notorious_Donk
            SBR MVP
            • 03-29-11
            • 2689

            #6
            Thursday night football was a NO PLAY tonight. Elo and Vegas spreads were too close.

            Elo: CIN -7
            Vegas: CIN -7.5
            Comment
            • Notorious_Donk
              SBR MVP
              • 03-29-11
              • 2689

              #7
              NFL Week 4: Status Update

              Looking ahead to Week 4, I compared the point spreads to my local and here are the plays as we stand right now. THESE ARE NOT OFFICIAL PLAYS.

              FOX: IND -2.5, NE -6.5, BAL -3, HOU -4.5, DEN -3, MIN -5
              PIG: ATL +3, CLE +8, NYJ +2.5, STL +7.5, KC +4.5
              DOG: SF +1.5
              Comment
              • Notorious_Donk
                SBR MVP
                • 03-29-11
                • 2689

                #8
                NFL Week 4 Update

                FOX: 3-3
                PIG: 3-1
                DOG: 0-1
                ---------------
                TOTAL = 6-5


                ***Minnesota will be a FOX play tonight as long as they don't become over 8 pt favorites.
                Comment
                • Notorious_Donk
                  SBR MVP
                  • 03-29-11
                  • 2689

                  #9
                  NFL Week 4 Results

                  FOX = 4-3
                  PIG = 3-1
                  DOG = 0-1
                  ----------------
                  TOTAL = 7-5 58.3%

                  YTD
                  FOX = 15-8 65.2%
                  PIG = 11-8 57.9%
                  DOG = 5-1 83.3%

                  ELO VEGAS PLAY FOX/PIG/DOG W/L
                  IND -4.5 IND -1 IND FOX L
                  NE -8 NE -3.5 NE FOX L
                  CAR -1 CAR -3 ATL PIG W
                  WSH -7 WSH -7.5 - - -
                  DET -2 DET -3.5 CHI PIG W
                  BAL -5 BAL -3.5 BAL FOX L
                  SEA -1.5 pk SEA FOX W
                  HOU -10.5 HOU -4 HOU FOX W
                  DEN -8 DEN -3.5 DEN FOX W
                  SF -1.5 DAL -1.5 SF DOG L
                  ARI -6 ARI -9.5 LA PIG W
                  SD -3.5 SD -4 - - -
                  PIT -1.5 PIT -3.5 KC PIG L
                  MIN -9 MIN -4 MIN FOX W
                  Comment
                  • Notorious_Donk
                    SBR MVP
                    • 03-29-11
                    • 2689

                    #10
                    year to date total = 31-17 64.6%
                    Comment
                    • Eric22174
                      SBR MVP
                      • 10-01-10
                      • 1334

                      #11
                      Thanks. Interested to see what you got for this week.
                      Comment
                      • jaydiz21
                        SBR High Roller
                        • 08-13-12
                        • 182

                        #12
                        same here please keep them coming this is very interesting. thanks
                        Comment
                        • Notorious_Donk
                          SBR MVP
                          • 03-29-11
                          • 2689

                          #13
                          NFL Week 5: Thursday Night Football

                          ELO spread: ARI -2.5
                          Vegas spread: ARI -3.5

                          Currently, the TNF play is San Francisco as long as they stay 3.5+ pt underdogs. If the line drops below 3.5 there will be no play. We will see how the line moves as we get closer to kickoff.
                          Comment
                          • Eric22174
                            SBR MVP
                            • 10-01-10
                            • 1334

                            #14
                            What site do you use for the line?
                            Comment
                            • Notorious_Donk
                              SBR MVP
                              • 03-29-11
                              • 2689

                              #15
                              Originally posted by Eric22174
                              What site do you use for the line?
                              I use my local guy, but as a secondary i've been using vegasinsider . com
                              Comment
                              • Notorious_Donk
                                SBR MVP
                                • 03-29-11
                                • 2689

                                #16
                                NFL Week 5: Thursday Night Football Play

                                PIG: San Francisco +3.5
                                Comment
                                • ericool007
                                  SBR High Roller
                                  • 09-21-11
                                  • 220

                                  #17
                                  san fran is terrible how they managed to get blown away at home by a drew stanton.
                                  anyways keep em coming.
                                  Comment
                                  • Notorious_Donk
                                    SBR MVP
                                    • 03-29-11
                                    • 2689

                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by ericool007
                                    san fran is terrible how they managed to get blown away at home by a drew stanton.
                                    anyways keep em coming.
                                    Yeah I wasn't very confident in that pick but again this is for tracking purposes only, tail at your own risk
                                    Comment
                                    • Notorious_Donk
                                      SBR MVP
                                      • 03-29-11
                                      • 2689

                                      #19
                                      Nfl week 5

                                      Picks are a little late, it was a long night. Whiskey beer and moonshine will make you feel some type of way.

                                      Here are the plays for Sunday

                                      FOX:
                                      MIN -6
                                      MIA -2.5
                                      DEN -4
                                      GB -7

                                      PIG:
                                      SF +4
                                      CLE +10
                                      NYJ +9.5
                                      DET +3.5
                                      CIN +2.5


                                      DOG:
                                      LA +2.5
                                      Comment
                                      • Notorious_Donk
                                        SBR MVP
                                        • 03-29-11
                                        • 2689

                                        #20
                                        (My personal play is GB -6.5. I'll be in attendance at Lambeau tonight, expect Green Bay to make a statement tonight. Giants coming off a very physical game against Minnesota and Aaron Rodgers is coming off a bye week. Great value at 6.5 IMO. Cheers)

                                        Comment
                                        • Notorious_Donk
                                          SBR MVP
                                          • 03-29-11
                                          • 2689

                                          #21
                                          Originally posted by Notorious_Donk
                                          Picks are a little late, it was a long night. Whiskey beer and moonshine will make you feel some type of way.

                                          Here are the plays for Sunday

                                          FOX:
                                          MIN -6
                                          MIA -2.5
                                          DEN -4
                                          GB -7

                                          PIG:
                                          SF +4
                                          CLE +10
                                          NYJ +9.5
                                          DET +3.5
                                          CIN +2.5


                                          DOG:
                                          LA +2.5
                                          It was a very rough Sunday for the system, but thats the way she goes. Gotta ride the waves. Here is the MNF play...

                                          MNF
                                          Panthers -6 (FOX)
                                          Comment
                                          • Notorious_Donk
                                            SBR MVP
                                            • 03-29-11
                                            • 2689

                                            #22
                                            NFL WEEK 5 RESULTS

                                            MNF: Panthers -6 (FOX) LOSS

                                            FOX: 1-3
                                            PIG: 1-4
                                            DOG: 0-1
                                            ---------------
                                            TOTAL: 2-8 20%


                                            YTD RESULTS


                                            FOX: 16-11
                                            PIG: 12-12
                                            DOG: 5-2
                                            ---------------
                                            YTD TOTAL: 33-25 56.9%
                                            Comment
                                            • Notorious_Donk
                                              SBR MVP
                                              • 03-29-11
                                              • 2689

                                              #23
                                              MNF displayed a huge flaw in the system and explained why I hated the pick. The elo system does not take injuries into account because it only looks at past games and how they played against those specific opponents. So the elo spread of 6 favoring Carolina (theoretically) had no idea that Scam Newton was not playing.

                                              Going forward, I will not take those plays into account. If a significant player (such as Scam or Gronk) is out AND played the previous week, that play will not count towards the system. Remember, the elo point spreads are a 'benchmark' so i'm simply trying to figure out a trend that is profitable and injuries can definitely impact that trend.

                                              If yall have any suggestions or questions just let me know.
                                              Comment
                                              • Notorious_Donk
                                                SBR MVP
                                                • 03-29-11
                                                • 2689

                                                #24
                                                NFL WEEK 6 ELO SPREADS

                                                Broncos -6.5
                                                Giants -1.5
                                                Panthers -2.5
                                                Patriots -5.5
                                                Titans -4
                                                Bears -3.5
                                                Lions -2.5
                                                Redskins pk
                                                Steelers -7.5
                                                Bills -10
                                                Chiefs -2
                                                Seahawks -5.5
                                                Packers -5.5
                                                Texans -5
                                                Cardinals -6
                                                Comment
                                                • Notorious_Donk
                                                  SBR MVP
                                                  • 03-29-11
                                                  • 2689

                                                  #25
                                                  Originally posted by Notorious_Donk
                                                  MNF displayed a huge flaw in the system and explained why I hated the pick. The elo system does not take injuries into account because it only looks at past games and how they played against those specific opponents. So the elo spread of 6 favoring Carolina (theoretically) had no idea that Scam Newton was not playing.

                                                  Going forward, I will not take those plays into account. If a significant player (such as Scam or Gronk) is out AND played the previous week, that play will not count towards the system. Remember, the elo point spreads are a 'benchmark' so i'm simply trying to figure out a trend that is profitable and injuries can definitely impact that trend.

                                                  If yall have any suggestions or questions just let me know.
                                                  Also, Cleveland should not have been a play this past weekend because the system never accounted for Tim Brady being back under center. The system was rating New England based on how they have been with Garappolo and Brisset. Yes they did pretty good with those two QBs, but its a fair argument to say they would have performed better with Brady.

                                                  So with this change, Fox plays YTD should be 16-10 and Pig plays YTD should be 12-11.
                                                  Comment
                                                  • Notorious_Donk
                                                    SBR MVP
                                                    • 03-29-11
                                                    • 2689

                                                    #26
                                                    NFL Week 6: TNF Play

                                                    Broncos -3 (FOX)
                                                    Comment
                                                    • Notorious_Donk
                                                      SBR MVP
                                                      • 03-29-11
                                                      • 2689

                                                      #27
                                                      Broncos -3 (FOX) LOSS
                                                      Comment
                                                      • ericool007
                                                        SBR High Roller
                                                        • 09-21-11
                                                        • 220

                                                        #28
                                                        not a good past week lol
                                                        Comment
                                                        • Notorious_Donk
                                                          SBR MVP
                                                          • 03-29-11
                                                          • 2689

                                                          #29
                                                          Originally posted by ericool007
                                                          not a good past week lol
                                                          Not good at all. I sense a turn around happening real quick tho
                                                          Comment
                                                          • Eric22174
                                                            SBR MVP
                                                            • 10-01-10
                                                            • 1334

                                                            #30
                                                            When do you post the picks?
                                                            Comment
                                                            • Notorious_Donk
                                                              SBR MVP
                                                              • 03-29-11
                                                              • 2689

                                                              #31
                                                              NFL Week 6 Update

                                                              MNF Pending Play: Jets +7 (only 7 and higher, otherwise no play)

                                                              Broncos -3 (FOX) LOSS
                                                              Baltimore +3.5 (PIG) LOSS
                                                              Bengals +7.5 (PIG) LOSS
                                                              Browns +7.5 (PIG) LOSS
                                                              Bears -2.5 (FOX) LOSS
                                                              Redskins +3 (DOG) WIN
                                                              Bills -7.5 (FOX) WIN
                                                              Falcons +7 (PIG) WIN
                                                              Texans -3 (FOX) PUSH

                                                              FOX: 1-2-1
                                                              PIG: 1-3
                                                              DOG: 1-0
                                                              ---------------
                                                              TOTAL: 3-5-1 (one pending play)
                                                              Comment
                                                              • Notorious_Donk
                                                                SBR MVP
                                                                • 03-29-11
                                                                • 2689

                                                                #32
                                                                Originally posted by Eric22174
                                                                When do you post the picks?
                                                                I post the picks whenever I get a chance. Usually I write them down a hour or two before the game but dont always have the time to post them on here
                                                                Comment
                                                                • Notorious_Donk
                                                                  SBR MVP
                                                                  • 03-29-11
                                                                  • 2689

                                                                  #33
                                                                  Originally posted by Notorious_Donk
                                                                  NFL Week 6 Update

                                                                  MNF Pending Play: Jets +7 (only 7 and higher, otherwise no play)

                                                                  Broncos -3 (FOX) LOSS
                                                                  Baltimore +3.5 (PIG) LOSS
                                                                  Bengals +7.5 (PIG) LOSS
                                                                  Browns +7.5 (PIG) LOSS
                                                                  Bears -2.5 (FOX) LOSS
                                                                  Redskins +3 (DOG) WIN
                                                                  Bills -7.5 (FOX) WIN
                                                                  Falcons +7 (PIG) WIN
                                                                  Texans -3 (FOX) PUSH

                                                                  FOX: 1-2-1
                                                                  PIG: 1-3
                                                                  DOG: 1-0
                                                                  ---------------
                                                                  TOTAL: 3-5-1 (one pending play)
                                                                  NFL Week 6 Results

                                                                  MNF: Jets +7 (PIG) LOSS

                                                                  Jets are garbage, plain and simple. Waste of a good defense. Once again I didn't agree with the system pick but i'm not laying any wood on these plays, just for tracking purposes only. After being very profitable through the first 4 weeks, the system has gotten absolutely shelled the previous 2 weeks. Here are the YTD numbers below

                                                                  FOX: 17-13
                                                                  PIG: 13-16
                                                                  DOG: 6-2
                                                                  ---------------
                                                                  TOTAL: 36-31
                                                                  Comment
                                                                  • Notorious_Donk
                                                                    SBR MVP
                                                                    • 03-29-11
                                                                    • 2689

                                                                    #34
                                                                    NFL Week 7 Elo Spreads

                                                                    Packers -10
                                                                    Rams -0.5
                                                                    Jets -2.5
                                                                    Bills -4
                                                                    Bengals -10.5
                                                                    Colts -0.5
                                                                    Vikings -2
                                                                    Chiefs -9.5
                                                                    Raiders -0.5
                                                                    Lions -1.5
                                                                    Falcons -7
                                                                    49ers -1.5
                                                                    Steelers -1
                                                                    Cardinals -0.5
                                                                    Broncos -6.5
                                                                    Comment
                                                                    • CamNewtonOutfit
                                                                      SBR Wise Guy
                                                                      • 09-26-16
                                                                      • 525

                                                                      #35
                                                                      Thanks for the info, I didnt realize the ELO spread was different than the vegas spread. Good stuff.
                                                                      Comment
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