Strikeforce: Barnett vs. Cormier

**Jordan23** · 01-05-12, 06:11 PM

I think a lot of people are underrating Josh's stand-up as well. He has pretty good stand up and that's where Cormier is going to want to keep this fight. I could see Cormier going for some takedowns in the later part of the rounds to try to steal a round or two, but he doesn't want to play the ground game with Josh. Josh is mostly known for his top control but I doubt Cormier will want to test Josh's guard.

**The HOFF** · 01-05-12, 06:17 PM

Tell me what to do:

I have a 4u bet on Overeem to win Grand Prix. - Obviously that's a loss.

I have a 4u bet on Barnett to win Grand Prix at +400. 16u-4u= 12u if Barnett wins.

How much do I put on Cormier?

**Vaughany** · 01-05-12, 06:25 PM

Originally posted by Jordan23

I think a lot of people are underrating Josh's stand-up as well. He has pretty good stand up and that's where Cormier is going to want to keep this fight. I could see Cormier going for some takedowns in the later part of the rounds to try to steal a round or two, but he doesn't want to play the ground game with Josh. Josh is mostly known for his top control but I doubt Cormier will want to test Josh's guard.

I think Cormier taking Barnett down would be a great strategy. Barnett probably wouldn't expect it and with Cormier's wrestling and power he'd be able to keep control and do some damage on top. Barnet isn't going to triangle or armbar Cormier off his back.

**PunisherIND** · 01-05-12, 07:59 PM

Originally posted by Jordan23

I think a lot of people are underrating Josh's stand-up as well. He has pretty good stand up and that's where Cormier is going to want to keep this fight. I could see Cormier going for some takedowns in the later part of the rounds to try to steal a round or two, but he doesn't want to play the ground game with Josh. Josh is mostly known for his top control but I doubt Cormier will want to test Josh's guard.

this is an interesting angle you bring up, and it will probably have a direct effect on how the fight plays out. is cormier really afraid of barnett's guard and will he be content to keep this a stand up fight? or is he confident in enough in his submission defense that he will go for steady takedowns?

does anyone recall josh being in guard?

**PunisherIND** · 01-05-12, 08:04 PM

Originally posted by Vaughany

I think Cormier taking Barnett down would be a great strategy. Barnett probably wouldn't expect it and with Cormier's wrestling and power he'd be able to keep control and do some damage on top. Barnet isn't going to triangle or armbar Cormier off his back.

i agree with this completely, but again, i dont recall seeing any footage of barnett working off his back. im sure he must have in the pride days. anyone remember?

**Jordan23** · 01-05-12, 11:09 PM

If I'm not mistaken I think Big Nog took him down.

**caveira** · 01-06-12, 04:27 PM

I see a good value on Cormier, he probably will stand up this fight and if the things goes bad, he still has the takedown possiblity.

**Kaladarus** · 01-06-12, 07:31 PM

Originally posted by The HOFF

Tell me what to do:

I have a 4u bet on Overeem to win Grand Prix. - Obviously that's a loss.

I have a 4u bet on Barnett to win Grand Prix at +400. 16u-4u= 12u if Barnett wins.

How much do I put on Cormier?

I think you should let it ride.

If you want to play it safe maybe like 5-6u on Cormier if you like Barnett or like 9-10u on Cormier if you like him.

**PunisherIND** · 01-16-12, 03:39 PM

i really like rousey under -300. i dont see anyone stopping those relentless armbar attempts. sure, she hasnt fought someone on the level of tate, but she's also been steamrolling these girls at 145, and is moving down to 135 for this fight. doubt we'll get props for this event, but rousey by sub would be the ideal play.

**Vaughany** · 01-16-12, 04:10 PM

Originally posted by PunisherIND

i really like rousey under -300. i dont see anyone stopping those relentless armbar attempts. sure, she hasnt fought someone on the level of tate, but she's also been steamrolling these girls at 145, and is moving down to 135 for this fight. doubt we'll get props for this event, but rousey by sub would be the ideal play.

Yeah, Tate's only chance is in the stand-up and catching Rousey early with a head-kick or something or somehow out-pointing her. If she uses her wrestling (which is her strength) I can only foresee her getting reversed and submitted or arm-barred.

**Beelzebubzy** · 01-16-12, 04:19 PM

Originally posted by Vaughany

Yeah, Tate's only chance is in the stand-up and catching Rousey early with a head-kick or something or somehow out-pointing her. If she uses her wrestling (which is her strength) I can only foresee her getting reversed and submitted or arm-barred.

or someother submission. One could also argue that Ronda Rousey-Bubzy will have the strength adavantage due to the weight cut as well as the years of Judo training.

I am on Ronda here(ok not literally but I wish) because I believe her skills have translated well so far. Meisha is going to have to run away for about a round or so and hope that Ronda gasses and is able to outstrike her. But IMO, this is a stylstic nightmare for Tate

**ghost kid** · 01-16-12, 06:09 PM

Devil's Advocate. Rousey hasn't been at 135 since high school. She now has 6 weeks. Cut should be interesting, to say the least. Waiting on the weigh-in for this event before wagering. Hopefully Showtime/Strikeforce gets their crap together and airs the weigh-ins on ShoExtreme. They should be able to spare 30 minutes of time, since all they run are old crappy action flix.

UFC on Fuel has been fantastic. Basically their own channel.

**MMAbetMASTA** · 01-16-12, 07:18 PM

Originally posted by PunisherIND

i really like rousey under -300. i dont see anyone stopping those relentless armbar attempts. sure, she hasnt fought someone on the level of tate, but she's also been steamrolling these girls at 145, and is moving down to 135 for this fight. doubt we'll get props for this event, but rousey by sub would be the ideal play.

I think some are underestimating tate's pure grappling skills. Everyone called me crazy for saying tate's jitz was better than coenen's and that she might hand her the first sub loss, and it happened. Her grappling is very underrated. Tate's a wrestler, but what's scary is a wrestler who's naturally adapted bjj (or they don't call it bjj at team alpha right? lol) and has used it effectively in her wrestling and top positional control.

I don't know enough about ronda outside of her pre-mma credentials, one fight I've seen, and what I have read on a fight finder (and I know she's a new comer, but her competition is less than stellar and tate's a HUGe step up who's fought vastly superior comp).

Yet it appears ronda's got the one gold gift - armbar. Somethign tells me tate is aware of this and I think her grappling might be competent enough to defend it. However, I could see size being an issue as ronda appears pretty thick and I'm assuming her judo gives her a great base and balance, so if tate does feel confident enough to take it down and fight on top - she might not be so successful or could succemb to being on her back under a larger woman, which I think is definitely tate's weakest area and the last place she wants to be against ronda . This is what scares me, as I know tate isn't a big 135er at all and that ronda might muscle her around. But like someone else said, ronda's size and first cut since high school could be detrimental and might benefit tate in the end...ronda could fade / gas past the first and tate could very well feel confident, get a td, and control her on top.

I'm gonna research ronda more, but if tate survives the first round I think her chances of winning go up dramatically as there are a lot of 'ifs' and questions surrounding ronda, or at least to me there are. I think it would be crazy to pay such a high price on a woman who is quite new and is fihgting a woman who is arguably one of the most well rounded female mma athletes.

To me, right now the value is clearly on tate... the pick on paper might be ronda and I can see why people favor her, but again she is being way overvalued and you're playing with fire by paying that juice imo. Not saying I'm gonna play tate, but I'm definitely not gonna take ronda at that price.

**MMAbetMASTA** · 01-17-12, 08:59 PM

Originally posted by MMAbetMASTA

I think some are underestimating tate's pure grappling skills. Everyone called me crazy for saying tate's jitz was better than coenen's and that she might hand her the first sub loss, and it happened. Her grappling is very underrated. Tate's a wrestler, but what's scary is a wrestler who's naturally adapted bjj (or they don't call it bjj at team alpha right? lol) and has used it effectively in her wrestling and top positional control.

I don't know enough about ronda outside of her pre-mma credentials, one fight I've seen, and what I have read on a fight finder (and I know she's a new comer, but her competition is less than stellar and tate's a HUGe step up who's fought vastly superior comp).

Yet it appears ronda's got the one gold gift - armbar. Somethign tells me tate is aware of this and I think her grappling might be competent enough to defend it. However, I could see size being an issue as ronda appears pretty thick and I'm assuming her judo gives her a great base and balance, so if tate does feel confident enough to take it down and fight on top - she might not be so successful or could succemb to being on her back under a larger woman, which I think is definitely tate's weakest area and the last place she wants to be against ronda . This is what scares me, as I know tate isn't a big 135er at all and that ronda might muscle her around. But like someone else said, ronda's size and first cut since high school could be detrimental and might benefit tate in the end...ronda could fade / gas past the first and tate could very well feel confident, get a td, and control her on top.

I'm gonna research ronda more, but if tate survives the first round I think her chances of winning go up dramatically as there are a lot of 'ifs' and questions surrounding ronda, or at least to me there are. I think it would be crazy to pay such a high price on a woman who is quite new and is fihgting a woman who is arguably one of the most well rounded female mma athletes.

To me, right now the value is clearly on tate... the pick on paper might be ronda and I can see why people favor her, but again she is being way overvalued and you're playing with fire by paying that juice imo. Not saying I'm gonna play tate, but I'm definitely not gonna take ronda at that price.

I formally retract much of what I've said in the above...

I watched a bunch of ronda's videos, both fighting and training, and wow.... she has some slick, slick grappling moves, so smooth and so powerful.

I was saying people might be underestimating tate's grappling, which I still believe is highly underestimated, but now after seeing more of ronda I definitely think she has a vast edge in technique and strenght.

Still wouldn't touch her at that price, as I think tate's chances go up dramatically if she survives the first, gets wet, and ronda loses some steam... But I would def favor ronda at this point and I was wrong with much of my assessment above I think... Tate will be game, but I'm favoring ronda and see why so many of you were big on her.

**PunisherIND** · 01-17-12, 09:25 PM

Originally posted by MMAbetMASTA

I formally retract much of what I've said in the above...

I watched a bunch of ronda's videos, both fighting and training, and wow.... she has some slick, slick grappling moves, so smooth and so powerful.

I was saying people might be underestimating tate's grappling, which I still believe is highly underestimated, but now after seeing more of ronda I definitely think she has a vast edge in technique and strenght.

Still wouldn't touch her at that price, as I think tate's chances go up dramatically if she survives the first, gets wet, and ronda loses some steam... But I would def favor ronda at this point and I was wrong with much of my assessment above I think... Tate will be game, but I'm favoring ronda and see why so many of you were big on her.

i would love a rousey wins in round 1 prop, also rousey by sub. dont think we are getting props though.

**Vaughany** · 01-18-12, 03:24 AM

Originally posted by MMAbetMASTA

I formally retract much of what I've said in the above...

I watched a bunch of ronda's videos, both fighting and training, and wow.... she has some slick, slick grappling moves, so smooth and so powerful.

I was saying people might be underestimating tate's grappling, which I still believe is highly underestimated, but now after seeing more of ronda I definitely think she has a vast edge in technique and strenght.

Still wouldn't touch her at that price, as I think tate's chances go up dramatically if she survives the first, gets wet, and ronda loses some steam... But I would def favor ronda at this point and I was wrong with much of my assessment above I think... Tate will be game, but I'm favoring ronda and see why so many of you were big on her.

God, I hope she survives and gets wet