Valands World Soccer Chase System

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  • Valand
    SBR High Roller
    • 05-25-11
    • 238

    #1
    Valands World Soccer Chase System
    Hi, I'm going to start to post my soccer system here instead of just writing it down in my sportbook. The system is a chase system were I scan the games of Europe soccer leagues and look at results with a zero in it a shutout. So a example if Tottenham wins 1-0 and then plays D,L and L I then check the stats of how the team performs after a 1-0 win and see that they W the worst time 2004-5 after 6 games between the 1-0 result. So that means a D bet at worst. I followed a shut out system with similar idea for baseball but here I have taken the filter of three matches as a safe barrier.

    so here is the recent win I had with Tottenham a B bet beating Fulham 4.12. As you can see the lost 6-0 against Man C. So let's check just saw this the three game filter is their. From 3-0, 4-0 L the always loose at a D maximum and that is only one L on 3-0 the have never lost by this much the last ten years in premier league.

    Game:
    A: Tottenham L vs Liverpool waiting on line 15.12

    post more games tomorrow Lorient and more
  • Valand
    SBR High Roller
    • 05-25-11
    • 238

    #2
    I have had 10 wins starting the 4.12:
    Man U L, 1,5 units
    Man C W (A) 1,5 u
    Spurs W 1,5 u
    Genclerbigli D, 1,5
    Roma W, 1,5
    Fc gröningen L, 1 u
    Lille L, 1,1 u
    Udinese D, 3,22 u
    Genoa L, 1 u

    Comment
    • Valand
      SBR High Roller
      • 05-25-11
      • 238

      #3
      A Inter, W, 1.5 u +322
      C Inter, L, 2,02 u -104
      C Roma,L, 3,47 u +135
      B Real Valladolid W, 0,95 u +146
      B Osasuna, D, 2,1 u +560
      B Villareal, L, 0,8 u -327
      B Levante, W, 1 u +133
      C Nacional de Madeira ,W, 4,07 u +107
      C Frieburg ,W, 1,83 u +746
      C Levadiakos,D, 2,02 u no line
      B Man U, W, 5,92 u -131
      B Everton,L, 2,77 u +926
      B Arsenal,L, 1,45 u +158 (Against Napoli all other league games)
      C Nice, W, 1,73 u no line
      A Lorient, L , 1,8 + 297
      Comment
      • Valand
        SBR High Roller
        • 05-25-11
        • 238

        #4
        C Frieburg should be a Draw ,D, no line
        Comment
        • Valand
          SBR High Roller
          • 05-25-11
          • 238

          #5
          B Arsenal,L, W 1,2 u up
          Comment
          • Valand
            SBR High Roller
            • 05-25-11
            • 238

            #6
            More plays that I have found:

            A Inter, W, 1.5 u +322
            C Inter, L, 2,02 u -104
            C Roma,L, 3,47 u +135
            B Real Valladolid W, 0,95 u +146
            B Osasuna, D, 2,1 u +560
            B Villareal, L, 0,8 u -327
            B Levante, W, 1 u +133
            A Athletic Bilbao, L , 1,1 u + 100
            A Betis, W , 1,8 u + 374
            A Celta Vigo, D , 1,5 u + 243
            A Espanyol ,D , 1,0 u + 232
            A Real sociedad, D , 1,0 u + 305
            A Sevilla, L , 1,2 u + 184 (12.12 vs Frieburg )
            C Nacional de Madeira ,W, 4,07 u +107
            A Sporting Braga, D , 3,5 u +403
            C Levadiakos,D, 2,02 u +277
            A Tottenham, L, 1,1 u no line
            B Man U, W, 5,92 u -131
            B Everton,L, 2,77 u +926
            B Arsenal,L, 1,45 u +158 (vs Napoli CL) W
            A Wolfsburg, L , 1,0 u + 386
            C Frieburg, D , 1,83 u + 248 (12.12 vs Sevilla)
            C Nice, W , 1,73 u -128
            A Lorient, L , 1,8 u + 297
            A PSV, W , 1,2 u -138 (12.12 vs Chornomorets Odessa)
            Comment
            • Valand
              SBR High Roller
              • 05-25-11
              • 238

              #7
              OK,

              A PSV, W , 1,2 u -138 (12.12 vs Chornomorets Odessa) L
              C Frieburg, D , 1,83 u + 248 (12.12 vs Sevilla) L
              A Sevilla, L , 1,2 u + 184 (12.12 vs Frieburg ) L


              B PSV, W ,2,85 u +115 vs Utrecht
              DFrieburg, D , 2,56 u + 398 vs Shalke 04 (still only 2,56 u, Draw series is less juice and can go longer then D bet)
              B Sevilla, L , 1.85 u + 296 vs Athletic Bilbao

              A Tottenham, L, 1,1 u +204 vs Liverpool

              Have a great Weekend!
              Comment
              • Valand
                SBR High Roller
                • 05-25-11
                • 238

                #8
                A Inter, W, 1.5 u +322 L
                C Inter, L, 2,02 u -104 W
                C Roma,L, 3,47 u +135 L
                B Real Valladolid W, 0,95 u +146 W
                B Osasuna, D, 2,1 u +560 W
                B Villareal, L, 0,8 u -327 W
                B Levante, W, 1 u +133 W
                A Athletic Bilbao, L , 1,1 u + 100 L
                A Betis, W , 1,8 u + 374 L
                A Celta Vigo, D , 1,5 u + 243 L
                A Espanyol ,D , 1,0 u + 232 W
                A Real sociedad, D , 1,0 u + 305 L
                B Sevilla, L , 1.85 u + 296 L
                C Nacional de Madeira ,W, 4,07 u +107 W
                A Sporting Braga, D , 3,5 u +403 L
                C Levadiakos,D, 2,02 u +277 L
                A Tottenham, L, 1,1 u +204 W
                B Man U, W, 5,92 u -131 W
                B Everton,L, 2,77 u +926 L
                A Tottenham, L, 1,1 u +204 W
                B Arsenal,L, 1,45 u +158 (vs Napoli CL) W
                A Wolfsburg, L , 1,0 u + 386 L
                DFrieburg, D , 2,56 u + 398 L
                C Nice, W , 1,73 u -128 W
                A Lorient, L , 1,8 u + 297 L
                B PSV, W ,2,85 u +115 W

                Good weekend! System + 29.89 since 04.12.2013
                Comment
                • Valand
                  SBR High Roller
                  • 05-25-11
                  • 238

                  #9
                  B Inter, W, 1.96 u no line 22.12
                  D Roma,L, 6.04 u no line 22.12

                  B Athletic Bilbao, L , 2.2 u no line 22.12
                  B Betis, W , 2.28 u no line 21.12
                  BCelta Vigo, D , 2.12 u no line 22.12
                  B Real sociedad, D , 1.32 u no line 21.12
                  C Sevilla, L , 2.475 u no line 21.12

                  B Sporting Braga, D , 4,37 u no line 19.12

                  D Levadiakos,D, 2,75 u no line 18.12 (E 22.12)

                  C Everton,L, 3.07 u no line 22.12 (D 26.12)

                  B Wolfsburg, L , 1.26 u no line 22.12
                  E Frieburg, D , 3.20 u no line 21.12

                  B Lorient, L , 2.41 u no line 22.12

                  Comment
                  • Valand
                    SBR High Roller
                    • 05-25-11
                    • 238

                    #10
                    B Inter, W, 1.96 u +175 22.12
                    D Roma,L, 6.04 u +1450 22.12

                    B Athletic Bilbao, L , 2.2 u +649 22.12
                    B Betis, W , 2.28 u -133 21.12
                    BCelta Vigo, D , 2.12 u +270 22.12
                    B Real sociedad, D , 1.32 u +236 21.12
                    C Sevilla, L , 2.475 u -111 21.12

                    B Sporting Braga, D , 4,37 u no line 19.12 W

                    D Levadiakos,D, 2,75 u no line 18.12 L/// E Levadiakos,D, 3,86 u no line 22.12

                    C Everton,L, 3.07 u +208 22.12 (D 26.12)

                    B Wolfsburg, L , 1.26 u +121 22.12
                    E Frieburg, D , 3.20 u +237 21.12
                    A Augburg. L . 1.5 u +115 20.12 L
                    A Nuremberg. W. 2.0 u +251 21.12
                    A Hoffenheim.L. 1,3. u +317 21.12
                    A Stuttgart , D, 1,0 u no line 25.12

                    A Zwolle ,W, 1,1 u +778 21.12
                    A Az Alkmar W. 3.0 u -128 21.12
                    A Fc Gröningen, W, 1,25 u -142 22.12

                    A Gaziantepspor,L, 1,2 u -127 21.12

                    B Lorient, L , 2.41 u +204 22.12
                    Comment
                    • Valand
                      SBR High Roller
                      • 05-25-11
                      • 238

                      #11
                      B Inter, W, 1.96 u +175 22.12 W
                      D Roma,L, 6.04 u +1450 22.12 L

                      B Athletic Bilbao, L , 2.2 u +649 22.12 L
                      B Betis, W , 2.28 u -133 21.12 L
                      BCelta Vigo, D , 2.12 u +270 22.12 W
                      B Real sociedad, D , 1.32 u +236 21.12 L
                      C Sevilla, L , 2.475 u -111 21.12 L

                      B Sporting Braga, D , 4,37 u no line 19.12 W

                      D Levadiakos,D, 2,75 u no line 18.12 L/// E Levadiakos,D, 3,86 u no line 22.12 L

                      C Everton,L, 3.07 u +208 22.12 (D 26.12) L

                      B Wolfsburg, L , 1.26 u +121 22.12 L
                      E Frieburg, D , 3.20 u +237 21.12 L
                      A Augburg. L . 1.5 u +115 20.12 L
                      A Nuremberg. W. 2.0 u +251 21.12 L
                      A Hoffenheim.L. 1,3. u +317 21.12 W
                      A Stuttgart , D, 1,0 u no line 25.12

                      A Zwolle ,W, 1,1 u +778 21.12 L
                      A Az Alkmar W. 3.0 u -128 21.12 L
                      A Fc Gröningen, W, 1,25 u -142 22.12 W

                      A Gaziantepspor,L, 1,2 u -127 22.12 W

                      B Lorient, L , 2.41 u +204 22.12 L
                      Comment
                      • Valand
                        SBR High Roller
                        • 05-25-11
                        • 238

                        #12
                        B Inter, W, 1.96 u +175 22.12 W
                        D Roma,L, 6.04 u +1450 22.12 L

                        B Athletic Bilbao, L , 2.2 u +649 22.12 L
                        B Betis, W , 2.28 u -133 21.12 L
                        BCelta Vigo, D , 2.12 u +270 22.12 W
                        B Real sociedad, D , 1.32 u +236 21.12 L
                        C Sevilla, L , 2.475 u -111 21.12 L

                        B Sporting Braga, D , 4,37 u no line 19.12 W

                        D Levadiakos,D, 2,75 u no line 18.12 L/// E Levadiakos,D, 3,86 u no line 22.12 L

                        C Everton,L, 3.07 u +208 22.12 (D 26.12) L

                        B Wolfsburg, L , 1.26 u +121 22.12 L
                        E Frieburg, D , 3.20 u +237 21.12 L
                        A Augburg. L . 1.5 u +115 20.12 L
                        A Nuremberg. W. 2.0 u +251 21.12 L
                        A Hoffenheim.L. 1,3. u +317 21.12 W
                        A Stuttgart , D, 1,0 u no line 25.12

                        A Zwolle ,W, 1,1 u +778 21.12 L
                        A Az Alkmar W. 3.0 u -128 21.12 L
                        A Fc Gröningen, W, 1,25 u -142 22.12 W

                        A Gaziantepspor,L, 1,2 u -127 22.12 W

                        B Lorient, L , 2.41 u +204 22.12 L


                        - 3.65 u Frieburg
                        - 3.49 u Levadiakos System + 33.00 since 04.12.2013
                        Comment
                        • Valand
                          SBR High Roller
                          • 05-25-11
                          • 238

                          #13
                          A Arsenal. W. 2.0 u 23.12
                          D Everton,L, 4.54 u 26.12
                          A Southampton ,W, 3.17 u 26.12 ( I'm on B )


                          A Stuttgart , D, 1,0 u 25.12
                          C Wolfsburg, L , 2.3 u 25.12
                          B Augburg. L . 2.80 u 25.12
                          B Nuremberg. W. 2.80 u 25.12

                          E Roma,L, 6.45 u 4.1 and all the other plays are coming 2014
                          Comment
                          • new era
                            SBR MVP
                            • 07-28-13
                            • 1470

                            #14
                            y are u editing?
                            Comment
                            • Valand
                              SBR High Roller
                              • 05-25-11
                              • 238

                              #15
                              Hi, Do you mean the southampton play or that I haven't the dutch play's and so on? It's because the are after 2013 so i'm going to add them later.
                              Comment
                              • Valand
                                SBR High Roller
                                • 05-25-11
                                • 238

                                #16
                                A Man C. L. 1.3 u 26.12 New
                                A Arsenal. W. 2.0 u 23.12 L / B Arsenal. W. 3.38 u 26.12
                                D Everton,L, 4.54 u 26.12
                                A Southampton ,W, 3.17 u 26.12 ( I'm on B )

                                and all the other plays are coming 2014
                                E Roma,L, 6.45 u 4.1

                                Didn't see that Bundesliga were in Jan, my mistake!
                                A Stuttgart , D, 1,0 u 25.1
                                C Wolfsburg, L , 2.3 u 25.1
                                B Augburg. L . 2.80 u 25.1
                                B Nuremberg. W. 2.80 u 25.1
                                ..............
                                Comment
                                • Valand
                                  SBR High Roller
                                  • 05-25-11
                                  • 238

                                  #17
                                  A Man C. L. 1.3 u 26.12 L
                                  B Arsenal. W. 3.38 u 26.12 W
                                  D Everton,L, 4.54 u 26.12 W +1008 but the still lost
                                  A Southampton ,W, 3.17 u 26.12 W

                                  4.9 units up got to love boxing day!

                                  System + 37.9 since 04.12.2013

                                  - 3.65 u Frieburg
                                  - 3.49 u Levadiakos
                                  Comment
                                  • Valand
                                    SBR High Roller
                                    • 05-25-11
                                    • 238

                                    #18
                                    B Man C.L .1.66 u 28.1
                                    A West Ham.W. 1.15 u 28.1
                                    A W.B.A.W, 1.7 u 28.1
                                    A NewCastle.L .1.2 u 29.12

                                    A Antalyaspor.W. 1.15 u 29.12

                                    A Olympiakos.D . 1.25 u 04.1

                                    C Athletic Bilbao, L , 2.6 u 05.1
                                    C Betis, W , 5.31 u 04.1
                                    C Real sociedad, D , 2.17 u 05.1
                                    D Sevilla, L , 5.84 u 05.1

                                    A Parma,L, 1.4 u 06.1
                                    A Parma,W, 1.4 u 06.1
                                    A A.C Milan(H).W. 2.6 u 06.1
                                    E Roma,L, 6.45 u 05.1

                                    C Lorient, L , 3.63 u 12.1
                                    A Reims.L . 1.35 u 12.1
                                    A Marsielle.W . 1.88 u 12.1
                                    A Saint etienne.D . 1.88 u 08.1

                                    B Zwolle ,W, 1,.24 u 18.1
                                    B Az Alkmar W. 6.84 u 18.1

                                    C Wolfsburg, L , 2.71 u 25.1
                                    B Augburg. L . 2.65 u +1.4 u (Passes on to Dortmund) 25.1
                                    B Nuremberg. W. 2.79 u 25.1
                                    A Stuttgart , D, 1,0 u 25.1
                                    Comment
                                    • onemoregoal
                                      SBR Hall of Famer
                                      • 02-04-13
                                      • 8149

                                      #19
                                      Im trying to understand, i just cant.
                                      Comment
                                      • Valand
                                        SBR High Roller
                                        • 05-25-11
                                        • 238

                                        #20
                                        Every play has a shutout where the team has had a zero in their result. W.B.A for example won 2-0. Since then the haven't won a game just played draws and lost. If I go back to their previous track record of 2-0 wins the always manage to win again if the won 2-0. Every game I put out I have gone threw the statistic of how the team react after 2-0, 0-0 , 5-0 and so on.


                                        U=units 29.12 is 29th of dec when the match is played

                                        A bet B bet C bet D bet is how far the bet has gone

                                        I don't have a fixed unit size as you can see because of the large number of leagues and teams. I sometime see plays that could have been a C bet if I had followed it from the start. That's why some A bets are 1.8 and some 1.15

                                        The play Ac milan (h) stands for home match the haven't won a home match since beating Udinese with 1-0


                                        Comment
                                        • Valand
                                          SBR High Roller
                                          • 05-25-11
                                          • 238

                                          #21
                                          New
                                          1 hour and 40 min left

                                          A Birmingham city, L, 2.2. u 29.12
                                          A Leeds united, L, 1.6 u 29.12
                                          A Blackpool, W, 1.5 u 29.12
                                          Comment
                                          • Valand
                                            SBR High Roller
                                            • 05-25-11
                                            • 238

                                            #22
                                            B Man C.L .1.66 u 28.1 L
                                            A West Ham.W. 1.15 u 28.1 L
                                            A W.B.A.W, 1.7 u 28.1 L
                                            A NewCastle.L .1.2 u 29.12 W

                                            A Antalyaspor.W. 1.15 u 29.12 L / B: 25.1 1.36 u

                                            A Birmingham city, L, 2.2. u 29.12 L
                                            A Leeds united, L, 1.6 u 29.12 W
                                            A Blackpool, W, 1.5 u 29.12 L


                                            System + 40.7 since 04.12.2013

                                            - 3.65 u Frieburg
                                            - 3.49 u Levadiakos
                                            Comment
                                            • Valand
                                              SBR High Roller
                                              • 05-25-11
                                              • 238

                                              #23
                                              Next game day 1th of Jan

                                              C Man C.L .1.72 u 1.1
                                              B West Ham.W. 1.90 u 1.1
                                              B W.B.A.W, 2.51 u 1.1

                                              B Birmingham city, L, 4.31 u 1.1
                                              B Blackpool, W, 2.25 u 1.1
                                              Comment
                                              • steevio_uk
                                                SBR Rookie
                                                • 09-23-13
                                                • 44

                                                #24
                                                Yeah, this is going over my head a bit too!

                                                Sounds interesting though!
                                                Comment
                                                • edabramov
                                                  SBR MVP
                                                  • 07-27-13
                                                  • 2059

                                                  #25
                                                  Originally posted by onemoregoal
                                                  Im trying to understand, i just cant.
                                                  Lmao you just described everyone who goes on this post, including me.
                                                  Comment
                                                  • Valand
                                                    SBR High Roller
                                                    • 05-25-11
                                                    • 238

                                                    #26
                                                    C Man C.L .1.72 u 1.1
                                                    B West Ham.W. 1.90 u 1.1
                                                    B W.B.A.W, 2.51 u 1.1

                                                    A Birmingham city, W,(H) 1.4 u 1.1
                                                    B Birmingham city, L, 4.31 u 1.1
                                                    B Blackpool, W, 2.25 u 1.1

                                                    A Wellington Phoenix, D, 0.9 u 1.1

                                                    Example:
                                                    Why I picked Birmingham city is because from this season to 2006-2007 in championship at most have had 11 matches between a lost if they have been beaten with 1-0 previously. That were season. T he home Win is because the won 4-0 02.11.13 and have played 6 home matches without a win since.
                                                    Comment
                                                    • Valand
                                                      SBR High Roller
                                                      • 05-25-11
                                                      • 238

                                                      #27
                                                      C Man C.L .1.72 u 1.1 L
                                                      B West Ham.W. 1.90 u 1.1 L
                                                      B W.B.A.W, 2.51 u 1.1 W

                                                      A Birmingham city, W,(H) 1.4 u 1.1 L
                                                      B Birmingham city, L, 4.31 u 1.1 L
                                                      B Blackpool, W, 2.25 u 1.1 L

                                                      A Wellington Phoenix, D, 0.9 u 1.1 L
                                                      Comment
                                                      • Valand
                                                        SBR High Roller
                                                        • 05-25-11
                                                        • 238

                                                        #28
                                                        A Sydney,D, 2.55 u 03.1

                                                        D Man C, L. 2.06 u 04.1 (FA-Cup)
                                                        C West Ham.W. 2.78 u 05.1 (FA-Cup)
                                                        B Blackpool, W, 3.75 u 04.1 (FA-Cup)
                                                        A Charlton Athletic, W. 1.3 u 04.1 (FA-Cup)

                                                        A Olympiakos.D . 1.25 u 04.1

                                                        C Athletic Bilbao, L , 2.6 u 05.1
                                                        C Betis, W , 5.31 u 04.1
                                                        C Real sociedad, D , 2.17 u 05.1
                                                        D Sevilla, L , 5.84 u 05.1
                                                        A Osasuna, W , 1.3 u 05.1
                                                        A Valencia, W , 1.1 u 04.1

                                                        A Parma,L, 1.4 u 06.1
                                                        A Parma,W, 1.4 u 06.1
                                                        A A.C Milan(H).W. 2.6 u 06.1
                                                        E Roma,L, 6.45 u 05.1
                                                        A Genoa, W, 1.2 u 06.1
                                                        Comment
                                                        • Valand
                                                          SBR High Roller
                                                          • 05-25-11
                                                          • 238

                                                          #29
                                                          I Hope 2014 will be as good as 2013. Forgot to post Sunderland game yesterday. Totally forgot about it took a live bet on it after Aston villa scored. Not going to include it in this system, Man u could have been a play as well but I didn't play them because I already won when Everton defeated them. Thought the couldn't loose more at Old trafford this season. Man C I'm just going to hunt them until the get defeated very tempted to play +2 on them vs palace. Well the get grinded now Fa, league cup and Newcastle away.
                                                          Comment
                                                          • AussiePunter123
                                                            SBR MVP
                                                            • 12-29-13
                                                            • 1473

                                                            #30
                                                            Very interesting system.

                                                            I think I understand, basically - you are trying to predict whether a team is going to win, lose or draw depending on their recent results and how this corresponds to that team's historical win loss record.

                                                            For example, if one team losses in embarrassing fashion, then perhaps they are more likely to win the next week as they will, in theory, be more up for the game. Especially if historically, that team seems to bounce back after an unexpected or humiliating loss.

                                                            Alternatively, some people argue that when a team changes coach, they are more likely to win the first game with their new coach.

                                                            Am I on the right track?

                                                            Seems a very interesting system.
                                                            Comment
                                                            • Valand
                                                              SBR High Roller
                                                              • 05-25-11
                                                              • 238

                                                              #31
                                                              Yes correct!

                                                              Like if Sampdoria has
                                                              0-4
                                                              1-1 Filter of 3 games
                                                              3-3

                                                              2-4

                                                              I check previous records of 0-4 and if the can manage a win with in 6-7 games from the big loss. I let the team play 3 games it works as a filter. So If a team gets zero resultat I wait three games before I bet. I'm thinking of adding Genoa they have 2-0 and have not won in 5 games. Only problem is that if the lo
                                                              Comment
                                                              • Valand
                                                                SBR High Roller
                                                                • 05-25-11
                                                                • 238

                                                                #32
                                                                Originally posted by AussiePunter123
                                                                Very interesting system.

                                                                I think I understand, basically - you are trying to predict whether a team is going to win, lose or draw depending on their recent results and how this corresponds to that team's historical win loss record.

                                                                For example, if one team losses in embarrassing fashion, then perhaps they are more likely to win the next week as they will, in theory, be more up for the game. Especially if historically, that team seems to bounce back after an unexpected or humiliating loss.

                                                                Alternatively, some people argue that when a team changes coach, they are more likely to win the first game with their new coach.

                                                                Am I on the right track?

                                                                Seems a very interesting system.
                                                                Thanks!
                                                                System + 42.4 since 04.12.2013

                                                                - 3.65 u Frieburg
                                                                - 3.49 u Levadiakos
                                                                Comment
                                                                • Giz
                                                                  SBR MVP
                                                                  • 11-06-13
                                                                  • 1703

                                                                  #33
                                                                  Originally posted by Valand
                                                                  System + 42.4 since 04.12.2013
                                                                  whats the system + since 09.12.2013

                                                                  ?
                                                                  Comment
                                                                  • Valand
                                                                    SBR High Roller
                                                                    • 05-25-11
                                                                    • 238

                                                                    #34
                                                                    Originally posted by Giz
                                                                    whats the system + since 09.12.2013

                                                                    ?
                                                                    I started in September with this system but didn't start posting in this forum until Dec. So I have more then + 42.4 units.
                                                                    Comment
                                                                    • Giz
                                                                      SBR MVP
                                                                      • 11-06-13
                                                                      • 1703

                                                                      #35
                                                                      Originally posted by Valand
                                                                      I started in September with this system but didn't start posting in this forum until Dec. So I have more then + 42.4 units.
                                                                      whats the system + since posting on the forum since 09.12.2013

                                                                      ?
                                                                      Comment
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