[PhillyFlyers]

Pulled in the 1st inning last night.

Best pitch was clocked at 83 mph and was supposed to be a fastball.

Guy is done.

Oh well, he wasn't no Andy Pettitte.

[SamDiamond]

Pulled in the 1st inning last night.

Best pitch was clocked at 83 mph and was supposed to be a fastball.

Guy is done.

Oh well, he wasn't no Andy Pettitte.

You're right.

Doc is a much better pitcher.

Halladay has 5 times as many shutouts as Pettitte.

Halladay has almost 3 times as many complete games.

Halladay has a lower ERA.

Halladay has a lower WHIP.

Halladay has more K's per 9 innings.

Halladay gave up fewer HRs.

There isn't a single fuking thing you can come up with that would make anyone think Pettite was better than Doc.

[Dilo]

what happened to doc? he needs the deer antler spray

[PhillyFlyers]

You're right.

Doc is a much better pitcher.

Halladay has 5 times as many shutouts as Pettitte.

Halladay has almost 3 times as many complete games.

Halladay has a lower ERA.

Halladay has a lower WHIP.

Halladay has more K's per 9 innings.

Halladay gave up fewer HRs.

There isn't a single fuking thing you can come up with that would make anyone think Pettite was better than Doc.

Wins.

Fukkin moron.

[easyliving]

You're right.

Doc is a much better pitcher.

Halladay has 5 times as many shutouts as Pettitte.

Halladay has almost 3 times as many complete games.

Halladay has a lower ERA.

Halladay has a lower WHIP.

Halladay has more K's per 9 innings.

Halladay gave up fewer HRs.

There isn't a single fuking thing you can come up with that would make anyone think Pettite was better than Doc.

not to mention Pettitte admitted to using Steroids

[PhillyFlyers]

not to mention Pettitte admitted to using Steroids

Halladay needs them now.

[tto827]

Love that PhillyFlyers threads get autosalooned

Sad to see Roy go, but a comeback would be quite the shock at this point.

[SamDiamond]

Wins.

Fukkin moron.

You're a moron.

Pettitte has the 5th LARGEST AVERAGE RUN SUPPORT in the history of baseball at 5.4 runs per game.

Halladay's was a full run lower.

Pettitte also never won a Cy Young.

Pettitte played on much better teams, don't be such a fuking knucklehead all the time.

Here'e may favorite stat in comparing Pettitte and Doc.

Pettitte had 4 shutouts in an 18 year career.

Doc threw 4 shutouts in a 6 week span of 2009 and then 4 more in 2010.

[Andy117]

Andy Pettitte was a good pitcher who played on mostly great teams. Roy Halladay was a great pitcher who played on many average to poor teams.

[PhillyFlyers]

You're a moron.

Pettitte has the 5th LARGEST AVERAGE RUN SUPPORT in the history of baseball at 5.4 runs per game.

Halladay's was a full run lower.

Pettitte also never won a Cy Young.

Pettitte played on much better teams, don't be such a fuking knucklehead all the time.

Here'e may favorite stat in comparing Pettitte and Doc.

Pettitte had 4 shutouts in an 18 year career.

Doc threw 4 shutouts in a 6 week span of 2009 and then 4 more in 2010.

A 250 win pitcher vs. a 200 win pitcher.

Huge difference there.

Pettitte was successful because he played on much better teams?

So, in your world, it's not possible to be a bad pitcher if you're on a good team? LMFAO

Halladay is a glorified Tim Hudson.

Pettitte is a world champion. More wins. More strikeouts. More postseason wins. Multiple championships.

[jds07v]

Hallday: ERA of 3.38 (half a run lower). WHIP of 1.17 (almost 0.2 lower). Win/Loss % of 65.9% compared to Pettite's 62.5% even though he played on average Blue Jays team. 67 career complete games (25 for pettite). ERA+ of 131 (pettite 117). Halladay slightly higher k/9 and much higher K/bb (3.58 vs 2.37). 20 shutouts vs 4 shutouts

Pettite: Wins, Championships, Postseason success. Career run support of 5.4 (not his fault, but its a factor). Career ERA of 3.86. Career WHIP of 1.35 (Both are outside top 140 of lefty pitchers with 1000+ innings). No Cy Young. 3 All Star selections. Never played on a team with sub .500 record.

In a vacuum, given the same lineup, Hallday > Pettite. Almost every pitching metric (besides wins, oh my god!) favors Halladay. The postseason isn't that fair to compare, since Halladay has 5 starts total while Pettite has 44. Just for fun, Halladay has a complete game shutout in the playoffs (Pettite doesn't). Hallday's ERA is 1.4 lower, WHIP 0.5 lower, Hits/9 is 4 lower, K/9 is 2 higher, K/BB is almost 3x higher.

[SamDiamond]

Hallday: ERA of 3.38 (half a run lower). WHIP of 1.17 (almost 0.2 lower). Win/Loss % of 65.9% compared to Pettite's 62.5% even though he played on average Blue Jays team. 67 career complete games (25 for pettite). ERA+ of 131 (pettite 117). Halladay slightly higher k/9 and much higher K/bb (3.58 vs 2.37). 20 shutouts vs 4 shutouts

Pettite: Wins, Championships, Postseason success. Career run support of 5.4 (not his fault, but its a factor). Career ERA of 3.86. Career WHIP of 1.35 (Both are outside top 140 of lefty pitchers with 1000+ innings). No Cy Young. 3 All Star selections. Never played on a team with sub .500 record.

In a vacuum, given the same lineup, Hallday > Pettite. Almost every pitching metric (besides wins, oh my god!) favors Halladay. The postseason isn't that fair to compare, since Halladay has 5 starts total while Pettite has 44. Just for fun, Halladay has a complete game shutout in the playoffs (Pettite doesn't). Hallday's ERA is 1.4 lower, WHIP 0.5 lower, Hits/9 is 4 lower, K/9 is 2 higher, K/BB is almost 3x higher.

Actually, Halladay THREW A NO-HITTER in the playoffs.

[SamDiamond]

A 250 win pitcher vs. a 200 win pitcher.

Huge difference there.

Pettitte was successful because he played on much better teams?

So, in your world, it's not possible to be a bad pitcher if you're on a good team? LMFAO

Halladay is a glorified Tim Hudson.

Pettitte is a world champion. More wins. More strikeouts. More postseason wins. Multiple championships.

Not that you would know this, but Halladay has a higher winning percentage than Pettitte.

You know that right?

How can you be so wrong about every single thing you post.

[Andy117]

Not that you would know this, but Halladay has a higher winning percentage than Pettitte.

You know that right?

How can you be so wrong about every single thing you post.

This is the same moron who thinks that Richie Ashburn was better than Jackie Robinson.

[PhillyFlyers]

Not that you would know this, but Halladay has a higher winning percentage than Pettitte.

You know that right?

How can you be so wrong about every single thing you post.

Andy Pettitte is the ONLY MLB pitcher IN HISTORY who played at least 18 seasons AND NEVER HAD A LOSING RECORD.

THE ONLY ONE!

To show how much an idiot you are, and the nitwits that agree with you, Pettitte is going to get consideration for the Hall of fame.

Halladay won't even be a thought.

And how perfect was it Pettitte ends his career with a complete game win while Halladay ended with getting pulled in the 1st?

[wagerjunkie]

Halladay won't even be a thought for the HOF? My god what planet are you on. With the writers showing they aren't letting roid users in pettite isn't getting in. You couldnt even have that more ass backwards holy shit

[robzilla]

Too bad he was the only good pitcher in the Jays rotation.

[wagerjunkie]

Too bad he was the only good pitcher in the Jays rotation.

actually him and Chris Carpenter both once pitched together same time in Jays rotation

[Roy Halladay]

My God man. Wins? Wins don't mean shit son.

[PhillyFlyers]

Halladay won't even be a thought for the HOF? My god what planet are you on. With the writers showing they aren't letting roid users in pettite isn't getting in. You couldnt even have that more ass backwards holy shit

No, he's not.

His numbers aren't close to being good enough and anyone who thinks they are, is a fukking nitwit.

[Andy117]

Andy Pettitte is the ONLY MLB pitcher IN HISTORY who played at least 18 seasons AND NEVER HAD A LOSING RECORD.

THE ONLY ONE!

To show how much an idiot you are, and the nitwits that agree with you, Pettitte is going to get consideration for the Hall of fame.

Halladay won't even be a thought.

And how perfect was it Pettitte ends his career with a complete game win while Halladay ended with getting pulled in the 1st?

That's not really that surprising, he never played for a bad team. And that is really one of those fluky stats that really doesn't mean anything.

[Roy Halladay]

http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/jaws_P.shtml

[PhillyFlyers]

http://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/jaws_P.shtml

What are you trying to say with this?

[stevenash]

JAWS is an elaborate wins above replacement metric.

He is saying Doc's seven year peak was solid.

[PhillyFlyers]

JAWS is an elaborate wins above replacement metric.

He is saying Doc's seven year peak was solid.

It very well might have been. His career is still not close to HOF worthy.

[stevenash]

Andy Pettitte is the ONLY MLB pitcher IN HISTORY who played at least 18 seasons AND NEVER HAD A LOSING RECORD.

Mussina pitched seventeen full seasons and never had a losing season.
1991 was his rookie season, only made a handful of starts, was 4-5 then ran off 17 full season of above .500 ball.
Moose missed seven starts in his last 10 years as a starter. Dude was a horse.

Moose should be a Hall of Famer, some people laugh at that statement.
Some people don't get it.

[PhillyFlyers]

Mussina pitched seventeen full seasons and never had a losing season.
1991 was his rookie season, only made a handful of starts, was 4-5 then ran off 17 full season of above .500 ball.
Moose missed seven starts in his last 10 years as a starter. Dude was a horse.

Moose should be a Hall of Famer, some people laugh at that statement.
Some people don't get it.

This is false.

Officially, he pitched 18 seasons and his first year went 4-5. Although I do agree Moose should be in the Hall.

[Roy Halladay]

That was linked within a bleacher report article:

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1...-another-pitch

I think this article makes a pretty damn good argument.

"Regardless of how he looks now, Halladay's resume certainly looks like that of a Hall of Famer. He meets all the logical criteria, despite not having the almighty win total because the way pitchers are used today is very different from the way they were even 20 years ago. "

Ding ding ding

And if wins are such a "valuable" stat to evaluate a pitcher, what the do you say about Verlander the last 2 starts?

[PhillyFlyers]

That was linked within a bleacher report article:

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1...-another-pitch

I think this article makes a pretty damn good argument.

"Regardless of how he looks now, Halladay's resume certainly looks like that of a Hall of Famer. He meets all the logical criteria, despite not having the almighty win total because the way pitchers are used today is very different from the way they were even 20 years ago. "

Ding ding ding

And if wins are such a "valuable" stat to evaluate a pitcher, what the do you say about Verlander the last 2 starts?

If Roy Halladay is a Hall of Fame player then so is Tim Hudson.

Here's a clue....Hudson is nowhere near a HOF player.

[Roy Halladay]

If you say so.

Is Trent Klatt a hall of famer?

[DoYouNotGetIT]

ONLY reason Roy Halladay might get into the Hall of Fame is the great baseball players of this era used PEDs. Andy Pettite would get into the Hall of Fame, but the PED usage will probably keep him out. Not going to argue stats, because the Baseball Hall of Fame isn't about advanced stats. I am sure King Felix will get in on advance stats, but he will be the exception to the rule.

[PhillyFlyers]

ONLY reason Roy Halladay might get into the Hall of Fame is the great baseball players of this era used PEDs. Andy Pettite would get into the Hall of Fame, but the PED usage will probably keep him out. Not going to argue stats, because the Baseball Hall of Fame isn't about advanced stats. I am sure King Felix will get in on advance stats, but he will be the exception to the rule.

Stop it.

He's not getting in the HOF.

Jamie Moyer has 66 more career wins than Halladay.

[stevenash]

This is false.

Officially, he pitched 18 seasons and his first year went 4-5. Although I do agree Moose should be in the Hall.

I said he pitched 17 full seasons
I said in 1991 was his rookie season, and alluded to the fact it was not a full season.

[PhillyFlyers]

I said he pitched 17 full seasons
I said in 1991 was his rookie season, and alluded to the fact it was not a full season.

It doesn't matter if it wasn't a full season or not. Officially, it counts as one.

In 2004, Pettitte went 6-4 and only started 15 games. Wasn't a full season, but it counted.

[stevenash]

^
Whatever, I was just making a point.