[Justin7]

So it seems that there are guys making big money arbing but they are doing it with the use of Vegas books. But you are saying it can be done from "abroad". I wasn't aware that it is possible to access Vegas books from abroad? So what am I missing?

Using runners.

[Hareeba!]

Using runners.

thanks Justin

hardly practical for most of us, especially those who are in a timezone which means its zzzz time when most of the action is taking place

[faststeady]

hareeba

im not in the US, dont use runners at vegas books and have comfortably made more than a 100k in a year with arbitrage. i also know people that do that in a month as i have said

because you dont see how its possible, doesnt make it so

[durito]

thanks Justin

hardly practical for most of us, especially those who are in a timezone which means its zzzz time when most of the action is taking place

so you are outside the us. this only makes it easier for you.

[Hareeba!]

hareeba

im not in the US, dont use runners at vegas books and have comfortably made more than a 100k in a year with arbitrage. i also know people that do that in a month as i have said

because you dont see how its possible, doesnt make it so

okay fasteady, I accept that, and it's good to hear it without the foul personal attacks.

as stated before though, I just can't see how it can be done when most books will limit you to betting in peanuts if you are sniping their top prices regularly

there are obviously secrets to the game which most are unaware of (including I would suggest "super" to whom I was originally responding)

[Thremp]

Could you stop posting whatever random bullshit pops into your head? Anyway, wtf you got to do during the day in Europe? Wimmenz at school or jubes. Take a nap. Go to the beach and take a nap. Stack your paper. Get a hobby.

[increasedodds]

Anyone smart enough to arb $100k/year (and it is certainly doable) is smart enough to get a pinnacle account.

[Hareeba!]

so you are outside the us. this only makes it easier for you.

in what way Durito?

[Hareeba!]

Could you stop posting whatever random bullshit pops into your head? Anyway, wtf you got to do during the day in Europe? Wimmenz at school or jubes. Take a nap. Go to the beach and take a nap. Stack your paper. Get a hobby.

I don't suppose there's any danger that you may actually post something constructive in this discussion?

[JoeVig]

I don't suppose there's any danger that you may actually post something constructive in this discussion?

Folks probably aren't going to get too specific in giving away their daily playbook, and I can't blame them (even if he is a little grumpy).

[Raleigh77]

How much does one have to pay runners. I can definitely see how if one had access to all the Vegas books through runners and all the offshore books you could make a ton arbing, probably actually be able to get a massive amount of looks at free middles and half middles or at least greatly discounted looks at middles, which is probably where a great deal of the profit would come, I could be wrong of course.

Hareeba- Stop asking for people to be constructive when their information given would hurt their bottom line, no one is going to hand you anything.

[Thremp]

I don't suppose there's any danger that you may actually post something constructive in this discussion?

Nothing is constructive to you because you aren't intelligent enough to understand what the implications are. No hate, but there are people who can figure it out quite easily despite not being very knowledgeable about sports betting because they think about things rather than make up theories and alter their view of the world to fit their theories. Your idea about arbitrage may be loosely correct or it may not be depending on what someone wants to do, yet you can't figure out why living abroad would be beneficial. You have such a pathetically small understanding for someone continually offering an "opinion" that you deserve derision and scorn as a way of peer review.

[Hareeba!]

Hareeba- Stop asking for people to be constructive when their information given would hurt their bottom line, no one is going to hand you anything.

hey mate, I am not expecting people to give up their secrets but have a look at Thremp's posts .. they add nothing to the discussion , they are purely personal attacks on me. If that's all he can offer isn't it better he just keeps out of it?

this discussion grew mainly out of my advice to a newbie who wanted to get into arbing
it is something I have tried and given up as not worth the effort
I was simply giving him the benefit of my experience and given his situation I stick by it as appropriate for him
others obviously have far more advanced techniques or access to books where it can be highly profitable
I (and I'm sure others including "super") am interested in learning more but of course if that might cut into one's profitability I understand they may not be willing to share secrets. That's fine. But personal abuse isn't.

[Hareeba!]

Nothing is constructive to you because you aren't intelligent enough to understand what the implications are. No hate, but there are people who can figure it out quite easily despite not being very knowledgeable about sports betting because they think about things rather than make up theories and alter their view of the world to fit their theories. Your idea about arbitrage may be loosely correct or it may not be depending on what someone wants to do, yet you can't figure out why living abroad would be beneficial. You have such a pathetically small understanding for someone continually offering an "opinion" that you deserve derision and scorn as a way of peer review.

I am assuming that you are referring (leaving the usual personal insults aside) to the ability to access books which Americans can't?

If so and if you had bothered to read what I have previously written you would know (with the exception of Pinnacle and Betfair) that they are useless once you have been severely limited as I have at practically all of them.

And whilst Pinnacle, Betfair and Matchbook are certainly the key books, the scope for arbing between them alone is relatively limited. One needs to find other books who will take a decent sized bet on the other side. And for me there aren't any that I'm aware of.

[Thremp]

It isn't worth the effort because you're incompetent. I don't advise people on semillion pairings with tofu because I don't know shit about it. You have an opinion of that caliber on arbitrage.

lol "benefit" gfy


ETA: You don't know the first ****ing thing about arbitrage. Stop posting like you do. No one ****ing uses Betfair. It is quite literally almost completely useless.

[Thremp]

Apparently I received an infraction for the above post. Apparently J7 isn't interested in truth. Or maybe he has issues with semillion pairings. Who knows.

[noyb]

ETA: You don't know the first ****ing thing about arbitrage. Stop posting like you do. No one ****ing uses Betfair. It is quite literally almost completely useless.

Thremp, you're making the exact same errors in your posts as you're accusing hareeba of, being: thinking you know it all. just because betfair is useless to you or the people you know, doesn't make it useless to everyone. you just gotta know how to use them; if you apparently don't, that might make them useless to you, not to others who do know.

[Thremp]

Explain to me in which markets you'd get the best price at Betfair? Pinnacle with ALWAYS have a better price on atleast one line in a major soccer market than Betfair. What you're likely referring to is "trading", not deterministic arbitrage which is the subject of this. The smaller leagues with virtually no liquidity could be used there, but if you're scouring Iranian soccer for $50 arbs. GLHF.

[skrtelfan]

Betfair offers far more markets than just sides and totals.

[Hareeba!]

No one ****ing uses Betfair. It is quite literally almost completely useless.

Classic!

[Thremp]

Betfair offers far more markets than just sides and totals.

And how much have you made arbing these markets?

[noyb]

Explain to me in which markets you'd get the best price at Betfair? Pinnacle with ALWAYS have a better price on atleast one line in a major soccer market than Betfair. What you're likely referring to is "trading", not deterministic arbitrage which is the subject of this. The smaller leagues with virtually no liquidity could be used there, but if you're scouring Iranian soccer for $50 arbs. GLHF.

who says we were talking soccer here?

and if we are in fact talking soccer, prices for the draw in a 1 x 2 market at betfair on a random game are typically the best out there, even after whatever commission you pay. also, as was already said, bf offers more markets then just sides and totals. there are many uses for bf besides "iranian soccer" as you put it.
i could talk much more about details, but that wasn't my point in the first place. fact is everyone has their own betting style, and their own tips and tricks, some make a lot, many lose a lot. neither you nor hareeba nor me has all the answers, and anyone making general statements about how much or how less money there is to be made by anyone, or statements about which books or exchanges are generally useless for anyone, is wrong.

[Thremp]

You're wrong because you don't know the math. Straight up. The overround is lower on Pinnacle for EPL for ANY commission level. The best price on any soccer match will almost NEVER bet at Betfair, especially for someone just starting out.

I'm being quite clear in what I said that is pertinent to this discussion. If you think there is a use for Betfair for an arbitrageur that has some utility, you don't know what you're talking about.

I'm not talking about playing derivatives, exotics, trading in running. I'm talking about deterministic arbitrage. The ENTIRE subject of the thread. Maybe you need to think before you post as you and Hareeba have similar problems.

[super]

quality discussion as always.


i have a friend that lives in vegas but im guessing i would probably need more than one person with lots of free time to research, correct?

if i decided to stay in vegas for a couple of years with access to pinnacle, and other non american books , with a decent sized roll, could i expect to find worthwhile arb opportunities?

thanks again for all insight.

[Tomato]

As of a year or two ago, the law prohibiting cell phones and other communication devices was repealed. Half the time I walk into a sportsbook, I see someone looking at Pinnacle lines now.

What?

Tomato was told to shut off the laptop or leave at Caesars and the Venetian.

Stratosphere won't let you bet if you have any clue.

The rest aren't complete idiots when it comes to their lines (M Resort, Hilton, MGM, Leroy's).

[faststeady]

personally i dont use betfair much if at all , and a large majority of my bets have a pinnacle component, but as others have pointed out there are those that use betfair alot . they're just of no use to me

hareeba, earlier in this thread you said "most will limit you" and you are right ...... you just need to discover which ones dont...

[Thremp]

I'm curious which "professional" arbitrageurs use Betfair. I question their competence and ability. I see no even remotely pertinent arguments put forth. Though I suppose you could attempt to arbitrage in runnings... GLHF with that.

[Hareeba!]

hareeba, earlier in this thread you said "most will limit you" and you are right ...... you just need to discover which ones dont...

yes, that would be good
but I have something like 50 books I've sacked as now worthless to me
leaving aside the exchanges the only ones which haven't limited me yet are Pinnacle, SBO and Tabcorp
frankly I don't know where next to look amongst books I could trust

[noyb]

I'm curious which "professional" arbitrageurs use Betfair. I question their competence and ability. I see no even remotely pertinent arguments put forth. Though I suppose you could attempt to arbitrage in runnings... GLHF with that.

you can question my competence all you want, but to be honest based on your answers i'm also starting to question yours. whether your arbing, betting straight or whatever, who cares about overround (and who cares only about EPL BTW, or do you think any non-EPL league equals exotics?), it's about who has the best price for a particular selection. obv it's easier to be best price with less overround, but it's not exactly essential. Pinnacle has better prices than Betfair on at least one leg, true. Betfair also has better prices than Pinnacle on at least one leg in 1X2. Betfair is useless in AH, Pinnacle isn't, but so what.
and besides, go to a random tennis match (or do you think tennis are also "exotics"?). betfair offering way better prices on at least one out of two legs, sometimes two out of two legs.

i'm done with this topic either way. my point is you have no idea what you're talking about either, and you should stick to stuff you do know (being: that apparently betfair does't work for you, and pinnacle does. well, good for you).

[Raleigh77]

kitties like to scratch

[faststeady]

they aren't the messiah noyb, but they are valuable to some, depends which way you roll.....

you're off on some of your "factual" statements however

[Thremp]

I'm comparing a single site to Betfair. Does SBObet exist? Are there other sites as well? Acting like Betfair is a mainstay of the arbitrageur is retarded.

[Hareeba!]

Betfair offer many more markets than SBO and Pinnacle thus there is more scope for finding arbs there

[Thremp]

Betfair offer many more markets than SBO and Pinnacle thus there is more scope for finding arbs there

It is obvious why you're a failed arbitrageur.

[Hareeba!]

It is obvious why you're a failed arbitrageur.

You're making a habit of being wrong Thremp

I never failed at it ... just found it nowhere near as rewarding as traditional punting.

In fact I did play a little tennis arb only yesterday, not that I was on the lookout for arbs but it was there staring at me whilst doing my regular betting ... and yes, one leg was at Betfair.

So rather than respond to the issue I raised you prefer to simply resort to your favourite pastime and denigrate me yet again.

In any other forum I've visited you'd have been suspended or banned for your behaviour by now. This one appears to have no moderators to clean out the scum.