[BigBlueNYG]

This is pathetic, you drop the ball big time on BI, and clearly something is going on at YW, any type of clarity or anything would be nice, dropped DSI to a D last year overnight for almost the same situation , so?

[SplitAces]

This is pathetic, you drop the ball big time on BI, and clearly something is going on at YW, any type of clarity or anything would be nice, dropped DSI to a D last year overnight for almost the same situation , so?

Can you please elaborate? Been with hem along time.

[BigBlueNYG]

There are reports that their CS staff has potentially taken BTC withdrawals from more than one player and sent it to their own wallets, also a player with a large balance of over 50k, had his account frozen, and at least one other player with large balance isn't being paid, there's multiple threads in sportsbook section

[bubba]

i believe they have stated clearly. youwagers rules allow theft of players, therefore youwager has done no wrong.

[Grumsi]

i believe they have stated clearly. youwagers rules allow theft of players, therefore youwager has done no wrong.

It is industry's standard now! It is because we are being convinced that we are the scammers here and not the books. Just check old threads and come to your own conclusions. They are slowly brainwashing us to believe that it is our fault when books are stealing our money, our hearts and our souls. It is our fault! F them! We need to put our standards, we need to create our T&C for them, the ones who can't follow our T&C, should be declared a scam book!

[Optional]

i believe they have stated clearly. youwagers rules allow theft of players, therefore youwager has done no wrong.

What on earth are you talking about??? Have I missed something?

First SBR won't talk about it (False) and now SBR says they can steal?? Are you mixing this matter up with something else?

This is pathetic, you drop the ball big time on BI, and clearly something is going on at YW, any type of clarity or anything would be nice, dropped DSI to a D last year overnight for almost the same situation , so?

1) SBR has given updates about both Youwager matters. Both are in the middle of being investigated. Both are complicated. Both are being taken seriously. And both will take as long as they take to resolve.

2) Each time I answer one of you drama queen's idiot questions like this, the answer is ignored and another round of you are defending the book commences from the peanut gallery. (see this stupid post claiming SBR wont make a statement as a prime example)

3) People that are not involved trying to act like they know the answer before the investigations are done, often do not help. Sometimes hurt the persons case.


and more than anything else 4) who the hell are you to demand personal information about someone elses case?


Of course there will be a result and SBR will say whatever can be fairly said at the time.

Stop acting like excited school children desperately wanting your birthday gift to be more and bigger drama today.

[infotimbo]

1) SBR has given updates about both Youwager matters. Both are in the middle of being investigated. Both are complicated. Both are being taken seriously. And both will take as long as they take to resolve.

As far as I can see, we have three (?) people on here that had their Bitcoin withdrawals sent to the very same, wrong address. How much worse can it get?

Of course Youwager should get the chance to investigate this and find out how this happened - but as long as the issue is not fixed and there's the high probability of more money getting taken away from customers, can you, with clean conscience, recommend anyone to use the site?! That's what SBR does with keeping the rating at A.

[shari91]

As far as I can see, we have three (?) people on here that had their Bitcoin withdrawals sent to the very same, wrong address. How much worse can it get?

Of course Youwager should get the chance to investigate this and find out how this happened - but as long as the issue is not fixed and there's the high probability of more money getting taken away from customers, can you, with clean conscience, recommend anyone to use the site?! That's what SBR does with keeping the rating at A.

The thing is though you can't drop a book's rating before actually knowing all of the facts in the case with a somewhat high degree of confidence after investigating all that you can because imagine the outrage if a book's rating was dropped and then it turns out they were actually in the right. They potentially lose new customers, existing ones react to the ratings drop by spreading negative word of mouth both here and at other forums or by withdrawing their funds completely and we totally smash a once great relationship with a book who wasn't at fault.

I understand why a few of you are calling for ratings drops, statements, etc beyond what's already been said but that's not how things work here. When definitive info is known it'll be released as some has already and not before.

[Optional]

The other thing that gets up my nose... any time there is a serious complaint at any book thought to be a possible SBR sponsor this same crap comes up. "SBR is bought and paid for and defends the book no matter what".

But over years and years, just about every genuine issue has ended up being sorted out and players helped.

Followed by a round of "thanks SBR", "So glad we have SBR".


We are not some sort of legal authority. We just try to help resolve problems between players and books. For free. And do a damn good job of it. Much better than any regulator you can name.

But still, the same crap every time. The new and inexperienced posters piling in is one thing. They probably know no better and just imagine SBR must be terrible based on the flood of posts from the few.

I don't let it bother me 99% of the time. But when it's experienced long term posters not just failing to pull them up, but even piling on when they should know better, that pushes me to this point of wanting to fight back.

[Optional]

As far as I can see, we have three (?) people on here that had their Bitcoin withdrawals sent to the very same, wrong address. How much worse can it get?

This one seems easy to me actually.

Youwager need to work out how this happened.

If it is clear the players submitted correct addresses, I'd be confident they will be made good again.


From their initial reaction to these people's problem, they obviously think the players did submit them that way.

Now they are looking into it more closely.


Let's hope they find differently.

(and before you tell me it definitely has to be an inside job, there are trojans out there that try to catch people copying bitcoin addresses and then alter the clipboard copy to go to scammer's wallets. As just one example of how it might not be)

[infotimbo]

and before you tell me it definitely has to be an inside job, there are trojans out there that try to catch people copying bitcoin addresses and then alter the clipboard copy to go to scammer's wallets. As just one example of how it might not be

the way I understood it, he requested all payouts at once. And as most of them were sent to the correct address, that would exclude this possibility.

But I am not familiar with Youwager's payout process personally, so I don't know whether all addresses need to be entered (and confirmed) one by one, or in one step.

[Optional]

the way I understood it, he requested all payouts at once. And as most of them were sent to the correct address, that would exclude this possibility.

But I am not familiar with Youwager's payout process personally, so I don't know whether all addresses need to be entered (and confirmed) one by one, or in one step.

The players machines are not the only ones involved in the transaction.

I don't really like going down the road of speculation on this one right now. So hope you don't mind me leaving it at that.

[infotimbo]

The players machines are not the only ones involved in the transaction.
I don't really like going down the road of speculation on this one right now. So hope you don't mind me leaving it at that.

no, it's fine, thanks.

In the end, most important is, that it never happens again. So from my point of view, "just" paying out the players will not do to regain a feeling of security in this case - let's hope Youwager is aware of that, and acts accordingly.

[Grumsi]

no, it's fine, thanks.

In the end, most important is, that it never happens again. So from my point of view, "just" paying out the players will not do to regain a feeling of security in this case - let's hope Youwager is aware of that, and acts accordingly.

If they are not scums, they should pay them double. Anything less and we are back to criminals. Trying to freeroll players.

[Optional]

no, it's fine, thanks.

In the end, most important is, that it never happens again. So from my point of view, "just" paying out the players will not do to regain a feeling of security in this case - let's hope Youwager is aware of that, and acts accordingly.

There has barely been any complaints about Youwager over my time here. Let alone serious problems like these. So as good as that sounds, it also means I have no way to gauge how they will react like I do with most other major offshores. But they look to be serious about finding the real cause so far to me.

I'm hoping this is cleared up with as transparent an explanation as possible too.

[milwaukee mike]

youwager will make the bitcoin transactions right... although the people that like to piss and moan about everything offshore would probably rather have it that they stiff everyone, just so they can say "i told you so"?

[Optional]

This is pathetic, you drop the ball big time on BI, and clearly something is going on at YW, any type of clarity or anything would be nice, dropped DSI to a D last year overnight for almost the same situation , so?

i believe they have stated clearly. youwagers rules allow theft of players, therefore youwager has done no wrong.

Nothing more to say here you two???

C'mon Bubba, you are super quick to question me any time you smell some drama. Always look to find a negative angle on everything.

But you just run away now I come back at you?

Explain yourself coward.

Where has SBR "stated clearly" what rules are allowed and that Youwager have done no wrong??


And you know what else Bubba? Say SBR ends up agreeing with whatever decision Youwager come up with... Why would you automatically say that must be wrong!?

Do you not think SBR and the dispute agents know what the hell they are doing? Or do you just think we are all corrupt and evil liars?? Because that's how you come across very often.


I know you would love me to be part of the drama and make proclamations about every case, declaring the book to be wrong or right and changing ratings based on one post from an unknown with a yet un-investigated issue.

But I'm not here to be judge and shamer. My role is to explain stuff, answer questions, help people on the forum and resolve complaints. I work with both sides of the industry to resolve problems. If books don't respect me they will not take any notice of my opinions and suggestions. I am not going to bash them to make you feel better even when I don't fully agree with decisions. But I'm also not going to defend them when i think they have done wrong. I'll stand by my posting history here to back that up.

Do you imagine you would have a snowflakes chance in hell of having any Bookmaker work with you with your horrible attitude?


And next time you try to tell me SBR is some money hungry blinded by profits book protectors, please think about all these little things;


* Why does SBR use a direct 3rd party donation to "pay" for membership? Not even a tax deduction out of it. Did the money hungry player hating assholes here miss that money making opportunity?

* When was the last time you joined a book under an SBR affiliate program? Do you feel pushed or even encouraged very heavily to signup to any books here? Is that at all different to every other sports betting forum out there?

* Why does SBR spend just about all of it's marketing money giving back hundreds of thousands to users here? Surely a hateful money hungry operation like you imagine this is would be more cost effective and cheaper to just do stuff like 1xbet does... new and better advertising all over the place to keep the flow of new signups replacing the old?

* And lastly, I'll make you a bet I can come up with more than 50 examples of SBR helping players and being praised on the result for every thread you want to bring up that shows players unhappy at the end result.

I'll also bet you someone like you will repeatedly post in most of those threads saying they know what happened, the player or the book is scam, or SBR is protecting the book.... before it works out as per normal, then you cowards are no where to be seen. Never come back and say oops I was wrong.

But you can be sure the same "Bubba type" will be back again next time saying shit like SBR declared the rules fair and clearly say they can steal.

[BigBlueNYG]

What's with the insults? No one insulted you , a valid question was asked, if you didn't lose any money in the BI FIASCO then shut your mouth and do your damn job which doesn't include insulting your customers

[Optional]

What's with the insults? No one insulted you , a valid question was asked, if you didn't lose any money in the BI FIASCO then shut your mouth and do your damn job which doesn't include insulting your customers

You're not my customer.

And this thread is the insult.

You posted complete BS, ran away when called out on it, and now want to cry that I should not insult you back instead of even addressing what you did.


What sort of snowflake starts a thread with a question like;

"Why will SBR not make some statement on Youwager?

This is pathetic, you drop the ball big time on BI, and clearly something is going on at YW, any type of clarity or anything would be nice, dropped DSI to a D last year overnight for almost the same situation , so?"

And now tries to squirm away by saying it's mean to be rude back in the answer.


It's funny how the mob of pricks like you have all run away and closed your big mouths when challenged.

Where's Lonnie now? You've been prolific and quick with your smart ass asides suggesting the same crap over the last week... have you run and hidden too??

I guess Bubba is still trying to think something up.

No doubt any sort of apology is just way too much for these types to handle.

NO HONOR OR INTEGRITY. <--- So you can't understand it in others. That's the problem you guys all suffer.

[captrobey]

I like SBR overall except for the casino. Optional has helped me in a lot of different ways so i always will trust him. I do like Youwager i really do and i have not really had any issues withdrawing from them. But the story about the guy who supposedly used a bot bothers me a little. I have never had a balance THAT high over $77000 i think he had. But what worries me is what if i ever got lucky on a longshot parlay or something. I do not think i have ever had over $20000 in there . But even if he used a bot unless he admits it there is no 100% proof that he actually did that. Even if you are 99% sure that still does not give you the right to just keep $77000 + unless you are absolutely sure. He should at least get his money he has won.

[Optional]

I like SBR overall except for the casino. Optional has helped me in a lot of different ways so i always will trust him. I do like Youwager i really do and i have not really had any issues withdrawing from them. But the story about the guy who supposedly used a bot bothers me a little. I have never had a balance THAT high over $77000 i think he had. But what worries me is what if i ever got lucky on a longshot parlay or something. I do not think i have ever had over $20000 in there . But even if he used a bot unless he admits it there is no 100% proof that he actually did that. Even if you are 99% sure that still does not give you the right to just keep $77000 + unless you are absolutely sure. He should at least get his money he has won.

Thanks Cappy.

The bot one does look like it was managed badly by YW. And i'm not sure what will happen there. Saying you can't be 100% sure is not an argument though. Unless you would accept Bart Simpson saying "No one saw me, so you can't prove it" as a defense.

If they do find evidence of a bot it will show a repeated non-human pattern over a lot of bets. I think you would be satisfied there was a bot if that is the case (or should be).

I hope that does not happen, as selfishly I'd just prefer this drama to go away now whoever is right.

[milwaukee mike]

Thanks Cappy.

The bot one does look like it was managed badly by YW. And i'm not sure what will happen there. Saying you can't be 100% sure is not an argument though. Unless you would accept Bart Simpson saying "No one saw me, so you can't prove it" as a defense.

If they do find evidence of a bot it will show a repeated non-human pattern over a lot of bets. I think you would be satisfied there was a bot if that is the case (or should be).

I hope that does not happen, as selfishly I'd just prefer this drama to go away now whoever is right.

oh come on optional you live for this shit.

[bubba]

Thanks Cappy.

The bot one does look like it was managed badly by YW. And i'm not sure what will happen there. Saying you can't be 100% sure is not an argument though. Unless you would accept Bart Simpson saying "No one saw me, so you can't prove it" as a defense.

If they do find evidence of a bot it will show a repeated non-human pattern over a lot of bets. I think you would be satisfied there was a bot if that is the case (or should be).

I hope that does not happen, as selfishly I'd just prefer this drama to go away now whoever is right.

I admit i am not familiar with bots. But you find it ok to have youwager have a rule that says they confiscate your entire balance if a bot was used? Any rule that results in confiscating balance is scary for players and why we need places like sbr for protection.

What if the rule said anyone who acceses account with public wifi has entire balance confiscated? Would you be ok with an "A" book acting like this? Or any private wifi that has had 2 accounts access it, all balances confiscated? Would you be ok with youwager acting on this?

In my humble opinion, players balances need to be treated as PLAYERS BALANCES and not the book doing as they please, even if in the fineprint of their site it says they can.

[Optional]

With all due respect Bubba, are you really going to ignore me going off my head and those questions and just fire your own questions back at me?

Oh don't worry. That's fine.

I agree the rule sounds quite broad. And the response of placing a CAPTCHA instead of directly warning the person to stop bot use or closing the account appears to leave the way open to a potential issue like this one to me too. I'm not sure there will be much chance of mounting that argument for this guy if YW prove the bot use he denies though. Just being realistic and knowing what it is like when a book is sure your guy is a cheat but agrees to go through a long process like this to give us documentary evidence. Don't shoot me for the info. It's not an opinion about right or wrong.

[bubba]

What on earth are you talking about??? Have I missed something?

First SBR won't talk about it (False) and now SBR says they can steal?? Are you mixing this matter up with something else?

I never said SBR wont talk about youwager. That was someone else so please dont point that at me.

I said Sbr appears to say youwager is acting appropriately due to their terms and conditions. I find taking away someones money theft. So i say SBR is OK with youwagers theft. Do you have any other questions directly for me that you need answers? I will be happy to answer.

[Optional]

Did you say that? Scroll above and you will see something about SBR stating clearly.

Of course you would not bother to quote that, or pull back from it.

I guess Bubba is still trying to think something up.

No doubt any sort of apology is just way too much for these types to handle.

NO HONOR OR INTEGRITY. <--- So you can't understand it in others. That's the problem you guys all suffer.

[bubba]

Did you say that? Scroll above and you will see something about SBR stating clearly.

Of course you would not bother to quote that, or pull back from it.

I honestly dont understand your question or complaint with me. I am drunk granted, but I feel like I'm being trolled. Just directly say what your current issue with me is, or ask a question. Dont say "read the thread, that's the issue". Be fair.

[goduke]

Optional I don’t know this case well but I remember BetIslands and because of that there’s always going to be skepticism. That wasn’t handled correctly and that’s why sometimes the paranoia ramps up here. You can say that SBR handles almost all the issues but that one that they missed was a pretty big one.

[Optional]

Optional I don’t know this case well but I remember BetIslands and because of that there’s always going to be skepticism. That wasn’t handled correctly and that’s why sometimes the paranoia ramps up here. You can say that SBR handles almost all the issues but that one that they missed was a pretty big one.

Yeah, I was just having a hissy fit about a barrage of attacks I felt were misguided over the last week and should not have let it get on top of me.

Bubba being one of the regular posters in this sub-forum who I thought should have known better is what set me off so badly in this thread.

I should not, and don't usually, let it get under my skin.

Sorry for my outburst everyone.

[bubba]

Yeah, I was just having a hissy fit about a barrage of attacks I felt were misguided over the last week and should not have let it get on top of me.

Bubba being one of the regular posters in this sub-forum who I thought should have known better is what set me off so badly in this thread.

I should not, and don't usually, let it get under my skin.

Sorry for my outburst everyone.

Optional- I have no idea your issue with me here. Cause I said sbr is ok with youwager confiscating 77k (due to questionable rules?) Or because I called the confiscation of 77k theft? Is either of my statements so horrible to continuously call me out?

The continued A rating makes me feel sbr is ok with what's gone down. I have no dog in the fight. Youwager closed my account a year or 2 ago (and you personally helped me get paid. Thanks again for that).

[Optional]

Bubba. You had your chance to discuss this with me.

First you ignored me for two days.

Then you dissed me out by totally ignoring what I said and tried asking questions back.

At that point I shrugged my shoulders and thought, oh well, he obviously can't deal with justifying his own words, I'll let it go, give up and just answer his question.

After that show of weakness on my part, you decide you will try to come back at me after all. But even worse, just acting dumb as your defense?!

You don't deserve another word from me, ever.


But just in case you really are so un-selfaware to really not understand your part here, SBR has not made a "Clear Statement" about these cases. Let alone one that says what you claim was CLEARLY STATED.

You can go through my 30 thousand odd posts and pick out any one you like and ask me to justify my words, and I will. Or admit I was wrong if that is the case. But you won't find a single post I will run away from like you and BigBlue have done here.

As a regular, your words carry more weight. That's why your post got picked out. You're not the worst or harshest critic, just one I was disappointed seeing piling on with the angry idiots rather than being a reasonable voice in the melee.

But I'll know better in future.

Again

[bubba]

Bubba. You had your chance to discuss this with me.

First you ignored me for two days.

Then you dissed me out by totally ignoring what I said and tried asking questions back.

At that point I shrugged my shoulders and thought, oh well, he obviously can't deal with justifying his own words, I'll let it go, give up and just answer his question.

After that show of weakness on my part, you decide you will try to come back at me after all. But even worse, just acting dumb as your defense?!

You don't deserve another word from me, ever.


But just in case you really are so un-selfaware to really not understand your part here, SBR has not made a "Clear Statement" about these cases. Let alone one that says what you claim was CLEARLY STATED.

You can go through my 30 thousand odd posts and pick out any one you like and ask me to justify my words, and I will. Or admit I was wrong if that is the case. But you won't find a single post I will run away from like you and BigBlue have done here.

As a regular, your words carry more weight. That's why your post got picked out. You're not the worst or harshest critic, just one I was disappointed seeing piling on with the angry idiots rather than being a reasonable voice in the melee.

But I'll know better in future.

Again

Try not to be so sensitive, especially with my delays in replying to posts. my ability to post fluctuates based on the rest of my life. I dont have the time now to dissect the entirety of your post right now. But you appear to now be upset that I used the word clearly. I thought it was a clear exaggeration/figure of speech. Obviously SBR has not issued a "clear" statement on the issue, especially at the time of my posting.

And if my words carry weight here like you say, id like to think of it because I always state the truth on here (to the best of my ability) and am fair and consistent to the best of my ability with all disputes and problems that arise amongst players and books. Not just because I am a "regular". There are many regulars here whose words are worth very little to me.

[aljack]

* When was the last time you joined a book under an SBR affiliate program? Do you feel pushed or even encouraged very heavily to signup to any books here? Is that at all different to every other sports betting forum out there?

Um... you force users to use an affiliate link to become an SBR Pro, and even sometimes deny those people who have signed up using the link (without any proof) forcing them to use another one of your affiliate links to access contests and to be able to cash out bet points from the rewards program.

Saying that SBR doesn't 'push or encourage' people to sign up to Sportsbooks they are affiliated with, using the tracking links - is a joke. An absolute joke. That's all you guys do. I've been given the run around multiple times trying to use Bet Points, I have been given the run around multiple times trying to renew my SBR Pro membership (even though I was already an SBR Pro via Pinnacle, my account was deemed "made in error" so I was forced to sign up and deposit with another book to cash out my bet points - those SBR Store orders have still not been fulfilled btw.)

All of this - and numerous other complaints that I have come across over my time on this forum has made it very clear - you guys feed the books, it is your overall goal as an internet platform...

To say you don't - well is an absolute joke.

Just more dishonesty and lies from SBR. Typical at this point.

[aljack]

Tell me more about how SBR doesn't "push or encourage" people to sign up for various online sportsbooks you are affiliated with.

Even when your users have already done so.

[Optional]

Um... you force users to use an affiliate link to become an SBR Pro, and even sometimes deny those people who have signed up using the link (without any proof) forcing them to use another one of your affiliate links to access contests and to be able to cash out bet points from the rewards program.

Saying that SBR doesn't 'push or encourage' people to sign up to Sportsbooks they are affiliated with, using the tracking links - is a joke. An absolute joke. That's all you guys do. I've been given the run around multiple times trying to use Bet Points, I have been given the run around multiple times trying to renew my SBR Pro membership (even though I was already an SBR Pro via Pinnacle, my account was deemed "made in error" so I was forced to sign up and deposit with another book to cash out my bet points - those SBR Store orders have still not been fulfilled btw.)

All of this - and numerous other complaints that I have come across over my time on this forum has made it very clear - you guys feed the books, it is your overall goal as an internet platform...

To say you don't - well is an absolute joke.

Just more dishonesty and lies from SBR. Typical at this point.

Tell me more about how SBR doesn't "push or encourage" people to sign up for various online sportsbooks you are affiliated with.

Even when your users have already done so.

I saw your thread about the Pinny sportsbook cash you are waiting for.

I have nothing to do with the store but am pretty sure Pinny wont credit sportsbook cash to accounts not originally referred by SBR. I bet that's the problem.

If you get on live chat in office hours and ask Genie she will know for sure. (or PM SBR Genie)