[onemoregoal]

True, for small amounts that may get you a free bet or a refund.
But for thousands, especially when they suspect cheating/criminal acts - not so much.

I suspect these cases are very different to a UK player being short changed at a betting shop, interesting case though.

Willhill have taken deposits, (very serious and normally its because of "cheating" - they have this as a term in their rules lol , and/or criminal acts) its very different to withholding winnings which happens more often.
It could be they are just being harsh on those particular countries, or linking accounts to previous "bad" accounts (possibly in error..).... hard to say.

[piterp]

To be honest i still dont see reason to confiscate deposit from players beacuse william hill is not owner of deposits another point is massive grown of negative comments about them since this year

[bigballa]

i dont even know where to begin with this thread........suppose i start with the original poster......

you bet a bent/fixed game my friend.....not saying you knew about it or not but this sounds like 95% most likely scenario, hills and betvictor pull this $hit all the time and i suppose from a business standpoint i cant blame them, the big books like 365 will pay out and settle up to avoid any extra paperwork....but books like hills and more specifically betvictor love to do their 'investigating'...which isnt more than them emailing the football league, tennis governing body etc. and/or GC(gambling commission) and seeing if their is anything inregular betting or suspect matches and will just sit on your cash and let it collect interest in their bank account while they do this, it could really take anyhting from a week to months for anything to be done, if anything is done at all. I have had this issue myself with betvictor and took a few moths to sort out, was on live chat a few times a week talking to various ppl and seeing what was up, the big thing that seemed to stick with whoever i talked to was mentioning a big book, in my case i mentioned 365 and the fact that they had settled out on the match(again this is assuming its that you bet a dodgy match at all, its safe to assume spain vs brazil wouldnt have been fixed but if your betting 3rd divison bulgarin youth matches and havent stated that here you will know it COULD have been fixed)...so just keep saying you cant hold my money other books have settled out on blah blah match...it really is a case of staying calm and kissing as much a$$ as you can cuz alot of these ppl will just brush you to one side on the chat if you come on and cuss and carry on at them, and never actually send an email to the higher power saying'yo this guy says 365 have paid and if we dont pay he going to ibas etc, think we should sort it' and it gets sorted'....

it is unfair i totally agree with you my man but it is a business to them and they dont give a poop if it takes 3 months for their 'investigation', just how it is, as another poster as mentioned it does look very suspect to go throwing down 2,500 euros or w/e it was on a FRIENDLY especially if its your FIRST bet.......all sorts of bells and whistles will be going off on their end with this kind of stuff......

all the best my man, sorry for my rambling and lot of extra bits..if was a dodgy game at worst you should get your money back but if your trying to 'clean' your money and depositing through skrill and that then your likely screwed.......

[bigballa]

SBR not only justifying William Hill actions but they started to delete Threads which are exposing their corupt behavior !

hahaha you catch on quick dont you my friend......your not paying sbr.....the bookies are paying sbr.....dirt on books disappears all the time.....

[bigballa]

Not only will they not help, but they will not even consider downgrading WH. this forum acts as a place to warn other players...that's it's only use. Do not expect anything else.

haha downgrade WH???? why?? has the original OP even said what the hell he has even back or what sport or what country he is from yet??? and you want sbr to cr@p their paints because some eastern european has bet a fixed game and come on here wondering why he hasnt been paid?? this issue is a small and probably and everyday thing here, if sbr changed ratings based on these ppl that come on for one day to have a moan because their cousin is on the team that is tossing a match today in 5th divison moldovian soccer and new accounts are throwing 3k down then wondering why they arent getting their money, then what would be the point of the ratings.....i agree with you they are a joke but your a fool if you use the ratings when deciding to use a book anyway.....you will find that there are much much worse books in the game than willhill....

[bigballa]

Here's the email:

this stuff is the nature of the business, pretty sure it says when you sign up to skrill something to the affect 'will you be using this for gambling purposes' and you check the box yes i pretty sure it states that ties you into the credit checks that companies will run.....this is normal, i am surprised ppl are so shocked about this.......

[bigballa]

Does anybody want to help us or whaT????????? HOW MANY COMPLAINTS DO YOU NEED "SBR"???????????????? I'm sorry that I repeat my self but obviously nobody cares:


These guys from WH are THIEVESSSS!!!!!! So this happen d before 2 weeks, waited 9 days to resolve my issue Here is my story:

I was playing from Toronto, but before a month I moved to UK. So I asked them : " Will be a problem for you if I play from UK??? " they told me that I've got to change my address, so the only way was to close my account and reopen a new one, everything was done from the WH agent and he assured me that there will be no problem with my account!!!! Few deposits for 5k, a long betting history, 6k winnings, they returned my deposits and stole my 6k winnings, the first reason they gave me was a "duplicate account" , but after they realized that I have a few copies of my chat conversations with 'em they sent me this bullshit!!!!

Subject: Your William Hill Account

We write further regarding the status of your account with us. First, we would like to apologize for the time it took us to get back to you. Due to the nature of your concern, we needed to coordinate with several teams in order to gather accurate information. Upon thorough investigation on your account, we regret to inform you that per Management's decision, it will remain closed and funds will be withheld due to breaching our Terms and Conditions. Whilst we understand that you may be unhappy with this action, we can assure you that this has been diligently investigated and has undergone a full thorough review by a group of our dedicated agents. Kind regards. Theresa Management Team William Hill Online (The agent is listening)

and this is the chat conversation before 13 days
Arabella: Hi, you’re speaking to Arabella. How may I help you?
****: Hello, my username is *****
Arabella: Hi *****.
******: I wish to change my address cause I live in London UK now
*******: Can you please help me with it?
Arabella: Let me go ahead and assist you with your concern.
*****: OK
******: Thank you
Arabella: I will need to verify your account in compliance with our standard procedures. To do this, I will ask you some questions regarding your account. Can I please have your username, full name,date of birth, email address and your full registered address as registered on your account?
*******: *****************
Arabella: Please verify the address that you registered on your account.
Arabella: Are we still connected?
*******: yes
*********: you want my new address?
Arabella: Please verify the address that you registered on your account.
Arabella: The address that you registered on your account.
******: I'm sorry
*******: I didn't understand you
Arabella: Please verify the address that you registered on your account.
*******: ***************
Arabella: Thanks.
Arabella: And please confirm the answer to your security question- Mother's Maiden Name?
**********: *********
Arabella: Thanks.
Arabella: One moment please.
Arabella: Thanks for waiting.
Arabella: Upon checking, your account will be closed so you can reopen a new one
*******: it's closed? so I must open a new one, is that right?
Arabella: Yes.
*******: and there'll be no problem with my account, this'll be not a duplicate account?
Arabella: No, because it is closed already.
******: Ok thank you

no sympathy here, it takes her asking you 3 times for the address CURRENTLY REGISTERED on the account...jesus its not like your on the phone its in a chat, so what she has said is still right there yet you play dumb about it.....you were obviously scamming them or something more to the story .......

[piterp]

haha downgrade WH???? why?? has the original OP even said what the hell he has even back or what sport or ...

If WH confiscate players deposit and not provide proof of cheating is no difference between them and c-rated books

[damnasians]

this stuff is the nature of the business, pretty sure it says when you sign up to skrill something to the affect 'will you be using this for gambling purposes' and you check the box yes i pretty sure it states that ties you into the credit checks that companies will run.....this is normal, i am surprised ppl are so shocked about this.......

That is not the nature of the business. That it not why you need to tell them that the funds are for gambling purposes.
Skrill do not perform credit checks. They do not provide credit.
This is not normal.

Do not talk about things you don't know about. You make yourself look like an idiot.

[sharpcircle]

bigballa,

it seems you didn't read polin issue properly. Also why shouldn't they either get a lower grade or justify their actions. THere is a lot of threads saying WH has been doing things unfairly and no explanation from them or SBR regarding the matters.

[bigballa]

That is not the nature of the business. That it not why you need to tell them that the funds are for gambling purposes.
Skrill do not perform credit checks. They do not provide credit.
This is not normal.

Do not talk about things you don't know about. You make yourself look like an idiot.

me the idiot??? your funny my friend, you yourself posted an email correspondence between skrill and and bookie....this is common stuff in the business even another poster has posted similar emails between the two, not sure where you are from but uk/european bookies WILL and do run credit checks, and lots more than that....you live in a fairy tale world if you think books are just going to let ppl sign up and throw cash around and not wonder who these ppl are, not saying they do it for everyone but they will defiantly be doing it for the eastern European ppl that sign up and throw 2500 on a friendly match....all

the best though my friend in your fairy tale world, you have a lot of growing up to do if you think company's and other business arent going to do background/credit checks etc.......

[bigballa]

bigballa,

it seems you didn't read polin issue properly. Also why shouldn't they either get a lower grade or justify their actions. THere is a lot of threads saying WH has been doing things unfairly and no explanation from them or SBR regarding the matters.

all i'm saying is you dont read to many good stories on here, ppl only search these forums out when they have problems or want to bash a book, you dont see many posters saying 'just wanted to thank WH for their outstanding service today when i made my withdrawal'....dont get me wrong there are some but my point is they are few and far between...so like i said sbr arent going to downgrade a book even if there are a 100 complaints because WH and other books will have millions of customers so just because a poster wants them downgraded they arent going to listen, you have to remember as well it isnt you or i paying for that willhill banner that will run across the top of the page...like damnasians said 'Not only will they not help, but they will not even consider downgrading WH. this forum acts as a place to warn other players...that's it's only use. Do not expect anything else.' take what these posters say with a pinch of salt as well could just be some ex employee with an ax to grind, i mean the guy still hasnt said where the hell he is even from.......

[benandjerry]

all i'm saying is you dont read to many good stories on here, ppl only search these forums out when they have problems or want to bash a book, you dont see many posters saying 'just wanted to thank WH for their outstanding service today when i made my withdrawal'....dont get me wrong there are some but my point is they are few and far between...so like i said sbr arent going to downgrade a book even if there are a 100 complaints because WH and other books will have millions of customers so just because a poster wants them downgraded they arent going to listen, you have to remember as well it isnt you or i paying for that willhill banner that will run across the top of the page...like damnasians said 'Not only will they not help, but they will not even consider downgrading WH. this forum acts as a place to warn other players...that's it's only use. Do not expect anything else.' take what these posters say with a pinch of salt as well could just be some ex employee with an ax to grind, i mean the guy still hasnt said where the hell he is even from.......

You definitely have a point with you'll hear about complaints and not all the good stuff, but it is quite alarming when there is a sudden increase in complaints regarding one specific book at any given time. WH has gotten a lot more complaints recently then before. All may not be true, all may not be the full story, but some probably are legit. Its really hard to tell whats really going on, but I wont be siding with the book unless the player is clearly proven guilty of something. Can you imagine what it'd be like being a eastern european player that was honest but had been put in a bad spot?

The guy with the changed address above seems very funny, if indeed those chats are legit. I know the procedure at a lot of places is similar to that, you need a big change of your account they tell you to close and open new one. I've had similar issues (not WH) so I can sympathise with this.

Regarding the ratings one obviously has to separate the sponsored books and the others, WH could pull some shady business and it'll be swept under the carpet whereas some other place does a little wrong there'll be official reports and downgrades.

I think this place used to act as a place to warn eachother and where to come for help, but I think it'd be hard to claim that too strongly these days.

[damnasians]

me the idiot??? your funny my friend, you yourself posted an email correspondence between skrill and and bookie....this is common stuff in the business even another poster has posted similar emails between the two, not sure where you are from but uk/european bookies WILL and do run credit checks, and lots more than that....you live in a fairy tale world if you think books are just going to let ppl sign up and throw cash around and not wonder who these ppl are, not saying they do it for everyone but they will defiantly be doing it for the eastern European ppl that sign up and throw 2500 on a friendly match....all

the best though my friend in your fairy tale world, you have a lot of growing up to do if you think company's and other business arent going to do background/credit checks etc.......

You do realise it is illegal for companies to carry out credit checks when no credit is being offered right? You have poor English, so I will give you the benefit of the doubt - what you mean are ID checks, such as NetIDme etc. These are not credit checks. These checks don't tend to work in Eastern European countries by the way - hence why they will be asked for ID documents and the vast majority of UK users will never have to send in documents.

The email I showed was a breach of the Data Protection Act and Moneybookers were reprimanded for it. It was not a "background/credit check". I suggest you read up on the Data Protection Act and contact the ICO for more information.

Back to your "fairy tale world" now little boy. Again, I will repeat; Do not talk about things you don't know about. You make yourself look like an idiot.

[piterp]

bigballa how much willhill pay you for defense them ???

endless robbery from will hill
http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/....php?t=4693275

[bigballa]

bigballa how much willhill pay you for defense them ???

endless robbery from will hill
http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/....php?t=4693275

piterp my man, as i have said the poster might have a beef but i think it was merely a case of him hitting on a fixed/bent game and they are 'investigating' as i have also stated this type of thing has happened to me as well @ betvictor, they will look into and try to give you the run around but if that is all it was they cant not pay out.......if it wasnt a case of a fixed game and the poster was being a naughty boy then he gets what he deserves, i am struggling to find any reason to give the OP any benefit of the doubt, a few ppl on here have asked him a few times where he is even from and yet he eludes the question.......take care buddy....

[HeeeHAWWWW]

bigballa how much willhill pay you for defense them ???

endless robbery from will hill
http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/....php?t=4693275

Lots of people with multiple accounts. Also known as fraud.

[onemoregoal]

bigballa how much willhill pay you for defense them ???

endless robbery from will hill
http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/....php?t=4693275

Thats just standard bonus abuse. money saving expert = people with no money, theyre just taking shots/bonus whores..

[piterp]

I don't believe that all people are cheaters similar situation was witch acbet they blame people for massive cheating but finally they found system problem

[onemoregoal]

Very true, they are not all cheaters. But the example you gave wasnt the best. Those guys are looking to exploit bonuses for financial gain.

[piterp]

so is it reason to taken deposits????

[onemoregoal]

Yes because they have a term in their T+Cs which states they can do that if they find people "cheating". Cheating/Fraud is also covered in the gambling act, too lazy to find it atm.
The term "cheating", is very vague and can cover many circumstances.
Those guys are also from UK and are protected much better, so if they had a case, they generally get their money.

[piterp]

If they cancel winnings i can agree but deposit should be returned what is normal practice for high rated bookmakers
and small claims court very often take players side what is perfect example of will hill unfair game

[onemoregoal]

All books are dirty somewhat. They rely on people who are addicted to losing money, that in itself is questionable.

But they are also at risk due to bonus abuse, fixed games etc. But its not fair if people open many accounts to bonus abuse. Or win Ł5k on fixed games, when the bookie never stood a chance. Maybe they over react sometimes and some innocent people get caught up, however UK players generally get paid if they really have done nothing wrong.

On the flip side, part of me thinks a "bets a bet" as long as its not a late bet, it should be paid. They dont want to be at risk from fixed games, then dont take bets on Lithuania, you dont want bonus abuse - stop bonuses and offer better odds.

[contesting]

I think the most astonishing thing about this thread is how Skrill delivers such info to bookmakers - cant believe that is legal.

[piterp]

But its not fair if people open many accounts to bonus abuse. Or win Ł5k on fixed games, when the bookie never stood a chance.

Its is not all true because dynamic IP can make everyone bonus abuser also if game is fixed they can later cancel bet without problem

For me now will hill behavior is typical for c-rated bookmachers

[onemoregoal]

Its is not all true because dynamic IP can make everyone bonus abuser also if game is fixed they can later cancel bet without problem

For me now will hill behavior is typical for c-rated bookmachers

1- That doesnt mean people are not bonus abusing.
2- You are basically saying no one is making money from fixed games because books cancel all of them? Yeah books arent at risk from fixed games, ok then.

Im bored now bro, I could own you all day, but unfortunately I have things to do - good luck though.

[vladsimeo]

3 months since my account was locked with 8441 EUR(still investigating my winning bets) , no updates from WH, Gibraltar and SBR - THE BEST BOOKIE, THE INCREDIBLE COMMISSIONER and THE UNBRIBED FORUM

[damnasians]

3 months since my account was locked with 8441 EUR(still investigating my winning bets) , no updates from WH, Gibraltar and SBR - THE BEST BOOKIE, THE INCREDIBLE COMMISSIONER and THE UNBRIBED FORUM

vladsimeo, some questions:

1) What is your nationality?
2) What game did you bet on?

Thank you

[onemoregoal]

Any updates on this?
got a feeling their will be more problems after tomorrows Europa qualifiers

[VáclavSkácel]

Burt: Hi, you’re speaking to Burt. How may I help you?
You: my account is locked.
Burt: Okay. I can check on that, but first, I need to verify your account in compliance with our standard procedures. To do this, I will ask you some questions regarding your account.
Burt: Can I please have your full name, date of birth and email address as registered on your account?
You: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxx
Burt: Your full billing address and postal code as registered on your account, please?
You: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Burt: And finally, please confirm the answer to the security question that you set-up on the account.
You: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Communication with the chat service has been lost. Please wait while attempts are made to restore the connection.
Disconnection in 240 seconds.
Disconnection in 120 seconds.
Connection resumed.
Burt: Let me check on your account, please.
Burt: Could you please allow me 3-5 minutes so I can check this matter for you?
You: yes
Burt: Thank you for your understanding.
Burt: Our Security Team have verified the National ID card, therefore the restrictions into your account have been removed.
You: I still can not login ACC02
Burt: Let me check on that, please.
Burt: I am sorry for that but can I have 3-5 minutes and check the problem on your account?
You: yes
Burt: Thank you
Burt: Thank you for patiently waiting and I am sorry for the delay of my response. May I have another 5 minutes as I have coordinated your concern to our Security Team so that we can
have your account reactivated.
You: yes
Burt: Thank you
Burt: Thus, the account will remain as it is. As advised by our Security team, due to fraudulent activity your account will remain closed and the funds witheld.
You: What??? I have 7625 EUROS in my account!!!! My deposit is 500 EUROS and I win 1875 EUROS from Sigma - Kaiserslautern and 5250 EUR from Shamrock - Birmingham! I want my winnings!
Burt: This is what the Security team has found out through a security check, and this is what we are able to advise you.
Burt: Anything else that I can assist you with?
You: You don't help me!!!! What is wrong with my account?? Why didn't you lock my account when I lost 600 EUROS last Saturday???
Burt: I believe we have already discussed this and I have provided you with all the information at hand.
You: I want to withdrawal my money!!! Close my account and pay my money!!
Burt: Do you have any other queries?
You: What??? I want to withdrawal my money!!! Are you crazy???
Burt: I advise you to please refrain from saying inappropriate words in order for me to assist you properly.
You: I want my money, I won and I want my money!!!!
Burt: Is there anything else I can help you with?
You: Yes, I want my money! This is ilegal, you are stealing my money!!!!!!
Burt: I am sorry but we have not stolen anything from you, it is still on your account and your account is being locked.
You: and when will be unlocked?
Burt: This is a non-negotiable decision by our Security Team and Management.
You: What is the reason to close my account? I verified my age and my account?? Give me a reason?
Burt: As advised, our Security team has run their security checks and this is the decision they have taken along.
Burt: Anything else that I can assist you with?
You: Yes, I want my money back to my DC!!!
Burt: If you continue doing so, I may have to disconnect this chat.
You: What??? Are you serious????? I want to know what is the reason you closed my account!!! This is ridiculous!
Burt: I will now terminate this chat to give way to other customers. Should you have any questions or enquiries, please feel free to contact Online Support again. We are available 24/7. Thanks.
Burt has disconnected.



I can't say anything else!!!

[damnasians]

VáclavSkácel,

1) Where are you from?
2) Deposit method?

[VáclavSkácel]

VáclavSkácel,

1) Where are you from?
2) Deposit method?

Czech Republic
DC

[onemoregoal]

They should give you a specific reason, I really dont understand why Willhill talk in riddles.

This part of the coversation, it looks like you have missed a bit out - maybe you didnt but it doesnt flow very well: After "Thank you"

Burt: Thank you for patiently waiting and I am sorry for the delay of my response. May I have another 5 minutes as I have coordinated your concern to our Security Team so that we can
have your account reactivated.
You: yes
Burt: Thank you
Burt: Thus, the account will remain as it is. As advised by our Security team, due to fraudulent activity your account will remain closed and the funds witheld.

[voo]

try to contact gibraltar and ibas again