[Regul8er]

OK, let me explain the situation, and tell me if I'm in the right or wrong.

Last night my account was dwindling. I made an if-win bet on San Francisco ML (which won easy). At the time I thought I only had one pending wager to do the if-win bet, but I guess I had two, and selected a game which had already lost. I was doing this from my blackberry, which isn't friendly to the site. Well, I contacted customer service very shortly after, and asked if they could change the location of the if-bet. I was told no, the bet has already been placed. OK, no big deal I screwed up....my bad, I'll learn from it.

Well now here's my beef. My pending bets all lose, and now I have $0 in my account. I login later in the night, and notice I had $150 or so, and figured management was curteous, and gave me credit for my screwup. Well apparently they misgraded a bet, which I didnt realize. I proceeded to make a wager, which lost. I go back into my account last night, and I have a negative balance.

I'm being told I have to send in money to get myself out of negative? Does this sound right to you? I don't use locals for a reason, I don't bet credit....only what I can afford to lose.

Now I'm at the point where I won't play at 5d anymore because I'm not going to pony that money up. It's not like I saw an opportunity, and tried to take a shot. I legitimately thought I was credited for my if-win screw up.

Do I have a case, or will I be looking elsewhere to play now? Thanks

[secretstash]

tony is a jerk sometimes but he is reasonable others.. more than likely if u dont pay he will not open ur account back up ever.. but if u ask for him and explain your case honestly he might do you some kind of a deal where you post up the 150 and he gives u it as freeplay and credits the 150 towards the loss.. (or maybe he will understand u fully)

-stash

[raydog]

misgrades happen and i will tell exactly what tony is going to say to you....

tony: you knew we messed up...why would we credit you money for your fukk up... you took a shot and you lost...pay up or you will never play here again.

that is what you are going to get if you ask to chat with him...

i dont think you took a shot with free money, but i have to wonder what in the world would ever make you think that any book would credit you that money for you fukking up and subsequently losing bets

[Regul8er]

YA.....I figure I'll get the exact same response you guys pointed out.
Maybe if times get better I'll pony up.....but my next deposit won't be with 5d. That's for sure.

[Regul8er]

I wonder if I would have gotten paid that that bet won.

[wager1]

How could you of bet on a game that already lost? How was that game even on the board to bet on if it already was over?? Makes no sense

[tz0]

I wonder if I would have gotten paid that that bet won.

No way. They'd zero out all your winnings and still make you pay the $150.

I am on 5dimes's side here. If you have a question about how a wager was graded or where money spontaneously came from, call them. That statement is all over their rules page.

[raydog]

No way. They'd zero out all your winnings and still make you pay the $150.

I am on 5dimes's side here. If you have a question about how a wager was graded or where money spontaneously came from, call them. That statement is all over their rules page.

no, they wouldnt make him pay on that bet if it won...they would simply cancel the winnings and his balance would be 0

i have to question how its even possible to bet a game that is already over, as well... sure we see games on the board shortly after they started, but a game on the board after its done? you gotta pay better attention

[BranchDavidian]

So 5dimes misgrades a wager. The customer gets paid money by mistake. The customer then makes bets with this mistaken money and loses. When 5dimes discovers its mistake, it tells the customer to repay the lost bets -- as it should according to its rules under these circumstances ( all bets placed after a misgrade will be honored ). Now explain to me why 5dimes does not owe Dan Bouton for the bets he placed and won for the next couple of months after an incorrect payout?

[raydog]

So 5dimes misgrades a wager. The customer gets paid money by mistake. The customer then makes bets with this mistaken money and loses. When 5dimes discovers its mistake, it tells the customer to repay the lost bets -- as it should according to its rules under these circumstances ( all bets placed after a misgrade will be honored ). Now explain to me why 5dimes does not owe Dan Bouton for the bets he placed and won for the next couple of months after an incorrect payout?

if you really want to get down to exacts, the rule you stated has absolutely nothing to do with dans case and thats why 5dimes doesnt owe him anything and every bet he made after collecting money he knew wasnt his , should be void.... this rule discusses paying a player by mistake on a loss... not the wrong payout on a win... dans bet didnt lose... interpret the way you like, but dan was laughing at 5d up until the point they caught the mistake because he knew he was fukking them on a mistake

[5mike5]

if you really want to get down to exacts, the rule you stated has absolutely nothing to do with dans case and thats why 5dimes doesnt owe him anything and every bet he made after collecting money he knew wasnt his , should be void.... this rule discusses paying a player by mistake on a loss... not the wrong payout on a win... dans bet didnt lose... interpret the way you like, but dan was laughing at 5d up until the point they caught the mistake because he knew he was fukking them on a mistake

correct

[mintpicks79]

I have realized there mobile site sucks. I always go to there full site on my windows phone.

[andywend]

and figured management was curteous, and gave me credit for my screwup.

What planet are you living on where this could possibly happen?

[Hardcoar]

Firstly, you knew damn well that money as never yours to wager.

Secondly, I don't see this as a problem. Obviously the only reasonable course of action is to void any bets you made with the 150 kexx. That means if your bet had won 1000000... it should have been voided. If it lost (which it happened to), it should have been voided.

Demanding the money from you is simply ludicrous. Consider if your bet had won 1000000..... Do you think you simply would have been asked for the wager?

All bets made, regardless of the outcome, are without question to be null and void.

[BranchDavidian]

correct

Incorrect. 5dimes own rule states that ALL wagers will be honored.

[BranchDavidian]

if you really want to get down to exacts, the rule you stated has absolutely nothing to do with dans case and thats why 5dimes doesnt owe him anything and every bet he made after collecting money he knew wasnt his , should be void.... this rule discusses paying a player by mistake on a loss... not the wrong payout on a win... dans bet didnt lose... interpret the way you like, but dan was laughing at 5d up until the point they caught the mistake because he knew he was fukking them on a mistake

The rule discusses any re-grading. And it is the ONLY RULE the site has for mistakes in grading.

[BranchDavidian]

if you really want to get down to exacts, the rule you stated has absolutely nothing to do with dans case and thats why 5dimes doesnt owe him anything and every bet he made after collecting money he knew wasnt his , should be void.... this rule discusses paying a player by mistake on a loss... not the wrong payout on a win... dans bet didnt lose... interpret the way you like, but dan was laughing at 5d up until the point they caught the mistake because he knew he was fukking them on a mistake

You keep saying that Dan knew the money wasn't his. Why do you hold Dan to a higher standard than the customer service reps ( 5dimes agents ) and/or supervisor who Dan asked if the payout table was correct? And, whether or not Dan had a feeling the payout was incorrect -- he followed 5dimes rules by calling up and asking. Dan is not the rule breaker here, 5dimes is.

[BranchDavidian]

Firstly, you knew damn well that money as never yours to wager.

Secondly, I don't see this as a problem. Obviously the only reasonable course of action is to void any bets you made with the 150 kexx. That means if your bet had won 1000000... it should have been voided. If it lost (which it happened to), it should have been voided.

Demanding the money from you is simply ludicrous. Consider if your bet had won 1000000..... Do you think you simply would have been asked for the wager?

All bets made, regardless of the outcome, are without question to be null and void.

You might find it enlightening to read 5dimes rule page.

[ThaWoj]

When he said the game already lost, he just meant that it wasnt graded as a loss yet so it was still pending. so bc it was pending u could still do a rolling if bet from it

[Duff85]

Choice is easy - you want to play at 5Dimes again you pay the $150 when you are ready to play again, otherwise fukk em.

This is drastically different to my response to a similar situation a while back - since Tony stiffed that Dan Bouton dude. For the record I believe you do owe 5Dimes the money.

[TheMoneyShot]

We can see where this is going...-150 and bye bye to 5Dimes. No big deal. Find another book.

[raydog]

The rule discusses any re-grading. And it is the ONLY RULE the site has for mistakes in grading.

you simply dont understand what the word "grade" means in this case.... there are 3 outcomes when grading a bet... win lose push ... dan didnt lose and this rule doesnt apply at all because there was no grading error (if the rule said payout amount error, it would make dans case much stronger, it doesnt)... its really pretty simple and ive been saying it the whole time...you want to interpret it another way, go ahead, its not going to help dans case and its not worth arguing over... 100% incompetent bookmaking on 5dimes part, but i have no problem with the way it was handled

[BranchDavidian]

you simply dont understand what the word "grade" means in this case.... there are 3 outcomes when grading a bet... win lose push ... dan didnt lose and this rule doesnt apply at all because there was no grading error (if the rule said payout amount error, it would make dans case much stronger, it doesnt)... its really pretty simple and ive been saying it the whole time...you want to interpret it another way, go ahead, its not going to help dans case and its not worth arguing over... 100% incompetent bookmaking on 5dimes part, but i have no problem with the way it was handled

This is the only rule that 5dimes has for guidance when funds are incorrectly added to a players account. Whether those funds get there because a loss was graded a win --- or whether a payout was too high. Even if "grading" only refers to win/push/loss, there is no other rule to go by. This rule shows that 5dimes intends to hold the customer responsible for any negative balance and shows its fairness by honoring any bets that win. Do you really think that there is a difference between getting money incorrectly added because a loss was graded a win and because a win was given too much money? And, that enables 5dimes to do whatever it pleases in the second circumstance?
The rule that 5dimes has written shows what 5dimes intent is in this sort of situation -- since they are going to hold customers responsible for any bets that lose, they need to pay any bets that win.

[Slimpickens]

Firstly, you knew damn well that money as never yours to wager.

Secondly, I don't see this as a problem. Obviously the only reasonable course of action is to void any bets you made with the 150 kexx. That means if your bet had won 1000000... it should have been voided. If it lost (which it happened to), it should have been voided.

Demanding the money from you is simply ludicrous. Consider if your bet had won 1000000..... Do you think you simply would have been asked for the wager?

All bets made, regardless of the outcome, are without question to be null and void.

I would agree with this. If the bet won they would have just voided it. For 5dimes being such a highly rated and popular book they sure do seem to have alot of Fukk ups. There my favorite book but Ive had problems with them cancelling wagers on me as well. Most notably when I bet a formula 1 winner at much higher odds than he evidently was supposed to be. So during the race not before the bet was cancelled and they didnt even pay me what the supposed true odds were when my driver won.