[Alex_Peterson]

Good morning guys. My name is Alex_Peterson and I work for betonline.ag I work just for customer support, and this case I have seen many times over. The reality is many people cheat online. If not with collusion, then its with chip dumping. By us simply giving you a copy of your poker hands, it won't solve the case. We have to check many other factors. Say a player is chip dumping. Then the account he is chip dumping to, then has to be investigated. Then everyone that player losses money to also.
You have to understand this is a business, and if your in the UNITED STATES your not suppose to be playing either way. You will be surprised the stupid things players do, and then claim they were not cheating. I can assure you, that although the process is long. The reality is we have many cases which needs to be handled before we can resolved any new cases. Imagine how many hands a player who has played for maybe 6 hours must be reviewed. Then if he is chip dumping, the further research which must be done. I for one don't play poker online, because we have casinos EVERYWHERE in panama. Yet if you don't want your money to be tied up, then take a flight to vegas. You can get there for 99 dollars, which is cheaper then you trying to get a payout from us for 2500 via **.

[wtt0315]

I dont play online poker either so i dont care, but I do know as a former manager if one of my employees came on a website and told potiental clients you shouldnt play at my book if you want your money tied up and you should fly to vegas instead and cost me buisness, you would be looking for another job. The way your post reads it sounds like you are telling people not to play at the place you work because your money is going be tied up.. Good advertisement there

Good morning guys. My name is Alex_Peterson and I work for betonline.ag I work just for customer support, and this case I have seen many times over. The reality is many people cheat online. If not with collusion, then its with chip dumping. By us simply giving you a copy of your poker hands, it won't solve the case. We have to check many other factors. Say a player is chip dumping. Then the account he is chip dumping to, then has to be investigated. Then everyone that player losses money to also.
You have to understand this is a business, and if your in the UNITED STATES your not suppose to be playing either way. You will be surprised the stupid things players do, and then claim they were not cheating. I can assure you, that although the process is long. The reality is we have many cases which needs to be handled before we can resolved any new cases. Imagine how many hands a player who has played for maybe 6 hours must be reviewed. Then if he is chip dumping, the further research which must be done. I for one don't play poker online, because we have casinos EVERYWHERE in panama. Yet if you don't want your money to be tied up, then take a flight to vegas. You can get there for 99 dollars, which is cheaper then you trying to get a payout from us for 2500 via **.

[Alex_Peterson]

I dont play online poker either so i dont care, but I do know as a former manager if one of my employees came on a website and told potiental clients you shouldnt play at my book if you want your money tied up and you should fly to vegas instead and cost me buisness, you would be looking for another job. The way your post reads it sounds like you are telling people not to play at the place you work because your money is going be tied up.. Good advertisement there

Well you can interpet what I said how ever you like. You have thousands of people who request Payouts and never get delayed. If for some reason your account is suspended, then you were more then likely cheating, or showed a pattern of cheating. The jist of post was to address cheating online. Me referring to not wanting to have your money tied up is to those who CHEAT! So I take it you have nothing helpful to add to this thread at all huh?

[prop]

Good morning guys. My name is Alex_Peterson and I work for betonline.ag I work just for customer support, and this case I have seen many times over. The reality is many people cheat online. If not with collusion, then its with chip dumping. By us simply giving you a copy of your poker hands, it won't solve the case. We have to check many other factors. Say a player is chip dumping. Then the account he is chip dumping to, then has to be investigated. Then everyone that player losses money to also.
You have to understand this is a business, and if your in the UNITED STATES your not suppose to be playing either way. You will be surprised the stupid things players do, and then claim they were not cheating. I can assure you, that although the process is long. The reality is we have many cases which needs to be handled before we can resolved any new cases. Imagine how many hands a player who has played for maybe 6 hours must be reviewed. Then if he is chip dumping, the further research which must be done. I for one don't play poker online, because we have casinos EVERYWHERE in panama. Yet if you don't want your money to be tied up, then take a flight to vegas. You can get there for 99 dollars, which is cheaper then you trying to get a payout from us for 2500 via **.

Your competitors have software for the bulk of this. Funny post, and if real, it lends to the side BetOnline may just be complete idiots, as opposed to crooks. In either case, I hope management and ownership is arrested soon and BetOnline shut down.

[wtt0315]

I wont get into a pissing match here because really I don't care, because I dont play there, but I was refering to the fact that you said if you dont want your money tied up take a 99 dollar flight to vegas. You also said if you are the u.s you arent supposed to be playing. Well why do you let them play then? That is telling me right now that if I am considering betonline and I hear a employee say that I am not deposting. If I am going to a resturant and I hear a employee saying yeah we have long lines because we get short staffed do you think i am going? Also you said everyone has to be investaged. So If i deposit and i am playing and win but do nothing wrong and i go to cash out there is a chance I could get delayed just because I played against someone who is suspected of chip dumping to someone else and not even me?. No thank you. I am curious as why americans would chip dump to other americans anyway considering the only way we can deposit somewhere is cash anyways. I am also curious as why other places such as poker stars when they were here, I never heard about these things. It seemed for a while there was people coming here every day saying their accounts were frozen and most were unfrozen. I am all for security but it seems you guys arent to smart when it comes to it. If a account is supsended then there needs to be a very good reason for it not just guessing someone is dumping. And if it is taking you this long to do investagations then you need to hire more people or stop accusing every that wins of dumping. Anyways have a good day hope all goes well there.

Well you can interpet what I said how ever you like. You have thousands of people who request Payouts and never get delayed. If for some reason your account is suspended, then you were more then likely cheating, or showed a pattern of cheating. The jist of post was to address cheating online. Me referring to not wanting to have your money tied up is to those who CHEAT! So I take it you have nothing helpful to add to this thread at all huh?

[HedgeHog]

Your competitors have software for the bulk of this. Funny post, and if real, it lends to the side BetOnline may just be complete idiots, as opposed to crooks. In either case, I hope management and ownership is arrested soon and BetOnline shut down.

The two aren't mutually exclusive. BOL could just be really dumb crooks, which is my own view on them. They steal from those w/o recourse and only return stolen funds to those that go public in the forums. That said, I can't believe even BOL would be so dumb as to let a lowly CS rep post what he did here. It shouldn't be too difficult to prove this guy is a fraud.

[Alex_Peterson]

I wont get into a pissing match here because really I don't care, because I dont play there, but I was refering to the fact that you said if you dont want your money tied up take a 99 dollar flight to vegas. You also said if you are the u.s you arent supposed to be playing. Well why do you let them play then? That is telling me right now that if I am considering betonline and I hear a employee say that I am not deposting. If I am going to a resturant and I hear a employee saying yeah we have long lines because we get short staffed do you think i am going? Also you said everyone has to be investaged. So If i deposit and i am playing and win but do nothing wrong and i go to cash out there is a chance I could get delayed just because I played against someone who is suspected of chip dumping to someone else and not even me?. No thank you. I am curious as why americans would chip dump to other americans anyway considering the only way we can deposit somewhere is cash anyways. I am also curious as why other places such as poker stars when they were here, I never heard about these things. It seemed for a while there was people coming here every day saying their accounts were frozen and most were unfrozen. I am all for security but it seems you guys arent to smart when it comes to it. If a account is supsended then there needs to be a very good reason for it not just guessing someone is dumping. And if it is taking you this long to do investagations then you need to hire more people or stop accusing every that wins of dumping. Anyways have a good day hope all goes well there.

I guess it just shows how close minded you are. Should I define chip dumping for you? The reason why chip dumping is taking so seriously in betonline is for the following reason. Say you have 6 people sitting on a table. One guy opens an account from EUR some where VIA MONEYBOOKERS OR NETELLER. They fund 10k or even 30k. They then all of a sudden they lose it all on a poker table. Even 5k of it. That would be considered MONEY LAUNDERING, because its a transfer funds from one party to another, in forms which is intended to look legitimate when it isn't. Which means that if betonline doesn't investigate it. Then guess what? They would be considered involved in it. Which is illegal under panama law.
As for US clients. The fact is under YOUR COUNTRIES LAW, you are doing something very illegal. All it will take is your name and IP address to be given to the IRS and believe me they will come knocking on your door. Me saying that isn't to deter anyone from opening an account at betonline. Yet the reality is it is a true statement. Then if the site gets shut down, you will be crying how you got scammed. Betonline has been doing business since 1992. Way longer before poker was SUPER POPULAR.
If poker is a game of reading your opponent, knowing his/her moves. You are taking away that key element by playing online. Which should give betonline more reason to review activity of people who preflop bet higher then the big blind by 10x on 2/9 off suit! Then keep betting aggressive on the flop, turn, and when it comes to a show down they FOLD, and lose over 80% of their chip count! That my friend is chip dumping.
As for the reason why anyone in the united states would chip dump. Its the same reason people get locked up in the feds for a 15 man conspiracy. Send money here, then there, then here, then there. Its a pattern. Chip dumping is very easy to identify, and the account which ends up benefiting from it, is also very easy to spot.
You per-say may not be involved in chip dumping. Yet if you were a MANAGER as you said you were. You know that you have plenty of people trying to get over in a business. Imagine all those who have cheated on other sites. You don't think they will try to do the same on betonline or any other site? You guys are only looking at it from the side of the client. Yet the reason bo-dog and other sites got shut down, is because they allowed this type of illegal activity to occur! Then everyone cries foul when it gets shut down. If your doing the right think you have no reason to worry about anything mentioned in this thread.

[BranchDavidian]

Good morning guys. My name is Alex_Peterson and I work for betonline.ag I work just for customer support, and this case I have seen many times over. The reality is many people cheat online. If not with collusion, then its with chip dumping. By us simply giving you a copy of your poker hands, it won't solve the case. We have to check many other factors. Say a player is chip dumping. Then the account he is chip dumping to, then has to be investigated. Then everyone that player losses money to also.
You have to understand this is a business, and if your in the UNITED STATES your not suppose to be playing either way. You will be surprised the stupid things players do, and then claim they were not cheating. I can assure you, that although the process is long. The reality is we have many cases which needs to be handled before we can resolved any new cases. Imagine how many hands a player who has played for maybe 6 hours must be reviewed. Then if he is chip dumping, the further research which must be done. I for one don't play poker online, because we have casinos EVERYWHERE in panama. Yet if you don't want your money to be tied up, then take a flight to vegas. You can get there for 99 dollars, which is cheaper then you trying to get a payout from us for 2500 via **.

Holy Cow! I am in the U.S., Alex. I played at BetonLine for a few years - right up to the time all these threads started appearing. My betting volume would total around $20,000 per month. I made monthly cashouts and B2B transfers and never had any problems. Almost all in the sportsbook, although I did play poker a couple of times before emptying my account. And now I am told by you that I was not even supposed to be playing ( is it only poker I shouldn't be playing, or does this include sportsbetting also since both are under attack by the dept. of justice? ). Perhaps, if this is true, you shouldn't be targeting Americans as customers then! I have been waiting for these complaint threads to get resolved and go away before coming back in. It is beginning to look like I won't be back - especially after your revelations.

[Alex_Peterson]

The two aren't mutually exclusuve. BOL could just be really dumb crooks, which is my own view on them. They steal from those w/o recourse and only return stolen funds to those that go public in the forums. That said, I can't believe even BOL would be so dumb as to let a lowly CS rep post what he did here. It shouldn't be too difficult to prove this guy is a fraud.

Not to sure what makes me a fraud. Yet betonline doesn't control what I do when I am free. I am just tierd of seeing people crying about being scammed, when all the company is doing is reserving their right to investigate activity which may be warranted to investigate.

[Alex_Peterson]

My friend all you have to do is google if wagering on online casinos is legal if you are a united states based company. As for us, we aren't doing anything wrong by accepting US based players. As we are governed under the laws of Panama. Why do you think when these companies get raided, The govt ask all those who profited to return the winnings?

Holy Cow! I am in the U.S., Alex. I played at BetonLine for a few years - right up to the time all these threads started appearing. My betting volume would total around $20,000 per month. I made monthly cashouts and B2B transfers and never had any problems. Almost all in the sportsbook, although I did play poker a couple of times before emptying my account. And now I am told by you that I was not even supposed to be playing ( is it only poker I shouldn't be playing, or does this include sportsbetting also since both are under attack by the dept. of justice? ). Perhaps, if this is true, you shouldn't be targeting Americans as customers then! I have been waiting for these complaint threads to get resolved and go away before coming back in. It is beginning to look like I won't be back - especially after your revelations.

[prop]

seriously that post was wtf lolz

[BranchDavidian]

My friend all you have to do is google if wagering on online casinos is legal if you are a united states based company. As for us, we aren't doing anything wrong by accepting US based players. As we are governed under the laws of Panama. Why do you think when these companies get raided, The govt ask all those who profited to return the winnings?

First you tell me that I shouldn't be playing at BetonLine if I am American. Now you seem to be saying that I can't bet at a U.S. based company. Well, since you are not a U.S. based company, you are not making much sense. And how about responding to all the people that were winners, then tried to cashout, only to be accused of chip dumping with absolutely no evidence provided. What, exactly was the cause of these allegations? Is it the fact that they requested a payout? Then, after months of not responding to the player, after SBR gets involved, it was determined that, gosh, there was no evidence after all and the player gets his money back! Without a public forum, it appears that BetonLine would have stolen these funds even tho they had no evidence! How many players have lost their funds because they were not aware of SBR?

[HedgeHog]

Not to sure what makes me a fraud. Yet betonline doesn't control what I do when I am free. I am just tierd of seeing people crying about being scammed, when all the company is doing is reserving their right to investigate activity which may be warranted to investigate.

What investigation? A big winner gets his account frozen. Next he gets the run-around from the worst CS in the industry, which you claim to be part of --one which has the mentality that you must be guilty if we froze your account. No proof, just accusations. I've seen this happen several times with BOL on this forum. It's only after a complaint is filed with SBR that a real investigation is conducted and innocent victims are able to recover their funds. This occurs over and over again and I'm tired of it too. BOL's rating of B+ and SBR recommended is both laughable and tragic.

[BranchDavidian]

Please keep in mind, Alex, that these questions are coming from a player who had a very good experience at BetonLine. I was ready to return until all these complaints surfaced.

[wtt0315]

I guess it just shows how close minded you are. Should I define chip dumping for you? The reason why chip dumping is taking so seriously in betonline is for the following reason. Say you have 6 people sitting on a table. One guy opens an account from EUR some where VIA MONEYBOOKERS OR NETELLER. They fund 10k or even 30k. They then all of a sudden they lose it all on a poker table. Even 5k of it. That would be considered MONEY LAUNDERING, because its a transfer funds from one party to another, in forms which is intended to look legitimate when it isn't. Which means that if betonline doesn't investigate it. Then guess what? They would be considered involved in it. Which is illegal under panama law.
As for US clients. The fact is under YOUR COUNTRIES LAW, you are doing something very illegal. All it will take is your name and IP address to be given to the IRS and believe me they will come knocking on your door. Me saying that isn't to deter anyone from opening an account at betonline. Yet the reality is it is a true statement. Then if the site gets shut down, you will be crying how you got scammed. Betonline has been doing business since 1992. Way longer before poker was SUPER POPULAR.
If poker is a game of reading your opponent, knowing his/her moves. You are taking away that key element by playing online. Which should give betonline more reason to review activity of people who preflop bet higher then the big blind by 10x on 2/9 off suit! Then keep betting aggressive on the flop, turn, and when it comes to a show down they FOLD, and lose over 80% of their chip count! That my friend is chip dumping.
As for the reason why anyone in the united states would chip dump. Its the same reason people get locked up in the feds for a 15 man conspiracy. Send money here, then there, then here, then there. Its a pattern. Chip dumping is very easy to identify, and the account which ends up benefiting from it, is also very easy to spot.
You per-say may not be involved in chip dumping. Yet if you were a MANAGER as you said you were. You know that you have plenty of people trying to get over in a business. Imagine all those who have cheated on other sites. You don't think they will try to do the same on betonline or any other site? You guys are only looking at it from the side of the client. Yet the reason bo-dog and other sites got shut down, is because they allowed this type of illegal activity to occur! Then everyone cries foul when it gets shut down. If your doing the right think you have no reason to worry about anything mentioned in this thread.

If it is so easy then why does it take so long? Also if it is so easy why are so many people accused account suspended then they are reopened and paid? Shouldnt be that many mistakes as it is that easy

[Alex_Peterson]

Please keep in mind, Alex, that these questions are coming from a player who had a very good experience at BetonLine. I was ready to return until all these complaints surfaced.

Think of it this way. A player comes into this forum saying he/she has been part of chip dumping. Yet if they can not prove it (the player) with copies of their hands, which BETONLINE DOES provide to players. Then who is to say that he/she really did not take part in chip dumping. A player could be accused of chip dumping, because someone at the table in which they played on WAS ACTUALLY doing it. Which is why they investigate ALL of the players hands one by one, to make sure that the player whos account is suspended (who wasn't chip dumping) ISNT apart of a chip dumping ring.
Branch you were with betonline. You have made payouts with no issues. So its clear to see that people are able to withdraw without an issue. I think its just the American mindset of "I WANT IT NOW" that seems to be causing the issue. And I like how no one has yet rebutted the fact that playing poker online ISNT illegal for U.S. citizens.

[Alex_Peterson]

If it is so easy then why does it take so long? Also if it is so easy why are so many people accused account suspended then they are reopened and paid? Shouldnt be that many mistakes as it is that easy

Well the answer is very simple. You have many accounts which were suspended, then reopened without help from this site. It takes long because it takes human resources to review poker hands. Imagine. Say a person who plays only at one table, but plays for 6 hours a day. How many hands do you think they see within that time? When an account is suspended we have to review ALL OF THE HANDS, along with the hands of people who have PLAYED AT THE SAME TABLE. Which is why it takes months at times to get it resolved. These people aren't blogging all day like you guys who have 4k post on this website.
There job is protect the pocket of the company which they work for. And don't give me this crap about "Oh I need this money to pay bills." Because if that's the case then you have a very serious problem if your gambling your money to pay bills.

[BranchDavidian]

Think of it this way. A player comes into this forum saying he/she has been part of chip dumping. Yet if they can not prove it (the player) with copies of their hands, which BETONLINE DOES provide to players. Then who is to say that he/she really did not take part in chip dumping. A player could be accused of chip dumping, because someone at the table in which they played on WAS ACTUALLY doing it. Which is why they investigate ALL of the players hands one by one, to make sure that the player whos account is suspended (who wasn't chip dumping) ISNT apart of a chip dumping ring.
Branch you were with betonline. You have made payouts with no issues. So its clear to see that people are able to withdraw without an issue. I think its just the American mindset of "I WANT IT NOW" that seems to be causing the issue. And I like how no one has yet rebutted the fact that playing poker online ISNT illegal for U.S. citizens.

You seem to be on both sides of the fence now! Whether poker and sportsbetting are legal or not in America is a debatable subject. Yes, the stance taken by the department of justice is that it is illegal. However, the courts have not been so definitive. I am amazed that a representative of a book wants to come out here and tell players that they are breaking the law when using their service!

[wtt0315]

Well the answer is very simple. You have many accounts which were suspended, then reopened without help from this site. It takes long because it takes human resources to review poker hands. Imagine. Say a person who plays only at one table, but plays for 6 hours a day. How many hands do you think they see within that time? When an account is suspended we have to review ALL OF THE HANDS, along with the hands of people who have PLAYED AT THE SAME TABLE. Which is why it takes months at times to get it resolved. These people aren't blogging all day like you guys who have 4k post on this website.
There job is protect the pocket of the company which they work for. And don't give me this crap about "Oh I need this money to pay bills." Because if that's the case then you have a very serious problem if your gambling your money to pay bills.

Doesnt really matter why they need the money because its their money. Alex go to the bank please make a deposit. Then go to the bank and withdrawel and let them tell you its going be 60 days because they suspect you did something illegal and tell me how you feel. You are talking about customers complaining, but please remember without the customers you don't have a job. Bashing people here isnt going help things. I get you need security and you have to protect yourself, but you make it sound like Americans are playing illegally and we want it now blah blah, but guess what if it is my money and i have done nothing wrong then yes I want my money when I want it. Anyways it is what is.

[HedgeHog]

And I like how no one has yet rebutted the fact that playing poker online ISNT illegal for U.S. citizens.

It's not relevant. Pay winners what they won, period.

[Alex_Peterson]

Doesnt really matter why they need the money because its their money. Alex go to the bank please make a deposit. Then go to the bank and withdrawel and let them tell you its going be 60 days because they suspect you did something illegal and tell me how you feel. You are talking about customers complaining, but please remember without the customers you don't have a job. Bashing people here isnt going help things. I get you need security and you have to protect yourself, but you make it sound like Americans are playing illegally and we want it now blah blah, but guess what if it is my money and i have done nothing wrong then yes I want my money when I want it. Anyways it is what is.

Well you are aware that the FEDS can have the bank freeze your assets if they SUSPECT you of doing anything illegal. So I don't see your point. This is a online business.. If betonline didn't care about their business they would these people chip dump all day, because they only make money from the rake! So if you think about it betonline losses more then people do this compared to when they don't.

[necro]

Lets say, IF i had 20k $ and don't know what to do with them and decided to lost it all on Betonline poker, will i be accused of chip dumping?

[Alex_Peterson]

It's not relevant. Pay winners what they won, period.

Not when there is suspicion of them winning against the terms and conditions of the website. That is what this is about.

[prop]

illegal for U.S. citizens.

Is the US same as Korea. Your babble about poker security shows you must merely be the a janitor or one those unhelpful dumb fvcks that answers live chats there are 1700 threads with lolz complaints about. But come on you can't be that fvcking stupid (can you?). There is no law regarding what citizens can and can't do. Perhaps in the country, perhaps in certain states - but no Korean type laws in US as far I know.

[Alex_Peterson]

Lets say, IF i had 20k $ and don't know what to do with them and decided to lost it all on Betonline poker, will i be accused of chip dumping?

Depends on how you lose it my friend. If you deposit 20k and lose it playing heads up. What do think?

[Alex_Peterson]

Is the US same as Korea. Your babble about poker security shows you must merely be the a janitor or one those unhelpful dumb fvcks that answers live chats there are 1700 threads with lolz complaints about. But come on you can't be that fvcking stupid (can you?). There is no law regarding what citizens can and can't do. Perhaps in the country, perhaps in certain states - but no Korean type laws in US as far I know.

Ok well contact the IRS and tell them what you have been doing. Wait 2 weeks and see what will happen.

[wtt0315]

Ok well contact the IRS and tell them what you have been doing. Wait 2 weeks and see what will happen.

I reported my winnings last year with the irs. I am posting this from jail

[prop]

Not when there is suspicion of them winning against the terms and conditions of the website. That is what this is about.

Yes that's BOL operating method. Looks suspicious we're not paying. End of story, for now. If player writes well, can campaign well, gets forum support, makes noise at such time the PR hit is greater than the theft they pay. SBR doesn't always help the people that don't speak well, campaign well, or draw support. In some cases SBRLou calls them a scammer and puts them on timer so forum isn't even usable. There have been unresolved cases with no proof that if they involved anyone other than a sponsor they'd be classified as theft.

[HedgeHog]

LOL, Alex or whatever your real name is. You really do sound like one of the CS reps I talked to when I had to get a rubber check situation resolved. BOL sent me a bad check, but it must be my fault because I'm from the US and shouldn't be betting in the first place.

[HedgeHog]

Although entertaining, Alex is obviously an imposter. In his first post ever at SBR, does he start his own thread or post in one on the front page? No, he instead bumps a 2-month old thread when 3 other BOL complaint threads are readily available on page one. Further, he claims to be a BOL rep and attempts to defend them in a thread where they were clearly caught red-handed stealing a player's 65k balance. No employee who values his job could be that stupid, not even one from BOL.

[Alex_Peterson]

...

[HedgeHog]

Thanks for the laughs, Alex. Have a great day.

[Alex_Peterson]

No problem. Stop defending people when you don't know the whole story. He has 7,214 post of nothing useful which can help anyone. He is the defender of the crooks who break the law of the land! All of you guys need to go to jail.

Thanks for the laughs, Alex. Have a great day.

[5mike5]

BOL is a complete joke...trying to steal from actual winning players....

hate to see how many players that dont have SBR to go to bat for them get robbed

[BranchDavidian]

No problem. Stop defending people when you don't know the whole story. He has 7,214 post of nothing useful which can help anyone. He is the defender of the crooks who break the law of the land! All of you guys need to go to jail.

If we all go to jail, who would be your customers? It is pretty obvious HedgeHog has outed you! You are posting against the best interests of your employer if HedgeHog is wrong. So, either you are a liar or you will shortly be unemployed.