[Shack]

Baptist for me. Whatever one chooses is fine with me. Just don't try to kill the non believers is all I ask.

[JohnGalt2341]

[The Madcap]

So are you a real atheist, or just one of those pussies who can't handle the idea there might be a higher power beyond your control?

Is it your need to feel special or your own failures in life that have led you to despise the idea of God?

Seems to me real atheists don't give a shit about religion. But you do. You seem obsessed with trashing it. And while the idea of a robed apparition in the sky looking down upon us might anger you, have you ever considered that for some people their religion gives them the strength and courage to carry on every day? To fight their demons and overcome their battles?

Where would Josh Hamilton be without religion? He certainly wouldn't be the best player on one of the best teams in baseball. God saved his life. Or so he believes. Why such animosity towards those who believe in things you don't?

[JohnGalt2341]

[quote=The Madcap;10748088]

So are you a real atheist, or just one of those pussies who can't handle the idea there might be a higher power beyond your control?

Is there such a thing as a fake Atheist? Why would anyone fake being an Atheist? What advantages come with admitting that you are an Atheist? I've never even heard of this before. Perhaps you are one yourself. And if so, I feel sorry for you.

Is it your need to feel special or your own failures in life that have led you to despise the idea of God?

Please quote me on this... because I don't recall ever saying that I despise the idea of God. I do find the idea of a Biblical or Islamic God disturbing however. If you want quotes from the Bible or Quran that I find extremely disturbing I can give you some.

Seems to me real atheists don't give a shit about religion. But you do.

I suggest you inform Christopher Hitchens, Richard Dawkins, Sam Harris, and Dan Barker among others of this. They will be shocked to learn that they are not "REAL" Atheists.

You seem obsessed with trashing it.

Please give me a specific example where I trashed Religion. I'm not saying that I haven't. But please just give me a specific example. Also, define "obsessed". I'm a frequent YouTube visitor. I stumble across a Religious video around once a week that I find informative and or amusing. I usually post it here. If that makes me obsessed in your eyes then so be it.

And while the idea of a robed apparition in the sky looking down upon us might anger you, have you ever considered that for some people their religion gives them the strength and courage to carry on every day? To fight their demons and overcome their battles?

If believing in God helps a person from stealing my car or breaking into my house then I'm all for it. However, there doesn't seem to be any evidence of this. If there was, our prisons wouldn't be filled with 99% believers. In fact, the exact opposite seems to be true. Take a look at the most Religious countries and or cities in the world and I will show you a country and or city that is filled with high crime and violence.

Why such animosity towards those who believe in things you don't?

Please give me 1 example of ANY animosity I have displayed in any of my posts. In fact, I think you showed more animosity in your last post than I have in all of my posts combined. If stating facts offends you... then I am offensive I suppose. I'm not one to spew off random insults without a shred of evidence like yourself.

[Nittany Lion]

I love how all you have to do is post the word "religion" in a thread title and bam...24 pages long. Our alien overlords will soon come back to rule over us and end the religious non-sense on this planet.

[jgilmartin]

So are you a real atheist, or just one of those pussies who can't handle the idea there might be a higher power beyond your control?

Pussies? What would you call someone who is a member of a religion out of fear of going to hell? If you don't think people do that, just look at the marketing materials handed out by fundamentalist churches.

[The Madcap]

[quote=JohnGalt2341;10752880]

Is there such a thing as a fake Atheist? Why would anyone fake being an Atheist? What advantages come with admitting that you are an Atheist? I've never even heard of this before. Perhaps you are one yourself. And if so, I feel sorry for you.

Please quote me on this... because I don't recall ever saying that I despise the idea of God. I do find the idea of a Biblical or Islamic God disturbing however. If you want quotes from the Bible or Quran that I find extremely disturbing I can give you some.

I suggest you inform Christopher Hitchens, Richard Dawkins, Sam Harris, and Dan Barker among others of this. They will be shocked to learn that they are not "REAL" Atheists.

Please give me a specific example where I trashed Religion. I'm not saying that I haven't. But please just give me a specific example. Also, define "obsessed". I'm a frequent YouTube visitor. I stumble across a Religious video around once a week that I find informative and or amusing. I usually post it here. If that makes me obsessed in your eyes then so be it.

If believing in God helps a person from stealing my car or breaking into my house then I'm all for it. However, there doesn't seem to be any evidence of this. If there was, our prisons wouldn't be filled with 99% believers. In fact, the exact opposite seems to be true. Take a look at the most Religious countries and or cities in the world and I will show you a country and or city that is filled with high crime and violence.

Please give me 1 example of ANY animosity I have displayed in any of my posts. In fact, I think you showed more animosity in your last post than I have in all of my posts combined. If stating facts offends you... then I am offensive I suppose. I'm not one to spew off random insults without a shred of evidence like yourself.

For real dude? Without a shred of evidence?

For fuks sake man, just about every post you've made in this thread is a video or comment ridiculing the idea of God/or religion.

Fake atheism: it's kind of like when liberals pretend to care about black people.

Criminality: Religion, it's like soccer hooliganism. Not all soccer fans are hooligans, but all soccer hooligans root for a team. Sort of like all religious fanatics have a god.

The point is that some people get too wrapped up into shit, like soccer hooligans. Soccer in and of itself isn't an evil or awful thing, and yet there have been plenty of people killed, thousands injured over the years, and millions of dollars in damage caused by soccer hooligans and the riots they start. Religion itself isn't a bad thing either, it's just some people get a little crazy about it the way the hooligans get a little crazy about soccer.

For most people, religion is a good thing, or at worst, a wash. For most involved, religious dogma provides some sort of social morality that makes them think twice about killing or stealing. Kind of like the saying that locked doors "help keep honest people honest."

The point brother, is that it is clear you hold a grudge/hatred for religion, otherwise you wouldn't feel the need to make so many damned posts about it. And so I'm just curious as to why you let something have such a hold over you. It's not like they can force you to go to church in this country. So why so concerned with what other people believe?

[The Madcap]

Pussies? What would you call someone who is a member of a religion out of fear of going to hell? If you don't think people do that, just look at the marketing materials handed out by fundamentalist churches.

I certainly think there are a lot of pussies sitting in churches. You're missing the point.

It's the difference between someone who wants to believe something, and someone who actually does.

Look at homosexuals. There are a lot of homosexuals out there who believe they are gay, BUT, also need the validation/acceptance of society in order to be comfortable in their own skin. Which is to say, if everyone else says it's cool, then ok, it's cool. Whereas convicted homosexuals don't need that shit, because they own their own identity, and therefore don't feel the need to prance around in the streets like a bunch of flaming queers to feel accepted. They know they are gay, they don't need the validation of society. They are who they are and they aren't changing for anybody.

And Galt here strikes me as one of those atheists who needs the validation of society in order to feel like it's ok to be an atheist. Which is probably why he got so defensive and asked questions like "what advantages there are to being an atheist?" Clearly he feels like some sort of outcast similar to that of the homosexual who isn't in control of his identity.

Galt wants to be an atheist, and I called him a pussy because clearly he is not. Clearly he has some unresolved issues with the nature of religion/spirituality, or otherwise he would have moved on like the rest of us who don't give a fuk that some people still go to church. And I'm just trying to give him a little forward thinking perspective so he doesn't have to be scared anymore.

[bettilimbroke999]

All the world's religions are fukin jokes, everyone with a functioning brain knows this

Come the **** on ppl, are you really this fuckin ignorant?

If you die and this world turns out to be a giant IQ test you all just got a fukin 0

[babyjesus]

voted christian, but haven't been a good one.

[JohnGalt2341]

[quote=The Madcap;10754647]

For fuks sake man, just about every post you've made in this thread is a video or comment ridiculing the idea of God/or religion.

I told you to give me a SPECIFIC example where I trashed God or Religion. I see you haven't found one yet. Keep looking, you might just find one.

Fake atheism: it's kind of like when liberals pretend to care about black people.

Wow, that might the worst analogy I have ever seen. I do realize that people Fake things. But why do they do it? It's usually because they think that they stand to gain something. You never answered my original question which was... Why would anyone fake being an Atheist? Is there something to gain that I'm completely unaware of?

For most people, religion is a good thing, or at worst, a wash. For most involved, religious dogma provides some sort of social morality that makes them think twice about killing or stealing. Kind of like the saying that locked doors "help keep honest people honest."

Is flying a plane into a building considered a wash? I guess we have different definitions of what a wash is. And if you think Religion keeps people moral you have much to learn.

The point brother, is that it is clear you hold a grudge/hatred for religion, otherwise you wouldn't feel the need to make so many damned posts about it

. Have you ever read the story "The Emperor's New Clothes"? I'm like the boy that says "He's not wearing any clothes!" It disturbs me that everyone else would pretend that he is.

So why so concerned with what other people believe?

If I can help enlighten just 1 person that is on the fence about religion by posting facts and video's then it is a step in the right direction for humanity.

[JohnGalt2341]

And Galt here strikes me as one of those atheists who needs the validation of society in order to feel like it's ok to be an atheist. Which is probably why he got so defensive and asked questions like "what advantages there are to being an atheist?" Clearly he feels like some sort of outcast similar to that of the homosexual who isn't in control of his identity. Galt wants to be an atheist, and I called him a pussy because clearly he is not. Clearly he has some unresolved issues with the nature of religion/spirituality, or otherwise he would have moved on like the rest of us who don't give a fuk that some people still go to church. And I'm just trying to give him a little forward thinking perspective so he doesn't have to be scared anymore.

Your analogy's are absolutely awful. In fact they are completely backwards. Let's stick with gay theme though... how many straight men pretend to be Gay?

And tell me more about people "pretending" to be Atheists. Am I the only one? Or are there millions of us? You also called Richard Dawkins, Sam Harris, Christopher Hitchens Fake atheists because they spend so much time on it. Tell me more about this...

I get a VERY VERY strong feeling that you are projecting your OWN feelings and emotions on to me. Is this because you are a Scientologist that is afraid to come of the closet? I've been an Atheist for 20 plus years. I have no reason to pretend anything.

[JohnGalt2341]

This video is inspiring:

[JohnGalt2341]

[dinaro7]

agnostic tony richkas is a jew

[JohnGalt2341]

Bible Quiz Show!

[theclutch7]

my religion is football!

[theclutch7]

dum asterikk

[theclutch7]

5 months to football, john morrision system anyone for baseball

[flyingillini]

Devoted Catholic now, I ate the Ritz Cracker my Priest gave me and still wearing the charcoal on my forehead from Ash Wednesday.

[JohnGalt2341]

[TheRifleman]

I'm a believer in the divinity of Jesus Christ. Jesus is Lord and Jesus is REAL.

[White Rhino]

I believe unicorns and dragons. Because it makes more sense then a God.

[Dutch]

"Really!?! You're gonna take a rock in your hand and throw it at a motherfukers head because he worked on a sunday..Really?!?"

Good stuff.

[Tuesday]

!

[DeeVeeOSs]

.certain experiments seem to show DNA can be observed to be independent of time/space. perhaps we really are connected beyond the particle in a more meaningful.

if there was a group consciousness would it not be the group observer and not the individual observer that "uncovers"

i do not believe for a second in individual wilful manifestation (magic) but maybe group subconscious uncovering. group sub-conscious thought-forms affecting the energy that is everything.

we r making it up as we go along?

It's unfortunate I got sidetracked.
Upon rereading this, I feel as though we had JUST finished defining terms, (which is a process that typically doesn't get past step 1), and I feel that we were JUST about to start having the REAL conversation.

A conversation where we spout out a whole lot of "???" and simply wander about marveling at the merit of the questions we ask, hoping for a bite of knowledge, not enough to answer any of them, but big enough so that our questions might be "answered" with 2 more.

I can't believe that after 1.5 years, I still haven't budged on much of what I've written.
Never in my life has a model lasted more than a few months.


So if you're there, then the question we on about is, "are we making it up as we go along, or, are we uncovering what is already there?"
-

I think that's 1 of the points that we were discussing. Anyway. I didn't say it then, but I'll say it now, it's always a pleasure rappin with you man.

[DeeVeeOSs]

i would like to ask the christians a question? obviously same logic applies to muslims and jews.

1/ god created everything
2/ god loves us.
3/ the only way to heaven is through Jesus.

why did he create Buddhists and animalists and muslims etc. with no access to his teaching, only for them to burn in hell for the rest of time. he should know that a muslim is very very unlikely to be exposed to jesus's teachings so he will burn forever. how is that loving us?

so even the best sorts of non christians will burn for all eternity?

Gandhi ?

thanks for ur thoughts

Simple. I'd like to answer that through empathetic means if you'd allow that. "We've postulated a subjective set of attributes for God. Everyone has their own at any one given time. per/post death of a loved one typically changes the tone of those attributes. But one attribute that we agree on is that God is fair and He is just. So, there is obviously a way that these people get to heaven despite the rulebook that makes the issue cloudy. Bottom line, we've pre-determined that God can do no wrong, so, there must be an error in our understandings."

[DeeVeeOSs]

"The older I get the more I think investigating spiritual matters is an absolute waste of time."

Amen to that.

Investigating typically means to find some point of discovery or closer. But when it comes to 'the spirit', the point of investigation is literally a "???".

So all you can do is answer 1 question, but in the process, replace it with several more.

This is where it's a little bit like crack rock. You never QUITE get what you came for...but it leaves you wanting more.

[king_danilo92]

well my guess is that there are few jewish people here.. seeing they dont like spending or anything to do with giving away money

[DeeVeeOSs]

DeeVos-

are you drunk? Your thoughts are all running together and barely decipherable this time.

And you are once again projecting your opinions of Americans on me.

You're equating Haiti to Iraq? It's a complete non-sequitur. Haitians aren't going around hijacking planes and blowing shit up.

And I've never stated I believe the U.S. can do no wrong. We screw shit up all the time. When have I said any different?

So you, as an outside observer, are of the thought that the U.S. should just pull out and let all the Jews get slaughtered? That's your solution?

wow. Well at least we know where you really stand now.

Look, the cold hearted bastard in me would love to sit back and let nature take its course as you suggest. Nothing would make me happier than to let them kill each other off and rid the world of their stupid bullshit all together. But it's not that simple.

Israel is a tiny county of a few million Jews surrounded by about billion Muslims. You think when cornered in that scenario they are just going to accept a hostile takeover?

They are going to bomb every Muslim city within reach and launch their damn nukes, and start a nuclear fukking holocaust. Hitler taught the Heebs a very valuable lesson: when faced with oppression you can't just take it. And they won't. They will go out swinging.

You obviously realize by my past comments that I am not specifically sympathetic to Israel or Jews. I am however, sympathetic to myself, and the MILLIONS of people that will die if Israel is left undefended.

Yes, America does have self-interest in Israel. The self-interest of living. Humanity in general has a self-interest in the survival of Israel. Even if they are too big of pussies to admit it. Israel won't just collapse. It will implode and take the world with it.


Your talk in this latest post is dangerous talk Deevos. It sounds as if you agree with Al Qaeda. It sounds as if you believe that Israel should be abandoned and the Jews left to the whims of the Islamic mob. Is that what you are saying? If that's what you are saying, then how can you possibly defend any of the things you've written about peace and equality?

I am by no means defending the violent/aggressive actions taken by Israel against Muslims. And as I have pointed out, looking back it seems to me that if the Brits hadn't been so damned determined to form a Jewish state,we wouldn't be here. But we are here. The Jews have nukes. For the time being, the Muslims don't. The Jews have shown they have the ability to refrain from using them. The Muslims have shown they will stop at nothing to kill Jews and take over Israel. Either way, abandoning Israel is to invite the destruction of all life on earth. For those of us who don't believe in an afterlife that includes dozens of virgins, we don't have the luxury of just bailing out and letting that happen.

"You're equating Haiti to Iraq? It's a complete non-sequitur. Haitians aren't going around hijacking planes and blowing shit up."

NEITHER WERE IRAQIS.

----

As for the Jewish Palestine argument.

Let's be crystal clear. It was said to the Palestinians mid-century, "this half now belongs to the Jews."

The brits had partially/semi/kinda/sorta "taken" it in war and gave it to the UN to give to the displaced Jews.

It was about 50/50 land mass wise.

Then the U.N. backed out and did NOT AT ALL uphold it's order which was 50/50. They just let the 2 fight.

So that's already being done.

Lebanon has Hezbollah to stop Israel taking their shit.
Palestinians have Hamas to resist Israel taking their shit.

Israels wealth, all of it, namely their nukes, where did those nukes come from?

You can't create an evil and then claim defense against it.
And by the way, Israel is nowhere near restrained.

If it weren't for China and Russia acting as the big brother to Iran, Israel would have set it off years ago.
And you know what? USA would have allowed it because they'd have gotten dibs on most of the contract work not to mention the sale of all those 2.5 million dollar smart bombs.

So let's come off this "Jewish people show control with nukes but Arab people can't be trusted" SHIT.

But back to the problem. The problem is that the Palestines are being displaced from their land at nauseating rates.

Israel does what it wants when it wants and by the way, it's international LAW that you may NOT annex territory by force!!
Those days are LONG passed.

So that's an ILLEGAL occupation by the definition of EVERY DAMNED LAW TEXTBOOK you can find.

So what I propose is that the US Britain, the UN put Palestine in this mess. USA keeps them in this mess. And it's time that UN, Britain and USA take Palestine OUT of this mess. Arab kids grow up with severe inferiority complexes. You wanna talk about the cause of a desperate mind? Yeah. UN Britain and USA are serving up a whole pool full of stagnant water.

These kids will grow up all effed up and then your grand kids will say, "I will defend myself from them".

Do you see that disgusting circle?

Move the line BACK to 50/50. Have it PROPERLY patrolled and monitored. Have it so that Jewish soldiers NO LONGER direct Palestinian traffic to where Jews get home in a timely fashion and Palestinians it takes all day. Where the Jews get clean water, and the Palestinians get dirty and dangerous water.


It's ALL ON ISRAEL to move back and slow their role.

And USA could do that with one phonecall. Trust me, Israel doesn't want to face US sanctions.

But NO WHERE in here are the Palestinians the ones to blame or the ones to take more action than they already are.

Israel must be made to back the hell up off of Palestine and her people.

The fact you don't indict Israel for war crimes is beyond me, but I think we covered this 18 months ago with the talk of tribalism and not being able to smell the shit when it's wafting from one's own trousers.

[zizoudane10]

Atheist.

[Snowball]

[PharaohUB]

sure somebody addressed this already but atheism and agnosticism are just as different as christianity and agnosticism. one is an absolute belief that there is no god, and the other is acceptance of not knowing, and that any of the many beliefs (including atheism/christianity) could be true.

a true agnostic is no more in disagreement with atheists then they are with christians.

i'm a true agnostic. i think anyone who thinks they truly know is stupid. atheist/christian/jew whatever. don't clump me in with those stupid atheists. nobody knows.

[jgilmartin]

sure somebody addressed this already but atheism and agnosticism are just as different as christianity and agnosticism. one is an absolute belief that there is no god, and the other is acceptance of not knowing, and that any of the many beliefs (including atheism/christianity) could be true.

Not necessarily. Many who consider themselves atheists don't claim to know there isn't a god (in fact I can't think of a single prominent atheist who claims to know with 100% certainty that no higher power of any kind exists or has ever existed). They simply haven't seen sufficient evidence to justify belief in a god. The burden of proof is on the side making the claim that something exists; not believing is the default position.

[zizoudane10]

The mormons are so stupid