1. #1
    bobbie11
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    Negative Balance@ a sportsbook

    If you have a negative balance at a sportsbook and you are a United States citizen, what can they do to retreive the funds if anything? I never submitted verification to them and they do not have my social security number. Gambling is illegal in the US, so I just do not see how they can recover their funds. Any thoughts or experiences? Thank you.

  2. #2
    Ganchrow
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    May I ask how you came by your negative balance?

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  3. #3
    jjgold
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    Might be a credit out but even those do not have negative balances

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  4. #4
    bobbie11
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    My deposit did not clear.

  5. #5
    bobbie11
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    ***************

  6. #6
    bobbie11
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    From what I have seen, that just cancels all the bets that you made right? The sportsbook never loses any money.

  7. #7
    JC
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobbie11 View Post
    My deposit did not clear.
    Why didn't it clear?

    Their fault or were the funds not available?

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  8. #8
    ShamsWoof10
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    I had a neg. balance at VIP recently but that was because they graded a wager as a win instead of a loss and I bet it before they made the correction.. Once they did they just made my balance negative....

  9. #9
    Mason
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    Any good businessman would zero out your balance as they should want your future business more than your past deposit that went awry. If you bounced a check or something, normally they would just move you to a cash deposit method and keep you on as a customer. My .02.

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  10. #10
    Carlos019
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    I had a negative balance of -250$ at Bodog and I wasnt planing to play there again soo I didnt pay it for a month; but then they sent me an email saying that they were going to send my case to a third party collections agency and that it was going to be reported to the credit beureus. I dont know if it was true or not but I rather not risk it.

  11. #11
    ShamsWoof10
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    I'd pay it because you honestly owe it but other then that I would say there is no way without your social that they can report it...

  12. #12
    tacomax
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mason View Post
    Any good businessman would zero out your balance as they should want your future business more than your past deposit that went awry.
    And then that good businessman would turn into a bankrupt businessman.

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  13. #13
    increasedodds
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    If you are honest you owe it.

    If you don't pay it, there is nothing they can do.

    They could go after your credit, but would never hold up if you fought it...

    Most honest people would pay it. If it was a book that is withholding payouts now, I would not.

    Sean

  14. #14
    Doug
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    If the deposit never cleared ( say for NSF) he could never have received any winnings, right ? Then why does he owe the money ?

    If it was betting money after an improper grading or some sort of over-payment, then I see it.

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  15. #15
    Santo
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug View Post
    If the deposit never cleared ( say for NSF) he could never have received any winnings, right ? Then why does he owe the money ?

    If it was betting money after an improper grading or some sort of over-payment, then I see it.
    Because if he had won, I suspect the money would have magically appeared in the bank account to pay the deposit.

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  16. #16
    Doug
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    Quote Originally Posted by Santo View Post
    Because if he had won, I suspect the money would have magically appeared in the bank account to pay the deposit.
    but if its not there when the *************** hits, I think that nulls it !

    I seem to recall some cases with Pinny about this, and they didn't pay it.

    I'm interested to hear Ganchrow's view. I'd for sure cut the guy off from furthur E-checks once one fails.

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  17. #17
    ShamsWoof10
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    I would also think but do not know that these books share info. and you can be blacklisted by other books... Everyone seems to have a list they go by... Regular creditors use your credit report... payday loans places have one too called "Teletrack" so I can't imagine that the books would not have one that don't disclose to the public...

  18. #18
    Doug
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    books in the same group like Jazzette,Yes... others out of the group are less likely to get the info,IMO. I don't think they are at this level of cooperation, they can't even do transfers of money for the most part.

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  19. #19
    Carlos019
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    My Bodog account went to negative recently because they credited my echeck deposit instantly but 2 days later their processor stopped taking money from the U.S. and they never received my money. I had allready lost the 250 soo it went to -250.

  20. #20
    picantel
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    Bodog can send it over to a collection agency all they want. Any CA stupid enough to collect on it can end up being sued. It is an empty threat.

    FDCPA
    § 807. False or misleading representations [15 USC 1962e]

    A debt collector may not use any false, deceptive, or misleading representation or means in connection with the collection of any debt. Without limiting the general application of the foregoing, the following conduct is a violation of this section:


    (2) The false representation of --

    (A) the character, amount, or legal status of any debt; or

    (B) any services rendered or compensation which may be lawfully received by any debt collector for the collection of a debt.

    (5) The threat to take any action that cannot legally be taken or that is not intended to be taken.

    (8) Communicating or threatening to communicate to any person credit information which is known or which should be known to be false,

    (10) The use of any false representation or deceptive means to collect or attempt to collect any debt or to obtain information concerning a consumer.



    § 808. Unfair practices [15 USC 1692f]

    A debt collector may not use unfair or unconscionable means to collect or attempt to collect any debt. Without limiting the general application of the foregoing, the following conduct is a violation of this section:

    (1) The collection of any amount (including any interest, fee, charge, or expense incidental to the principal obligation) unless such amount is expressly authorized by the agreement creating the debt or permitted by law.


    It gets better. you have the right to dispute any debt. The CA would have to send you proof i.e. proof of bodog's illegal gamblings. I doubt they want to do that. Since gambling is illegal in the US the collection agency could get into loads of trouble also. When I had my dispute with betcris they tried to send it over to a collection agency here in the US. I told them how betcris had ripped me off and also told them gambling is illegal here and their collection was also illegal. I told them if they contacted me, pulled my credit, or put anything on my credit reports they would see the inside of a courtroom and would pay me. Never heard from them again.

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  21. #21
    Doug
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carlos019 View Post
    My Bodog account went to negative recently because they credited my echeck deposit instantly but 2 days later their processor stopped taking money from the U.S. and they never received my money. I had allready lost the 250 soo it went to -250.
    Bodog is basically saying that if you won with the $250 ***************, then made arrangements to later pay them by another method ( like **), since THEY couldn't process the ***************, they would honor the winnings, and since you lost the $250, you owe it since they would have paid if you won. Lets assume you bet the $250 on a parlay or big ML dog, so now its $2,000 or something like that, after all you can bet whatever you want.

    I say BS, they wouldn't have accepted the $250 in that case, and therefore you don't owe because you couldn't have won.

    I wouldn't have paid it.

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  22. #22
    freebie
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    if he bet and won the $250, the book won't pay since it's a NSF.

    either way, both parties can't collect. kinda bad to take shots at a book with no betting money.

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  23. #23
    Doug
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    I'd say Carlos wasn't taking a shot, if anything Bodog took the shot, in his case.

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  24. #24
    bobbie11
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    So basically they can do nothing from the gist of this. What is to stop people from just cancelling their deposits if they lose and taking "no-risk" bets.

  25. #25
    Doug
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobbie11 View Post
    So basically they can do nothing from the gist of this. What is to stop people from just cancelling their deposits if they lose and taking "no-risk" bets.
    I don't think you can cancel an *************** ( like a CC **********).

    When E-checks worked, you'd *************** it to the book, book gives you the credit, play it as you like, but you can't withdraw for like 10-14 days ( clearance time for ***************).

    *************** comes back NSF, you don't get the 10k you "won " off of a no-good deposit.

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  26. #26
    Santo
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    My understanding is that they try to collect it 2-3 times in that 10-14 days, so there would be plenty of time to put the money in. That's the reason for my original response on this thread.

    It's all just hearsay on what I've been told, e-checks never worked internationally

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  27. #27
    stylibet
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    I actually was honest and paid 300 dollars of a deposit that hadnt gone through but in which I lost the bet. And this was with those fu$king crooks at sportsbook. I believe it was my new debit card or something. I cant exactly remember what happened but I knew they were waiting for me to call the number on the card into my bank. I will never be honest with those pieces of shit again. If a deposit doesnt go through from now and Ive already lost the bet Im not paying anymore if I can get away with it.

  28. #28
    betplom
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    I had a eft from Instadebit to Pinnacle for less than $200 bounce once. Pinnacle won't allow me to use Instadebit OR my credit card to deposit anymore, I am allowed to use Moneybookers at Pinny though.

    The reason it bounced was my fault and I paid Instadebit the funds and a penalty within two days of it happening.

    I use a separate chequing account for online transactions and I only transfer funds into this account when I'm doing an online deposit etc, I have given out the account details to many online companies and for my own security and peace of mind keep my money in another account that no one has access to.

    I would really like to have the Instadebit option back as my account is in good standing, however this is Pinnacles decision so I play at other books that use Instadebit or deposit to my Pinny account with Moneybookers.

    Live and learn.

  29. #29
    TLD
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    Quote Originally Posted by stylibet View Post
    I will never be honest with those pieces of shit again. If a deposit doesnt go through from now and Ive already lost the bet Im not paying anymore if I can get away with it.
    If the “pieces of shit” refers to the sportsbook(s) that have stolen from you, I can understand that. If it refers to just all sportsbooks, I fail to see your logic.

    Sportsbook.com stiffed or slow paid you, so if you get a chance you’ll steal from Greek, WSEX, 5 Dimes, etc.? What sense does that make?

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  30. #30
    Doug
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ganchrow View Post
    Before I answer this question I'd be interested to learn how you came by your negative balance.

    Your answer,Ganch ?

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  31. #31
    GoofMouth
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug View Post
    I don't think you can cancel an *************** ( like a CC **********).

    When E-checks worked, you'd *************** it to the book, book gives you the credit, play it as you like, but you can't withdraw for like 10-14 days ( clearance time for ***************).

    *************** comes back NSF, you don't get the 10k you "won " off of a no-good deposit.
    I was in good standing with BoDog. Had always had my echecks clear, probably a dozen over the course of a year. I deposited 3 echecks of $300 in one day. I turned that last $300 into $28,000 in 3 days. I immediately saw the first 2 go through a few days later and the last one bounce. I called them, notified them that the last check was going to bounce, let me ** the money or go ahead and charge my bank account again, it will go through. They kept pushing me off, saying they re-charge the bank account a 2nd time in these situations. Guess what? When the last check was processed, they froze my account. I called them, and asked them why they didn't re-submit the deposit to my bank account. This is the first time it's ever bounced in a year. It's because I won 28K that's why. I asked them, don't you want your 300 dollars. They said no, we're even. HA! **** EM. They had grounds for fraud, even though my record was impeccable with them prior, so there was nothing I could do.

    **** BoDog. They wouldn't have paid you if you won, so why give them any money at this point. They can't attack your U.S. credit, they are illegal for U.S. citizens.

  32. #32
    cwsulzba
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    agreed

  33. #33
    sobre
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    Can anyone confirm having had a similar experience in which the sports book did indeed refer you to a collection agency in the United States and what happened?

    I've had a similar experience over at Bodog. I deposited $500 using a credit card (illegal on their end to begin with after July 2006 as I understand), made roughly 1200 in the course of the evening and then moved to withdraw. I was told that someone else had attempted to use my information and that the account was frozen. As part of the freezing, they refunded my initial deposit to the credit card for "security" purposes. They then declined to pay the $1200, stating i didn't actually deposit money, so i can't collect. Finally, they sent me an email a few weeks later informing me of my "negative balance" of $500, stemming from the refund (the $1200 has disappeared at this point) and threatening to refer the balance to third party collection agency.

    Long-story short: what exactly can they do to me here in the States, specifically, to my credit?

  34. #34
    spliff
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    pay the debt you deadbeat

  35. #35
    marc
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    Quote Originally Posted by sobre View Post
    Can anyone confirm having had a similar experience in which the sports book did indeed refer you to a collection agency in the United States and what happened?

    I've had a similar experience over at Bodog. I deposited $500 using a credit card (illegal on their end to begin with after July 2006 as I understand), made roughly 1200 in the course of the evening and then moved to withdraw. I was told that someone else had attempted to use my information and that the account was frozen. As part of the freezing, they refunded my initial deposit to the credit card for "security" purposes. They then declined to pay the $1200, stating i didn't actually deposit money, so i can't collect. Finally, they sent me an email a few weeks later informing me of my "negative balance" of $500, stemming from the refund (the $1200 has disappeared at this point) and threatening to refer the balance to third party collection agency.

    Long-story short: what exactly can they do to me here in the States, specifically, to my credit?
    I'm confused, how did you account go negative. YOu dpeosited $500, and they gave it back to you. you should be at zero

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