[Fred The Hammer]

Why the heck would Bird & Magic need to team up? They were on stacked teams already! Bird had McHale and Parish (and DJ and Ainge) and Magic had Kareem and Worthy (and Scott and Cooper). How can you possibly compare that to what LeBron had? Also, the league was way different in the 80s. Players stayed on teams their whole careers. That barely happens now. Why does LeBron get so chastised for leaving Cleveland? He played 7 years there and they never brought anyone good in. Is he held to such a standard that it only counts if he wins on a shit team?

Jordan, to his credit, stuck with a pretty bad team for some time, but I don't recall how the CBA and contracts worked then. I don't remember too many players demanding trades in the late 80s.

Good points....personally I don't blame LeBron for leaving Cleveland. Some guys left in the old day like Kareem or Shaq in the 90s. The way LeBron left and was so cocky in Miami just continues to rub people the wrong way.

[BigDofBA]

I see eye to eye on a lot of your views, but man please not you too.

People just are going to hate Lebron. And after Jordan, every god damn asshole degenerate in here would take him #2 if their life depending on building a winning NBA team. Please just STFU with these ignorant threads.

I respect your opinion but I would not take Lebron #2.

I don't even hate Lebron like you think I do. I say he is a great player and possibly the best athlete to ever play the game yet that's not enough for people.

I point out that he isn't remotely close to Jordan or even top 5 of all-time and people automatically think I hate him. LOL. I thought I was pointing out the obvious.

[j37hr0]

Alot of us don't hate the guy but he's just not as mentally tough as some of the greatest of all-time and thats not going to change this late in his career. I'm guessing you're a younger guy and maybe you didn't see Jordan, Bird, or Magic in their prime but they never wentpassivein alot of big games like LeBron does.

This fuggin tired old bullshit. Larry Bird played with HALL OF FAMERS. Magic Johnson played with HALL OF FAMERS. Michael Jordan won with HOF coach, Pippen, Rodman, don't give me this fugging bullshit that they did it by themselves. I'm guessing you weren't anywhere near the Delta Center June 14, 1998 and have only seen Jordan highlights on youtube.

[nomercysir]

"The Decision" was extremely dooshey but people need to get over it. It was like 5 years ago. The fact is that LeBron was a free agent and, just like most free agents, he exercised his right to switch teams. Playing with Bosh & Wade is no different than Kobe playing with Shaq (I'd trade Bosh & Wade for prime Shaq in a second), but because LeBron wasn't put in that situation to begin with, he had to manufacture it.

[jazzdrum78]

Kobe plays with Shaq .. and Lebron is hated for playing with Wade's broke end of career ass .. are people here that stupid????

[Fred The Hammer]

I see eye to eye on a lot of your views, but man please not you too.

People just are going to hate Lebron. And after Jordan, every god damn asshole degenerate in here would take him #2 if their life depending on building a winning NBA team. Please just STFU with these ignorant threads.

This asshole would take Bird #2. He won 3 and Boston's 2 losses were to Magic and a ridiculously more athletic Lakers team. Boston also had to get by Philly and Detroit who had HOFers as well. Parrish and McHale were great players but Boston rarely had anyone that could jump over a phone book athletically

[nomercysir]

I respect your opinion but I would not take Lebron #2.

I don't even hate Lebron like you think I do. I say he is a great player and possibly the best athlete to ever play the game yet that's not enough for people.

I point out that he isn't remotely close to Jordan or even top 5 of all-time and people automatically think I hate him. LOL. I thought I was pointing out the obvious.

Who are your top 5 of all-time?

[jazzdrum78]

This asshole would take Bird #2. He won 3 and Boston's 2 losses were to Magic and a ridiculously more athletic Lakers team. Boston also had to get by Philly and Detroit who had HOFers as well. Parrish and McHale were great players but Boston rarely had anyone that could jump over a phone book athletically

I'd take Bird #4 .. if Lebron only had the honor of playing with the teammate Bird played with

[nomercysir]

This asshole would take Bird #2. He won 3 and Boston's 2 losses were to Magic and a ridiculously more athletic Lakers team. Boston also had to get by Philly and Detroit who had HOFers as well. Parrish and McHale were great players but Boston rarely had anyone that could jump over a phone book athletically

Bird was fantastic and as a Lakers fan in the 80s, he scared the shit out of me. But, frankly, his legacy is overrated because his career was so short. There is no way he should be considered over LeBron if you are talking careers. Maybe peak for peak, there is an argument.

[nomercysir]

For me, if you are grouping all players, I would say peak Shaq is the best peak player of all time. I would take him over peak MJ. Ditto with Kareem & Hakeem. Career wise, I take Kareem, then MJ and I think there are a lot of guys in the next tier, LeBron included.

[Fred The Hammer]

Bird was fantastic and as a Lakers fan in the 80s, he scared the shit out of me. But, frankly, his legacy is overrated because his career was so short. There is no way he should be considered over LeBron if you are talking careers. Maybe peak for peak, there is an argument.

See I would say Bird is #2 because of what he did in about 9 years of good health.

[nomercysir]

I think if you look at LeBron's last nine years, statistically they beat Bird and it's just one title short, same #FMVPs. He also has one more MVP. Less Finals appearances but some here seem to think if you don't win the Finals it counts against you, LOL.

I think Bird's three straight MVPs was one of the best ever runs, though.

[Pauulzcappin]

People were comparing Lebron to Jordan before this series

His name shouldn't even be said in the same sentence as KOBE BRYANT

Kobe would at least try to shoot his team into the game as done as they might have looked early, not look to pass the ball.

[Fred The Hammer]

For me, if you are grouping all players, I would say peak Shaq is the best peak player of all time. I would take him over peak MJ. Ditto with Kareem & Hakeem. Career wise, I take Kareem, then MJ and I think there are a lot of guys in the next tier, LeBron included.

I agree with you on 95% of your points. The Heat are really like some girl that spent somebody's $150,000 to look good but they're still a skank without the surgeries and makeup. They have no post play...no point guard...Chalmers finds a way to look chubby every year and is absolutely worthless and Cole has nothing except heart. They have a deeply flawed team...its not like LeBron showed up in Oklahoma CIty or something

[Seto]

He doesn't have this:



Man i miss that guy. Kobe in his prime in the playoffs was must watch basketball.

[Fred The Hammer]

I think if you look at LeBron's last nine years, statistically they beat Bird and it's just one title short, same #FMVPs. He also has one more MVP. Less Finals appearances but some here seem to think if you don't win the Finals it counts against you, LOL.

I think Bird's three straight MVPs was one of the best ever runs, though.

You have to remember though....the West sucked in the 80s....the Lakers could just coast to the Finals while BIrd had to battle loaded teams like Philly and Detroit. Jordan with 63 pts on Boston in 86 as well

[jazzdrum78]

I respect your opinion but I would not take Lebron #2.

I don't even hate Lebron like you think I do. I say he is a great player and possibly the best athlete to ever play the game yet that's not enough for people.

I point out that he isn't remotely close to Jordan or even top 5 of all-time and people automatically think I hate him. LOL. I thought I was pointing out the obvious.

It's a team penetrating sport asshole. All the other greats have been on better teams from #2 - #9.

[jazzdrum78]

People were comparing Lebron to Jordan before this series

His name shouldn't even be said in the same sentence as KOBE BRYANT

Kobe would at least try to shoot his team into the game as done as they might have looked early, not look to pass the ball.

Kobe is a better champion. Do you honestly think if Lebron was swapped in for Kobe on those Lakers teams that they would not win 3.

Are you a moron too? Lebron with Shaq????

[Fred The Hammer]

1. Jordan
2. Bird
3. Olajuwon
4. Magic
5. LeBron

done....going to bed

[jazzdrum78]

Every single one of those greats had better teammates #2 - #9 and way better coaches .. Hall of penetrating fame coaches!!!!!

[jtoler]

Said the same thing last year when people all over tv kept saying "the best player on the planet", they say it even more this year. Cant beat anyone off the dribble without having a head start, like watching him when things are clicking though.

[nomercysir]

Said the same thing last year when people all over tv kept saying "the best player on the planet", they say it even more this year. Cant beat anyone off the dribble without having a head start, like watching him when things are clicking though.

Who is a better player right now? Durant definitely isn't... he wasn't even the best player on his team in the playoffs this year.

[jazzdrum78]

Let's kill this thread already.

The Lebron haters in this thread will at least agree with this statement:

ROBERT HORRY IS THE GREATEST PLAYER IN NBA HISTORY...

This it kind of deduction most of the idiots in here would conclude.

[upscope]

LeBron continues to show us why he is a puzzy. The only people that don't see it are the 25 & under LeBron nuthugger crowd.

[BigDofBA]

LeBron continues to show us why he is a puzzy. The only people that don't see it are the 25 & under LeBron nuthugger crowd.

Yeah, if you're not praising him you're a "hater" even though were just speaking the truth.

I compliment the guy in Bering a great player and athlete and I'm still labeled a hater.

I can tell most of these people are probably in their early 20s if not younger.

[nomercysir]

I didn't say you were a hater and I had season tickets for the Lakers in the mid 80s to mid 90s, so I saw plenty of these "all time greats" in their prime. LeBron is right up there, and his career isn't close to over. So I just think it's very shortsighted to not say he's an all-time great considering his body of work, just because he happens to have lost a few Finals (only once as the favorite, really). I'm still wondering who your top-5 are and how LeBron is not considered top-tier (which I would say goes to top-10 all-time).

[jsmithj88]

You can have your opinion.

I don't hate Lebron. I actually think he is a lot better than most athletes. He doesn't have 15 baby mommas, arrests, or felonies.

He is a great player. Just not all-time great as in top 10 or close to MJ.

he is obviously gonna be in the top10

[jsmithj88]

Yep!

Also, those Bulls teams didn't have great talent. Pippen was a nice player but Jordan really made him into who he was just like Jordan willed everyone on that team. Without Jordan Pippen was just a solid player but the Bulls were really nothing those two years Jordan was out.

Jordan is the kind of guy that would score 70 if that's what it took to win. Jordan would take on the world, still take the last shot, and make it.

man, thats a total lack of respect for pippen
he was and prolly is one of the best wing defenders of all times
thats a pretty good asset for jordan to lean on
whos exactly helping lebron out on defense?

[bigtymer56]

man, thats a total lack of respect for pippen
he was and prolly is one of the best wing defenders of all times
thats a pretty good asset for jordan to lean on
whos exactly helping lebron out on defense?

Didnt realize he disrespected pippen too. People conveniently forget that the Bulls won 50+ games and got eliminated by the eventual ecf in 7 the season after jordan retired the 1st time. Lebron left cleveland...clowns still havent recovered.

Wanna see what his top 10 looks like.

And too all the ppl saying Kobe....

[Scorpion]

lebron suks donkey kok

[BigDofBA]

Jordan won 6 championships and in all of those games he only lost once by 15 or more. That was because his Bulls were already 3-0 and they were coasting.

Lebron lost by more than 15 three times in this series.

Jordan would have put his team on his back. Not let them get rolled here times.

Actually four blowout wins this series.