1. #1
    Bsims
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    Questions about your use of sports book

    The formula for the return that you receive on a wager is simple, Return = Probability * Odds. Undoubtedly, we all spend much time and effort assessing the probability estimates and picking the side we want. However, equally important in the equation is the odds. Maximizing the return requires picking the best odds available. This requires having multiple sports books to choose from. We likely have an account with more than one sports book. What process do you go through to make the best wager?

    In my case, I log on to each account, navigate to the proper sport, identify the wager I want, and note the odds. I compare the odds, select the best, and return to make the wager. Hopefully, the odds havenít changed by the time I complete this process. This is a time consuming and potentially error ridden process. Do you have any better approach?

    Sometimes the odds have changed by the time you actually try to make the wager. How does this impact your decision (in the two cases of odds moving in your favor or against you)?

    Having multiple books requires splitting your funds between them. As your balance goes up and down in each account you need to move funds. How often do you find yourself doing this?

    And finally, how many sports books do you actively use?

  2. #2
    BigdaddyQH
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    What you say is true, but not nearly as important as it used to be because of the use of computers to instantaneously change the odds at numerous off shore book at the same time. Back in the day when books used to have 2-3 point differences in lines, it was very important to keep on top of the game. Today such line difference between books is a rarity. The most important thing to be able to do is to wager before our book opens to the general public. This can give you a big edge in wagering and looking for solid middles. Middles is by far, the best way to make money because you are only risking a little vig to win two wagers. A $100.00 middle wager can cost you a maximum of $10.00, but you can win $210.00. That is 20/1 boys and you are not going to get any better than that. It is much more difficult to wager middles at off sore books who have their own set of rules that they can enforce whenever they want to. I personally have accounts at 6 different Las Vegas books.

  3. #3
    ace7550
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bsims View Post
    The formula for the return that you receive on a wager is simple, Return = Probability * Odds. Undoubtedly, we all spend much time and effort assessing the probability estimates and picking the side we want. However, equally important in the equation is the odds. Maximizing the return requires picking the best odds available. This requires having multiple sports books to choose from. We likely have an account with more than one sports book. What process do you go through to make the best wager?

    In my case, I log on to each account, navigate to the proper sport, identify the wager I want, and note the odds. I compare the odds, select the best, and return to make the wager. Hopefully, the odds haven’t changed by the time I complete this process. This is a time consuming and potentially error ridden process. Do you have any better approach?

    Sometimes the odds have changed by the time you actually try to make the wager. How does this impact your decision (in the two cases of odds moving in your favor or against you)?

    Having multiple books requires splitting your funds between them. As your balance goes up and down in each account you need to move funds. How often do you find yourself doing this?

    And finally, how many sports books do you actively use?
    Good conversation topic Bsims.
    I used to use SBR line ticker but it just doesn't work very well anymore. Most of the time the line SBR is showing is not the line the book is offering.
    Still, from a professional standpoint, it is extremely important to line shop. The difference between getting +145 or +150 on a $1,000 wager over time becomes huge.
    I have 5-7 books funded at any given time. If the balance becomes too big in one I make a withdrawal and if I go broke in one I just redeposit.
    I typically login to all my accounts and scan the games I'm interested in as quickly as possible. Yes, it is a bummer when you miss a good price because scanning all the prices took too long. One thing I've learned to do to mitigate this problem is bet a good line when I see it. For example. If I see the Yankees offered at BM for -135 and then I look at BOL and the Yankees are offered for -130 I will immediately bet the BOL line without looking any further.
    You can also pay to have software built that scans the lines at any desired books. Or you can pay a fee to use software that's already built. This is also something probably only a professional would do.

  4. #4
    Waterstpub87
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    Unfortunately Bsims, my choices of books are rather limited these days.

    The legal ones are spreading -110 lines on baseball, so thats a no go.

    The offshore ones, I'm limited to the heritage type ones and Bookmaker, but no bonuses or cashback, so I dont use it.

    I have heritage and bet -105 at the moment. I bet the overnight at heritage, and check it against bet -105 (they occasionally have pretty different lines on international baseball). Thats the extent of my line shopping.

    It matters less for football at this point. Its rare to get different lines, like 4 vs 4.5 at different books.

  5. #5
    TommieGunshot
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigdaddyQH View Post
    The most important thing to be able to do is to wager before our book opens to the general public.
    ...
    I personally have accounts at 6 different Las Vegas books.
    Could you explain how you are able to bet at Las Vegas sportsbooks before they are open to general public customers?

  6. #6
    wolfmanmeadows
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    using chrome keyboard shortcuts helps move between tabs quicker


    Jump to the next open tab Ctrl + Tab or Ctrl + PgDn
    Jump to the previous open tab Ctrl + Shift + Tab or Ctrl + PgUp
    Jump to a specific tab Ctrl + 1 through Ctrl + 8



    https://support.google.com/chrome/an...ndow-shortcuts

    you can also use windows snap and big monitors to help arrange windows into corners and halves


  7. #7
    BeatTheJerk
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    Quote Originally Posted by TommieGunshot View Post
    Could you explain how you are able to bet at Las Vegas sportsbooks before they are open to general public customers?
    Please enlighten us BD ?

  8. #8
    BigdaddyQH
    BigdaddyQH
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    Quote Originally Posted by BeatTheJerk View Post
    Please enlighten us BD ?
    It is quite simple and has been going on for years. To do this you must know several things. First you must know where to place your wager and be allowed into that area. Sports Books all know who there knowledgeable customers are. Now you must understand that there is a difference between a knowledgeable customer and one who just wastes money on wagers because he/she has the money and can afford to do so. You need not wager thousands a game. If you are really good (and I am not talking about the B.S. that you hear in here) the books want to know what you think about the upcoming lines BEFORE they open them up to the public so the can adjust bad lines. If you know anything about successful wagering on a long term basis you know that you do not wager on every game on the board. You will have already set preliminary lines for all the games coming up and be able to compare your lines to the openers. You wager on the lines (if any) that differ from your lines by more than 3 points. The books look at this action and then adjusts their lines accordingly.

    The big difference between wagering today and wagering 10 years ago is the operating cost of the Sports Books and the Casino in General. Employees earn bigger salaries. The guy or gal who earned $5.00 an hour writing tickets for two dollar Horse players now earns $10.00 or more for writing that same ticket. P.C. at the bars go up. Scam artists are sharper than they were yesterday. There is a lot more competition because of the number of Casino's in Vegas. The fact is that Vegas is like everything else in life. Older Hotels cost more to operate because they are always in need to some type of repair. Because of this, it is tougher for the books to make a profit. Years ago it took a substantial amount of money to move a line. Today, because of higher operating costs, the book cannot afford to take a huge hit, so the lines are adjusted a lot more often and for smaller wagers. Computers can now notify players the instant a line changes, eliminating the need for a player to have to sit and wait all day long to see what was going to happen.

    If you are a serious player, the old adage of "bet early or late and skip the rest of the week still holds true, but now, you have to be one of the very first, or one of the very last to wager for that to hold water because of the constant line changes. If the casino knows that you are a knowledgeable player, they want to know your opinion BEFORE they open up to Joe Pub. The small bettor is the "Meat" for most books. They are fully aware of the fact that it takes 10 small wager wins ($100.00) to cover one major wager loss ($1000.00) It is the same principal today as it was 50 years ago.

  9. #9
    BeatTheJerk
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigdaddyQH View Post
    It is quite simple and has been going on for years. To do this you must know several things. First you must know where to place your wager and be allowed into that area. Sports Books all know who there knowledgeable customers are. Now you must understand that there is a difference between a knowledgeable customer and one who just wastes money on wagers because he/she has the money and can afford to do so. You need not wager thousands a game. If you are really good (and I am not talking about the B.S. that you hear in here) the books want to know what you think about the upcoming lines BEFORE they open them up to the public so the can adjust bad lines. If you know anything about successful wagering on a long term basis you know that you do not wager on every game on the board. You will have already set preliminary lines for all the games coming up and be able to compare your lines to the openers. You wager on the lines (if any) that differ from your lines by more than 3 points. The books look at this action and then adjusts their lines accordingly.

    The big difference between wagering today and wagering 10 years ago is the operating cost of the Sports Books and the Casino in General. Employees earn bigger salaries. The guy or gal who earned $5.00 an hour writing tickets for two dollar Horse players now earns $10.00 or more for writing that same ticket. P.C. at the bars go up. Scam artists are sharper than they were yesterday. There is a lot more competition because of the number of Casino's in Vegas. The fact is that Vegas is like everything else in life. Older Hotels cost more to operate because they are always in need to some type of repair. Because of this, it is tougher for the books to make a profit. Years ago it took a substantial amount of money to move a line. Today, because of higher operating costs, the book cannot afford to take a huge hit, so the lines are adjusted a lot more often and for smaller wagers. Computers can now notify players the instant a line changes, eliminating the need for a player to have to sit and wait all day long to see what was going to happen.

    If you are a serious player, the old adage of "bet early or late and skip the rest of the week still holds true, but now, you have to be one of the very first, or one of the very last to wager for that to hold water because of the constant line changes. If the casino knows that you are a knowledgeable player, they want to know your opinion BEFORE they open up to Joe Pub. The small bettor is the "Meat" for most books. They are fully aware of the fact that it takes 10 small wager wins ($100.00) to cover one major wager loss ($1000.00) It is the same principal today as it was 50 years ago.
    Does anyone know WTF he’s talking about ? I mean seriously can anyone on this forum vouch for what he said, or is this something he just made up right here right now to sound like he knows something we all don’t . I mean to think Linemakers are looking to actually discuss with a professional or semi-professional gambler on what he/she thinks prior to opening their line to me is laughable. They figure that out when they open & close the line throughout the day.

  10. #10
    BeatTheJerk
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    He could just be completely delusional & really believe this in his head because he has been asked before what do you think this line should be from a “writer” possibly or not a manager. Only because he said the line is off at the betting table.

  11. #11
    TommieGunshot
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigdaddyQH View Post
    It is quite simple and has been going on for years. To do this you must know several things. First you must know where to place your wager and be allowed into that area. Sports Books all know who there knowledgeable customers are. Now you must understand that there is a difference between a knowledgeable customer and one who just wastes money on wagers because he/she has the money and can afford to do so. You need not wager thousands a game. If you are really good (and I am not talking about the B.S. that you hear in here) the books want to know what you think about the upcoming lines BEFORE they open them up to the public so the can adjust bad lines. If you know anything about successful wagering on a long term basis you know that you do not wager on every game on the board. You will have already set preliminary lines for all the games coming up and be able to compare your lines to the openers. You wager on the lines (if any) that differ from your lines by more than 3 points. The books look at this action and then adjusts their lines accordingly.

    The big difference between wagering today and wagering 10 years ago is the operating cost of the Sports Books and the Casino in General. Employees earn bigger salaries. The guy or gal who earned $5.00 an hour writing tickets for two dollar Horse players now earns $10.00 or more for writing that same ticket. P.C. at the bars go up. Scam artists are sharper than they were yesterday. There is a lot more competition because of the number of Casino's in Vegas. The fact is that Vegas is like everything else in life. Older Hotels cost more to operate because they are always in need to some type of repair. Because of this, it is tougher for the books to make a profit. Years ago it took a substantial amount of money to move a line. Today, because of higher operating costs, the book cannot afford to take a huge hit, so the lines are adjusted a lot more often and for smaller wagers. Computers can now notify players the instant a line changes, eliminating the need for a player to have to sit and wait all day long to see what was going to happen.

    If you are a serious player, the old adage of "bet early or late and skip the rest of the week still holds true, but now, you have to be one of the very first, or one of the very last to wager for that to hold water because of the constant line changes. If the casino knows that you are a knowledgeable player, they want to know your opinion BEFORE they open up to Joe Pub. The small bettor is the "Meat" for most books. They are fully aware of the fact that it takes 10 small wager wins ($100.00) to cover one major wager loss ($1000.00) It is the same principal today as it was 50 years ago.
    So what you are saying, is that you do not have access to what you claim is "most important thing." Every single piece of bullshit you wrote here says absolutely nothing about you being able to wager before a Las Vegas sportsbook is open to general public customers.

  12. #12
    Gaze73
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    Just play on asian bookies, they have the best odds 99% of the time. US bookies have awful odds. For example, Pinnacle always has better odds than the SBR Book which I believe copies the lines from Bookmaker.

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