[getlucky2win]

i think cormier vs jds would be a great matchup. cormier could be the guy 2 put jds on his back. jds prob ko him but i think cormier could give him a battle.

[zoo youk]

as good as cormier is dos santos would pick him apart. junior is a freak lf nature

[JuicedUp]

much bigger threat than mir. dan is a top 5 heavy now. He is a big problem for everyone. jds would be forced to show his BJJ back game.

[Imsmarterthanu]

as good as cormier is dos santos would pick him apart. junior is a freak lf nature

I doubt that

Cormier IS coming to the UFC and he IS going to beat Junior Dos Santos

Cormier can take Dos Santos down at will, he will have a little bit of trouble standing up but Dos Santos isn't going to be able to handle Cormier's wrestling, Daniel's standup is going to neutralize the fight on the feet and his wrestling is going to bemore than enough to get him a victory.

[Vitooch]

Dos Santos has better boxing and gas tank. Cormier may be able to take JDS down, but I don't think he has the ability to keep him down for significant periods of time.

[Imsmarterthanu]

Dos Santos has better boxing and gas tank. Cormier may be able to take JDS down, but I don't think he has the ability to keep him down for significant periods of time.

WTF ?

you're trying to say JDS is now a better grappler than Josh Barnett. Cormier can take him down anytime he wants and keep him there, when was the last time you've even seen JDS on his back ? never. He won't know jack shit. JDS may have better boxing but that's all he has is boxing , haven't seen him do anything but box people up, Cormier is quick enough to get in and out of range and kick JDS once he puts his legs out his boxing foundation will be in jeopardy , he's the better kick boxer, this isn't Shane Carwin standing flat footed in front of JDS getting his face punched in, Cormier is the SMARTER fighter, he'll have the better game plan he'll shut down JDS's boxing and man handle him to the floor.

[Vitooch]

WTF ?

you're trying to say JDS is now a better grappler than Josh Barnett. Cormier can take him down anytime he wants and keep him there, when was the last time you've even seen JDS on his back ? never. He won't know jack shit. JDS may have better boxing but that's all he has is boxing , haven't seen him do anything but box people up, Cormier is quick enough to get in and out of range and kick JDS once he puts his legs out his boxing foundation will be in jeopardy , he's the better kick boxer, this isn't Shane Carwin standing flat footed in front of JDS getting his face punched in, Cormier is the SMARTER fighter, he'll have the better game plan he'll shut down JDS's boxing and man handle him to the floor.

I think the fact that we haven't really seen JDS off his back speaks volumes of his grappling. He trains with the Nogueira brothers, his MMA base is BJJ, and he is a brown belt. He is perfectly efficient off his back. JDS was momentarily taken down by Nelson and Gonzaga, both black belts with very good top games, and got right back up. Cormier's top game isn't great. Jeff Monson is the best fighter he's been able to completely stiffle. And, JDS has a boxing advantage and bigger reach.

[Imsmarterthanu]

I think the fact that we haven't really seen JDS off his back speaks volumes of his grappling. He trains with the Nogueira brothers, his MMA base is BJJ, and he is a brown belt. He is perfectly efficient off his back. JDS was momentarily taken down by Nelson and Gonzaga, both black belts with very good top games, and got right back up. Cormier's top game isn't great. Jeff Monson is the best fighter he's been able to completely stiffle. And, JDS has a boxing advantage and bigger reach.

comparing gonzaga and nelson to cormier is like comparing apples to oranges just the fact that he got taken down by Gonzaga speaks volumes. You haven't seen JDS on his back because no one wrestler could ever get in close enough to take him down. Like I said Cormier's speed is an attribute which JDS will have trouble dealing with, he's faster than cain has more power in his hands and is the better wrestler. He's also smart he doesn't fall into other fighter's game plans, he sticks with his own. He's strictly business, he does nothing that throws his game off and jeopardizes the fight.

He is not roy nelson and he is not gabriel gonzaga

[Vitooch]

Roy Nelson and Gonzaga have much better top games than Cormier, and they weren't able to hold JDS down.

[Imsmarterthanu]

Roy Nelson and Gonzaga have much better top games than Cormier, and they weren't able to hold JDS down.

Once again you're a moron with no grappling experience comparing an olympic wrestler to a bjj grappler is just a sign of ignorance. A bjj practitioner isn't the same as a wrestler. Nelson and Gonzaga have no wrestling credibility, they couldn't hold JDS down because they don't know how to keep him down. Look at Brock Lesnar he would take down guys at will and hold them there why ? because he knew how to wrestle, wrestling is over powering out working your opponent combined with wrestling technique like hitting switches knowing when to drop in for a leg and knowing when to pull out of an attempt , the wrestler with the stronger core strength can always keep his opponent on the ground, he uses his leverage to hold him on his back. That's wrestling pinning your opponent down, you get points for putting your opponent on his ass cheeks/on his back and/or pinning him down. That's what Cormier has trained all his life to do, he made it to the Olympics I'm absolutely sure he can hold a guy like JDS with no wrestling background down at will and keep him there.

Did you see the way he lifted Barnett over his head and flipped him around like a rag doll ? NO ONE has EVER done that to Josh Barnett in his entire fighting carreer, Barnett usually beasts people to the ground and in this fight he got absolutely beasted. Josh Barnett is a better grappler than JDS bar none. Training under the nogueira brothers doesn't mean shit, Nogueira bros are the only BJJ masters on that team no one else even has grappling skills on their team. JDS has had 0 success submitting guys on the ground, his only success was able to get back up from getting taken down by fat guys with no wrestling ability.

[Vitooch]

One of the biggest skills possessed by BJJ black belts are their ability to use technique (applying proper force and leverage) to control top position. Black belts aren't only good at submissions off their back.

Lesnar is an absolute freak of nature. His size alone is so overwhelming and overpowering fighters have an incredibly tough time of their back. Cormier isn't as gifted athletically, and, as proven in his fight tonight, doesn't possess the controlling top game that other wrestlers like Matt Hughes and Lesnar possess.

[Imsmarterthanu]

One of the biggest skills possessed by BJJ black belts are their ability to use technique (applying proper force and leverage) to control top position. Black belts aren't only good at submissions off their back.

Lesnar is an absolute freak of nature. His size alone is so overwhelming and overpowering fighters have an incredibly tough time of their back. Cormier isn't as gifted athletically, and, as proven in his fight tonight, doesn't possess the controlling top game that other wrestlers like Matt Hughes and Lesnar possess.

I have to hold myself back reading some of your shit, you don't get to the olympic level wrestling and not be gifted athletically, Cormier is PLENTY well as gifted athletically as brock lesnar and about 10 times better standing with 10 times the fight IQ as Brock. Like I said you probably think Brock Lesnar would own Cole Konrad in wrestling too because he's so "buff". I'm willing to bet Brock wouldn't be able to take Cormier down. Once again you're on foreign ground, BJJ black belts aren't there to apply proper force and leverage to control top position. Being on top position is to pass guard with the goal of moving into full mount where there are opportunities to execute submissions. It's not about controlling top position that's wrestling dumbass. You don't win BJJ matches by being on top, you win BJJ matches by passing guard, getting into mounted positions, getting body triangles, knees on the belly and eventually executing a submission. Just laying in someones guard doesn't mean shit.

[Vitooch]

Cormier is an unbelievable athlete, but Lesnar has better top control in due part to his shear size and strength. Cormier just doesn't seem to have the same top control, and I must credit Lesnar's size for the disparity.

[Imsmarterthanu]

Maybe against guys the likes of Heath Herring and Frank Mir he does, but he couldn't control Velasquez on the ground and Cormier is a better wrestler than Cain who took Brock down himself. Brock also got taken down by Randy Couture, these guys were both much smaller than him but the difference was they had wrestling backgrounds. Cormier beasted Barnett and Barnett is probably around the same level as Cain and Couture when it comes to wrestling maybe not traditional wrestling but mma wrestling. You're not going to see JDS going for leglocks against Cormier if it hits the floor, you won't see him attempting triangles either. The first thing he's going to try to do is get right back up but he won't because Cormier won't have anything to worry about . JDS is dangerous standing but only against opponents who stand in front of him with no foot work. That's usually how they get caught they freeze up in front of him and he catches them with something, cormier moves too much, he moves like Frankie Edgar does at lightweight.

[bogbat]

I think Cormier has a good shot against JDS. JDS's opponents so far haven't been known for their wrestling except for Cain but we all know how long that fight lasted. If Cormier turns it into a wrestling match I can see JDS gassing two and half rounds in and getting decision-ed or possibly even finished on the ground in the later rounds. JDS slowed down quite significantly in his fight vs Roy and that was a fight he was in complete and utter control of. Lets see how he holds up when he faces some real resistance. Resistance that is unlikely Mir will provide.

Hopefully JDS knocks out Mir quick so we can get incredible value on Cormier if/when Cormier faces him soon.

[v1y]

Roy Nelson and Gonzaga have much better top games than Cormier, and they weren't able to hold JDS down.

this is a troll post right?

[Vitooch]

No. Cormier has excellent takedowns, but his top game isn't great. He had no luck passing Barnett's guard or landing any effective GnP. He laid in Barnett's guard and displayed good submission defense.

Gonzaga and Nelson are much more comfortable in top position. Both fighters are able to land effective GnP while still advancing position and threatening with submissions. This is in due part to their skill in BJJ.

[Digo]

Cormier has the wrestling abilities to TD JDS, but he will not come so close to try, like Cain and so many others...
JDS has infinity better boxe
JDS as the reach advantage
JDS has more gás
JDS has much more agility and speed
You can stay here all day... Cormier is a top fighter, but last night he fough a "walking dead" Barnett, in the UFC he can fight to be top5, no more than that.
Cain, JDS, Overeem and even Werdum, can take him a part.

[dww123]

Once again you're a moron with no grappling experience comparing an olympic wrestler to a bjj grappler is just a sign of ignorance. A bjj practitioner isn't the same as a wrestler. Nelson and Gonzaga have no wrestling credibility, they couldn't hold JDS down because they don't know how to keep him down. Look at Brock Lesnar he would take down guys at will and hold them there why ? because he knew how to wrestle, wrestling is over powering out working your opponent combined with wrestling technique like hitting switches knowing when to drop in for a leg and knowing when to pull out of an attempt , the wrestler with the stronger core strength can always keep his opponent on the ground, he uses his leverage to hold him on his back. That's wrestling pinning your opponent down, you get points for putting your opponent on his ass cheeks/on his back and/or pinning him down. That's what Cormier has trained all his life to do, he made it to the Olympics I'm absolutely sure he can hold a guy like JDS with no wrestling background down at will and keep him there.

Did you see the way he lifted Barnett over his head and flipped him around like a rag doll ? NO ONE has EVER done that to Josh Barnett in his entire fighting carreer, Barnett usually beasts people to the ground and in this fight he got absolutely beasted. Josh Barnett is a better grappler than JDS bar none. Training under the nogueira brothers doesn't mean shit, Nogueira bros are the only BJJ masters on that team no one else even has grappling skills on their team. JDS has had 0 success submitting guys on the ground, his only success was able to get back up from getting taken down by fat guys with no wrestling ability.

You mean Heath Herring? An old, undersized Couture? A totally gassed Carwin? Frank Mir?? Surely you could have come up with someone other than than Borck Lesnar as an example!

[dww123]

He did make it to the olympics but the problem he will have in this senario is JDS will be punching him in the face.

[eligibletackle]

It's still Cain, but I'd say Cormier could very well be #2. I felt JDS could've made Overeem crumble as he wouldn't have a Plan B if standup was going south, unlike the AKA HWs.

[bogbat]

No. Cormier has excellent takedowns, but his top game isn't great. He had no luck passing Barnett's guard or landing any effective GnP. He laid in Barnett's guard and displayed good submission defense.

Gonzaga and Nelson are much more comfortable in top position. Both fighters are able to land effective GnP while still advancing position and threatening with submissions. This is in due part to their skill in BJJ.

Did you not see the damage to Cormier's eye Barnett did with elbows? Also, I don't recall Cormier trying to pass his guard but he did land straight into side control after one of this beautiful take downs.

[fosho14]

Roy Nelson and Gonzaga have much better top games than Cormier, and they weren't able to hold JDS down.

No disrespect intended here man, but just wondering if you are aware of what constitutes and qualifies as top game and how much better Cormier is than the 2 fighters you just mentioned. Very puzzled as to how you arrived at that conclusion.

[omalley21]

JDS's mma base is boxing not bjj.... Cormier poses a huge threat to JDS. Why is everyone saying JDS has a great gas tank. I've seen him gas/fade a few times. Nothing terrible, but not on Cain's level at all. Cain will be the HW champ of this era when all is said n done.

[Vitooch]

No disrespect intended here man, but just wondering if you are aware of what constitutes and qualifies as top game and how much better Cormier is than the 2 fighters you just mentioned. Very puzzled as to how you arrived at that conclusion.

Cormier just did not particularly impress me in top position against Barnett. I'm not denying how much better Cormier is than the other two fighters mentioned. I just think a JDS that isn't gassed (like Barnett was) will not attempt any subs off his back like Barnett did. He will make sure to cage walk or do something to get the fight back standing. JDS has underrated "grappling in reverse". Unless, of course he gasses (Having Cormier on top of you is admittedly exhausting).

[Vitooch]

Did you not see the damage to Cormier's eye Barnett did with elbows? Also, I don't recall Cormier trying to pass his guard but he did land straight into side control after one of this beautiful take downs.

Landing elbows in guard against a gassed Barnett does not constitute as a great top game. A great top game includes landing effective GnP, while advancing position, and threatening with submissions. Cormier seems to be content in whatever position on top his takedowns lead him to. When he took Barnett and landed in guard, he was content staying there and landing GnP until the ref stood them up. Same goes for when he was in side control. There is not much activity from Cormier. I think JDS will try to get the fight back standing more urgently than Barnett did.

[getlucky2win]

jds is a beast. i think he destroys everyone. but i think cormier has best chance 4 upset. jds has to defend the takedown and heavy hands of cormier. cain doesnt have good standup and overeem will not attempt takedown. travis browne and miocic could challenge for title in future, but i think cormier is best matchup now. i know he hasnt fought alot of top guys but he is still relatively new to mma and should improve

[fosho14]

Landing elbows in guard against a gassed Barnett does not constitute as a great top game. A great top game includes landing effective GnP, while advancing position, and threatening with submissions. Cormier seems to be content in whatever position on top his takedowns lead him to. When he took Barnett and landed in guard, he was content staying there and landing GnP until the ref stood them up. Same goes for when he was in side control. There is not much activity from Cormier. I think JDS will try to get the fight back standing more urgently than Barnett did.

Not much activity? What is landing GnP on top battering barnetts face called? Is that called being inactive? That to you is having a "bad top game" ?? Your forgetting the most important part though bud. He did not do this to some striker with no sense of grappling or wrestling, no he did that to someone who is considered by many to be a master on the ground with excellent submissions and highly adept catch wrestling skills. Furthermore a much larger man. Do you think fat country or gonzaga would be able to do what Cormier did? The answer is no, not even close. And yes I'm addressing your specific point about "top position" in this post.

[Vitooch]

Not much activity? What is landing GnP on top battering barnetts face called? Is that called being inactive? That to you is having a "bad top game" ?? Your forgetting the most important part though bud. He did not do this to some striker with no sense of grappling or wrestling, no he did that to someone who is considered by many to be a master on the ground with excellent submissions and highly adept catch wrestling skills. Furthermore a much larger man. Do you think fat country or gonzaga would be able to do what Cormier did? The answer is no, not even close. And yes I'm addressing your specific point about "top position" in this post.

I don't think Cormier has a bad top game. If I did say that in a previous post, let me correct myself. Against the likes of JDS, where Cormier is probably going to want to (or have to) take this fight down to the ground as soon as possible, I don't think he will be able to keep JDS down, especially in the early rounds when JDS is fresh. JDS has very strong hips. I can see him wall walking up as soon as he has the opportunity. His "grappling in reverse" is underrated. In terms of pure BJJ, Barnett is better off his back in threatening with submissions and sweeping. But JDS has the frame, and strength to not let fighters control him and get the fight back standing.

[fosho14]

I don't think Cormier has a bad top game. If I did say that in a previous post, let me correct myself. Against the likes of JDS, where Cormier is probably going to want to (or have to) take this fight down to the ground as soon as possible, I don't think he will be able to keep JDS down, especially in the early rounds when JDS is fresh. JDS has very strong hips. I can see him wall walking up as soon as he has the opportunity. His "grappling in reverse" is underrated. In terms of pure BJJ, Barnett is better off his back in threatening with submissions and sweeping. But JDS has the frame, and strength to not let fighters control him and get the fight back standing.

All of those attributes about JDS remains to be seen for obvious reasons, but lets just agree that cormier is a stud on the ground and although we have a differing opinion (which is fine) I personally think he has a stellar top game.

[fosho14]

All we know about JDS is that he currently possesses the sharpest striking skills in the HW division, and they have been so good that he hasn't needed to face adversity against someone who can take things to the mat. Therefore we can't start evaluating his skills down there.

[getlucky2win]

i think bjj is underrated. if these wrestlers could learn how 2 use submissions they would be way more dangerous. i hate it when the fight hits the ground and thers no action. cormier is pretty solid controlling possition and landing strikes. idk about stellar. if he works his bjj he would be very dangerous

[fosho14]

i think bjj is underrated. if these wrestlers could learn how 2 use submissions they would be way more dangerous. i hate it when the fight hits the ground and thers no action. cormier is pretty solid controlling possition and landing strikes. idk about stellar. if he works his bjj he would be very dangerous

I see your point. It may not be as vicious as it could be but it's stellar for winning fights. I don't see most being able to get up from bottom or sweep cormier. Follow this guys next few fights, watch you'll see.

[getlucky2win]

i agree with u. dc is a load and tough 4 any1 2 handle. i hope he gets time 2 improve b4 he fights 4 ufc title. i think a lil more experience and training is all that he needs to be the ufc champ

[Vitooch]

I see your point. It may not be as vicious as it could be but it's stellar for winning fights. I don't see most being able to get up from bottom or sweep cormier. Follow this guys next few fights, watch you'll see.

I guess that's where we differ...While I don't think JDS has any chance of sweeping or submitting Cormier, I do believe he can get up from bottom position in the early stages of a fight between the two.