[Wheell]

So much for Moose. If not on short rest Wang would be -220 or so. The real issue is how good can Wang be on short rest. I want to avoid the game, but I wonder if Cleveland just took a shot to the shorts and will they recover. Interesting game.

[bigboydan]

Wang looked really shaky in game 1, and with only 3 days rest. I expect much of the same here in game 4, even despite Byrd throwing for the Tribe.

[tevari]

i think he'll rebound from his game 1 disaster, if he opens anywhere near -220, im grabbing the runline...Byrd is terrible.

[Seattle Slew]

Cleveland should throw their top pitchers on 3 days rest in Games 4 and 5. Throwing Byrd to the wolves and tanking the game only helps the Yankees.

Remember Jack McKeon did that in 2003, saying he was going with Beckett and Pavano on short rest in Games 6 and 7.

Cleveland making a mistake.

[WestsidePete]

Cleveland should throw their top pitchers on 3 days rest in Games 4 and 5. Throwing Byrd to the wolves and tanking the game only helps the Yankees.

Remember Jack McKeon did that in 2003, saying he was going with Beckett and Pavano on short rest in Games 6 and 7.

Cleveland making a mistake.

I agree..it's like they don't think they can win in NY even with Sabathia....I took the Yankees total over 5 team runs today...and will do it again tomorrow if it stays at 5....Wang also pitches better at home ....I'll probably take the RL and parlay with the Cowboys ML...

[mv09]

Would the fact that Wang is a sinkerballer and is throwing on short rest benefit him? He wont be too strong and hang that sinker.
Either way, I like Cleveland today

[BossRoss]

Sinkers sink better on short rest, when you're strong the ball doesn't break until too late because of the added velocity, but when you're more tired the break starts earlier and gives it more time to dart downward and makes it much harder to hit(The same is true for breaking ball pitchers like Bronson Arroyo, who usually throws better on short rest as he gets more break with less velocity) Finesse pitchers less rest is OK, power pitchers not so much(2 examples I can remember from this year was when Peavy and Smoltz were moved up to throw on 3 days rest and both guys are more 'power' pitchers and both lost and didn't throw like their norm in those games! that said, CLEV is darn good offensively and even if wang does throw better, CLEV is good enough that they can still give him fits, but I'm still a believer in Good Pitching beats good hitting and think wang is the Much MUCH better hurler than Byrd and will take my chances on Wang and a still desperate yanks team in this spot as they respond for Joe Torre again and try to send this series back to CLEV!

P.S. I don't think clev is making a mistake by not throwing CC today, he's been the best pitcher in baseball all year and I think if you have any confidence in the guy at all, you show it by letting him pitch game 5(if neccessary) cause if he pitches there, clev already knows he can win and if Clev does win today's game, now you have your ace set-up to pitch in Game one of the ALCS and possibly can get 3 starts in that series, you move him up to today and you likely can't use your ace until the weekend! Clev still is in the drivers seat and even if they lose tonight(Which I expect) i think they got a great chance WED with CC on the hill at home!

[WestsidePete]

Sinkers sink better on short rest, when you're strong the ball doesn't break until too late because of the added velocity, but when you're more tired the break starts earlier and gives it more time to dart downward and makes it much harder to hit(The same is true for breaking ball pitchers like Bronson Arroyo, who usually throws better on short rest as he gets more break with less velocity) Finesse pitchers less rest is OK, power pitchers not so much(2 examples I can remember from this year was when Peavy and Smoltz were moved up to throw on 3 days rest and both guys are more 'power' pitchers and both lost and didn't throw like their norm in those games! that said, CLEV is darn good offensively and even if wang does throw better, CLEV is good enough that they can still give him fits, but I'm still a believer in Good Pitching beats good hitting and think wang is the Much MUCH better hurler than Byrd and will take my chances on Wang and a still desperate yanks team in this spot as they respond for Joe Torre again and try to send this series back to CLEV!

P.S. I don't think clev is making a mistake by not throwing CC today, he's been the best pitcher in baseball all year and I think if you have any confidence in the guy at all, you show it by letting him pitch game 5(if neccessary) cause if he pitches there, clev already knows he can win and if Clev does win today's game, now you have your ace set-up to pitch in Game one of the ALCS and possibly can get 3 starts in that series, you move him up to today and you likely can't use your ace until the weekend! Clev still is in the drivers seat and even if they lose tonight(Which I expect) i think they got a great chance WED with CC on the hill at home!

good post..actually it makes sense on the 3 day rest for a power pitcher not to go today ...sometimes the media and us overthink all of this stuff...

[pavyracer]

I don't know what you guys think but the Indians RL at 4 is ridiculous. They scored 12 runs on this guy just three days ago. The problem with Wang is he throws more balls than strikes. I see Indians covering the RL very easily.

[The HG]

Tough game, I think both lines are about right, my picks are Yanks and the under 10, but not betting either one.

But the "sinkerballers are better when tired" theory is IMO a bit overestimated. There is merit to the concept but I think it is not as pronounced as people think, and to the degree that it exists, is pitcher-specific.

And regarding Arroyo, I'd have to dig up my tucked away rest numbers on pitchers to be sure, but I recall that he in fact suffers markedly from short rest, and benefits quite a bit from extended rest.

[WestsidePete]

is Wang truely considered tired after 4 2/3 innings and 94 pitches?? If he went 7 innings and threw 115 pitches that's an outing to make you tired...he labored, but was also able to sit between innings for good stretches as the Yankees were still in the game and were getting men on base and had scored 3 runs up until that point.

[pavyracer]

Does anyone know Wang's numbers against Indians? Correct me if I'm wrong but I think they are horrible. If I was an Indian hitter he would't scare me at all.

[WestsidePete]

only one time all year did Wang give up 5 or more runs in consecutive starts...trend was to follow a bad one with a good one or two...gave up 5 runs or more in a total of 5 starts out of 30...so we'll see

[BossRoss]

Tony Gwynn was even talking about how a ball sinks better with less velocity...and I think he knows a little bit about the game!!! LOL

As for the Arroyo comment, i just made that off the top of my head(I was gonna say Aaron Sele at 1st...hehe) and really don't know if he's good or not on short-rest, i just remember winning a pick once when he did go on 3 days and he threw great and had a better than usual bender, but not sure how he's faired exactly historically and just used that as an example cause I know what I said is true for MANY sinkerball and breaking ball or finesse type pitchers! Again, just my opinion from personal experience and didn't think I'd be getting a background check on a guy I just threw into the fray for argument sake!

[The HG]

Tony Gwynn was even talking about how a ball sinks better with less velocity...and I think he knows a little bit about the game!!! LOL

As for the Arroyo comment, i just made that off the top of my head(I was gonna say Aaron Sele at 1st...hehe) and really don't know if he's good or not on short-rest, i just remember winning a pick once when he did go on 3 days and he threw great and had a better than usual bender, but not sure how he's faired exactly historically and just used that as an example cause I know what I said is true for MANY sinkerball and breaking ball or finesse type pitchers! Again, just my opinion from personal experience and didn't think I'd be getting a background check on a guy I just threw into the fray for argument sake!

Yeah I only responded to the specific mention of Arroyo because I have a particular impression of him as being someone who benefits from rest. His kind of stuff requires arm strength to control and execute, so even though its off-speed, if he's weak for some reason, its more likely to come out flat and get crushed, in my estimation.

The sinkerballer/rest issue though is a common assumption, and I'm sure there is real merit to it.