1. #1
    bigboydan
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    Player files $500,000 complaint against BetRoyal

    Player files $500,000 complaint against BetRoyal (SBR rating D-)

    SBR Justin investigated the available facts of the complaint. In 2004 a group of players were invited by BetRoyal management to trade prices and betting odds at BetRoyal against other sportsbooks . The manager who had made the arrangement had taken a position with BetUS (SBR rating D+) before this issue emerged.

    BetRoyal management would often solicit sharp players to bet off action they did not want while offering them special low juice, or even no juice lines, to increase liquidity. For example, if the sportsbook felt it had too much exposure on one play or wanted to gamble on the other team, it would make the applicable vig pricing appealing for their players that were known to trade on the sports betting market. The sportsbook was aware that at least two individuals were placing wagers on this account. The deposited funds initially lost but the invested $85,000 in deposits eventually earned a balance of $586,000. Several days before SBGglobal (SBR rating D-) completed its buyout of BetRoyal last year, the Royal website was taken off of the servers. When the site returned on the SBG platform, all winnings were removed from the account.

    During the investigation, Royal, which was known for odd player arrangements and high risk bookmaking models, claimed that it had an agreement with the account holder that he would never take out winnings – only deposits. Royal claimed that the players were using some sort of hedging strategy where they would guarantee that they lost money at Royal, and won at other books. Royal offered no solid proof of this, often referring to the deal as something arranged independently by the manager that had moved on. The account holder denies there was any such agreement to “not withdraw winnings.” He rightfully points out that such an arrangement is not logical and describes a scenario where the account could only lose money. SBR told Royal that their explanation was not believable. The account holder believes BetRoyal erased the winnings in order to take $500,000 in liabilities off the books before selling to SBG Global.

    SBR Founder Join Date: 8/10/2005


  2. #2
    Justin7
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    I would note that when SBG acquired Royal, it acquired all its liabilities as well. In this case SBG owes the player over $500k, and is not acknowledging the debt. Upper management is aware of this complaint, but did not respond to it.

  3. #3
    topgame85
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    Figures half a million bucks I'd hired a squad of mercenaries to go F--- there week up for that much cash

  4. #4
    JoshW
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    Before I worked at SBR, I made hundreds of bets ever day, and I was involved in something similar with Bet Royal. I was offered odds on bets over IM and over the phone that were not available on the BetRoyal website. The odds offered were well outside the market. I was told I was doing them a favor, so I made the bets they offered (I talked to both the head linesmaker and the book manager about this issue at the time to make sure it was on the up and up). This sounds exactly the same, and the timing would have been right. There was no restrictions on my account. No arrangement were I couldn't withdrawal funds and winnings. If fact I did win, and I did withdraw winnings. If SBG won't even communicated on this issue, I don't know that it makes any difference. But I can provide more details if it becomes a issue. These players are being stiffed without justification from my perspective.

    SBR Founder Join Date: 8/10/2005


  5. #5
    JBC77
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    Thats just terrible. I'm not a violent guy but if you stole that much money from me I would find your facility and burn that f!@#er right down to the ground.

  6. #6
    MonkeyF0cker
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    Not withdraw winnings? LOL. Now that's gotta be the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Is that the best they could come up with? LOL. What a scam operation. A horrible one at that...

  7. #7
    MonkeyF0cker
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    Quote Originally Posted by JBC77 View Post
    Thats just terrible. I'm not a violent guy but if you stole that much money from me I would find your facility and burn that f!@#er right down to the ground.
    I agree. I'd be on the next plane to Costa Rica. Bye bye, SBGglobal...

  8. #8
    Peep
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    Do you know if Bet Royal did full disclousure about this to SBG Josh?

  9. #9
    onthewhat
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    For $500 grand I'm in Costa Rica and murdering somebody

  10. #10
    Shark79
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    Give me 70% and Ill get your money back (well the remaining 30%)

  11. #11
    Steeltown
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    when I was scammed by Royal it was a couple jokers by the names of Kevin King and Richard Jones. What are the chances that these same two compulsive liars were involved in this? Tej Kohil being the owner and Amit his little bitch. And guess where Kevin King went, BET US! Funny as hell how a guy goes from one scam op to the other.

  12. #12
    big joe 1212
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peep View Post
    Do you know if Bet Royal did full disclousure about this to SBG Josh?
    Without full disclosure Royal is still liable!

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  13. #13
    Frank
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    Quote Originally Posted by Justin7 View Post
    I would note that when SBG acquired Royal, it acquired all its liabilities as well. In this case SBG owes the player over $500k, and is not acknowledging the debt. Upper management is aware of this complaint, but did not respond to it.

    SBG may have been in the dark about this 500k liability if the money in these accounts were mysteriously missing days before the acquisition.

    Maybe BetRoyal pulled a fast one on SBG

    Maybe SBG did it and pulled a fast one on these players and pretend to know nothing about this.

    Who knows?

  14. #14
    JoshW
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    Peep, I don't know about disclosure to SBG. I still had money at Royal at the time of the transition to SBG, but I didn't have any funds from this situation (the funds from these bets had all been withdrawn at least a year before).

    SBR Founder Join Date: 8/10/2005


  15. #15
    truthwillsetyouf
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    The Rasberry awards wasn't enuff for Ya?
    Last edited by truthwillsetyouf; 07-22-08 at 06:55 PM.

  16. #16
    Peep
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    Well, somebody screwed the players for sure.

    I was just wondering if anyone knew if it was old management Royal or new management SBG. I can't pick between them without an informed opinion, I don't think much of either.......

  17. #17
    Bill Dozer
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peep View Post
    Well, somebody screwed the players for sure.

    I was just wondering if anyone knew if it was old management Royal or new management SBG. I can't pick between them without an informed opinion, I don't think much of either.......
    SBG stated today that they had "nothing to do with" this issue and it happened before SBG had the brand. In our last email to them we wrote:

    although it is rarely thought of this way in the world of offshore gambling, disputes and debts of one company do get carried over under US law. In the days of publicly traded sportsbooks, Book A selling to Book B means book B acquires liabilities. That is why some companies would not buy books with many disputes.
    Surely SBG had access to Royals database and could see that $500k was there up to the point of the platform switch? You must have known about this account. Were you told the same story as us?

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  18. #18
    Peep
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    Good post Bill.

    For sure the liabilities carry, as well as the assets.

    SBG makes themselves sound stupid.

  19. #19
    sofun
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    hmm, I really don't understand this deal at all, how could these player win up to 500K from 1 books, it means that they lost to another book at lease 400K or even 450K, anyway still don't understand that, you can't just deposit 85K into one book and when winning without a withdraw, what kind of deal is it.

    JohnW, could you please make a clear statement about your deal so we all can understand more clear.
    thanks

  20. #20
    JoshW
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    Say Royal "thought" they had too much action on Team A at -110. The would offers bets for "special players" on Team B at +105 (or whatever odds). Some of the odds offered didn't make much sense for Royal at the time and I don't think they were always laying off action. At times I believe they(linesmaker and book manager) might have been taking a stand on their own opinions or opinions they thought were sharp. I don't believe it was good bookmaking, but I was only offered these type of odds for a couple months. I know others were offered it longer. I have no idea what type of special conditions royal and SBG are claiming now as that was never mentioned to me. They were bets that I could make and I made them with no restrictions.

    The idea might have been that Royal was sharp so that these bets were more likely to lose than win so Royal wouldn't get hurt. But they weren't sharp bets, and I told them several times that this style of bookmaking didn't make much sense.

    I believe that I was offered these bets in 2004 (I am editing it, because it could have been 2005, not 100% sure, just remember the seasons) in March through no later than July, but it could ended a few months earlier or later. So I am not sure, why the players hadn't gotten their money out by the time SBG took over, but who knows how long it went on. Either way, the players are owed the money. Royal when bought should have included this account. Are barring something saying otherwise that they can produce, bet made, bet paid.

    SBR Founder Join Date: 8/10/2005


  21. #21
    JC
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    If the facts are correct, SBG owes the 500K and their beef is with the former management of Royal. SBG needs to pay and then seek the money from Royal.

    Then again, a few months ago, SBG arbitrarily wiped out a bunch of accounts because they were winners.

    My only question is why did the players wait so long to come forward about this if their balances were wiped out at the time of the aquisition?

    SBR Founder Join Date: 8/23/2005


  22. #22
    Bill Dozer
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    Quote Originally Posted by sofun View Post
    hmm, I really don't understand this deal at all, how could these player win up to 500K from 1 books, it means that they lost to another book at lease 400K or even 450K,
    You have a handle on that part. When those TOW rookie books closed and stiffed, a lot of players were hit twice. They were opportunists betting the bonuses out using Pinnacle. A lot of it was deposited funds essentially moved from Pinnacle to a NoJuiceSports. Actually some of the books might have even survived if they were exposed to players who were actually gambling instead of traders. In the book's minds they blamed these players for the reason they couldn't pay them.

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  23. #23
    Bill Dozer
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    Quote Originally Posted by JC View Post
    If the facts are correct, SBG owes the 500K and their beef is with the former management of Royal. SBG needs to pay and then seek the money from Royal.

    Then again, a few months ago, SBG arbitrarily wiped out a bunch of accounts because they were winners.

    My only question is why did the players wait so long to come forward about this if their balances were wiped out at the time of the aquisition?
    Royal just finished the payment plan on the 86k they deposited. $500k of 586k was removed. That was still pending when SBR first received the complaint.

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  24. #24
    sofun
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    Thanks JohnW,
    I don't know why they let the sum of money going that much, I hope SGB would pay them, but they have all the right not to pay if the statement between bet royal and SGB are not on the table. beside that the histroy is too long,

  25. #25
    truthwillsetyouf
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    sbg isnt going to pay them. The ownership involved with sbg is like running a sour vina sausage store.

  26. #26
    HeeeHAWWWW
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    Crooks. Hope you F them, Bill.

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