1. #1
    MeanPeopleSuck
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    Bitcoin Cash (BCC) and its Unique Threat to Gamblers. IF YOU OWN BTC, READ ME

    First, WTF is actually happening to my Bitcoin?


    Here's the deal: Unless there's a major change between now and then, at 7:20am EST next Tuesday, August 1st, Bitcoin will divide into two incompatible coins (a "hard fork"). The new coin will be called Bitcoin Cash (BCC) and will be awarded to BTC owners on a 1 to 1 basis (so if you own 3.25 btc, you're about to own 3.25 btc and 3.25 bcc.) BTC's current value will be divided between the two coins based on factors you don't care about like mining pools and their hash rates, but there's already a futures market for BCC and as I type this it's pricing BCC at about $400: https://www.viabtc.com/quot/realtime...c&chart=simple




    So what's the problem?

    The problem is the only way BCC tokens can be distributed is to give them to the holders of BTC's private keys. You probably believe that's you, but if your BTC is at a sportsbook or at an exchange, it's not. THEY hold those private keys, so THEY will receive the BCC. Whether they decide to pass it along to the rightful owners -- i.e., you -- is completely up to them and, worryingly, as far as I know, not a single exchange -- and certainly not a single sportsbook -- has yet promised to do that, and we're only 5 days out from the event.

    Edit: Bitfinex has now announced it WILL be distributing BCC to its clients, so it appears to be the first safe exchange to keep your BTC at for August 1st. Conversely, Bitstamp and Coinbase / GDAX have announced they definitely WON'T be distributing BCC to their clients, so move your BTC OUT of those two exchanges.




    CONCLUSION: If you own BTC at any exchange except Bitfinex, your value is in danger THIS COMING TUESDAY. If you have BTC at any BTC sportsbook, your value is in GRAVE DANGER THIS COMING TUESDAY.




    1. How to Protect Yourself if Your BTC is at an Exchange (Coinbase/GDAX, Kraken, Poloniex, Bitstamp, Bittrex, Bitmex, etc., etc.). There's two options:

    a. (Not recommended): Sell your BTC for any other currency and wait until after the hard fork of BTC into BTC and BCC on August 1st, then buy back in afterward. Of course it's up to you, but the reason I wouldn't choose this option is that BTC's price has already been partially reduced, probably reflecting some the value it's about to lose to BCC.

    b. (Recommended): Move your BTC to a wallet where you, not the exchanges, have control over your private keys. Whoever controls the private keys will receive the BCC and you want that to be you, yourself, not an exchange that might -- or might not -- pass those tokens along to you. There's also a recent, bad precedent: last month alt coin STR/XLM gave away $30 of itself per bitcoin to every bitcoin owner in the world, but every BTC sportsbook and almost every exchange just pocketed that money for themselves.


    Any of the wallets on the following page are safe, leaving you in control of your private keys: https://bitcoin.org/en/choose-your-wallet





    2. How to Protect Yourself if Your Bitcoin's at a BTC Sportsbook:

    There's only one way: Withdraw it all before July 31st and send it to a wallet where you control the private keys. Do NOT, under any circumstances, have any BTC at Nitro/Cloudbet/Fairlay/Coinbet/Onehash, etc., on August 1st unless, like myself, some of your BTC is stuck on pending futures wagers. In that sad case -- just my luck! -- we're at the absolute mercy of the sportsbooks to pass along our BCC tokens. To see why that's a problem, here's the worryingly non committal reply I got from Nitro when I asked whether players would receive the BCC tokens issued to the private keys of our BTC, which they hold:


    Nitrogen Sports Support at 3:03pm on July 26, 2017
    Hello XXX,

    Thank you for reaching out to us with your inquiry! We appreciate your kind words.

    Nitrogen continuously monitors updates to the bitcoin client, network, protocol and community. We would certainly never make any kind of switch independently, but we will pay attention to the community at large in order to make the best decision for Nitrogen and it's users.

    Unfortunately, we cannot commit to what this decision will be at this time but we encourage you to continue checking our website for any updates in this regard.

    If you have any other concern, feel free to contact us.

    Best regards,

    XXX

    This reply isn't at all reassuring. Read a certain way, one might even interpret it to mean they're going to wait and see how much BCC tokens are worth before deciding whether to pass our money along to us or just pocket it for themselves.




    Concluding on a Happy Note

    The August 1st dangers for BTC owners are real and the August 1st dangers for BTC depositors at BTC sportsbooks are VERY real, but don't let that fool you: outside of the problems with BCC token distribution, the news is all good. The Great Scalability War is over. One of the proposed fixes (BIP 91) has already triggered, reducing the voting pool on a second fix (BIP 141, aka "SegWit"), which basically guarantees its adoption on August 11th. A doubling of the bitcoin block size is then scheduled for November (the "2x" part of SegWit2x), but I know this community well, and if we're really able to agree on how best to do that in barely more than 3 months, I'll eat my hat.

    Still, these are all steps in the right direction. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see a nice August rally, possibly hitting All Time Highs (once you've added BTC + BCC). GOOD LUCK TO ALL!
    Last edited by MeanPeopleSuck; 07-27-17 at 09:43 PM. Reason: To Update Thursday's Happenings
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  2. #2
    JAKEPEAVY21
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    How do we go about controlling our private keys?

    I recently moved all my bitcoin into my Airbitz wallet on my phone.

    I'm thinking of just cashing out and then reinvesting after the hard fork.

  3. #3
    MeanPeopleSuck
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    OP updated to reflect today's Nitro blog post.


    The post is somewhat reassuring, but it doesn't address the biggest issue: will players receive the Bitcoin Cash (BCC) assigned to their BTC currently deposited at Nitro?

  4. #4
    MeanPeopleSuck
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    Quote Originally Posted by JAKEPEAVY21 View Post
    How do we go about controlling our private keys?

    I recently moved all my bitcoin into my Airbitz wallet on my phone.

    I'm thinking of just cashing out and then reinvesting after the hard fork.
    Hi, Jake, how's tricks?

    No need to sell. By transferring your BTC to Airbitz you've already secured your private key.

    Here's how to access it, but again, you're already completely safe: https://airbitz.co/go/faq/how-do-i-get-my-private-key/

  5. #5
    RonPaul2008
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    I second manpeoplesuck, it would be super if SBR could ask Nitrogen specifically if they will provide the 1 bcc to nitro users per btc in their account, and also still have all their bcc and be able to withdraw each coin separately. My feelings is their new update may have intended to say as much, but it's not clear enough to be sure.

  6. #6
    JAKEPEAVY21
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    Quote Originally Posted by MeanPeopleSuck View Post
    Hi, Jake, how's tricks?

    No need to sell. By transferring your BTC to Airbitz you've already secured your private key.

    Here's how to access it, but again, you're already completely safe: https://airbitz.co/go/faq/how-do-i-get-my-private-key/
    doing well thanks and yourself?

    thanks for the info buddy, appreciated

  7. #7
    Bsims
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    I have a wallet at blockchain.info. I don't see anything about a private key, but they discuss a master seed. Is this a good place to store your BTC over the next 10 days, and will they get BCC?

  8. #8
    ThaWoj
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    I'd like to know that about blockchain.info as well

  9. #9
    Optional
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bsims View Post
    I have a wallet at blockchain.info. I don't see anything about a private key, but they discuss a master seed. Is this a good place to store your BTC over the next 10 days, and will they get BCC?
    Quote Originally Posted by ThaWoj View Post
    I'd like to know that about blockchain.info as well
    There is no absolute guarantee with blockchain.info online wallets but assuming there is no technical reason that pops up preventing them from supporting both chains (highly unlikely) then you can be near enough to certain you will get both coins there if both chains look like surviving.

    You could also use the downloadable desktop wallet they offer and hold the private key yourself.

    But for me, with only a couple of hundred in there, I'm not concerned.

  10. #10
    MeanPeopleSuck
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bsims View Post
    I have a wallet at blockchain.info. I don't see anything about a private key, but they discuss a master seed. Is this a good place to store your BTC over the next 10 days, and will they get BCC?
    Heh, that turned out to be a much trickier question than it looked. Blockchain.info used to be just an ewallet and back then it was easy to find your private key, but recently it's gone into the buying and selling of BTC business, and now their menus are different from what I remember, and I couldn't find the right combo clicks to get you to your private key -- I know, worthless, right?

    So, here's what I'll say: I'm 95% sure you're safe -- and maybe somebody who has used Blockchain.info more recently than me can confirm this -- but if you want to raise that to 100%, you can open a wallet at any of these choices, move your BTC there, and sleep soundly on July 31st: https://bitcoin.org/en/choose-your-wallet

    FWIW, Electrum and Airbitz are two of the more popular, user friendly options.

  11. #11
    Optional
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    ^^^ you can only get the private key for imported wallets. Not your main one.

  12. #12
    raiders72001
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  13. #13
    Brooks
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    should i hold in my wallet or send to a sportsbook like 5dimes or bookmaker? thanks

  14. #14
    bigtymer56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brooks View Post
    should i hold in my wallet or send to a sportsbook like 5dimes or bookmaker? thanks
    If you care about receiving the Bitcoin Cash (BTCC) then keep it in your wallet.

    Honestly, I would just keep everything in your wallet for the few days before and after Aug. 1st, and see whats up when everything settles.

    PS. Make sure you have you're private keys.

  15. #15
    GoldRush7
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    I have all my invested bitcoin on a Trezor. Am I good to go there or do I need to do something?

  16. #16
    MeanPeopleSuck
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    Quote Originally Posted by Optional View Post
    ^^^ you can only get the private key for imported wallets. Not your main one.
    Ah, cool. Thanks, Optional. Nice to see you again, btw.

  17. #17
    MeanPeopleSuck
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brooks View Post
    should i hold in my wallet or send to a sportsbook like 5dimes or bookmaker? thanks
    Sending your BTC to a sportsbook that converts BTC deposits to dollars, like 5d and Bookmaker, works out the same as selling it for dollars and sitting out the hard fork (little letter "a" in the "How to Protect Yourself...Exchanges" section in the OP), so if that's the option you want to choose, rock on.

    You'll be in dollars during the HF, then can get back into BTC with a payout whenever it suits you.

  18. #18
    MeanPeopleSuck
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoldRush7 View Post
    I have all my invested bitcoin on a Trezor. Am I good to go there or do I need to do something?
    You are 100% safe already. Trezor's a super well regarded wallet; your private key is your own.

  19. #19
    jtoler
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    hehe

  20. #20
    MeanPeopleSuck
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    YIPES. I just got an email from Bitstamp. They are NOT going to support, trade in, or forward anyone's BCC to them. Here's the decisive sentence, "For these reason, Bitstamp is not in a position to support BCC, nor will Bitstamp be liable for any BCC sent to Bitstamp." (Entire email pasted below).

    So, get your BTC the heck OUT of Bitstamp. Send it to any of these and you're safe: https://bitcoin.org/en/choose-your-wallet

    Here's the crazy part: Bitstamp's the exchange I thought was the MOST likely to make sure its clients got their BCC. If Bitstamp's not going to forward it, will any exchanges? (Hey, at least Bitstamp's telling people ahead of time; scuzzier places -- I'm looking at you, Polo -- probably won't, so they can maximize their windfall off their depositors' BTC).



    Dear,

    We would like to take this opportunity to let you know our plans for the upcoming weeks as we navigate any potential disruptions on the Bitcoin (BTC) network. As always, our focus will continue to be on the safety of your funds. In the event of a User Activated Hard Fork (UAHF) on 1 August or thereafter, it is important to clarify that Bitstamp would not be in a position to support Bitcoin Cash (BCC), the coin associated with the Bitcoin Cash proposal. In Bitstamp's view, BCC is an alt-coin and the decision to list BCC tokens remains at our sole discretion at all times.

    If Bitstamp chooses to list BCC, we would decide at our own discretion on what course of action to take with balances deriving from the hard fork. BCC would also be subject to the same due diligence processes as for any other alt-coin, which requires time and careful planning. For these reason, Bitstamp is not in a position to support BCC, nor will Bitstamp be liable for any BCC sent to Bitstamp.

    As always, the safety of your funds remains our number one priority. To this end, as a security precaution, we will be disabling bitcoin deposits and withdrawals on 31 July 2017 at 23:00 hrs UTC to ensure that all BTC funds stored at Bitstamp remain secure. Trading will remain unaffected throughout. Deposits and withdrawals will be resumed only when we deem it safe and prudent to do so.

    We will leave it to you to decide whether to withdraw your BTC funds from Bitstamp prior to this cut-off date if you would like to access BCC or any other hard fork, and Bitstamp shall not be held liable for any consequences of that decision, from neither a financial, operational nor regulatory standpoint.

    To be clear, Bitstamp has no favoured outcome to the resolution of the bitcoin scaling issue. Our sole focus is on you and your best interests. As such, we are continuing to monitor developments clo sely. Please check our Twitter feed, Facebook page and website for the latest news, updates and developments.

    Best,

    The Bitstamp team

  21. #21
    DawgPound1738
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    Does anyone know about Heritage or can someone find out please, this is really alarming to me.

  22. #22
    Optional
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    Quote Originally Posted by DawgPound1738 View Post
    Does anyone know about Heritage or can someone find out please, this is really alarming to me.
    Heritage only takes bitcoin as the money transfer method and converts it to US$ for your account. So your balance there is unaffected whatever happens.

  23. #23
    raiders72001
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    Quote Originally Posted by MeanPeopleSuck View Post
    You are 100% safe already. Trezor's a super well regarded wallet; your private key is your own.
    agree

  24. #24
    MeanPeopleSuck
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    Thursday's Big Developments (as so often in crypto, these developments conflict):

    1. This afternoon Bitstamp announced it would NOT support BCC trading, nor distribute BCC to its clients. From that announcement, people thought, "well, if straight-as-an-arrow Bitstamp's not going to support BCC then maybe none of the exchanges will. Wait, they're trying to strangle BCC in its crib!"

    So, BTC jumped $200 and the futures market for BCC plunged by $100. All looked great until 20 minutes ago, when:

    2. Bitfinex Announced the exact opposite position: It WILL distribute BCC to its BTC holders and it plans to open a trading market in BCC "as soon as practicable." So, now I suppose BTC's upward momentum will be blunted and the BCC'ers hopes (and futures price) will re-inflate.

    Why? Because life in crypto is NEVER easy.

  25. #25
    MeanPeopleSuck
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    The Aug 1 Bitcoin Hard Fork Survival Guide, In 3 Easy Steps

    Are you understandably confused by Bitcoin's different factions and scalability fixes? Do you not care about any of that crap, but just want to know how to protect all of your BTC value through next Tuesday's hard fork? Then this guide's for you.

    How To Protect All of Your Bitcoin Value on August 1st in 3 Easy Steps:

    1. Immediately withdraw all your BTC from BTC only sportsbooks (Nitro, Cloudbet, Fairlay, Coinbet, Onehash, etc.)

    2. Open an account at Bitfinex. It's free, anonymous and takes about 5 minutes to open: https://www.bitfinex.com/trading

    3. Withdraw all your BTC from every other wallet, exchange and sportsbook you have it at now and send it all to Bitfinex by Monday night.

    That's it, you're covered. On Tuesday, Bitcoin will divide into two different coins: BTC, which you're used to, and BCC, which is new. BCC will be awarded to all BTC owners on a 1 to 1 basis (so if you own 1.5 BTC on Monday night, on Tuesday night you'll own 1.5 BTC and 1.5 BCC), but the only way to easily receive your BCC is to have your BTC at Bitfinex.

    Here's the best part: to get your free BCC, you won't have to do anything at all because Bitfinex will go out and get it for you and deposit it in your account.

    On Wednesday you can either stay with Bitfinex or withdraw your BTC back to wherever you had it before, then decide on selling or holding the new coin based on its price and future prospects.

  26. #26
    Bsims
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    Kraken is a crypto-currency exchange. They just released the following;

    We have posted an important announcement on our blog about the “Bitcoin Cash” (BCH) hard fork that will happen on August 1. Everyone should read the complete post, but here are a few highlights from the post:

    • Kraken plans to support BCH on our platform for funding and trading in the pairs BCH/XBT, BCH/USD, BCH/EUR
    • Clients holding Bitcoin (XBT) balances at the time of the fork will be credited with an equal amount of Bitcoin Cash (BCH) - e.g. 1 XBT will result in 1 XBT + 1 BCH

  27. #27
    MeanPeopleSuck
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bsims View Post
    Kraken is a crypto-currency exchange. They just released the following;

    We have posted an important announcement on our blog about the “Bitcoin Cash” (BCH) hard fork that will happen on August 1. Everyone should read the complete post, but here are a few highlights from the post:

    • Kraken plans to support BCH on our platform for funding and trading in the pairs BCH/XBT, BCH/USD, BCH/EUR
    • Clients holding Bitcoin (XBT) balances at the time of the fork will be credited with an equal amount of Bitcoin Cash (BCH) - e.g. 1 XBT will result in 1 XBT + 1 BCH
    Cool, so Kraken joins Bitfinex as two safe exchanges to have your BTC at on Tuesday. It's interesting they've decided to use the same ticker symbol as Bitfinex, BCH, instead of BCC (which was already used at Bitfinex to represent Bitcoin Core tokens).

  28. #28
    MeanPeopleSuck
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    Quote Originally Posted by MeanPeopleSuck View Post
    Are you understandably confused by Bitcoin's different factions and scalability fixes? Do you not care about any of that crap, but just want to know how to protect all of your BTC value through next Tuesday's hard fork? Then this guide's for you.
    How To Protect All of Your Bitcoin Value on August 1st in 3 Easy Steps:

    1. Immediately withdraw all your BTC from BTC only sportsbooks (Nitro, Cloudbet, Fairlay, Coinbet, Onehash, etc.)

    2. Open an account at Bitfinex. It's free, anonymous and takes about 5 minutes to open: https://www.bitfinex.com/trading

    3. Withdraw all your BTC from every other wallet, exchange and sportsbook you have it at now and send it all to Bitfinex by Monday night.

    That's it, you're covered. On Tuesday, Bitcoin will divide into two different coins: BTC, which you're used to, and BCC, which is new. BCC will be awarded to all BTC owners on a 1 to 1 basis (so if you own 1.5 BTC on Monday night, on Tuesday night you'll own 1.5 BTC and 1.5 BCC), but the only way to easily receive your BCC is to have your BTC at Bitfinex.

    Here's the best part: to get your free BCC, you won't have to do anything at all because Bitfinex will go out and get it for you and deposit it in your account.

    On Wednesday you can either stay with Bitfinex or withdraw your BTC back to wherever you had it before, then decide on selling or holding the new coin based on its price and future prospects.
    PS: whoever moved the above quote, which started as its own thread with updated information, to a post on this thread, whose OP is now hopelessly outdated, is a complete crypto moron.

  29. #29
    Optional
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bsims View Post
    Kraken is a crypto-currency exchange. They just released the following;

    We have posted an important announcement on our blog about the “Bitcoin Cash” (BCH) hard fork that will happen on August 1. Everyone should read the complete post, but here are a few highlights from the post:

    • Kraken plans to support BCH on our platform for funding and trading in the pairs BCH/XBT, BCH/USD, BCH/EUR
    • Clients holding Bitcoin (XBT) balances at the time of the fork will be credited with an equal amount of Bitcoin Cash (BCH) - e.g. 1 XBT will result in 1 XBT + 1 BCH
    You'd think that all exchanges could be this clear about it by now!

    Kudos to Kraken.


    Think I'll be calling them BTC and BCC for a while yet. Too few will understand what BCH is once this is over in a few weeks and the BitcoinCash thing dies out (?)


    What's the plan on receiving new BitcoinCash everyone? Sell ASAP and take whatever we can get? Or does anyone think this alt coin is going to rise in value short or medium term?

  30. #30
    Bsims
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    My guess is most folks will sell them or convert them to BTC quickly. Although, since they are "free" I might just sit on them for a while and see what happens.

  31. #31
    MeanPeopleSuck
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bsims View Post
    My guess is most folks will sell them or convert them to BTC quickly. Although, since they are "free" I might just sit on them for a while and see what happens.
    Me too. BCC is emerging from the crypto faction I was a member of for over a year, so I can't help secretly rooting for it.

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