[HappyHounds]

USA Guide to Using Bitcoin effectively:

Purpose: To give a brief overview of Bitcoin and how to use it successfully. My definition of successfully using bitcoin is to minimize fees and to be able to have the freedom to use your money as your please. You worked for it! This guide is geared towards people living in the United States, since we have different banking than in Europe.

Advantages

• When you understand it all, it makes it very easy to make bets instantly or to place large bets cost effectively. You can bet pennies or you can bet literally hundreds of thousands of dollars very conveniently.
• When you need USD, you can get your money much faster than waiting for a check or other methods of payout. Plus, you can get much larger sums faster.
• You can actually use your Bitcoin directly to pay for things, without converting to USD, so using a book like Nitrogen will allow you to literally spend your winnings right after the match ends.

Disadvantages

• Bitcoin suffers from some high-volatility at times.
  
  • If you spend or send your bitcoin to a book that converts to USD right when you buy your BTC, you are not likely to suffer any loss in value.
  • If you keep BTC or wager solely in Bitcoin you are subject to the market fluctuations. This can be a good or bad thing, which leads too....
  
  
• You can't really predict the market.

What is Bitcoin? https://www.weusecoins.com/
Simply, Bitcoin is a digital currency. The advantages of using Bitcoin is there is some privacy with your transactions, relatively low transaction fees, and it is fairly fast.


How to Buy?
So this is the meat-and-potatoes of using Bitcoin effectively.
There are different ways that fees are assessed and there are several ways to buy bitcoins.
I will personally talk about my methods I've used in the United States and what I find to be most cost effective.
Fees: Generally are charged for wire transfers & purchasing/selling coins.


PURCHASING COINS:
1.) Most recommended: Gemini & itBit

• Both of these sites are trading platforms, which means that you are buying coins from another user. I like these exchanges for United States citizens because of the fact that their banks are located on US-Soil. What does this mean? It means lower fees on wire transfer fees.
• 
  
  • Gemini: Allows *************** deposits up to $500 and wire transfers are accepted free of charge! Withdrawal is free! (https://gemini24.zendesk.com/hc/en-u...transfer-fees-)
  • itBit: Accept wire transfers for $10. Withdrawl: FREE *************** up to and including $3000, $20 for a wire transfer over $3000(https://support.itbit.com/customer/p...awal-bank-fees)

• If you want to wire money to these exchanges, they both are domestic wire transfers, so your fees are generally lower. For example, if I use my FNBO Direct Account, it costs me $15+$10 to send a wire to itBit (arrives next day) or $15 to Gemini. That's pretty cost effective. Remember, Gemini allows *************** deposits up to $500 for free.
• Generally speaking, if you use any of the free deposit methods to an exchange, you'll get more Bitcoin than if you were to use Circle/Coinbase. A wire transfer makes sense around the $3000 mark.

Trading fees: They are generally from 0% to .25%. I generally don't pay a fee at itBit because I'm usually a "maker" (https://www.itbit.com/h/fees-maker-taker-model)

The disadvantge of my favorite sites are that you can't INSTANTLY buy coins. *************** will take a few days, but a wire transfer to these exchanges has been showing up the next day.


IN A CLOSE SECOND: BitStamp, Bitfinex -->These are excellent exchanges with good liquidity. The difference is that their banks are located in Slovenia and Hong Kong, so you will pay more for your transfers and there is no *************** option. For example, when I wired to Bitfinex, I'm charged $40 from my bank + $20 for accepting + I was charged by an intermediate bank.
Sending to BitStamp = $40 from my bank + $8.50 for accepting the wire.


2.) Circle
-Pros

• You can use your debit card to instantly purchase Bitcoins. This is a money-transfer service so you are subjected to more regulations (it's in USA). You start at $300 limits and can go to $3000. You'll have send, buy, and cashout limits. This makes it vital to use an intermediate wallet because you can't send back and forth from Circle without maxing your limits pretty quickly.
• That's really the big advantage of Circle: Debit card purchases up to $3000 once you're verified.
• The market is about 1% higher than many exchanges, so it's advantageous to sell your coins here if you can.
• *************** up to $3000
• -Circle allows you to operate in USD/BTC. You can actually have 2 seperate accounts, one in each currency. This allows you to avoid volatilty when some books take a while to process a payout.

-CONS

• -VERY EASY TO BE BANNED. They will look into your transactions and ask you questions. Very important to use an intermediate wallet.
• -Support is hit or miss.
• -As said above...The market is about 1% higher than many exchanges, ---so even though there are no "fees" if you do the math on most large bitcoin purchases, you are better off purchasing from an exchange and getting more coins for your money.

3.) Coinbase
-Pros

• You can work your way into Instant Buys.
• 1% fee is pretty reasonable since the market price is usually a bit lower on Coinbase
• *************** , high limits
• DEBIT CARDS coming : https://blog.coinbase.com/2016/03/01/debit-card/

CONS

• -Support is slow
• The limits on INSTANT purchases are not that high.
• -It can be difficult to get your limits up
• Takes some time to get your coins if you use *************** & you will get the coins at the price you purchased them... So you will either gain or lose some value in the time it takes those coins to be credited to your account.

Coinbase offers an exchange as well as their normal brokerage services of buying coins. The exchange is not available in my state, so I can not comment on it.

What to do with your coins?

• -Once you purchase your coins, the first thing that you should do it transfer them to a secure wallet.I prefer Electrum, but you can start with the basic Blockchain wallet until you get more comfortable with understanding private keys and how it all works. https://bitcoin.org/en/choose-your-wallet
• Just make sure that whatever wallet you choose, that you go through the steps of properly backing it up.

How to process winnings?
1.) Make sure you are sending your winnings from your gambling site to your intermediate wallet--not to Circle, Coinbase, or your exchange. This will prevent any privacy issues where you get questioned for gambling.
2.) If you can use Circle, cashout there. You'll generally get the best rate.
otherwise,

• Up to $3000, use free *************** through itBit.
• Over $3000, use wiretransfer @Gemini (free)
• If you only want to spend some of your winnings, look into https://www.gyft.com/ where you can buy giftcards.

Recommended Books:
1.) Nitrogen Sports
Pros-

• Pretty good odds,
• free deposits and cashouts
• cashouts are usually processed within 10 minutes even when they are large. Win a bet, get your money right away. I haven't seen a limit on deposits or payouts, I've done some over 10k processed within a few minutes.
• The book has a cool self-excluding feature
• PRO or CON--Wagering is all in BTC ---> you might gain some value or lose some as the price of BTC changes

Cons-

• Live betting is not the best
• Support is just through chat and e-mail

2.) Heritage Sports
Pros-

• Okay lines,
• great customer service.
• free deposits and cashouts.
• PRO or CON? -- Your btc deposits are converted to USD, so you can avoid some market volatility.

Cons-

• Cashouts require you taking a phone call and verbally giving a payout password. There is no two-factor authentication or anything automated.
• Only processed once a day M-F. Limit is said to be $3000 ... but I've done more, I think if you make larger deposits you can cashout more at once.

Cloudbet can be considered for smaller wagers or obscure matches. They sometimes feature stale lines and I think they have pretty good live betting. The payouts are instant, which is why I'm listing it. However, support is very slow and I can personally never find out what the true limits are on a wager. Many times, I will look up a line and hover over it to see the limit that is allowed; I will then make a deposit and attempt to place a bet, only to find out the wagering limit is much lower. It can create some frustration.


That said, Nitrogen and Heritage should be all you need to get your money down on whatever you want to wager on.

[HappyHounds]

...........

[NCarts]

Great post. I wasn't aware you could process your winnings at Circle. For some reason I thought you could just buy BTC, send and receive there. So in the past I was processing through CoinBase and the 1% pimp fee into my account was hurting my winnings.

[HappyHounds]

Great post. I wasn't aware you could process your winnings at Circle. For some reason I thought you could just buy BTC, send and receive there. So in the past I was processing through CoinBase and the 1% pimp fee into my account was hurting my winnings.

Hey, thanks. Yes, Circle has a "Cash Out" or "Sell BTC" option (depending on what your currency is in).

Just keep in mind your statement is against their TOS: https://support.circle.com/hc/en-us/...nt-Violations-

I'd recommend using https://sharedcoin.com/ to get some Privacy. Be very careful if you cherish your Circle account as they WILL ban you. Sending or receiving directly to a gambling site will almost immediately raise a red flag. (I had over 6 months worth of weekly transactions, but was banned almost instantly, when I was rushed and sent ONCE to a well-known site even though I used a fresh deposit address). Not as much privacy with Bitcoin as you think.

[3runhomer]

VERY helpful post!

Thanks HappyHounds!

[Ghenghis Kahn]

great post but this seems so complicated. why not just request a check?

[kj8210]

great post but this seems so complicated. why not just request a check?

Checks take 3-4 days on average to receive, up 10 days from some books. Plus after you deposit your check, it can take weeks for the funds to clear. Bitcoin cashouts are done within 24 -48 hours and you have your money. So would you rather wait 2-3 weeks for your funds or 1-2 days? When you are dealing with a goo chunk of change I think being able to cash out quickly is the most important thing.

[kj8210]

Also if you are using a bitcoin book like nitrogensports which I recommend (dont use cloudbet because their limits are disgustingly low, around $300 USD) you can cash out in minutes and as many times as you want in a week or month. My old book, Bookmaker, I could only cash out once a week.

[success27]

I'm just starting to play with Bitcoins. I currently have an account with Coinbase/Circle and am waiting for my instant buy limits to go up. This is what I plan on doing so that I can avoid having my Coinbase/Circle account closed. I also plan on getting payed out via the steps listed below.

Deposit
Step 1. Buy Bitcoins from Coinbase/Circle
Step 2. Transfer to Blockcain wallet.
Step 3. Transfer from Blockchain wallet to an exchange.
Step 4. Sell and Buy Bitcoins on the exchange?
Step 5. Send directly from the exchange to sports book? or should I send it back to Blockchain and then send it to the sports book from there?

Payout

Step 1. Transfer from Sportsbook to Blockchain wallet
Step 2. Blockchain wallet to an exchange.
Step 3. Buy/Sell bitcoins on the exchange.
Step 4. Transfer bitcoins from the exchange to Coinbase/Circle
Step 5. Convert Bitcoins from bitcoins to USD and transfer it back to my bank.

Am I doing this the right way? Any additional steps I should be using?

I'm very new to this so I appreciate your help in advance!

[NCarts]

Just my 2 cents and from personal experience... you can eliminate the steps where an exchange is involved. That's just extra work/"washing". I yet to have a problem with "Circle-->Blockchain-->Sportsbook" and vice versa for payouts. Blockchain being the intermediary is the key. Without that, then you're actually asking for trouble.

[success27]

Just my 2 cents and from personal experience... you can eliminate the steps where an exchange is involved. That's just extra work/"washing". I yet to have a problem with "Circle-->Blockchain-->Sportsbook" and vice versa for payouts. Blockchain being the intermediary is the key. Without that, then you're actually asking for trouble.

Thank you for your feedback!

A couple of posters had mentioned that Coinbase/Circle banned their account even after sending money to blockchain and then to their sports books. However, they said that they immediately would send the funds to their sports books after sending it to blockchain. So maybe I should wait a day or two?

Also, is blockchain the best intermediary wallet? Or should I get an account with Airbitz?

Thanks again!

[TheMoneyShot]

great post but this seems so complicated. why not just request a check?

Some books won't allow you a payout with another form other than BTC.

If you deposit BTC... you must take a payout with BTC. 5Dimes is this way.

Only book I know that you can deposit BTC and take another form of a payout. Heritage Sports.

I wish more books would allow you getting a chk. Much easier.

[raiders72001]

Thank you for your feedback!

A couple of posters had mentioned that Coinbase/Circle banned their account even after sending money to blockchain and then to their sports books. However, they said that they immediately would send the funds to their sports books after sending it to blockchain. So maybe I should wait a day or two?

Also, is blockchain the best intermediary wallet? Or should I get an account with Airbitz?

Thanks again!

You can change your bitcoin address with each transaction at blockchain.info if it isn't being done automatically. Any wallet where you can change your address with each transaction should work as long as transfers aren't immediate. You have to delay. I'm not sure how many hops that Coinbase/Circle are checking along with time delay.

The safest way to do it is Coinbase/Circle to exchange to sportsbook. You don't have to wait to delay the transactions other than waiting for confirmations at the exchange. Many exchanges require 3 confirmations before crediting your account.

Using an exchange also gives you proof of transactions if Coinbase/Circle want proof.

[Ringo]

So with Heritage if I want to request a payout through "bitcoin" I have to tell them the wallet address over the phone?

[HappyHounds]

Ringo, they have a field for you to enter it on the payout screen. You have to confirm a payout password over the phone... if it's your first time, you'll setup a password when they call you

[HappyHounds]

great post but this seems so complicated. why not just request a check?

Just curious, what's complicated about this? No offense, but you link your bank account and you initiate a transfer. It's more simple than going to do a ** or ** transfer at the drug store for a max of $500-1000, no? How do you fund $10,000 to a sportsbook now? (or for that matter, even $2000-3000).. Maybe you don't, but at most sportsbooks if you don't use BitCoin, you can't make substantial deposits quickly. I literally sit in my boxers and click initiate transfer, or I login into my FNBO or Chase website and type in the wire transfer details and it sends.... Wire transfers arrive the same day, so they are SUPER QUICK, most credited within a few hours.

How are you funding your books now? I guarantee it's more complicated, unless you're using a CREDIT CARD and then you're going through all sorts of verification steps. I have ZERO verification at Nitrogen and Heritage---which means I don't have to wait for a check.

Payouts are even more easy. I mean you click payout, enter your bitcoin address, and you'll have your coins from Nitrogen within minutes and from Heritage within the day. Then, if you want them in your bank account you can transfer them to the exchange and you can sell to your bank account and have cash in just days. Also, again if you know how to use Bitcoin you can IMMEDIATELY use your winnings to buy things---like on bestbuy, amazon, playstation, etc... I almost completely shop with bitcoin @ amazon now using giftcards. Win a bet- I can buy me some good stuff as soon as the game ends using those winnings!


Also, you're very limited in check amounts and it takes a long time! I want my money in my account within 1-3 days. That's the whole point of getting away from checks. I also just sit in my boxers and request the money which goes right to my account of choice. I don't have to have a bank hold put on a check, I can do LARGE or TINY amounts (like dollars-with no fees).

So I hope that answered your question as to why. Checks are out-dated.

NITROGEN SPORTS


Traditional
-----------
1. Fund your account using cash at a drug strore ($500-1000 daily max)
2. Wait an hour or so at least usually for books to credit
3. Winnings: Request a check (usually $3000? max)
4. Wait for check to actually arrive (days to weeks)
5. Wait for check to clear at your bank (days to 7 days)

BitCoin
----------------
1. Once you have opened your exchange account, you can instantly purchase bitcoin and you can also purchase unlimited amounts.
***COMPLETE CONTROL OF YOUR CASH/BTClike it's in your wallet in your back pocket and you're at the casino *****
2. Fund your book INSTANTLY with no real min or maximum! except for the limits that your book will take on a wager. Need to bet $1? Need to bet $20,000 tonight? No PROBLEM!
***COMPLETE CONTROL OF YOUR CASH/BTC like it's in your wallet in your back pocket and you're at the casino*****
3. Request a payout - Get that payout instantly or same day.
4. Spend Immediately from your bitcoin wallet
5. If you need cash, sell at exchange and transfer to bank account within 2-3 days or same day using wire transfer.

Hope that makes it a little simpler.

[Ghenghis Kahn]

Lol are you saying requesting checks or using your debit/************ are more complicating? C'mon man. Bitcoin may be convenient for you but it's pain in the ass to load and set up. It isn't neteller. That's for sure. How would you even purchase $10,000 bitcoins?

[raiders72001]

Bitcoins seem very complicated and intimidating until 2-3 transactions. After that, it's very simple.

To withdraw from a bitcoin book, you click withdraw and your money is in your account in a few minutes.

Most of the fiat books available to US players allow bitcoins. The advantage that bitcoin books have is remaining anonymous and not having to produce a driver's license or utility bill.

[Ghenghis Kahn]

i don't doubt once everything is set up, it's easy to use but to make claims like it's easier to use than checks is a straight up lie.

you get a check in couple business days, deposit it in your bank, and it's available. yeah sometimes you have to pay $50 for a $3000 check but how much fees go along with bitcoins when you convert that from a bitcoin site to a bank? is it less than 2%?

having said all that, i do have a coinbase account that i haven't used yet.

[Ringo]

When using an exchange such as circle, If I have a checking account with a debit card linked to it, can I just link the debit card to circle to deposit and withdraw funds rather than linking my bank account?

[Ghenghis Kahn]

Bitcoins seem very complicated and intimidating until 2-3 transactions. After that, it's very simple.

To withdraw from a bitcoin book, you click withdraw and your money is in your account in a few minutes.

Most of the fiat books available to US players allow bitcoins. The advantage that bitcoin books have is remaining anonymous and not having to produce a driver's license or utility bill.

Enter your tax information

All fields are required.

Taxpayer Identification Number SSN
EIN





Under penalty of perjury, I certify that:1. The number shown on this form is my correct tax identification number I agree
I disagree



2. I am a US Citizen or other US person. I agree
I disagree



3. I am not subject to backup withholding. Note: Click "I disagree" only if you have been notified by the IRS that you are subject to backup withholding because you have failed to report all interest and dividends on your tax return.

I agree
I disagree


what is all this just to sign up with itbit? lol nice and anonymous...

[raiders72001]

When using an exchange such as circle, If I have a checking account with a debit card linked to it, can I just link the debit card to circle to deposit and withdraw funds rather than linking my bank account?

yes, you can just link debit card.

[raiders72001]

Enter your tax information

All fields are required.

Taxpayer Identification Number SSN
EIN





Under penalty of perjury, I certify that:1. The number shown on this form is my correct tax identification number I agree
I disagree



2. I am a US Citizen or other US person. I agree
I disagree



3. I am not subject to backup withholding. Note: Click "I disagree" only if you have been notified by the IRS that you are subject to backup withholding because you have failed to report all interest and dividends on your tax return.

I agree
I disagree


what is all this just to sign up with itbit? lol nice and anonymous...

itBit will 1099 some. Better to use something else.

[raiders72001]

but how much fees go along with bitcoins when you convert that from a bitcoin site to a bank? is it less than 2%?

having said all that, i do have a coinbase account that i haven't used yet.

1% at Coinbase. Free at Circle. Exchanges average $15 for a b wire. With local bitcoins it's all over the place depending upon method and a profit can be made.

[Ghenghis Kahn]

thanks raiders. i gotta look through your old posts again.