Horse Racing questions and answers

[Easy-Rider 66]

Hey STR: Just saw a message from HRN and they said R. Dutrow has a horse on the derby trail. Captain Cook just scored in the Withers. By Practical Joke out of an Indian Charlie Mare. Look like he will stay in NY to try and qualify for the big race. Thought I would pass it on. GL to Rick and the connections.

[Madison]

It would be unfair of me to say yes or no without seeing the horse and gauging what I felt were it's needs. While wew don't see this like we did all the time 40 years ago, if this horse is sound, I have no problem with it. What is typically not realized is that during those 7 or 9 days off you see no workouts. This horse most likely got 3 days off after the 1/17 race , jogged the wrong way a day or two or maybe all three and galloped an easy mile once. That's it.

So the question is: is it harder on a horse to work out 3 times and run once a month or train lightly and run 3 times a month?
When I was active, the overwhelming answer among trainers would have been that it is easier on the horse to run 3 times with little in between. Today, I guess it might be the opposite. Both have their critics.
This was the way most horses were trained in the 70,80,90's. I'm not sure there is a right answer Madison.
Hope that helps.

Thx! Just trying to learn. Seemed unusual to my untrained eyes.

[Easy-Rider 66]

THX STR for the good words and the take. Makes sense. As for being scarce lately in the horse racing forum Football season is my time off from the game. Probably hit the ground running again sometime no later than April with the Derby season heating up and the commencement of the Keeneland Spring meet. THX.

[str]

Hey STR: hope thing are good down your way? have you read about the decoupling issue down in FLA. I don't understand too much of what's going on but the Stronach group is threatening to shut down operations at Gulfstream Park if the decoupling is not instituted. Any thoughts on the subject? THX in advance.

The current organization representing horse people drew the ire of many rank-and-file owners and trainers in South Florida when its board said it would not oppose efforts by Gulfstream Park’s owner, The Stronach Group, to seek legislation decoupling, or separating, the Hallandale Beach track’s pari-mutuel permit from its slot machine permit. In other words, decoupling would permit The Stronach Group to end live racing at Gulfstream Park while still operating their slots casino. Under the current law, Gulfstream Park must have live racing for a minimum of 40 days a year to maintain their slots permit. The horsemen's organization board said they agreed to the controversial position out of a need to get Stronach Group's help in securing workers' compensation policies for exercise riders.

The issue of decoupling came to a head during a heated horsemen's meeting on Jan. 15, one week after Gulfstream Park distributed a press release saying the horsemen's organization supported decoupling legislation. At the meeting, according to published reports, Keith Brackpool, an advisor to company owner Belinda Stronach, said the company would commit to live racing into 2028 if decoupling legislation passed. He made no guarantees about the future if the bill does not pass.

At one point during the meeting, which was attended by the horsemen's organization board members, leading trainer Saffie Joseph Jr. asked for anyone to stand up if they supported decoupling. No one stood, according to individuals who attended the meeting.

"This isn't just a Florida issue," Vaccarezza said. "Owners and breeders in Kentucky and New York count on those three or four months of winter racing to get their horses ready for Keeneland and Churchill or Belmont Park and Saratoga. And this affects the agricultural industry because of the hay, feed, straw and everything that racing supports. The damage this could do if Gulfstream closes is enormous."

Just to make my position as clear as possible, let me give you as short an opinion on 1st racing as I can. They are only interested in making money for the family and will destroy anything that tries to get into their path. They are not from this country. They could care less about American horse racing EZ.
That is a fact derived from their previous actions in Md. , what we see in Calif. and now in Fla.

Now that we are clear on that here are a few facts:

They did all they could do to make one terrible decision after another in Maryland, which they recently sold. The state stepped in to buy it and changes will start with the newly built Pimlico in 2026.
At least those terrible decisions cost them money. And plenty of money. IMO, Good.

You see where California racing stands these days. Another gem that 1st racing ( who seemingly would have been better off naming themselves last racing, as that is what is going on wherever they go it seems), ran into the ground and is now needing major help to survive. And now, they turn their attention to Florida where they are demanding that casino and racing days no longer be tied together. Why? So they can run casino only which we all know is a can't lose proposition and say to hell with horse racing, which was what allowed casinos to exist in the first place.
The old adage, " promises made, promises kept", does not apply in these cases.

In the simplest terms, all this in all three states is nothing more than a money grab that will ruin anyone's livelihood that is attached to horse racing in those states. They do not care if you, or anyone associated with horse racing eats tonight, or has a place to sleep. It's all about the money and them grabbing all that they can.

A sad situation EZ. What probably needs to happen, just like in Maryland, the state will most likely need to buy them out and maybe build a new facility or revive an existing old one so that the Canadian based company can sell the land for windfall profit and leave.

I would not worry too much about the end of Florida racing. New York, Kentucky and marquee racing jurisdictions won't allow it to occur. All the best horses from those places head south in the winter to avoid the cold racing tracks and surfaces they need to train on. That will not end. Too much money there EZ.

Just know that this has nothing to do with greedy horsemen and that sort of nonsense. And I think you know that if it did, I would tell you that. This is all about the current ownership and the thirst for more money. Period.

Hope that makes sense EZ. And great to see you back in here man. Don't be so scarce. You are one of the founding posters of this thread.

[str]

Speaking of......
[COLOR=rgba(77, 76, 76, 0.9)]Caldera Breeze Report
[/COLOR]
Caldera worked very strongly this morning at Oaklawn, covering five furlongs in a bullet 1:00.80.
Trainer D. Wayne Lukas told us afterwards that Caldera couldn’t have breezed any better. As you’ll see in the accompanying clip, he pulls away from his workmate pretty easily.
Your colt’s next target will be the $400K Sunland Derby at Sunland Park on Sunday, Feb. 16. Note that this race will be contested over 1 1/16 miles again this year (it was run at 1 1/8 miles prior to last year).
Between the Sunland Derby, G2 Risen Star S. at Fair Grounds and G2 Rebel S. at Oaklawn, the Sunland race will almost certainly be the easiest of the three spots. Considering Caldera is just coming off a maiden win, this will give him a chance to test deeper waters without jumping all the way in first time against winners. We’ll also be able to get last-out jockey Rafael Bejarano in this spot (he’s committed to riding Southwest winner Speed King in the Rebel, no surprise) and the timing—a week earlier than the Rebel—will allow us a bit more wiggle room as we plot out subsequent races on the Derby trail. The Risen Star, in addition to likely coming up tough, will be run over 1 1/8 miles—something Caldera should eventually relish, but he’d probably benefit from another race for foundation before trying that trip.
Click here to view nominations for the Sunland Derby, though note that most connections who have horses with Triple Crown aspirations tend to be pretty liberal with their nominations, so the nominations won’t tell us much about the final field. Caldera was also nominated to the Triple Crown before the deadline this past Monday.
Another son of Liam’s Map, Burnham Square, was an impressive winner of yesterday’s G2 Holy Bull S. at Gulfstream—hopefully we can add to the sire’s success in a couple of weeks.

https://cdnb-media.myracehorse.com/blog/video/VIDEO20250202091105_1738519374885/MP4/VIDEO20250202091105_1738519374885.mp4

makes a bunch of sense to me..hit an easier field than you would at the major tracks for the first try against winners..take a purse hit but worth it imo


.

Makes perfect sense to me as well. IMO much more important to build with smaller steps and lesser purses in the beginning. A solid mindset means so much . I like it !

[str]

[COLOR=rgba(77, 76, 76, 0.9)]Straight No Chaser Workout Report[/COLOR]

Your Eclipse champion Straight No Chaser blazed through another head-turning workout this morning at Santa Anita, covering five furlongs in a best-of-72 :59.20. He continues to train exceptionally well and we couldn’t ask for more than he’s been showing us of late. Be sure to watch the second video for all of trainer Dan Blacker’s thoughts on the breeze as well as more detail about the plan between now and the G2 Riyadh Dirt Sprint in three weeks.https://cdnb-media.myracehorse.com/b...8443232861.mp4

https://cdnb-media.myracehorse.com/blog/video/IMG3120_1738443233015/MP4/IMG3120_1738443233015.mp4

Thanks Batt. Good luck !

[str]

Glad you enjoy it! Just showing a different side of the game that I never had much access to..... so I figured I would post for others to enjoy.

I actually have 3 other mares that are part of the partnership ready to foal.... and will be bred back to STG....

Nice. Going to roll the dice with your boy. Heck, why not.

[Easy-Rider 66]

The issue of decoupling came to a head during a heated horsemen's meeting on Jan. 15, one week after Gulfstream Park distributed a press release saying the horsemen's organization supported decoupling legislation. At the meeting, according to published reports, Keith Brackpool, an advisor to company owner Belinda Stronach, said the company would commit to live racing into 2028 if decoupling legislation passed. He made no guarantees about the future if the bill does not pass.

At one point during the meeting, which was attended by the horsemen's organization board members, leading trainer Saffie Joseph Jr. asked for anyone to stand up if they supported decoupling. No one stood, according to individuals who attended the meeting.

"This isn't just a Florida issue," Vaccarezza said. "Owners and breeders in Kentucky and New York count on those three or four months of winter racing to get their horses ready for Keeneland and Churchill or Belmont Park and Saratoga. And this affects the agricultural industry because of the hay, feed, straw and everything that racing supports. The damage this could do if Gulfstream closes is enormous."

[Easy-Rider 66]

The current organization representing horse people drew the ire of many rank-and-file owners and trainers in South Florida when its board said it would not oppose efforts by Gulfstream Park’s owner, The Stronach Group, to seek legislation decoupling, or separating, the Hallandale Beach track’s pari-mutuel permit from its slot machine permit. In other words, decoupling would permit The Stronach Group to end live racing at Gulfstream Park while still operating their slots casino. Under the current law, Gulfstream Park must have live racing for a minimum of 40 days a year to maintain their slots permit. The horsemen's organization board said they agreed to the controversial position out of a need to get Stronach Group's help in securing workers' compensation policies for exercise riders.

[Easy-Rider 66]

Hey STR: hope thing are good down your way? have you read about the decoupling issue down in FLA. I don't understand too much of what's going on but the Stronach group is threatening to shut down operations at Gulfstream Park if the decoupling is not instituted. Any thoughts on the subject? THX in advance.

[batt33]

makes a bunch of sense to me..hit an easier field than you would at the major tracks for the first try against winners..take a purse hit but worth it imo


.

I agree 100%!

[batt33]

Something you don't see everyday......an "Into Mischief" QH,=. The breeder was the owner at one time.



Tesio

Own: Moya Juan H Or Flores Jose5/1 Blue, White "jaf" On Front And Back, White Diamonds OnMendez CruzB. g. 3Sire : Into Mischief (Harlan's Holiday) $250,000Dam: Jesst a Dream (Mr Jess Perry)


Brdr: Reginald R Rasner (CA)Trnr: Flores Jose ALife: 8 0 - 2 - 1 $5,5992024 8 0 - 2 - 1 $5,599L 126 2023 0 0 - 0 - 0 $0

[str]

AQ R7 #4 JJ's Joker. Potts barn.

This was in my stable a year or so ago. Decent runner. Always try's.

3rd race in 21 days. 1/17, 1/24, 2/2.

Str, is this fair to the horse??

It would be unfair of me to say yes or no without seeing the horse and gauging what I felt were it's needs. While wew don't see this like we did all the time 40 years ago, if this horse is sound, I have no problem with it. What is typically not realized is that during those 7 or 9 days off you see no workouts. This horse most likely got 3 days off after the 1/17 race , jogged the wrong way a day or two or maybe all three and galloped an easy mile once. That's it.

So the question is: is it harder on a horse to work out 3 times and run once a month or train lightly and run 3 times a month?
When I was active, the overwhelming answer among trainers would have been that it is easier on the horse to run 3 times with little in between. Today, I guess it might be the opposite. Both have their critics.
This was the way most horses were trained in the 70,80,90's. I'm not sure there is a right answer Madison.
Hope that helps.

[JBEX]

Speaking of......
[COLOR=rgba(77, 76, 76, 0.9)]Caldera Breeze Report
[/COLOR]
Caldera worked very strongly this morning at Oaklawn, covering five furlongs in a bullet 1:00.80.
Trainer D. Wayne Lukas told us afterwards that Caldera couldn’t have breezed any better. As you’ll see in the accompanying clip, he pulls away from his workmate pretty easily.
Your colt’s next target will be the $400K Sunland Derby at Sunland Park on Sunday, Feb. 16. Note that this race will be contested over 1 1/16 miles again this year (it was run at 1 1/8 miles prior to last year).
Between the Sunland Derby, G2 Risen Star S. at Fair Grounds and G2 Rebel S. at Oaklawn, the Sunland race will almost certainly be the easiest of the three spots. Considering Caldera is just coming off a maiden win, this will give him a chance to test deeper waters without jumping all the way in first time against winners. We’ll also be able to get last-out jockey Rafael Bejarano in this spot (he’s committed to riding Southwest winner Speed King in the Rebel, no surprise) and the timing—a week earlier than the Rebel—will allow us a bit more wiggle room as we plot out subsequent races on the Derby trail. The Risen Star, in addition to likely coming up tough, will be run over 1 1/8 miles—something Caldera should eventually relish, but he’d probably benefit from another race for foundation before trying that trip.
Click here to view nominations for the Sunland Derby, though note that most connections who have horses with Triple Crown aspirations tend to be pretty liberal with their nominations, so the nominations won’t tell us much about the final field. Caldera was also nominated to the Triple Crown before the deadline this past Monday.
Another son of Liam’s Map, Burnham Square, was an impressive winner of yesterday’s G2 Holy Bull S. at Gulfstream—hopefully we can add to the sire’s success in a couple of weeks.

https://cdnb-media.myracehorse.com/blog/video/VIDEO20250202091105_1738519374885/MP4/VIDEO20250202091105_1738519374885.mp4

makes a bunch of sense to me..hit an easier field than you would at the major tracks for the first try against winners..take a purse hit but worth it imo


.

[JBEX]

It can be difficult for a sprinter influence to get much more than a mile or 1 & 1/16. Not always but as a rule of thumb. They are all a little different. So cannot compare that way but overall production and percentage better than expected would be fair.
The better mare thing will be fun to watch won't it? I can't wait to see that.

yes it will be interesting for sure and especially the 2027 newbies whose breeders shelled out $25k ..have to think when they spend that much more that there will be more of a lean to get a route horse..think he'll do well and maybe by 2030 he'll be a $40-50k stallion

[Madison]

Not sure I've seen this one before

AQ R7 #4 JJ's Joker. Potts barn.

This was in my stable a year or so ago. Decent runner. Always try's.

3rd race in 21 days. 1/17, 1/24, 2/2.

Str, is this fair to the horse??

[batt33]

yes nice effort batt ..probably go to the fountain of youth in march and looks like extra distance down the road might not be a problem..also another reason to root for caldera next out !




.

Speaking of......
[COLOR=rgba(77, 76, 76, 0.9)]Caldera Breeze Report
[/COLOR]
Caldera worked very strongly this morning at Oaklawn, covering five furlongs in a bullet 1:00.80.
Trainer D. Wayne Lukas told us afterwards that Caldera couldn’t have breezed any better. As you’ll see in the accompanying clip, he pulls away from his workmate pretty easily.
Your colt’s next target will be the $400K Sunland Derby at Sunland Park on Sunday, Feb. 16. Note that this race will be contested over 1 1/16 miles again this year (it was run at 1 1/8 miles prior to last year).
Between the Sunland Derby, G2 Risen Star S. at Fair Grounds and G2 Rebel S. at Oaklawn, the Sunland race will almost certainly be the easiest of the three spots. Considering Caldera is just coming off a maiden win, this will give him a chance to test deeper waters without jumping all the way in first time against winners. We’ll also be able to get last-out jockey Rafael Bejarano in this spot (he’s committed to riding Southwest winner Speed King in the Rebel, no surprise) and the timing—a week earlier than the Rebel—will allow us a bit more wiggle room as we plot out subsequent races on the Derby trail. The Risen Star, in addition to likely coming up tough, will be run over 1 1/8 miles—something Caldera should eventually relish, but he’d probably benefit from another race for foundation before trying that trip.
Click here to view nominations for the Sunland Derby, though note that most connections who have horses with Triple Crown aspirations tend to be pretty liberal with their nominations, so the nominations won’t tell us much about the final field. Caldera was also nominated to the Triple Crown before the deadline this past Monday.
Another son of Liam’s Map, Burnham Square, was an impressive winner of yesterday’s G2 Holy Bull S. at Gulfstream—hopefully we can add to the sire’s success in a couple of weeks.

https://cdnb-media.myracehorse.com/blog/video/VIDEO20250202091105_1738519374885/MP4/VIDEO20250202091105_1738519374885.mp4

[str]

LM is 3 years older and off the top much more capable of getting distance horses..it will be interesting to see what AM does with better mares ..possibly get more distance runners..not that this is a contest but in both cases it's nice to see them perform well,at least in our opinions,at their set fees
..even the coming class of 2yo's for AM will still be for the $7500 fee i believe ..LM many times that so obviously he gets better quality mares to breed to

It can be difficult for a sprinter influence to get much more than a mile or 1 & 1/16. Not always but as a rule of thumb. They are all a little different. So cannot compare that way but overall production and percentage better than expected would be fair.
The better mare thing will be fun to watch won't it? I can't wait to see that.

[JBEX]

worth mentioning liam's map and arrogate (seize the grey) are both by unbridled's song

[JBEX]

LM is 3 years older and off the top much more capable of getting distance horses..it will be interesting to see what AM does with better mares ..possibly get more distance runners..not that this is a contest but in both cases it's nice to see them perform well,at least in our opinions,at their set fees
..even the coming class of 2yo's for AM will still be for the $7500 fee i believe ..LM many times that so obviously he gets better quality mares to breed to

no comparison in their sires (LM much better) and I think with getting solid distance horses that might matter