Hey scumbag you made some good points but are still missing the hugest piece to the puzzle bro.! The elites who are running the show give us peons the choice between chocolate milk and white milk. They don't care if white milk or chocolate milk gets elected. It's all theatre people! Wake the penetrate up! Follow the $ and see who's printing the $! That's where you'll find the answers. No penetrating Bernie Sanders, Donald Trump or any other Republican or Democrat will change this. There the problem!! For starters quit voting for Republicans and Democrats if you want to make a change!!!
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Nope, you're up, I showed you mine. Show me yours.......I need a good laugh.Comment -
People seriously think a Socialist should be President. Unbelievable...Comment -
He wants everyone on welfare driving golf carts. And your grand kids will be paying off his debts. We need someone real for a change.Comment -
Who pays you? The state, federal? Can you name the owner of the company you work for? You can't, because
you work for the GOVT! Gee wiz, imagine that, a govt UNION job!Comment -
No reason to give away my first name especially with muldoon around, he might actually find my rap sheet from when I was 8.
Remember I challenged you months ago to go one day without being wrong... still waiting. Of course, back then I didn't know you based your bs on your "my truths" that have no real bearing whatsoever in the real world.Last edited by brooks85; 09-28-15, 08:38 PM.Comment -
OK Brooksy. Yeah, you have your own business where you belong to a union..........okey dokey.
You've heard of editorials right? You know, the opinion of the writer, where no real facts need to be displayed?
Right or wrong, disagree or agree, this forum does not have to be factual. If the opposing writer wants to be factual
against the writer of his "editorial", he has the right to provide factual material, so long as that "factual material"
isn't written by some other writer doing an "un factful opinion" editorial.
You know the drill, prove me wrong.Comment -
lol, not everyone is an underachiever like you rkelly. Some of us are capable of doing more than one thing. We have that benefit because we exercised the one muscle that counts.
This forum will be factual with me around. Sorry if you thought you were going to be able to spread your sheep feed to others but not going to happen. I don't post on any other forums so feel free to go join one, I won't be there. It will be like the land of Falsehood for you. You can say all the bs, lies and "my truths" you want just like a child and I won't be there to make you look stupid; even though you still be "stupid." Can you not understand that basic concept?Comment -
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The best is you have intelligent black and hispanic people who have rightfully turned on Obama and the democrats because they realize financial slavery is all the have to offer yet it is white people who still defend Obama. Some even go far enough to insinuate the reason white conservatives don't like him is because he is "black".... I guess the intelligent black people are racist too? lolComment -
Haven't seen any yet. All I see is word play. You are all knowing, yet show nothing. It's ok, you can give your complete explanations an any subject, in your own words, you chose. If you get blasted, that's what happens. No worse than what you do to me.
No, you won't run me off, I'll stay just to piss you off......that's how I roll.Comment -
liar or memory loss? hmm
Governments DO NOT create jobs
Unions and the government DID NOT give us the work week.
The auto bailout was a huge mistake and solely the UAW's fault.
Obama will be known as a one of the worst presidents in the country's history under quantifiable measures.
Obamacare was a ponzi scheme which is why it will not last.
Need anymore refreshing?Last edited by brooks85; 09-29-15, 11:25 AM.Comment -
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Why must you argue with me on this? You, yourself are getting paid by the state or federal which I pay for.
Is that your word play? If it is, I didn't create your job, the govt did.
There are over 21m state and govt employees. http://factfinder.census.gov/faces/t...xhtml?src=bkmkComment -
its not governments job to create jobs. All government jobs are paid for by the private sector. Government's job is to protect it's people, look after the needy (not the clueless) and to help create an environment for the people to prosper and get out of the way (not invest in things like Solyndra).Comment -
don't worry, I have no doubt you'll forget or your ego will bury it and we can start all over again.
Governments DO NOT create jobs
Unions and the government DID NOT give us the work week.
The auto bailout was a huge mistake and solely the UAW's fault.
Obama will be known as a one of the worst presidents in the country's history under quantifiable measures.
Obamacare was a ponzi scheme which is why it will not last.Comment -
you penetrating idiot!Unions and the government DID NOT give us the work week.
<header class="article__header" style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-stretch: inherit; line-height: 36px; font-family: Georgia, 'Times New Roman', Times, serif; font-size: 24px; vertical-align: baseline; color: rgb(51, 51, 51);">Does the 8-hour day and the 40-hour week come from Henry Ford, or labor unions?
By Louis Jacobson on Wednesday, September 9th, 2015 at 3:54 p.m.
<figure class="art-block" style="margin: 0px 0px 2em; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; font-weight: inherit; font-stretch: inherit; line-height: inherit; font-family: inherit; vertical-align: baseline;">
<figcaption class="art-block__caption" style="margin: 1em 0px 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: italic; font-variant: inherit; font-weight: inherit; font-stretch: inherit; line-height: inherit; font-family: inherit; font-size: 0.845em; vertical-align: baseline; color: rgb(126, 126, 126);">Employees leaving the Ford Motor Co. factory in Detroit, circa 1916. (Library of Congress)</figcaption></figure></header><figure class="art-block" style="margin: 0px 0px 2em; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; font-weight: inherit; font-stretch: inherit; line-height: inherit; font-family: inherit; vertical-align: baseline;">
<figcaption class="art-block__caption" style="margin: 1em 0px 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: italic; font-variant: inherit; font-weight: inherit; font-stretch: inherit; line-height: inherit; font-family: inherit; font-size: 0.845em; vertical-align: baseline; color: rgb(126, 126, 126);">A reader asked us to check this graphic circulating on the Internet over Labor Day 2015.</figcaption></figure><figure class="art-block" style="margin: 0px 0px 2em; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: inherit; font-variant: inherit; font-weight: inherit; font-stretch: inherit; line-height: inherit; font-family: inherit; vertical-align: baseline;">
<figcaption class="art-block__caption" style="margin: 1em 0px 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-style: italic; font-variant: inherit; font-weight: inherit; font-stretch: inherit; line-height: inherit; font-family: inherit; font-size: 0.845em; vertical-align: baseline; color: rgb(126, 126, 126);">"The Anarchist Riot in Chicago - A Dynamite Bomb exploding among the police," from Harper's Weekly, May 15, 1886. (Library of Congress)</figcaption></figure>
On Labor Day weekend, it’s not unusual to see claims about unions circulating on social media -- both favorable and unfavorable.
A shareable graphic critical of organized labor caught the eye of a PolitiFact reader, who decided to forward it to us for a fact-check. The viral image said:
Unions did not create:
--Weekends
--8-hour work days
--A "living wage" (doubled worker's pay from $2.34/hr to $5/hr)
--Five-day, 40-hour work weeks
Henry Ford did in 1926 to attract better workers from his competitors for his automobile plant. Capitalism & competition creates higher wages & better working conditions. #HappyLaborDay.
We wondered whether it was correct that Henry Ford, rather than unions, should get credit for creating the eight-hour work day and the 40-hour work week.
A long struggle
In the United States, a few limited eight-hour-day laws were on the books shortly after the Civil War. One, in Illinois, was passed in 1867, followed in 1868 by a law covering certain classes of federal workers. But neither law was well-enforced, and in most sectors, working hours of 10 to 12 hours were common. So a reduction in the work week became a leading issue for the nascent labor movement.
The issue came to a head in 1884, after the Federation of Organized Trades and Labor Unions -- a predecessor of today’s AFL-CIO -- called for all workers to have eight-hour days by May 1, 1886. When that deadline wasn’t met, labor leaders upped the ante by calling for demonstrations. In Chicago, peaceful marches morphed into violence, with an explosion marring a rally at Haymarket Square on May 4, 1886, leaving seven police officers and four workers dead. Subsequent trials, executions and clemencies for the accused made the eight-hour week a top issue nationally and internationally.
All of this occurred decades before Ford founded his company in 1903.
Ford’s move
In 1914, at a time when most workers still lacked a guarantee of eight-hour days, the Ford Motor Co. attracted notice for instituting eight-hour shifts and raising wages in the manner the graphic indicates. (For many Ford workers, the work week remained six days.)
The company’s move -- made a dozen years earlier than the graphic said -- was significant, labor historians say. But they add that it’s worth noting some caveats. For instance, Ford’s " ‘sociological department’ had to inspect a worker’s home to make sure they ‘deserved’ the $5 first," said Ileen A. DeVault, a professor of labor relations, law and history at Cornell University.
In addition, Ford’s policy wasn’t law, so it wasn’t guaranteed to last indefinitely, even for those who qualified for it.
"It was a unilaterally provided benefit at the discretion of the employer and could be yanked away whenever the cost exceeded profits," said Robert Bruno, a professor with the University of Illinois School of Labor and Employment Relations. Companies that operated this way, Bruno said, often revoked these policies when the Great Depression hit.
The endgame
Ford’s initiative was not widely copied overnight. In 1916, the federal government passed an act to require an eight-hour day and overtime pay for railroad workers, but most workers still didn’t have those protections, and working hours remained a hotly contested issue. "Demands for the five-day week began to proliferate in 1919, a year in which 4 million American workers went out on strike," said Priscilla Murolo, a professor of history at Sarah Lawrence College. "That was about 20 percent of the industrial labor force."
It took President Franklin D. Roosevelt’s signing of the Fair Labor Standards Act in 1938 for all workers to see limits on working hours -- initially 44 hours a week, then phased to 42 and eventually 40 by 1940. "When the FLSA was passed in 1938, Saturday working hours were still common," DeVault said. "Saturday noon was the most frequent ‘payday’ time."
Given this history, Ford is best described as an early adopter of today’s familiar working hours, experts said.
"That happened more than 60 years after workers, through their unions, began organizing for an eight-hour day in the 1860s," said David Bensman, a professor at Rutgers University's School of Management and Labor Relations. "When Ford adopted the eight-hour day for his factory, he was responding to a working force that had been demanding the eight-hour day for a long time."
Other experts agreed that labor unions, rather than Ford, deserve the primary credit for today’s working-hour schedule -- including Matt Anderson, curator of transportation at the Henry Ford museum in Dearborn, Mich.
"Henry Ford was an early proponent of the five-day week, but the American Federation of Labor fought for it to be adopted more widely via contract negotiations," Anderson said. "Unions absolutely deserve much credit for the reform."
Our ruling
A viral image said that Henry Ford, not unions, created the eight-hour work day and the five-day work week.
Ford does deserve credit for adopting shorter working shifts, but he was hardly the first employer to do this, and the now-standard working schedule did not become federal law -- and thus a right for all workers -- until almost a quarter-century after Ford’s move. Meanwhile, experts said, unions do deserve credit for keeping the working-hours issue alive, at significant personal sacrifice, for 70 years.
The claim contains some element of truth but ignores critical facts that would give a different impression, so we rate it Mostly False.Comment -
Sanders: Universal Healthcare and Free College Aren’t Radical Ideas, They Are ‘Human Rights’
Bernie Sanders: "We need the idealism and the energy and the intelligence of millions of young people to join us in the fight to make America the kind of country we know it must become."
The United States still has two major parties. But one of them is no longer interested actually in governing. And we’re dealing with the consequencesComment -
you're an idiot and so is whoever wrote that which is why if you objectively read it, it only proves the statement it is analyzing outside of it being the wrong date of 1926 lol. Very similar to when they tried to look at the claim about how much money green energy received under obama compared to oil. They said it was false even though they proved it true. Same thing here exactly lol, you're not even wise enough to realize the fact you "educate" yourself with this crap makes you look stupid but you proudly display it anyways ha
No one said henry was the first employer to do it in the world, that is why anyone who actually knows the history knows he took the idea from Europe and improved it. He was first for a large company in this country though which was history rightfully credits him for bring it to the USA. The fact is the idea already existed and the government didn't believe in it. It wasn't until Ford improved the idea and brought it to USA that it was adopted. These are facts, your bs will not change this.
Our ruling
A viral image said that Henry Ford, not unions, created the eight-hour work day and the five-day work week.
Ford does deserve credit for adopting shorter working shifts, but he was hardly the first employer to do this, and the now-standard working schedule did not become federal law -- and thus a right for all workers -- until almost a quarter-century after Ford’s move. Meanwhile, experts said, unions do deserve credit for keeping the working-hours issue alive, at significant personal sacrifice, for 70 years.
Last edited by brooks85; 09-29-15, 07:13 PM.Comment -
I don't always agree with what a particular party stands for on every friggen issue. That's idiotic. My views are almost always inline with a fiscal conservative mindset. I believe in responsible government and even though we all know they can't run a country exactly like an actual business, they should be close to it. If they do, there will be plenty of money to help those that are in need and that includes an inexpensive healthcare system (like in Canada. Yes we know its not perfect) and an inexpensive education system passed grade 12.
I have always believed that.Comment -
free healthcare is an illogical idea which is why countries that have it have inferior healthcare compared to ours when it comes to actually having medical problems. Their system works just don't have any serious medical problem and you're golden.
And also, just so you don't keep sounding moronic(you know I'm always trying to help you here intellectually, remember I'm the guy that broke your reality on Obama; you still haven't thanked me for that
) trump's plan is nothing like single payer in the traditional sense. Nothing in any way, and you proves you should really take note in what dwight said "I don't always agree with what a particular party stands for on every friggen issue. That's idiotic."
Last edited by brooks85; 09-29-15, 07:35 PM.Comment -
whatever the right healthcare plan is, it should be a plan that both sides of the aisle agree with. Whoever the president is and whoever controls the house or senate. They should do their job as entrusted by the citizens who elected them. They should leave chambers united and praising each each for designing a plan that is good for the whole country. Rarely is any plan of any type perfect initially but surely one can be designed that doesn't require the POTUS to have to bribe his own party to vote to pass it.
So many people just give a pass to incompetence because of party affiliation. When did it become a government that spends more energy blaming the other guys than actually doing the work they are elected/paid to do? Its sad to me.Comment -
that is the key and doesn't even touch on the bs supreme court rulings to save it lol
It is still crazy when you think about how many democrats don't comprehend how the bill was passed and even worse are the sheep who do but still support it because they "toe strict party lines."Comment -
dwight, you think trump will find one fellow republican to support his single-payer plan?
they wouldn't even support ACA (which was a huge giveaway to for-profit insurers). on what planet are they going to support telling the insurance industry to penetrate off, and then turn over their job the the government?Comment -
again, you're welcome for that enlightening. Remember how moronic you sounded supporting it? Well, here I am to tell you you're doing it again. The didn't support ACA for the same reason they abandoned their counter to hillarycare; because it doesn't work. You're sheepish brain won't let you see the facts, it is the rkelly "my truths" way for you.
saying it over and over isn't going to make it true sheepy. Of course, you are mr "my truths."Last edited by brooks85; 09-29-15, 08:53 PM.Comment
