Andre Dawson - HOF

TobiasFunke · 01-06-10, 02:07 PM

Willie when will Blylevin get in????

Wrigley · 01-06-10, 02:13 PM

Originally posted by TobiasFunke

Willie when will Blylevin get in????

Blyleven 5 votes short

405 votes needed for election

Andre Dawson 420 (77.9%), Bert Blyleven 400 (74.2%), Roberto Alomar 397 (73.7%), Jack Morris 282 (52.3%), Barry Larkin 278 (51.6%), Lee Smith 255 (47.3%), Edgar Martinez 195 (36.2%), Tim Raines 164 (30.4%), Mark McGwire 128 (23.7%), Alan Trammell 121 (22.4%), Fred McGriff 116 (21.5%), Don Mattingly 87 (16.1%), Dave Parker 82 (15.2%), Dale Murphy 63 (11.7%), Harold Baines 33 (6.1%), Andres Galarraga 22 (4.1%), Robin Ventura 7 (1.3%), Ellis Burks 2 (0.4%), Eric Karros 2 (0.4%), Kevin Appier 1 (0.2%), Pat Hentgen 1 (0.2%), David Segui 1 (0.2%), Mike Jackson 0, Ray Lankford 0, Shane Reynolds 0, Todd Zeile 0

Regul8er · 01-06-10, 02:19 PM

The thing that kills me is the moronic writers that gave votes to Burks, Karros, Appier, Hentgen, Segui. I'd like to know of those 7 votes, how many didn't give a nod to Blyleven???? Kills me

seaborneq · 01-06-10, 02:19 PM

I hope they let those bad knees have their own special bust, because if had two good ones we would be talking about Hawk in the same breath as Mantle, Joltin Joe, and the Babe.

seaborneq · 01-06-10, 02:20 PM

Originally posted by Wrigley

Blyleven 5 votes short

405 votes needed for election

Andre Dawson 420 (77.9%), Bert Blyleven 400 (74.2%), Roberto Alomar 397 (73.7%), Jack Morris 282 (52.3%), Barry Larkin 278 (51.6%), Lee Smith 255 (47.3%), Edgar Martinez 195 (36.2%), Tim Raines 164 (30.4%), Mark McGwire 128 (23.7%), Alan Trammell 121 (22.4%), Fred McGriff 116 (21.5%), Don Mattingly 87 (16.1%), Dave Parker 82 (15.2%), Dale Murphy 63 (11.7%), Harold Baines 33 (6.1%), Andres Galarraga 22 (4.1%), Robin Ventura 7 (1.3%), Ellis Burks 2 (0.4%), Eric Karros 2 (0.4%), Kevin Appier 1 (0.2%), Pat Hentgen 1 (0.2%), David Segui 1 (0.2%), Mike Jackson 0, Ray Lankford 0, Shane Reynolds 0, Todd Zeile 0

Take the votes away from whoever voted for David Segui. I hope it was the Balco man or his brother.

Carseller4 · 01-06-10, 02:24 PM

Andre Dawson was a great choice! Would have liked to have seen Lee Smith get a few more votes.

TobiasFunke · 01-06-10, 02:25 PM

Originally posted by Wrigley

Blyleven 5 votes short

405 votes needed for election

Andre Dawson 420 (77.9%), Bert Blyleven 400 (74.2%), Roberto Alomar 397 (73.7%), Jack Morris 282 (52.3%), Barry Larkin 278 (51.6%), Lee Smith 255 (47.3%), Edgar Martinez 195 (36.2%), Tim Raines 164 (30.4%), Mark McGwire 128 (23.7%), Alan Trammell 121 (22.4%), Fred McGriff 116 (21.5%), Don Mattingly 87 (16.1%), Dave Parker 82 (15.2%), Dale Murphy 63 (11.7%), Harold Baines 33 (6.1%), Andres Galarraga 22 (4.1%), Robin Ventura 7 (1.3%), Ellis Burks 2 (0.4%), Eric Karros 2 (0.4%), Kevin Appier 1 (0.2%), Pat Hentgen 1 (0.2%), David Segui 1 (0.2%), Mike Jackson 0, Ray Lankford 0, Shane Reynolds 0, Todd Zeile 0

wow...unbelievable.

tullamore · 01-06-10, 02:31 PM

Alomar will get in, I think some writers just don't vote for you on the first time. You are either a HOF or not. I am Jim Rice fan, but what changed over those 15 years. I just dont understand.

Regul8er · 01-06-10, 02:32 PM

I have no problem with the Hawk getting in, but there is no WAY Dawson should have received more votes then Robby Alomar.
Alomar had a more impressive career in my opinion, and was the elite 2nd basemen for a solid decade.

Think the "spitting" episode had something to do with Alomar being 8 votes short?

seaborneq · 01-06-10, 02:55 PM

Originally posted by Regul8er

I have no problem with the Hawk getting in, but there is no WAY Dawson should have received more votes then Robby Alomar.
Alomar had a more impressive career in my opinion, and was the elite 2nd basemen for a solid decade.

Think the "spitting" episode had something to do with Alomar being 8 votes short?

That's how many remember him most. Spitting and acting Gay.

pattymayo · 01-06-10, 03:00 PM

LOL I'd like to meet the ONE guy who voted for David Segui. Are you kidding I should get into the HOF before him

Chi_archie · 01-06-10, 03:20 PM

Andre Dawson had that one great great great year after the blank check.... but otherwise he didn't really have any OUTSTANDING years. mostly slightly above avg and "good" years

but I guess if you put Jim Rice in you put Dawson in.

BurtRapp · 01-06-10, 04:07 PM

Dawson had his kness drained every week. he was tough as nails. I wouldn't want to see him in a dark alley

Doc JS · 01-06-10, 05:27 PM

Glad to see the Hawk get in...

Sorry to see Bert not get in...

Yes, I think the writers were punishing Alomar for the spitting incident...

Doc

Wheell · 01-06-10, 05:39 PM

Originally posted by Regul8er

The thing that kills me is the moronic writers that gave votes to Burks, Karros, Appier, Hentgen, Segui. I'd like to know of those 7 votes, how many didn't give a nod to Blyleven???? Kills me

It is possible that every person who voted for the players you listed also voted for Blyleven.

Jay Mariotti voted for no one.

G's pks · 01-06-10, 06:28 PM

Dawson great choice!

The HOFF · 01-06-10, 06:31 PM

Even as a Minnesota guy I don't think Blyleven should get in. His whining about it and then campaigning for it only makes it worse.

Jasonal_98 · 01-06-10, 06:32 PM

I remember seeing Dawson play for the Cubs against Montreal. The pitcher slipped off the mound and threw an underhand softball to the Hawk. I think the ball landed last week.

Tough guy, and thrilled to see him get in.

jjgold · 01-06-10, 07:24 PM

He was good but a borderline hall of famer.

ClydeFontaine · 01-06-10, 07:27 PM

Mike Jackson was robbed. Guy was the King of Pop, died this year, and played for Georgetown in the early 80s.

ClydeFontaine · 01-06-10, 07:28 PM

I wonder if my Kevin Appier rated rookie card collectionmwent up today. maybe I could sell it to the guy who voted for him.

BestPlay2day · 01-06-10, 07:35 PM

As a Twins fan, I thought this might be the year when Blyleven would get in. Alomar should of been in, but that spitting incident plus there are stupid writers that don't vote for 1st time on the ballet.

Chi_archie · 01-06-10, 07:40 PM

I remember when Eric Show hit Dawson in the face and almost got killed by the Hawk

daneblazer · 01-06-10, 08:08 PM

so only one person gets in this year from votes? dumb

cobra_king · 01-06-10, 08:29 PM

Alomar should be in. The two reasons he didn't get in display the total ignorance of the people who did the voting. The spitting incident should not play a factor at all. First of all, if John Hirshbeck can forgive Alomar and they can now become friends and work for the umpires charity together, then the writers should get off their high horse on this one. Secondly, any person who doesn't vote for someone because it's their "first time on the ballot", should immediately have their voting rights removed. Sad state of affairs this voting paternity is.

THE HITMAN · 01-06-10, 08:42 PM

Alomar just missed by a spit. Don't think Dawsonis worthy (man, the hall is getting cheaper & cheaper each year), but I got 1/2 dozen balls signed by him when he was a Marlin, so that''s OK.

pattymayo · 01-07-10, 03:11 AM

Dawson never won anything, had 1 monster season and was terrible in the postseason..... ehhhhhh

Shortstop · 01-07-10, 03:39 AM

It's unreal that some of these players are even on the ballot!

Shortstop · 01-07-10, 03:41 AM

Congrats to Andre Dawson! He is deserving in my opinion!

Bigmikesm · 01-07-10, 03:59 AM

Eric Karros and David Segui got some votes? Now that's messed up. How are they even on the ballot?

Willie Bee · 01-07-10, 07:59 AM

Originally posted by cobra_king

Alomar should be in. The two reasons he didn't get in display the total ignorance of the people who did the voting. The spitting incident should not play a factor at all. First of all, if John Hirshbeck can forgive Alomar and they can now become friends and work for the umpires charity together, then the writers should get off their high horse on this one. Secondly, any person who doesn't vote for someone because it's their "first time on the ballot", should immediately have their voting rights removed. Sad state of affairs this voting paternity is.

Disagree with you about Hirschbeck forgiving Alomar. That is between the two of them and should have no bearing on Alomar's Hall of Fame status. A player should be elected for his status as one of the game's elite on the field, and nothing else.

Totally agree with you on the 'first time on the ballot' bit. Others have pointed that out in this thread as well, and I've simply never understood that mentality. The ONLY reason you don't vote for someone would be due to the limit of only being able to vote for 10 players max. If there were 11, 12 or more players you wanted to vote for and could only vote for 10, that's the only time I would understand the 'first time on ballot' part.

It is indeed a sad state of affairs. I've met a few of the BBWAA members along the way and given each of them a tongue lashing for their little club. If and when you meet a BBWAA member, ask them to justify why ANY writer could leave players like Willie Mays, Mickey Mantle and Warren Spahn off their ballot. Then ask them to explain how in the hell it took three ballots to get Joe DiMaggio elected.

BobbyBaseballs · 01-07-10, 03:06 PM

Funny I was just typing out the OBVIOUS reason alomar gets a one year penalty then caught the post above me here. Pete Rose is banned for his actions of wagering on his games........It's the same situation.....You are expected to be a professional at all times, and if not should pay for your actions. In my opinion Alomar got way too many votes here for his first year on the ballot......But next year he is a shoe in.....Can someone give Pete Rose some love now?

exstatman · 01-07-10, 03:25 PM

How does someone become a NINTH BALLOT HOFer? Did he suddenly become a better player? Did his stats improve over the previous 8 years? Always liked Andre, but c'mon, if a guy doesn't get in the first 2-3 ballots, he should never get in the front door, that's what the Veterans Committee is for. HOF should never become a "best of who's left" award, and in this case, it's a guy who was passed over 8 times already.

Willie Bee · 01-07-10, 05:25 PM

Originally posted by BobbyBaseballs

.....You are expected to be a professional at all times, and if not should pay for your actions.

Can't help but agree. At the same time, the 'character' or professional issue is so inconsistently applied that I've just always thought about whether a player should be in for their performance on the field and that's all. Rose was among the game's greatest players and is a Hall of Famer in my mind. Have always thought that journeyman outfielder Jim Dwyer summed it up best: "The Hall of Fame is for baseball people. Heaven is for good people."

Originally posted by exstatman

How does someone become a NINTH BALLOT HOFer? Did he suddenly become a better player? Did his stats improve over the previous 8 years? ...and in this case, it's a guy who was passed over 8 times already.

Again, I can't help but agree with what you say, at least the first part. It's almost like the BBWAA 'saved' Rice and Dawson until it was a convenient time to enshrine them. I'd have checked both of them on my ballot in their first years of eligibility. The player that, in my opinion, has been shafted the worst all along has been Ron Santo. Check his numbers, compare them -- Yes, even his defense -- to one of his contemporary 3B who is in the Hall of Fame, Brooks Robinson. And this is coming from someone that has been a Cubs hater since 1962.

ALL of the ballots should be made public. ALL. This is the national pasttime, after all. And when someone skips a player like Dawson, Rice and Alomar for a ballot or eight, and then votes for that player, that voter should tell us WHY.