Matchbook should know it how much volume comes from scalpers within Matchbook. If that number was a large % of their total volume they could easily have made this change quite different. Alternate they just fuc*ing hate you guys who they feel are cheating the system. In that case they might just be cutting their own throats.
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I know that WSEX was the first site to offer live betting and perhaps their betting volumes have fallen since Matchbook came on the scene. Since Matchbook and WSEX are "sister sites" perhaps they are making this change to increase volume on the non-live betting side at Matchbook while decreasing the live-betting side in hopes that bettors will return to WSEX.
On the Matchbook home page, it states that this change "will result in Matchbook making less commission per trade". That statement doesn't make any sense since the change results them charging commission on EVERY trade as opposed to just commission on net profit.Comment -
I still think they should have upped the commission on players betting both sides of the line. As like wheel said before they may just be cutting their own throats. No-one is going to want to accept a bet anymore unless the odds are way out of wack.Comment -
Does anyone know exactly when this change will be taking place (what day), and also what exactly the structure will be for baseball? Both of these issues have been rather vague.Comment -
Nobody knows (a) and they've not yet decided themselves on (b).Comment -
This is a strange system I have to admit, you actually win more at worse odds if u offer vs accept
+101 accepted, bet 100 charged a 1 and win 101, net profit 100
+100 offerred, bet 100 paid .20 and win 100, net profit 100.20
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What's the best browser to use to navigate Matchbook? I use both FireFox 3.0 and IE 8 on Windows Vista, and I have a hell of a time getting around the site.Comment -
Firefox, and opening a bunch of separate tabs works best for me. Matchbook's layout has a lot of room for improvement, but they don't seem to be overly interested in that.Comment -
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If that is right then technically they are taking 2% off us and our bet is really at -102 not -101 like I thought.Comment -
After thinking about it I think I am right. If you bet 100 at even money then they will either take the $1 out initially so you have $99 at evens which gives you a profit of $99 on your $100 investment. If you lose however you will only lose the $100 you originally bet as the $1 will come out of that. I think it has to be done like this, anyone else have any thoughts.Comment -
Simple Matchbook Commission Calculator
Taking an offer at even money would be the equivalent of wagering at -102.02.
This means if you had exactly $100 in your account and placed it all on an even money bet (taking the offer) your account would stand at $198.02 were your bet to win.Comment -
Can you please explain Ganchow the break up of how you get 198.02. I don't understand.Comment -
If you accept a wager at +100, if you win you will receive 100 minus 1 for commission for a net of 99. If you lose, you lose 100 plus 1 for commission for a total loss of 101. The effect is that accepting a wager at +100 you are risking 101 to win 99.
Joe.Comment -
So let's say your account is at $100 and you want to take an offer at +100.
But because you need to pay 1% commission on a losing bet you can in fact only risk $100/1.01 ≈ $99.01.
If that bet loses your out the $99.01 + commission of ($99.01 * 1%) = $99.01 + $0.99 = $100.
If that bet wins you then you collect $99.01 on the winning bet then have to pay commission of ($99.01 * 1%) = $0.99 for a net win of $99.01 - $0.99 = $98.02.Comment -
I am having the above confirmed right now on live chatComment -
They aren't even sure. I got 2 different answers to my question about the above bet. I have now e-mailed the trading department and am awaiting their response. I will post it as soon as I get it.Comment -
That all makes sense Ganchrow but the way I see it you are charging yourself 1% twice and that is not correct. Yes I agree you will only be able to bet $99.01 because $0.99 pays your commission but the when you win you will keep all the $99.01 because you have already payed you commission. Why would you say that it needs to be payed again? 1% is payed whether you win or lose but it is only payed once.Comment -
I think I agree with Mark. Ganchrow's scenario seems to apply only when you bet your whole remaining balance. And even then, you're risking 99.01 to win 98.02, which is -101.
I may well be wrong.Comment -
Actually, I am wrong. With a $100 balance, you can't risk $100 to win $99.01, but you can lose $100. You're effectively risking $100 to win $98.02. It applies to every scenario.
Sneaky.Comment -
Thanks for your support Matt but your example helps Ganchrow not me because you still are betting $100 . However I think your payout will be $99.01 as the $0.99 commision would have already been payed when you made the bet.Comment -
Why would you all think that you have to pay commission twice. I don't understand.Comment -
It's not paying twice - it's allowing for either possibility (win or lose). Before, you paid 2% when you won, now you pay 1% win or lose. At even odds, it's pretty much the same thing as before.
In other words, only $99.01 of your $100 is used as an actual stake. But your full $100 is always at risk. $100 to win $98.02 on $99.01, or $100 to lose $100.Last edited by Matt Rain; 03-12-09, 07:44 PM.Comment -
The Matchbook Commission Calculator I posted above is accurate.
Also see the odds conversion and comparison chart I had previously posted as well as the MB2US() and MB2DEC() functions in my http://forum.sbrforum.com/handicappe...tml#post256487.Comment -
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I am sorry Ganchrow you are correct. So their 1% commission really is 2%, what a joke they are trying to pass it off as 1%Comment -
Why can't matchbook figure in the commission BEFORE the bet is placed now... seems it would be alot less confusing and def easier for arbing/hedging.Comment -
I think arbing/hedging will be much much harder now. In bets where you would normally break even, you would now lose 2% due to a 1% loss on each bet.Comment -
Grab the reins Mark. The person who offers is subsidized and the person who accepts pays a percent. It is a real and significant commission reduction.
The change benefits most bettors a lot. Scalpers who liked to juggle in one market are hurt (which MB admits right on the home page explaining the policy). They have said elsewhere that these people constitute a tiny portion of their volume. But scalpers with multiple outs who take good leads now have a place to clear their bell positions at -102 so even they should be happy.Comment -
yesterday I was e-mailing a trader at Matchbook and he assures me they are watching this forum for reactions and ideas about the changes. So please let them know what you think of the new commission structure.Comment -
Mark, they are not trying to pass it off as 1%. They flat out tell you that its 1% for winners and 1% for losers, taking the commission off the lesser of the to win/risk amounts. They aren't hiding anything, this is not rocket science.
As Ganch showed in his calculator, it makes all your bets higher expected value and also gives .02 extra to market makers.
As said on the front page, scalpers are hurt by this. Regular bettors are helped.Comment -
I'm probably not the best person to be posting what I'm about to post, since I've never actually played at matchbook. I just registered there and sent my first wire transfer deposit less than 24 hours ago.
So there's a decent chance what I'm about to post is wrong, but here's how I understand it... what Matt Rain said makes sense to me. If I'm wrong, I hope someone will correct me and help explain it better.
OLD SYSTEM
Even odds bet of $100 is offered and accepted. It makes no difference if the offerer or acceptor wins. The loser is out $100 and the winner wins that $100 minus a 2% commission. So the "risk" and "to win" amounts are the same for both parties - risk $100 to win $98.
In other words, there's a pot of $100 + $100 = $200 total. MB keeps $2 and the winner of the bet keeps the other $198.
NEW SYSTEM
Even odds bet of $100 is offered and accepted. Matchbook immediately takes 1% (in this case one dollar) from the acceptor as commission. Of this one dollar commission, they keep 80 cents and give 20 cents to the offerer. This all takes place when the wager is accepted and matched, before the event starts, and before the wager is graded.
The acceptor now has only $99 at risk after paying the one dollar commission, so if the acceptor wins the bet, he gets his $99 back plus $99 in winnings, so the payout is still $198, same as it was before.
HOWEVER, the offerer still has $100 at risk even though the acceptor only has $99 at risk. So when the acceptor wins the bet, the offerer has to cough up the full $100 minus his 20 cent commission. MB's take is $1.80 under the new system instead of $2.00 under the old system, with that last 20 cents going back to the offerer.
If the offerer wins the bet, he gets the $99 in winnings from the acceptor, plus his $100 risk returned, plus his 20 cent subsidized commission, for a total of $199.20. MB's take in this case is only 80 cents, as opposed to $1.80 if the acceptor wins.
Therefore, if everything here is correct, this doesn't help acceptors at all but it doesn't hurt them either. If an acceptor wins a bet, he's effectively still paying 2% in commission.
It substantially helps offerers by effectively charging them only 0.8% on their winnings rather than 2% PLUS giving them back 0.2% of their losses.Comment
