Lakers offense was better without Kobe

[williams22]

Pau Gasol only took 9 shots tonight. Artest only took 8. The ball simply doesn't move nearly as much with Kobe in the lineup. He shot 39% tonight and had only 2 assists despite having the ball in his hands most possessions.

Also, as I've said all along, Fisher is the Achilles heel of this team. 3 for 13 tonight.

[BigDaddy]

i agree

[chisox19]

They did look real stagnant, especially in the 4th quarter

[williams22]

Pau Gasol is way too good to only get off 9 shots in a game. Also, Bynum started the game 4 for 4 inside in the first quarter. They then got him 1 shot in the 2nd, 1 in the 3rd, and 2 in the 4th. Seriously? Just stupid on offense.

[lakerboy]

This should make you happy. The Lakers were on a b2b . I didnt think they were gonna win this game regardless of how they set up there offense. Its like the Magic when they have a 15 point lead and keep jacking 3's and never go back to Howard and the other team gets back in the game and wins. Fisher is old and just there for a few minutes. He was shit on last year as well but we rememeber he hit the biggest shot of the finals. While I see what you are getting at it wont matter in the playoffs. They cant win anything without Kobe.

[williams22]

This should make you happy. The Lakers were on a b2b . I didnt think they were gonna win this game regardless of how they set up there offense. Its like the Magic when they have a 15 point lead and keep jacking 3's and never go back to Howard and the other team gets back in the game and wins. Fisher is old and just there for a few minutes. He was shit on last year as well but we rememeber he hit the biggest shot of the finals. While I see what you are getting at it wont matter in the playoffs. They cant win anything without Kobe.

I agree with the last sentence but not the one prior. It will absolutely matter. I don't understand why the Lakers can't have Kobe on the floor AND still have good ball movement. There's too much talent on that team with Gasol, Odom, and Bynum to not go to these guys more often. They do early on, but as the game progresses the only shots they get are secondary options.

Fisher is going to be a huge problem. Not wanting to pay a little more luxury tax is not a reason to pass up a deal if it will improve your team.

[kobefanatic]

always finding ways to bash/ criticize kobe, do you have a man crush on him? just like an ex girlfriend that you can't get over with? kobe has a bad night and they're tired on a b2b, now if gasol doesn't choke as much during late games i think kobe will share the ball with him, besides you shouldn't criticize kobe only look at derek fisher's FG 3/13 that guy is the one who doesn't pass that ball much, you can't blame kobe he's option 1 for his team but fihser i think he is option 5 or 6

[BranGor]

They looked really tired and stagnant in the 4th, it's hard to tell if it was the Mavs D or just shitty O.

[phillybadboy]

disagree kobe is the man

[williams22]

always finding ways to bash/ criticize kobe, do you have a man crush on him? just like an ex girlfriend that you can't get over with? kobe has a bad night and they're tired on a b2b, now if gasol doesn't choke as much during late games i think kobe will share the ball with him, besides you shouldn't criticize kobe only look at derek fisher's FG 3/13 that guy is the one who doesn't pass that ball much, you can't blame kobe he's option 1 for his team but fihser i think he is option 5 or 6

First off, I did blame Fisher, I ALWAYS blame Fisher.

Second, yes, Kobe can be blamed as well. He shot the ball very poorly, didn't recognize the hot hand, and when the shots weren't falling he didn't attack the rim.

Gasol, Bynum, Artest, and Odom combined to go 23 for 36 for 64%. When options 2 through 5 shoot 64% and you lose, it's a big problem.

This is what I have said all along. Kobe is capable of playing a team game against weaker teams, but when the competition gets tough he resorts to his old selfish habits and becomes a detriment to the team. Obviously if they want to win the Western Conference Finals or the Finals they need Kobe, I'm not arguing that. What I'm saying is when you add Kobe to the way the Lakers play without Kobe, you don't come nearly close to the theoretical sum of parts.

Kobe took 23 shots tonight and 2-5 options combined to take only 36 when they were hot. That doesn't make sense.

[dynamite140]

You want to bench Kobe?

[williams22]

disagree kobe is the man

Solid argument.

"The man" went 9 for 23 tonight and only had 2 assists. Very un-"the man" like numbers.

[williams22]

You want to bench Kobe?

No.

Let me make this argument simple for everyone:

- The Lakers play at level X without Kobe.
- Kobe has Y ability and talent.
- The Lakers plus Kobe should = X + Y
- But it doesn't, and in fact it is far from it.

The Lakers played some great basketball with Kobe out of the lineup. Gasol and Odom played great and the ball was moving. Now Kobe returns and that stops.

[kobefanatic]

First off, I did blame Fisher, I ALWAYS blame Fisher.

Second, yes, Kobe can be blamed as well. He shot the ball very poorly, didn't recognize the hot hand, and when the shots weren't falling he didn't attack the rim.

Gasol, Bynum, Artest, and Odom combined to go 23 for 36 for 64%. When options 2 through 5 shoot 64% and you lose, it's a big problem.

This is what I have said all along. Kobe is capable of playing a team game against weaker teams, but when the competition gets tough he resorts to his old selfish habits and becomes a detriment to the team. Obviously if they want to win the Western Conference Finals or the Finals they need Kobe, I'm not arguing that. What I'm saying is when you add Kobe to the way the Lakers play without Kobe, you don't come nearly close to the theoretical sum of parts.

Kobe took 23 shots tonight and 2-5 options combined to take only 36 when they were hot. That doesn't make sense.

gasol doesn't pound the ball inside in the 2nd half, he usually settles for a 18ft jumpshot, besides bynum taking less shots phil jackson should be the one to blame, i think he doesn't run any plays for bynum after the 1st half, he usually gets replaced by odom

[anthonyc023]

thats why you cant compare kobe to jordan jordan was far more consistent

[MastaB]

a lot of guys lost money on the lakers tonight

[ZetaPsi808]

damn I liked lakers too

[1UP]

People make too much assumptions from regular season games. You can't seriously tell me that Sasha, Farmar, Fish, and Brown is anywhere near dangerous in the postseason.

That 9 man rotation without Kobe gets bounced in the 2nd round. The 7 man rotation Phil will use with Kobe in the spring makes a push for the Finals.

[williams22]

People make too much assumptions from regular season games. You can't seriously tell me that Sasha, Farmar, Fish, and Brown is anywhere near dangerous in the postseason. That 9 man rotation without Kobe gets bounced in the 2nd round. The 7 man rotation Phil will use with Kobe in the spring makes a push for the Finals.

That's not the point. The point is the Lakers should be better with Kobe on the court than they are, and stem's from the way he plays.

[makemerich]

kobe did bad tonight but was on fire yesterday. bad night i would say. 3/4 on the 3 last night. with the winning shot. 100 precent on ft. 7 reb 6 asssit and 32 pts if im not wrong with high fg precentage. today was jsut a bad day.

[williams22]

No.

Let me make this argument simple for everyone:

- The Lakers play at level X without Kobe.
- Kobe has Y ability and talent.
- The Lakers plus Kobe should = X + Y
- But it doesn't, and in fact it is far from it.

The Lakers played some great basketball with Kobe out of the lineup. Gasol and Odom played great and the ball was moving. Now Kobe returns and that stops.

This is the main reason I hate Kobe and love Lebron. If the Lakers are X and Kobe is Y:
Kobe and the Lakers < X+Y

If the Cavs are X and Lebron is Y:
Lebron and the Cavs > X+Y

Lebron improves his teammates abilities, Kobe hampers them.

[ajdupuis]

Lebron all the way...

[StraitShooter]

a fresh young points ghost is born

[jsmithj88]

kobe is a superscorer that can pass
lebron is a great passer and great scorer
he will always make a team better with his passing or scoring

[Bumble Bee]

The authority on this subject and man with the final say is....Deshawn Stevenson. You guys heard what he said. He has a feud with Lebron and has called him out but he told Mark Jackson "I aint saying nothing about Kobe" He knows better and you guys should know better. If MJ and the Bulls lost on the road to Sir Charles and the Sixers and MJ was 12-37 would we be having this discussion?? NO. Cause everyone knows Da Bulls would take care of the sixers in 5 or 6 when it counted. We know the same with the Lakers and Mavs. Its Kobe hate and thats what it alays will be. Oh and the best player in the Association taking his first FT with 10 seconds to go may have a little something to do with tonights result.

[alittlemoresound]

There is so many people here in LA who think lakers are gonna win it this year....if there was a bet that lakers won't win it...id throw my entire bank on it now... and not make a single bet the rest of the season...because i know i will win......

[MB]

Folks are always gonna have a complaint when it comes to Kobe. They are the NBA champions!!! They wouldn't be without Kobe. They'll figure this shit out. A game in February in Dallas doesn't mean a damn thing. It's his 2nd game back. He hit the game winning shot last night. They wouldn't of won in Memphis without him. What are y'all tryna say about the man and the team. 2nd best record in the NBA. Stars win playoff series, so like I said, a regular season game in February vs. Dallas doesn't mean shit

[kobefanatic]

kobe is just in his 2nd game back so they would need a few more games to have their chemistry back

[TGHMak]

As much as I like see fisher on the lakers, I really wanted the Hinrich deal to go through

[HoulihansTX]

Pau Gasol only took 9 shots tonight. Artest only took 8. The ball simply doesn't move nearly as much with Kobe in the lineup. He shot 39% tonight and had only 2 assists despite having the ball in his hands most possessions. Also, as I've said all along, Fisher is the Achilles heel of this team. 3 for 13 tonight.

This sounds like an argument I made....

http://www.sportsbookreview.com/forum/nba-basketball-handicapping/335989-anybody-notice-how-much-better-lakers-were-without-kobe.html?highlight=lakers+kobe

[williams22]

This sounds like an argument I made....

http://www.sportsbookreview.com/foru...ht=lakers+kobe

Yup, and it was dead-on.

By the way, for whoever mentioned that the Lakers need time to get their chemistry back, that's the thing, Kobe doesn't have a ton of chemistry with the team...ever.

[HoulihansTX]

Kobe is a Ballhog, and is widely known. But with all the talent on the team it really doesnt matter.


For example, when Kobe was jacking up shots in the 1stH (3-10 FG) Lakers still went into halftime with a lead. Most other teams would have a huge deficit at that time, but Lakers overall talent is able to overcome Kobe's shit ball movement.

[williams22]

The authority on this subject and man with the final say is....Deshawn Stevenson. You guys heard what he said. He has a feud with Lebron and has called him out but he told Mark Jackson "I aint saying nothing about Kobe" He knows better and you guys should know better. If MJ and the Bulls lost on the road to Sir Charles and the Sixers and MJ was 12-37 would we be having this discussion?? NO. Cause everyone knows Da Bulls would take care of the sixers in 5 or 6 when it counted. We know the same with the Lakers and Mavs. Its Kobe hate and thats what it alays will be. Oh and the best player in the Association taking his first FT with 10 seconds to go may have a little something to do with tonights result.

Calling Deshawn Stevenson an authority on anything besides ugly beards and stupid celebrations is ridiculous.

By the way, Kobe didn't get to the line because he didn't attack. He settled for jumpers all night, which has become fairly usual for him.

If he ever learns to play team basketball I'll be terrified of the Lakers, but until then I'm smiling from ear to ear.

[Grind House]

Williams has a agenda to convert everyone to be a Cavs Fan.

[williams22]

Williams has a agenda to convert everyone to be a Cavs Fan.

Not at all. In fact, I don't even really hate the Lakers, I just hate Kobe because he plays the game the wrong way. He is as much talent as anyone who has ever played the game, but his selfishness will always hold him back.