Horse Racing questions and answers

[str]

hey str


fairgrounds

R7 #11 liberty hauler's hauler (15-1)


2nd time starter by Army Mule..cost $390k @ kee sept '21
so yearling purchase another plus..Went off 5-1 and did little in his kee debut..albert stall excellent trainer and good value roi

all that being said 11 post in a route and a bad (overbet) route jock..lots of big pedigrees and a few of them have shown talent in limited starts


don't like as a bet..more making you aware one of them is running especially since it's an expensive horse

honestly if the post and jockey were better I'd take a flyer but too much to overcome here

<br>
<br>


I could see taking a flyer on this horse with a better post.

His works have picked up since his first race. That is something.

This has to be at least a little easier than the last race was. I guess.

1st lasix never hurts but that post should have him parked pretty wide starting so close to the turn.Now and then though, you find a spot to get over somewhat. Need some luck there.

Don't know the rider but I believe you.

Would be nice to see him show something and won't be surprised if he does.

They all seem to show up so might get a bad trip and yet show enough to play next out.

But because I see so many run well, nothing would surprise me with an Army Mule.
Thanks for the heads up JBEX.

[JBEX]

np str and thanks for the feedback


made a bit of wide move on the turn but overall did little @ 45-1..I'd feel good about it if he showed up again in 4-6 weeks with a better post and jockey..with some experience and fitness maybe a wake up situation and the price will be right..

[JBEX]

hey str

laurel

R3 #10 ellie victorina (9-2)

just letting you know it's an army mule and looks like
she has a decent shot



happy new year to you and your family

[str]

hey str

laurel

R3 #10 ellie victorina (9-2)

just letting you know it's an army mule and looks like
she has a decent shot



happy new year to you and your family

Thanks JBEX. I'll check it out.

Happy New Year to you and everyone .

[Pigpen]

Happy New Year STR!!!!!!!!

[str]

Happy New Year STR!!!!!!!!

Thank you sir.

Same to you !

Stay safe everybody.

[JBEX]

hey str

parx

R9 #8 recruiter (5-2) 3:31
by Army Mule

a juvenile stakes and this one is undefeated in 3 starts.. his last 2 races at laurel respectively are an alw/oc and listed stakes..trainer having a terrific meet and tremendous over a small sample with the jockey..will be a sloppy track and he's already won over one


not interested in betting ..just making you aware another one is running

[str]

hey str

parx

R9 #8 recruiter (5-2) 3:31
by Army Mule

a juvenile stakes and this one is undefeated in 3 starts.. his last 2 races at laurel respectively are an alw/oc and listed stakes..trainer having a terrific meet and tremendous over a small sample with the jockey..will be a sloppy track and he's already won over one


not interested in betting ..just making you aware another one is running

Thanks for the heads up.

I just looked at the pp's.

Certainly his race to lose.

Has the box ( outside post and is the controlling speed.)

Kate Demasi's horse should improve 3rd time out. 2 for 2 but probably runs better today. That won't be enough if Recruiter runs his race though.

He looks real tough to beat today going in.

Thanks again JBEX.

[JBEX]

Thanks for the heads up.

I just looked at the pp's.

Certainly his race to lose.

Has the box ( outside post and is the controlling speed.)

Kate Demasi's horse should improve 3rd time out. 2 for 2 but probably runs better today. That won't be enough if Recruiter runs his race though.

He looks real tough to beat today going in.

Thanks again JBEX.

no problem str..was thinking this is a nice bridge to get to 2 turns also..did some pedigree research


dam was 1/20 but

dam sire Medaglia d'oro

2nd dam sire stakes placed and by Touch Gold (belmont stakes)

3rd dam's sire is "saratoga six" who's by Alydar

6 generations back in the female family is Seattle Slew

[JBEX]

actually paternal great grandsire is Seattle Slew also (through AP Indy)

[JBEX]

interested to see what army mule produces.. $10k stud at hill n dale.. first year stallion this year so the yearlings won't hit the sales ring till next year.. have a hunch he's going to be a good one with the dominant performances... think he was no fluke costing so much out of a cheap stallion

I would guess that he would be worth a try at 10K.

I get goosebumps looking at his bloodlines going back.

It's like a who's who of greatness.

Unreal.

you commented on his pedigree back on 10/9/19

[JBEX]

9 of them running this week including today's.. interesting that 7 of them are fillies (colt today)


two stakes at gulfstream on saturday.. two of them are running in one of them (R9) which is at 1 mile on the turf



1) navy goat.. most expensive auction purchase at $450k earlier this year

2) bel pensiero






.

[str]

no problem str..was thinking this is a nice bridge to get to 2 turns also..did some pedigree research


dam was 1/20 but

dam sire Medaglia d'oro

2nd dam sire stakes placed and by Touch Gold (belmont stakes)

3rd dam's sire is "saratoga six" who's by Alydar

6 generations back in the female family is Seattle Slew

With deep bloodlines, I don't worry that much if the dam struggled with winning. She probably had so so talent at best but because of the bloodlines, she had to run against superior horses all the time.
I remember a maiden filly that kept losing badly at Delaware Park in the 70's. Bud Delp trained her. She needed a cheap group but had great bloodlines. Can't remember her name but not sure if she ever won. If so, just a maiden race.
Anyway, after she won or if she even didn't, she went to the breeding shed and threw a big time runner. Grade 1 winner. Again, can't remember the name. Hexatonia stable owned her. Easy to remember that as the lady that owned her always wore green and was a real wackadoodle. Lol.

That was when I realized that the dam isn't a huge deal when it comes to being great as long as her bloodlines are big time. Had to be my 1st or 2nd year training. I had not realized that until then.

[JBEX]

With deep bloodlines, I don't worry that much if the dam struggled with winning. She probably had so so talent at best but because of the bloodlines, she had to run against superior horses all the time.
I remember a maiden filly that kept losing badly at Delaware Park in the 70's. Bud Delp trained her. She needed a cheap group but had great bloodlines. Can't remember her name but not sure if she ever won. If so, just a maiden race.
Anyway, after she won or if she even didn't, she went to the breeding shed and threw a big time runner. Grade 1 winner. Again, can't remember the name. Hexatonia stable owned her. Easy to remember that as the lady that owned her always wore green and was a real wackadoodle. Lol.

That was when I realized that the dam isn't a huge deal when it comes to being great as long as her bloodlines are big time. Had to be my 1st or 2nd year training. I had not realized that until then.

that's kind of the way I've felt all along..while it can't hurt to have a stakes winning dam who has produced as a broodmare (one or the other ok) the deep class and distance bloodlines mean something..a good indicator he may move forward stretching out ..I'm guessing they may be thinking the first leg of the florida path to the derby in the Hutchinson on 2/4 @ 1 1/16 miles..forget what the name of tampa's first leg but a possibility also..maybe rest him till the 2nd leg at these tracks ..it'll certainly be interesting to see how he handles it
..sure the folks at hill n dale will be pulling for him also..even to get a solid performance without winning one or two in those races would be a nice move forward for the stallion

[JBEX]

they were talking about army mule as a very promising looking stallion on tvg following the race
..scott hazleton said he likes the really brilliant short career horses as stallions..you once said they're so fast and talented (something along those lines) that they are more prone towards injuries .. doesn't necessarily mean that'll be case for their progeny..he gave a couple of examples with danzig being one of them ..again not saying he's going to be that as he's one of the all time greats..hey you never know

[JBEX]

that's kind of the way I've felt all along..while it can't hurt to have a stakes winning dam who has produced as a broodmare (one or the other ok) the deep class and distance bloodlines mean something..a good indicator he may move forward stretching out ..I'm guessing they may be thinking the first leg of the florida path to the derby in the Hutchinson on 2/4 @ 1 1/16 miles..forget what the name of tampa's first leg but a possibility also..maybe rest him till the 2nd leg at these tracks ..it'll certainly be interesting to see how he handles it
..sure the folks at hill n dale will be pulling for him also..even to get a solid performance without winning one or two in those races would be a nice move forward for the stallion

wouldn't have guessed it but there first leg is at 7f next saturday...that's followed by the sam davis (G3)
@ 1 1/16 four weeks after that and their derby four weeks later on 3/11

[str]

they were talking about army mule as a very promising looking stallion on tvg following the race
..scott hazleton said he likes the really brilliant short career horses as stallions..you once said they're so fast and talented (something along those lines) that they are more prone towards injuries .. doesn't necessarily mean that'll be case for their progeny..he gave a couple of examples with danzig being one of them ..again not saying he's going to be that as he's one of the all time greats..hey you never know

He might be one of the all time great 7.5k or 10k stallions the way his 1st crop showed up.

I know it's early but you just don't see less expensive studs do what he has done so far, very often.

[JBEX]

He might be one of the all time great 7.5k or 10k stallions the way his 1st crop showed up.

I know it's early but you just don't see less expensive studs do what he has done so far, very often.

makes me think of Distorted Humor..I had Funny Cide in 2003 (my last derby winner unfortunately lol)
and he was by the above ..FC was from DH 2nd crop and at the time his fee was $12.5k ..that launched him into an excellent and long career as a stallion I believe at his peak was fetching around the $100k
mark..different than starting in the $50-100k range and some of those wind up not succeeding and just being avg sires..plus ,as you know they are getting better mares to start with which is the point you're making about starting this low and having success
..seems he has a few prospects who could develop into nice 3yo's ..no guarantee they will but this is definitely the spot you want to be in up to this point for the farm

[str]

they were talking about army mule as a very promising looking stallion on tvg following the race
..scott hazleton said he likes the really brilliant short career horses as stallions..you once said they're so fast and talented (something along those lines) that they are more prone towards injuries .. doesn't necessarily mean that'll be case for their progeny..he gave a couple of examples with danzig being one of them ..again not saying he's going to be that as he's one of the all time greats..hey you never know

I have to think he has gotten the attention of a lot of people by now.

Especially at his price point.

[str]

wouldn't have guessed it but there first leg is at 7f next saturday...that's followed by the sam davis (G3)
@ 1 1/16 four weeks after that and their derby four weeks later on 3/11

It's about that time of year where Todd comes off the bench with a bunch of horses.

Isn't the Sam Davis where he ran that maiden that finished 4th in the BC Juvenile 2 years ago?

It was something like that. It didn't end well whatever it was.

Not blaming him though. If they show they might, you have to try.

[JBEX]

It's about that time of year where Todd comes off the bench with a bunch of horses.

Isn't the Sam Davis where he ran that maiden that finished 4th in the BC Juvenile 2 years ago?

It was something like that. It didn't end well whatever it was.

Not blaming him though. If they show they might, you have to try.

I believe you are right about that but forget the name of the horse..think he lost at 1/5..believe he lost at least one more time after that also and i gave him another shot in that one lol..going to try and find his name (not right away)


yeah the 2nd and 3rd legs of tampa if they choose that route npi lol are where the water starts getting deep..the drop-off from the gulfstream preps not as much as it used to be and you'll get a lot top horses landing there..think this has been true for a good 20 years now


agree that you have to try and find out what you have..with all the route influences underneath he might be well suited for it

[JBEX]

guess he could try the nyra path also..trainer is based at laurel I believe

[JBEX]

It's about that time of year where Todd comes off the bench with a bunch of horses.

Isn't the Sam Davis where he ran that maiden that finished 4th in the BC Juvenile 2 years ago?

It was something like that. It didn't end well whatever it was.

Not blaming him though. If they show they might, you have to try.

command performance in the 2021 bc juvenile

2nd in tampa bay msw @ 1-20 (not the sam davis)

next 2 out of the money in the blue grass and then a msw at belmont

final starts of 2022 got through msw and n1xot at mth in july and august

[str]

command performance in the 2021 bc juvenile

2nd in tampa bay msw @ 1-20 (not the sam davis)

next 2 out of the money in the blue grass and then a msw at belmont

final starts of 2022 got through msw and n1xot at mth in july and august

Good to see he won a couple races albeit at Monmouth instead of Saratoga but he did need some serious class relief to help his mental side after that tough stretch over the fall and winter.

I remember that 1-20 race. The rail horse just kept going. But he turned out to be an ok horse after that. After winning that, he ended up needing some class relief as well I think.

Thanks JBEX. Glad to hear Command Performance was able to win a couple races.

[JBEX]

Good to see he won a couple races albeit at Monmouth instead of Saratoga but he did need some serious class relief to help his mental side after that tough stretch over the fall and winter.

I remember that 1-20 race. The rail horse just kept going. But he turned out to be an ok horse after that. After winning that, he ended up needing some class relief as well I think.

Thanks JBEX. Glad to hear Command Performance was able to win a couple races.

no problem str

be interesting to see if he turns up again this year ..stopping on him after winning in august might not be the best of signs ..assuming he was OK after the last win ,might not have been easy to spot him as a major track n2x ot probably too tough for him..or could be they felt that was enough activity for the year and bring him back fresh this year..mike repole
and st elias stable are the owners so the expense of keeping him on the sidelines no big deal for them

[JBEX]

no problem str

be interesting to see if he turns up again this year ..stopping on him after winning in august might not be the best of signs ..assuming he was OK after the last win ,might not have been easy to spot him as a major track n2x ot probably too tough for him..or could be they felt that was enough activity for the year and bring him back fresh this year..mike repole
and st elias stable are the owners so the expense of keeping him on the sidelines no big deal for them

goes full circle..owner of army mule during his racing days..maybe still has an ownership interest while he's standing at hill n dale..not sure how those arrangements work

[JBEX]

9 of them running this week including today's.. interesting that 7 of them are fillies (colt today)


R2 stakes at gulfstream on saturday.. two of them are running in one of them (R9) which is at 1 mile on the turf



1) navy goat.. most expensive auction purchase at $450k earlier this year

2) bel pensiero






.

not picks.. just figured with all we've talked about it this week would just give a reminder.. agree with the odds.. ng has some chance but can't see the other (like most 30-1's)


#7 navy goat (8-1)


#4 bel pensiero (30-1)

[str]

goes full circle..owner of army mule during his racing days..maybe still has an ownership interest while he's standing at hill n dale..not sure how those arrangements work

The owners can do anything they want when structuring a deal, therefore the arrangement can be just about anything so long as both sides agree.

Some sell outright, some retain several breeding shares to use or sell privately each year, some sell 50% stake. It's all over the place.

I would have to think they retained something in the way of ownership.

Now that the horse is being talked about, I'm sure it will come out as to who owns what shares.

Great position to be in if indeed they are.

[JBEX]

The owners can do anything they want when structuring a deal, therefore the arrangement can be just about anything so long as both sides agree.

Some sell outright, some retain several breeding shares to use or sell privately each year, some sell 50% stake. It's all over the place.

I would have to think they retained something in the way of ownership.

Now that the horse is being talked about, I'm sure it will come out as to who owns what shares.

Great position to be in if indeed they are.

yes it is.. good to know about how that works when a horse becomes a stallion.. have a hunch he probably kept an interest and would be interested to know the current ownership split (if there is)

[JBEX]

if you didn't see thought navy goat ran a nice race..a little tardy out of the gate and got squeezed around mid-stretch but kept coming..think he'll capture a listed stakes or better down the road

https://youtu.be/G-AUk0XOtzA

19:50 start of race

[JBEX]

just saw there's an army mule going at gulfstream R8

#10 be here now (8-1)

playing a different one in my thread


ran nice in his debut and think it's interesting they're stretching and switching surfaces with him off that..
trainer definitely an under the radar type with those roi's..not my choice

[str]

just saw there's an army mule going at gulfstream R8

#10 be here now (8-1)

playing a different one in my thread


ran nice in his debut and think it's interesting they're stretching and switching surfaces with him off that..
trainer definitely an under the radar type with those roi's..not my choice

Man these horses just keep on running.

Looks like he got beat about 3 1/4 lengths with what the chart suggests was a really wide trip.

And the stretch out and surface change can be difficult on an unseasoned young horse.

Seems like plenty of these Army Mules handle that which tells you they are not only talented and game, but smart as well.

Thanks JBEX.

[JBEX]

Man these horses just keep on running.

Looks like he got beat about 3 1/4 lengths with what the chart suggests was a really wide trip.

And the stretch out and surface change can be difficult on an unseasoned young horse.

Seems like plenty of these Army Mules handle that which tells you they are not only talented and game, but smart as well.

Thanks JBEX.

no problem str


I didn't watch the race live but the horse I picked was on the front end and threw the jock in the stretch and two other horses went down.. of course they wouldn't show a replay of that..as you said it looks by the charts even and wide for the army mule


slow week this week.. 3 and they are all running on friday

aqu 5
lrl 6
oak 8

oaklawn ml favorite and has run big every time.. 4th career start and its an alw oc which is always a tough race there

[Foosball Champ]

http://www.paceadvantage.com/

[cincinnatikid513]

can someone explain to me how the 8 horse at parx won the race at 7-1 odds and only paid 11.60 to win doesn't make any sense at all

1st:

8

Milano

$11.60

$5.20

$3.20

8

7M/L:[COLOR=rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.5)]8[/COLOR]

Milano 6 G Into Mischief - Dixie Song