How books make money if they keep closing accounts?

**brankica023** · 01-25-12, 03:37 PM

My record for kicking out off book is 2 bets and winning 80€ from partybets

**Hareeba!** · 01-25-12, 03:38 PM

Many of us have been through all the European books and found them doing that.

Just keep moving on until you've exhausted your welcome at all of them.

But for the longer term you really should be playing at Pinnacle or the exchanges (Betfair and Matchbook) or if you are into soccer at SBO and 188Bet. Best odds and won't get limited.

**brankica023** · 01-25-12, 03:38 PM

My record for kicking out off book is 2 bets and winning 80€ from partybets

**v1y** · 01-25-12, 04:11 PM

I'm up 5 figures at 5Dimes and they've never limited me, so go play there!

**Hareeba!** · 01-25-12, 04:17 PM

Originally posted by v1y

I'm up 5 figures at 5Dimes and they've never limited me, so go play there!

My experience with them was somewhat different.

They introduced a delay and limited me severely.

**slikec** · 01-25-12, 05:15 PM

I heard that only pinnacle never limited anyone outside their limits which lets be honest for most sports they offer are just huge

From big books i use most of them and would use 5dimes if i could have account in euros.

Anyway is funny how books dont want our money. I dont know how it would be if people would go to supermarket and they would kick out 1/5 of custumers after few shopings

**Hareeba!** · 01-25-12, 05:21 PM

Originally posted by slikec

I heard that only pinnacle never limited anyone outside their limits which lets be honest for most sports they offer are just huge

From big books i use most of them and would use 5dimes if i could have account in euros.

Anyway is funny how books dont want our money. I dont know how it would be if people would go to supermarket and they would kick out 1/5 of custumers after few shopings

Exchanges will never kick you out for winning.

Pinnacle's early limits on many sports are far from huge.

It makes sense for books to close down punters who win and cost them money. They make their money from the mugs who don't know the meaning of value.

**LordVodka** · 01-25-12, 05:24 PM

Will a book close your account if you win a lot but bet the team that is getting the least action coming in?

**JohnAnthony** · 01-25-12, 05:42 PM

Never, cause I'm with Pinny! and honestly, I've been a losing degenerate for the most part until early last year

**BradyMossTD** · 01-25-12, 06:36 PM

What about Bookmaker? I heard they never limit or delay winners. Seems like it's the only option for US players?

**Emily_Haines** · 01-25-12, 07:05 PM

Originally posted by BradyMossTD

What about Bookmaker? I heard they never limit or delay winners. Seems like it's the only option for US players?

They only take the rewards program away if you win.

**Bill Dozer** · 01-25-12, 07:11 PM

If your book has unique numbers but isn't moving the market, that's a bad sign unless they kick out the players who bet all of those numbers. Good risk management means not getting beat to line moves. For the books who are premier marketers, they can afford to kick out players who might just price shop. For most books that dont set the lines, all they care about is players beating them to a number they want to change.

**LordVodka** · 01-25-12, 07:26 PM

Originally posted by Bill Dozer

If your book has unique numbers but isn't moving the market, that's a bad sign unless they kick out the players who bet all of those numbers. Good risk management means not getting beat to line moves. For the books who are premier marketers, they can afford to kick out players who might just price shop. For most books that dont set the lines, all they care about is players beating them to a number they want to change.

So in theory you can be a winning player as long as you don't bet steam they will not care?

**Emily_Haines** · 01-25-12, 07:33 PM

Originally posted by LordVodka

So in theory you can be a winning player as long as you don't bet steam they will not care?

If you bet steam the books can just put a delay on your account to prevent you from getting the number. If you win they have no measures left other than closing your account. Only about 5 online books worth a shit these days.

**LordVodka** · 01-25-12, 07:36 PM

For US players at least.

There's gotta be a way for us to find some kind of loophole and use the US laws against them. There's gotta be some kind of technicality we're not looking at.

**FourLengthsClear** · 01-25-12, 07:40 PM

Originally posted by LordVodka

So in theory you can be a winning player as long as you don't bet steam they will not care?

If you are consistently on the right side of line moves before steam occurs you will be collared too. This is true even if your account with that book is in negative territory.

**Bill Dozer** · 01-25-12, 08:01 PM

Originally posted by LordVodka

So in theory you can be a winning player as long as you don't bet steam they will not care?

Well, line moves. If you watch SBRodds to see which way a game is moving before game time and see it is moving opposite your favor but that a few of your outs still have it at the old line where you bet it, there are some books that will boot you eventually. 365 and VIP for example. There are players that win $400k in a month from 5dimes and they don't care. But, if you are always betting a line that is eventually going to follow Betfair, Bookmaker's and Pinnacle's move, and don't gamble on anything else, you may get the boot. If you won 20 NFL bets in a row for $5k/per the book still has the same chance at beating you on the 21st bet as they do everyone else as long as you are betting the numbers everyone else is betting.

**TheMoneyShot** · 01-25-12, 08:10 PM

Bill back to what you just said. You mean if you follow a steam move from Betfair, Bookmaker, and Pinnacle... it's cashing at a higher percentage? For instance if the line goes from -4 to -4.5 then -4.5 is the play? And if the line goes from -4 to -3.5 then +3.5 is the play? Just trying to understand more clearly.

**LordVodka** · 01-25-12, 08:13 PM

Originally posted by Bill Dozer

Well, line moves. If you watch SBRodds to see which way a game is moving before game time and see it is moving opposite your favor but that a few of your outs still have it at the old line where you bet it, there are some books that will boot you eventually. 365 and VIP for example. There are players that win $400k in a month from 5dimes and they don't care. But, if you are always betting a line that is eventually going to follow Betfair, Bookmaker's and Pinnacle's move, and don't gamble on anything else, you may get the boot. If you won 20 NFL bets in a row for $5k/per the book still has the same chance at beating you on the 21st bet as they do everyone else as long as you are betting the numbers everyone else is betting.

WOW!

**Bill Dozer** · 01-25-12, 08:22 PM

Originally posted by TheMoneyShot

Bill back to what you just said. You mean if you follow a steam move from Betfair, Bookmaker, and Pinnacle... it's cashing at a higher percentage? For instance if the line goes from -4 to -4.5 then -4.5 is the play? And if the line goes from -4 to -3.5 then +3.5 is the play? Just trying to understand more clearly.

Your bet will cash at a higher percentage if you are playing the dog. If your opinion was that the dog would cover then you don't want to bet +3.5 when Pinnacle has +4 -111 because your book will likely move to 4. However if you like the fav and see the line is going up across the board so you hurry to bet the 3.5, your book won't like that because your betting a stale line. Linesmakers get headaches when their reports show X amount of bets coming in at the old line because they weren't quick enough. It doesn't matter if they win or lose, they look bad. Winners can always win and be fine at most places as long as they are part of the intended balanced action.

**slikec** · 01-25-12, 09:06 PM

Well my job is to get best line and books job is to set the right line. Explains why i became unwelcome costumer for so many books

**davidchong** · 01-25-12, 09:58 PM

tony answer: i dont want your action.

**TheMoneyShot** · 01-26-12, 01:46 AM

Thanks Bill

**LordVodka** · 01-26-12, 05:49 AM

Bill, were you joking when you said there are people who win 400k a month and don't get kicked out? Why would any book keep someone like that around?

**Santo** · 01-26-12, 07:36 AM

If you bet $440k to win $400k on -3 -110 when the market is -3 +100, why wouldn't they?

Extrapolate that, 2 bets of $220k/$200k are the same..

Whether you win or not is not meaningful without average size of bet, average advantage vs closing line etc..

**Bill Dozer** · 01-26-12, 10:05 PM

Originally posted by LordVodka

Bill, were you joking when you said there are people who win 400k a month and don't get kicked out? Why would any book keep someone like that around?

Yea, there are guys who will win six figures a day. But you have to remember gambling is a money making business for books that are doing it right. If one guy is winning 100k there is probably another losing 110k. If books can work with the action, they generally don't care who wins. When you bet on a line that they intend or move or should have moved, they can't work with the action.