GOD

[bobbywaves]

Posts from this Atheist are so informative.

Let's take a deeper look at the moral character of this typical Atheist, who's also a father to ants.

Not only has he cheated poker rollover, illegally entered a password protected poker tourney, he's also been stiffing on a pts loan that BF eluded to: http://www.sportsbookreview.com/foru...ints-loan.html

Doesn't get anymore pathetic than that, I'm sure his off forum actions in Houston, TX. are no different.

[BigDofBA]

I'm just going to start posting some of the stories of the bible and ask some questions because a lot of the stories aren't logical or backed by anything scientific. Most of them are based on the supernatural. As is such, the more outrageous the claim, the more evidence is needed to prove the claim.


1. Problems with the Bible: The story of Noah's Ark

If there was a great flood, as depicted by the story of Noah's ark, why don't we find fossils of different animals all over the world?

Example: Why don't we find Kangaroo fossils in the middle east? Why are they only in Australia? The Ark supposedly crashed in the Middle East yet Kangaroo fossils aren't within thousands of miles of the area.

Study and research fossil patterns in the Grand Canyon. It's not consistent with a great flood. There isn't evidence a great flood existed. Also, anyone else find it odd that Noah and his family could build a vessel that housed 14,000 individuals? They couldn't do this centuries later with skilled shipmakers....

People in the early 1900s, skilled shipmakers, built the Wyoming and it couldn't even make it at sea; however, Noah could do it long before with his unskilled family and he could build a ship that could stay a float for a year. Does that sound reasonable to anyone? Maybe it's reasonable to you that Noah had super powers.

2. Problems with the Bible: The story of Abraham and Isaac

God ordered Abraham to kill his son to prove Abraham's loyalty and faith.

Exodous 20:13 states, "Thou shall not kill". Why did God order someone to do something that contradicts his word?

Numerous verses in the Bible state that God is all knowing. These can be found in Isaiah, Psalms, Job, etc. If God is all knowing, why would he have to test Abraham? Shouldn't he already know what Abraham's action would be?

[brainfreeze]

1. Problems with the Bible: The story of Noah's Ark

If there was a great flood, as depicted by the story of Noah's ark, why don't we find fossils of different animals all over the world?

?

https://answersingenesis.org/noahs-ark/origin-of-species-after-flood/

. If God is all knowing, why would he have to test Abraham?

It's Gods pleasure to tell prophetic stories, and it's a delight to man to witness... " He provided Himself a lamb " it wasn't about killing his son, it was about sacrificing for God... That was the bloodline the Hebrew tribes would arrive from, through the seed of Abrahams son...Issac. Abraham not only proved his heart was willing to go beyond for God, but God proved He was willing to go further beyond for man... He did so with the Lamb of God, who takes away the sins of the world...our Messiah, Christ Jesus

[brainfreeze]

[Muller Rose]

How do you know there is one? Should one really feel him in ones heart?

I personally believe in God. With or without proof. and yes, you feel him in your heart!

[BigDofBA]

Believing in something without proof is insanity IMO.

Posting something saying it is "undeniable" proof the bible is true is also insanity.

Why do you guys choose to believe the Bible over the Quran or Book of Mormon? There are over 4000 religions. How do you know Christianity is the correct religion?

They can't all be right.....which leads me to believe none of them are right.

The Bible was written by man. It's an imperfect book with many contradictions and horrible stories of murder and discrimination. Those stories are ignored while the good stories are taught to children.

The Bible explains things that man was too stupid to understand back in the day. Science disproves the Bible time and time again but the Bible never disproves science.

[BigDofBA]

https://answersingenesis.org/noahs-a...s-after-flood/





It's Gods pleasure to tell prophetic stories, and it's a delight to man to witness... " He provided Himself a lamb " it wasn't about killing his son, it was about sacrificing for God... That was the bloodline the Hebrew tribes would arrive from, through the seed of Abrahams son...Issac. Abraham not only proved his heart was willing to go beyond for God, but God proved He was willing to go further beyond for man... He did so with the Lamb of God, who takes away the sins of the world...our Messiah, Christ Jesus

That still doesn't answer my question. If God is all knowing, why did Abraham have to "prove" anything?

When I ask questions about the Bible and backup my thinking with science, I encourage people to use their own brain to respond.

Don't google the answer and goto some religious website that is biased and puts their own spin on things. When you do that, the answer never adds up.

Also, there is a reason it's beaten into people's heads to not question the bible or God. There is a reason you have to have "faith" and blindly believe without proof. If you start thinking about it or questioning it, the house of cards begin to fall.

You wouldn't blindly buy something or believe someone in any other aspect in life so why do you do it with religion?

[brainfreeze]

That still doesn't answer my question. If God is all knowing, why did Abraham have to "prove" anything?

When I ask questions about the Bible and backup my thinking with science, I encourage people to use their own brain to respond.

Don't google the answer and goto some religious website that is biased and puts their own spin on things. When you do that, the answer never adds up.

Also, there is a reason it's beaten into people's heads to not question the bible or God. There is a reason you have to have "faith" and blindly believe without proof. If you start thinking about it or questioning it, the house of cards begin to fall.

You wouldn't blindly buy something or believe someone in any other aspect in life so why do you do it with religion?

So you don't want to hear a thorough and complete researched answer... You just want to hear someone's opinion ...yet you went to some atheist website to come up with half the nonsense you talk about...if you try to post things that raise doubt, I will post things that raise God...simple

to answer your question, " we are tried by fire " there will be test, and Abraham wasn't the only one, look at the story of job... It shows they're faithful servants to Jesus.. but we have free will... We aren't robots, we have choice to do whatever is in our heart..and He may know who we are, but sometimes we need assurance to know who we are, and that happens by completing the motions...a " test "

p.s. He's no house of cards.... He's like that of mt. Everest, He is on His foundation, He's there for the world to see and without the right passion, dedication, and heart to get to Him, most never will...

you see through eyes of the flesh, and what man has told you is right...but again, it's interesting you don't want any answers, just to argue " there is no God " if there isn't ...then why are you troubled to post here so much? If there isn't, why waste your time on pages and pages of discussing something you believe isn't real? Yet you aren't even discussing anymore or wanting to look at the answers, " think for yourself " isn't the answer...studying out a matter is, so now that you are just posting for the cause of doubt, we know who does that...right?

[brainfreeze]

I personally believe in God. With or without proof. and yes, you feel him in your heart!

Good to hear you testify of Jesus muller, God bless

[BigDofBA]

So you don't want to hear a thorough and complete researched answer... You just want to hear someone's opinion ...yet you went to some atheist website to come up with half the nonsense you talk about...if you try to post things that raise doubt, I will post things that raise God...simple

to answer your question, " we are tried by fire " there will be test, and Abraham wasn't the only one, look at the story of job... It shows they're faithful servants to Jesus.. but we have free will... We aren't robots, we have choice to do whatever is in our heart..and He may know who we are, but sometimes we need assurance to know who we are, and that happens by completing the motions...a " test "

p.s. He's no house of cards.... He's like that of mt. Everest, He is on His foundation, He's there for the world to see and without the right passion, dedication, and heart to get to Him, most never will...

you see through eyes of the flesh, and what man has told you is right...but again, it's interesting you don't want any answers, just to argue " there is no God " if there isn't ...then why are you troubled to post here so much? If there isn't, why waste your time on pages and pages of discussing something you believe isn't real? Yet you aren't even discussing anymore or wanting to look at the answers, " think for yourself " isn't the answer...studying out a matter is, so now that you are just posting for the cause of doubt, we know who does that...right?

You're typing a lot by still not really addressing my questions and you're also making a lot of assumptions.

When I have asked a lot of simple questions, many of the responses I have gotten are links to websites or YouTube videos. For example, you totally avoided my questions about animals and fossils as it pertains to Noah's Ark. Science doesn't support a great flood.

This leads me to believe that people either don't know or hadn't thought about some of the questions I've asked. I'm not surprised since your religion requires you to blindly believe and not ask questions. Research is fine but I encourage people to look at from both ends.

A lot of the "support" for God is vague heresay that can't be proved.

You criticize me for looking at things through the "eyes of man" yet you worship based on a book made by man.

What other eyes am I supposed to use? How do we know anything in this world?

Religion contradicts everything we know about the world and it holds back discovery. Saying God did something when you don't understand something is a cop out based on what I know about life and what scientists know about life.

I'm trying to open people's minds up. That's why I'm here.

[brainfreeze]

You're typing a lot by still not really addressing my questions and you're also making a lot of assumptions.

When I have asked a lot of simple questions, many of the responses I have gotten are links to websites or YouTube videos. For example, you totally avoided my questions about animals and fossils as it pertains to Noah's Ark. Science doesn't support a great flood.

This leads me to believe that people either don't know or hadn't thought about some of the questions I've asked. I'm not surprised since your religion requires you to blindly believe and not ask questions. Research is fine but I encourage people to look at from both ends.

A lot of the "support" for God is vague heresay that can't be proved.

You criticize me for looking at things through the "eyes of man" yet you worship based on a book made by man.

What other eyes am I supposed to use? How do we know anything in this world?

Religion contradicts everything we know about the world and it holds back discovery. Saying God did something when you don't understand something is a cop out based on what I know about life and what scientists know about life.

I'm trying to open people's minds up. That's why I'm here.

Over this thread there has been MANY prominent rational thinkers of time and times past that have dedicated their lives to studying the Bible and being Christian that I've shown... You just don't want to acknowledge that, or that some of today's inventions that HELP mankind have came from Christians as I've given example tesla, Newton, or Raymond damadian inventor of the MRI etc... http://www.icr.org/article/8685

there have also been many intellectuals that have been converted from atheists to Christians ... Like c.l. Lewis

but I believe I answered your questions pretty well, I didn't " avoid " anything, I sent you in the direction with thorough research that you either don't want to accept or just blatantly want to disregard the truth...

but I've gone far enough with you bigdofba... At some point I realized it's time to dust my feet with an individual who doesn't want to look at the truth, only post propaganda that has been distributed by the mainstream science community. Just continue to post why you think there is no God, and I will continue to post why there is... Let the reader decide if they want to see for themselves ...

and you're not trying to open people's mind up... You are trying to shut them off from the very source that created them...GOD

[bobbywaves]

When I have asked a lot of simple questions, many of the responses I have gotten are links to websites or YouTube videos. For example, you totally avoided my questions about animals and fossils as it pertains to Noah's Ark. Science doesn't support a great flood.

YouTube videos such as the following are utilized to show Atheists the evidence you crave, yet you choose to ignore:

[BigDofBA]

I encourage people to consider both sides and reach their own conclusions.

Do you believe in the Supernatural?

Or

Do you believe in Science, math, and what we know about the world that has been proven?

I don't believe in having slaves or discriminating against gays or women. The bible has verses that preach that.

I don't believe snakes could talk, men could walk on water, people could live to be 900, and in the ability to part oceans or Seas. The Bible says this has happened yet no one has ever witnessed it.

If you choose to believe in supernatural explanations then fine. Just please, ask questions and keep an open mind.

[bobbywaves]

I don't believe snakes could talk, men could walk on water, people could live to be 900, and in the ability to part oceans or Seas. The Bible says this has happened yet no one has ever witnessed it.

How can you possibly say nobody has witnessed these things, just because you weren't alive to witness it?

All the witnesses you wish to talk to, are obviously dead. If you change your thinking & make it to Heaven one day, then you could interrogate these witnesses yourself. However, if you see God all your questions will be answered instantly.

[BigDofBA]

How can you possibly say nobody has witnessed these things, just because you weren't alive to witness it?

All the witnesses you wish to talk to, are obviously dead. If you change your thinking & make it to Heaven one day, then you could interrogate these witnesses yourself. However, if you see God all your questions will be answered instantly.

If God existed, he would surely appreciate my thought process.

After all, if God was real, that means he gave me the very brain that makes me question these things. Surely God would understand my doubts.

Is it fair that I didn't get to witness these things? Is it fair that no one on this earth has witnessed those things? How am I crazy for doubting something that no one alive has ever seen?

Is it fair that I only have two choices, heaven or hell, all because of Adam and Eve? People that came thousands or years before me? Is it fair that I have to pay for their shortcomings?

If my brother breaks the law, I don't pay for it. He does. Why should I pay for the sin of Adam and Eve? That isn't fair.

Why even make me exist and put me in that situation? I don't have free will because I only have two choices and God made me exist right? Why did God put me in this predicament?

Is it fair that someone can commit murder and then ask for forgiveness and goto heaven yet I can't go to heaven because I won't fake believing in a God whose very existence is debatable?

Other than playing along and putting on a front that I'm religious, I could live a perfect life and not get into heaven yet convicted felons can? WTF kind of messed up system is that?

The Bible says God is a fair and loving being yet none of his plan is fair or loving at all.

I guess Christians will get their heaven with golden gates, Muslims will get their heaven with 72 virgins, and others in India will be reincarnated.....

Bottom line, no one I know or will ever know, will see a talking snake, live in a whale or live to be 900. It's not possible yet some people believe it.

In current times God could easily prove his existence and save mankind but he chooses not to. It's because he doesn't exist.

I love the idea of getting a home made of gold, 72 virgins, and eternal life but I'm not naive enough to waste me one and only life "hoping" it happens.

[Snowball]

My aunt was in the hospital ready to get a feeding tube with internal bleeding,
I prayed this to St. Rocco and hours later she recovered, no feeding tube, saw her
today and she will be released soon.

[brainfreeze]

My aunt was in the hospital ready to get a feeding tube with internal bleeding,
I prayed this to St. Rocco and hours later she recovered, no feeding tube, saw her
today and she will be released soon.

You're a catholic snowball? Repetitive prayer, asking the dead to pray ? No one comes to the Father but by Jesus... This is scripture, if you have scripture showing to talk to God through saints, I'd love to see that..

[BigDofBA]

To anyone that has prayed for something and gotten the result they've wanted, I am thankful. I'm glad everything has worked out for you.

With that said, it still doesn't explain anything to me. You're either going to get the result you want or you won't. For every time some one preys and their prayer is answered, another person's prayers aren't answered. People pray for their loved ones everyday and it doesn't work out in their favor.

Why give glory to God when a loved one gets better? Why did God let them get ill in the first place? So God let your loved one suffer and only after you prayed to him did he make them better? Then you praise him for it?

Why even bother to take your loved one to the hospital? Why not just stay home and leave it in "God's hands"?

Why even pray of God has a plan? He will do what he wants anyway.

We pray for Paris after a terrorist attack. We pray for Belgium. We pray for Orlando. We pray for Nice...none of the prayer has helped since horrible things keep happening.

Again, I'm happy for Snowball and Bobby, I'm just continuing the conversation.

If you have so much faith in God, why use the science and technology at a hospital?

[brainfreeze]

This guy gets it.... Being nice, and political correctness could be the end of us... Covering up THE CROSS so muslims will enter churches, shame on whoever does that... All this " trying to respect " other religions will bite when it has the chance...

Turkey was greek and Christian ... Now not even 1 percent Christian, less than a hundred years might not exist there at all...and I guess we all know what runs turkey now right? ...

[bobbywaves]

If God existed, he would surely appreciate my thought process.

God wouldn't appreciate any thought process which includes non belief in Him.

Is it fair that I only have two choices, heaven or hell, all because of Adam and Eve? People that came thousands or years before me? Is it fair that I have to pay for their shortcomings? If my brother breaks the law, I don't pay for it. He does. Why should I pay for the sin of Adam and Eve? That isn't fair.

Quite fair on all accounts. Jesus died for our sins. If you decide not to believe in Him & repent your sins, that's on you, not on Adam & Eve's shortcomings.

Why even make me exist and put me in that situation? I don't have free will because I only have two choices and God made me exist right? Why did God put me in this predicament?

This life is a test & you're failing. The good news is you may have time to find God. But if you get hit by a bus tonight, I'm afraid your soul will be turned over to Satan.

Is it fair that someone can commit murder and then ask for forgiveness and goto heaven yet I can't go to heaven because I won't fake believing in a God whose very existence is debatable?

Quite fair. At least the murderer repented his sin to God, while you won't even acknowledge God at all. Why would you expect to be accepted into Heaven, without faith in God's existence?

Other than playing along and putting on a front that I'm religious, I could live a perfect life and not get into heaven yet convicted felons can? WTF kind of messed up system is that?

God's simple system, which requires faith. If you think God's easy system is messed up, wait until you see Satan's messed up system.

The Bible says God is a fair and loving being yet none of his plan is fair or loving at all.

If this were true, then it stands to reason your opinion should be shared by the majority instead of the minority.

Why are there invocation prayers prior to Nascar races? Why don't any atheist drivers/people in the crowd protest this prayer by pulling a Colin Kaepernick & not standing, or throw beer bottles & riot in protest? Are Atheists petrified of going to jail or getting their ass kicked by God fearing folk?

[BigDofBA]

God wouldn't appreciate any thought process which includes non belief in Him.

How do you know? I've lived an honest life, treated others well, helped people in need, and been a good person in my community.

This life is a test & you're failing. The good news is you may have time to find God. But if you get hit by a bus tonight, I'm afraid your soul will be turned over to Satan.

Actually, I do well for myself in life. I also try to help people and have a positive impact on those around me. I don't believe in something because I'm afraid of Hell. I don't believe in something just because I want the reward of heaven. It would be easy to act like a Christian in case I'm wrong. With that said, I believe so strongly I am right, I'm taking a bigger risk than you.

Quite fair. At least the murderer repented his sin to God, while you won't even acknowledge God at all. Why would you expect to be accepted into Heaven, without faith in God's existence?

So murderers and rapist can still get into heaven but I can't even though I live a good honest life? LMAO. You're proving my point for me. If I make a mistake or screw up, I feel guilty about it and try not to repeat the mistake. If a Christian makes a mistake so what? They're fine because they've accepted Jesus Christ as their lord and savior....what an unbelievable privilege to have. That probably explains all the Catholic priests that molest people and do horrible things. They still get into Heaven over me....

God's simple system, which requires faith. If you think God's easy system is messed up, wait until you see Satan's messed up system.

Another problem I have. God had this "perfect plan", which required him to revise three times....first Adam and Eve, then Noah, and finally he had to send his son down......then there is the problem of Satan. God is powerful yet he does nothing to prevent Satan from existing. Why? He knows people will goto hell but he doesn't care. He just lets it happen.

Before you get into free will and all that BS, why does God need to test us anyway? For his entertainment?

Why does God even exist? Why did he make the human race knowing most of our poor souls would be banished to a Firey hell for eternity? Seems like a sick and demented diety to me.

That would be like me having a child and saying "you can like me and live or like your mother and die". Sounds stupid right?

Why are there invocation prayers prior to Nascar races? Why don't any atheist drivers/people in the crowd protest this prayer by pulling a Colin Kaepernick & not standing, or throw beer bottles & riot in protest? Are Atheists petrified of going to jail or getting their ass kicked by God fearing folk?

Atheists don't promote violence like the Quran or Bible do. Likewise, Atheists aren't dumb enough to get in fights or kill people over a mythical diety that no one can prove exists.

Don't you find it strange that the poorest, most obese, most uneducated states in the country are the most religious? I don't think this is a coincidence. Hell, I live in one of those states so it's all around me. I'm not saying the people are bad...I'm just pointing out facts.

I appreciate your responses. I'm not trying to change your mind because I already know that's not possible. I'm just trying to get you to understand my perspective.

[brainfreeze]

So murderers and rapist can still get into heaven but I can't even though I live a good honest life? LMAO. You're proving my point for me. If I make a mistake or screw up, I feel guilty about it and try not to repeat the mistake. If a Christian makes a mistake so what? They're fine because they've accepted Jesus Christ as their lord and savior....what an unbelievable privilege to have. That probably explains all the Catholic priests that molest people and do horrible things. They still get into Heaven over me....

.

Nay... This is part of a " once saved, always saved " agenda ...which is false, here's scripture

John " 6:66 "

66From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.

It's saying some were disciples, then " turned away " and walked no more with Christ... They weren't saved,

I will pick my spots answering some of your questions because it gets to be rhetorical ..but this is a good question, here's a answer...if you aren't getting it, hope someone is...

[BigDofBA]

Nay... This is part of a " once saved, always saved " agenda ...which is false, here's scripture

John " 6:66 "

66From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.

It's saying some were disciples, then " turned away " and walked no more with Christ... They weren't saved,

I will pick my spots answering some of your questions because it gets to be rhetorical ..but this is a good question, here's a answer...if you aren't getting it, hope someone is...

Thank you for googling something to try to answer my questions.

You are correct. Some of it is rhetorical. With that said, religious people can't agree on what's correct and what isn't. What you just said, which is logical, contradicts what Bobby said.

[brainfreeze]

Thank you for googling something to try to answer my questions.

You are correct. Some of it is rhetorical. With that said, religious people can't agree on what's correct and what isn't. What you just said, which is logical, contradicts what Bobby said.

I didn't " Google " the answer ... Some things are discussed amongst Christians (had this talk a while back), and the Spirit discerns, the mind & heart accepts what the truth is ...

And it's not what I say... This is scripture " John 6:66 ", now if bob is supporting a once saved always saved perspective, he has to back that up with scripture... We all fall, Peter denied Christ 3x, yet died preaching Christ... He kept walking... Some will turn away, and they won't walk anymore, get distracted by the world, or lose something they love and blame God, see a preacher do wrong and have doubt casted in their heart etc. etc. many different reasons...just like with these disciples, they couldn't understand what Jesus was saying, so they took it upon themselves to think they understood and to walk away from Him... The 11 didn't (12 if you want to include judas) judas was another, he did even worse by selling Jesus out to be killed for monetary gain... You think he's in heaven...nay


but yes, some of it, it seems you ask the same questions and are expecting different answers as if the ones given just aren't enough for you to search and start your own journey seeking...but being good isn't good enough, there are things you just can't do...one is earning your way to heaven. It's a gift...

[BigDofBA]

Nay... This is part of a " once saved, always saved " agenda ...which is false, here's scripture

John " 6:66 "

66From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.

It's saying some were disciples, then " turned away " and walked no more with Christ... They weren't saved,

I will pick my spots answering some of your questions because it gets to be rhetorical ..but this is a good question, here's a answer...if you aren't getting it, hope someone is...

So just because you are saved once doesn't mean you will always be saved?

You don't have to keep answering the same questions. I keep asking the same questions because I'm not getting answers I deem sufficient. This is nothing against you. This is more an indictment on the Bible.

That verse you just quoted is vague and can be interpreted many different ways. Again, another problem with the Bible....

John 3:15 states that whoever believes in Jesus Christ will "have eternal life". If you believe in Christ today and have eternal life, but lose it tomorrow I guess it was never eternal was it? This means the promise of eternal salvation is a lie and the Bible is wrong and contradicts itself

This is another major problem I have with religion. You have people within the same sects of different religions that interpret things differently. People can't even get on the same page. One person can quote one verse as their evidence and another person can quote another verse that totally contradicts it (because it's bs).

Obviously both can't be true. So by using deductive reasoning, I can reach conclusions that a lot of the Bible must be false.

If salvation can be taken away, how in the hell am I supposed to know if I've sinned to the point that I am no longer going to heaven? How in the hell can you play the game if you don't even know the rules?

If two people were taking me on a trip somewhere and both people told me they knew the way, then when we were in the car they couldn't agree if we needed to go north or south, I would start doubting that they knew where they were going. These is what I see with Religion as evidenced by the many thousands of religions that exist.

[brainfreeze]

So just because you are saved once doesn't mean you will always be saved?

You don't have to keep answering the same questions. I keep asking the same questions because I'm not getting answers I deem sufficient. This is nothing against you. This is more an indictment on the Bible.

That verse you just quoted is vague and can be interpreted many different ways. Again, another problem with the Bible....

John 3:15 states that whoever believes in Jesus Christ will "have eternal life". If you believe in Christ today and have eternal life, but lose it tomorrow I guess it was never eternal was it? This means the promise of eternal salvation is a lie and the Bible is wrong and contradicts itself

This is another major problem I have with religion. You have people within the same sects of different religions that interpret things differently. People can't even get on the same page. One person can quote one verse as their evidence and another person can quote another verse that totally contradicts it (because it's bs).

Obviously both can be true. So by using deductive reasoning, I can reach conclusions that a lot of the Bible must be false.

If salvation can be taken away, how in the hell am I supposed to know if I've sinned to the point that I am no longer going to heaven? How in the hell can you play the game if you don't even know the rules?

No they can't ... There are no contradictions in scripture, only mans misunderstanding and confusion...

and that verse " John 3:15 " is meant for people who don't blow like the wind... Especially as an adult, one day you are here and believe the next day you are there and don't believe, is Luke warm, it is written " He will spew you from His mouth " if one is lukewarm... Gods system is built on faith, after reading about Jesus in His gospel and one establishes this is truth in their heart, and begins to make changes being guided by God, this is a trust one has put into His Words, that have sank into ones heart.... It doesn't just change because we don't understand something, or something bad happens... If one does give up that easily... That one was never meant for God or eternal life to begin with, that one has their reward... The world


but to answer the last part... Be saved, and let God start working on your life, let the Holy Spirit guide you into perfection... A good analogy is like a cup of coffee (black) and you start pouring water in this cup...the more you pour continually the clearer the cup will become ...becoming perfect is a process, a process one has to be willing to go through with... Adapting to a new life " reborn " ...

also there is different sects for a reason... Some will try to cheat their way to God, he leads them to disillusion and let's them be decieved because that's what's in their heart... The ones that go into " a rattle snake church " with a good heart and the Holy Spirit guiding will quickly tell them RUN...get out of there, and they will, but the different sects are there with reason...this used to trouble me a bit myself...

[b1slickguy]

Believing in something without proof is insanity IMO.

Posting something saying it is "undeniable" proof the bible is true is also insanity.

Why do you guys choose to believe the Bible over the Quran or Book of Mormon? There are over 4000 religions. How do you know Christianity is the correct religion?

They can't all be right.....which leads me to believe none of them are right.

The Bible was written by man. It's an imperfect book with many contradictions and horrible stories of murder and discrimination. Those stories are ignored while the good stories are taught to children.

The Bible explains things that man was too stupid to understand back in the day. Science disproves the Bible time and time again but the Bible never disproves science.

[BigDofBA]

No they can't ... There are no contradictions in scripture, only mans misunderstanding and confusion...

and that verse " John 3:15 " is meant for people who don't blow like the wind... Especially as an adult, one day you are here and believe the next day you are there and don't believe, is Luke warm, it is written " He will spew you from His mouth " if one is lukewarm... Gods system is built on faith, after reading about Jesus in His gospel and one establishes this is truth in their heart, and begins to make changes being guided by God, this is a trust one has put into His Words, that have sank into ones heart.... It doesn't just change because we don't understand something, or something bad happens... If one does give up that easily... That one was never meant for God or eternal life to begin with, that one has their reward... The world


but to answer the last part... Be saved, and let God start working on your life, let the Holy Spirit guide you into perfection... A good analogy is like a cup of coffee (black) and you start pouring water in this cup...the more you pour continually the clearer the cup will become ...becoming perfect is a process, a process one has to be willing to go through with... Adapting to a new life " reborn " ...

also there is different sects for a reason... Some will try to cheat their way to God, he leads them to disillusion and let's them be decieved because that's what's in their heart... The ones that go into " a rattle snake church " with a good heart and the Holy Spirit guiding will quickly tell them RUN...get out of there, and they will, but the different sects are there with reason...this used to trouble me a bit myself...

Brainfreeze...I appreciate your input. We will continue to disagree. I have no hard feelings toward you. I've rattled off several questions and you're really the only person to try to answer them...Bobby did a little, although you two don't seem to agree on everything eitehr.

[brainfreeze]

Brainfreeze...I appreciate your input. We will continue to disagree. I have no hard feelings toward you. I've rattled off several questions and you're really the only person to try to answer them...Bobby did a little, although you two don't seem to agree on everything eitehr.

That's fine... I love you, and the readers enough to tell you this stuff, or I'd be doing something else or just read and say nothing... I don't have hard feelings towards you either but sometimes I have to let people figure out the hard way, when God is calling for you, it would be wise to open the door to Him... As you get older, some get set in their ways and then it's even a harder task to overcome and get where some rightfully belong...

As for bob, I think his heart is in the right place and doesn't have a specific agenda or have researched properly to understand why he thinks catholic is a good practice... because if one leaves it to the pope, anything can happen. Tomorrow the pope could say jews don't need to believe in Jesus to get to heaven (which I hear he already did) or say muslims are our brothers (which he's done as well, having them over at vatican) or saying " a personal relationship with Jesus is dangerous " ...then one has to agree with his thought... Which I don't, and a lot of other parts of the practice but thats not here nor there... I think bob is genuine, and just believes in Jesus, is he perfect yet? Probably not... but he has faith in Jesus, most times that's enough... God is simple. We make it complex and maze looking...

[bobbywaves]

How do you know? I've lived an honest life, treated others well, helped people in need, and been a good person in my community.

I know God wouldn't appreciate any thought process which includes non belief in Him, since I'm familiar with the first & all ten of His commandments: 1) “I am the Lord thy God, thou shalt not have any strange gods before Me.” This commandment insists on monotheism, the belief in one God.

But that's good you've lived an honest life, I obviously have no evidence to the contrary. Unfortunately, you need faith as well.

Actually, I do well for myself in life. I also try to help people and have a positive impact on those around me. I don't believe in something because I'm afraid of Hell. I don't believe in something just because I want the reward of heaven. It would be easy to act like a Christian in case I'm wrong. With that said, I believe so strongly I am right, I'm taking a bigger risk than you.

Correct, you're taking a huge risk no religious person is willing to take. Not sure how you could believe so strongly your Atheist belief is 100% right, when the % numbers & evidence are clearly not in your favor.

So murderers and rapist can still get into heaven but I can't even though I live a good honest life? LMAO. You're proving my point for me. If I make a mistake or screw up, I feel guilty about it and try not to repeat the mistake. If a Christian makes a mistake so what? They're fine because they've accepted Jesus Christ as their lord and savior....what an unbelievable privilege to have. That probably explains all the Catholic priests that molest people and do horrible things. They still get into Heaven over me.

Not sure what you didn't understand about my prior explanation. If a murderer repents & accepts God, his soul will be saved.

Many people make the mistake of believing that God forgives “little” sins such as lying, anger, and impure thoughts, but does not forgive “big” sins such as murder and adultery. This is not true. There is no sin too big that God cannot forgive it. When Jesus died on the cross, He died to pay the penalty for all of the sins of the entire world (1 John 2:2). When a person places his faith in Jesus Christ for salvation, all of his sins are forgiven. That includes past, present, and future, big or small. Jesus died to pay the penalty for all of our sins, and once they are forgiven, they are all forgiven (Colossians 1:14; Acts 10:43).

We are all guilty of sin (Romans 3:23) and deserve eternal punishment (Romans 6:23). Jesus died for us, to pay our penalty (Romans 5:8). Anyone who believes in Jesus Christ for salvation is forgiven, no matter what sins he has committed (Romans 6:23; John 3:16). Now, a murderer or adulterer will likely still face serious consequences (legal, relational, etc.) for his evil actions – more so than someone who was “just” a liar. But a murderer’s or adulterer’s sins are completely and permanently forgiven the moment he believes and places his faith in Christ.

It is not the size of the sin that is the determining factor here; it is the size of the atoning sacrifice of Christ. If the shed blood of the sinless Lamb of God is sufficient to cover all the sins of all the millions of people who would ever believe in Him, then there can be no limit to the size or types of sins covered. When He said, “It is finished,” sin was made an end of, full atonement and satisfaction for it were given, complete pardon was obtained, peace was made, and redemption from all sin was achieved. It was sure and certain and complete; nothing needs to be, or could be, added to it. Further, it was done entirely without the help of man, and cannot be undone.

Another problem I have. God had this "perfect plan", which required him to revise three times....first Adam and Eve, then Noah, and finally he had to send his son down......then there is the problem of Satan. God is powerful yet he does nothing to prevent Satan from existing. Why? He knows people will goto hell but he doesn't care. He just lets it happen.

You make it sound like God is somehow to blame for people being in Hell. People in Hell chose not to believe in God, they chose not to repent their sins. How exactly is this God's problem?

Satan is NOT God's evil twin; Satan is angel, one of a class of intelligent created beings, just as humans are. Part of allowing angels and humans to exist as autonomous beings is allowing them to embrace or reject God's ways. God can't allow this if he simply destroys any created intelligent being who rejects Him.

Before you get into free will and all that BS, why does God need to test us anyway? For his entertainment?

In both the Old and New Testaments, the words translated “test” mean “to prove by trial.” Therefore, when God tests His children, His purpose is to prove that our faith is real. Not that God needs to prove it to Himself since He knows all things, but He is proving to us that our faith is real, that we are truly His children, and that no trial will overcome our faith.

Why does God even exist? Why did he make the human race knowing most of our poor souls would be banished to a Firey hell for eternity? Seems like a sick and demented diety to me.

The question should be "why do we exist?", because God is self sustaining. There is no reason that God exists, because God created the very concept of reason!

God is who He chooses to Be, and among other things, He chose to be our creator.

That would be like me having a child and saying "you can like me and live or like your mother and die". Sounds stupid right?

Correct, the analogy does sound stupid.

Atheists don't promote violence like the Quran or Bible do. Likewise, Atheists aren't dumb enough to get in fights or kill people over a mythical diety that no one can prove exists.

Unlike the Bible, atheists don't "promote" God. Likewise, Atheists are dumb enough to burn in Hell for all eternity.

Don't you find it strange that the poorest, most obese, most uneducated states in the country are the most religious?

Do I find it strange that there's a McDonald's located near a Mississippi church?

No, not at all.

I appreciate your responses. I'm not trying to change your mind because I already know that's not possible. I'm just trying to get you to understand my perspective.

No problem...Understood, we can agree to disagree on the subject. If you don't find God, my hope is someone else reading this thread will.

[brainfreeze]

I know God wouldn't appreciate any thought process which includes non belief in Him, since I'm familiar with the first & all ten of His commandments: 1) “I am the Lord thy God, thou shalt not have any strange gods before Me.” This commandment insists on monotheism, the belief in one God.

But that's good you've lived an honest life, I obviously have no evidence to the contrary. Unfortunately, you need faith as well.



Correct, you're taking a huge risk no religious person is willing to take. Not sure how you could believe so strongly your Atheist belief is 100% right, when the % numbers & evidence are clearly not in your favor.



Not sure what you didn't understand about my prior explanation. If a murderer repents & accepts God, his soul will be saved.

Many people make the mistake of believing that God forgives “little” sins such as lying, anger, and impure thoughts, but does not forgive “big” sins such as murder and adultery. This is not true. There is no sin too big that God cannot forgive it. When Jesus died on the cross, He died to pay the penalty for all of the sins of the entire world (1 John 2:2). When a person places his faith in Jesus Christ for salvation, all of his sins are forgiven. That includes past, present, and future, big or small. Jesus died to pay the penalty for all of our sins, and once they are forgiven, they are all forgiven (Colossians 1:14; Acts 10:43).

We are all guilty of sin (Romans 3:23) and deserve eternal punishment (Romans 6:23). Jesus died for us, to pay our penalty (Romans 5:8). Anyone who believes in Jesus Christ for salvation is forgiven, no matter what sins he has committed (Romans 6:23; John 3:16). Now, a murderer or adulterer will likely still face serious consequences (legal, relational, etc.) for his evil actions – more so than someone who was “just” a liar. But a murderer’s or adulterer’s sins are completely and permanently forgiven the moment he believes and places his faith in Christ.

It is not the size of the sin that is the determining factor here; it is the size of the atoning sacrifice of Christ. If the shed blood of the sinless Lamb of God is sufficient to cover all the sins of all the millions of people who would ever believe in Him, then there can be no limit to the size or types of sins covered. When He said, “It is finished,” sin was made an end of, full atonement and satisfaction for it were given, complete pardon was obtained, peace was made, and redemption from all sin was achieved. It was sure and certain and complete; nothing needs to be, or could be, added to it. Further, it was done entirely without the help of man, and cannot be undone.



You make it sound like God is somehow to blame for people being in Hell. People in Hell chose not to believe in God, they chose not to repent their sins. How exactly is this God's problem?

Satan is NOT God's evil twin; Satan is angel, one of a class of intelligent created beings, just as humans are. Part of allowing angels and humans to exist as autonomous beings is allowing them to embrace or reject God's ways. God can't allow this if he simply destroys any created intelligent being who rejects Him.



In both the Old and New Testaments, the words translated “test” mean “to prove by trial.” Therefore, when God tests His children, His purpose is to prove that our faith is real. Not that God needs to prove it to Himself since He knows all things, but He is proving to us that our faith is real, that we are truly His children, and that no trial will overcome our faith.



The question should be "why do we exist?", because God is self sustaining. There is no reason that God exists, because God created the very concept of reason!

God is who He chooses to Be, and among other things, He chose to be our creator.



Correct, the analogy does sound stupid.



Unlike the Bible, atheists don't "promote" God. Likewise, Atheists are dumb enough to burn in Hell for all eternity.



Do I find it strange that there's a McDonald's located near a Mississippi church?

No, not at all.



No problem...Understood, we can agree to disagree on the subject. If you don't find God, my hope is someone else reading this thread will.

And we don't disagree as much as you think...I'm in agreement with all of this..

[brainfreeze]

And we don't disagree as much as you think...I'm in agreement with all of this..

But I'm not in agreement with catholicism ... and if one understands what's wrong with a particular " sect " and agrees to be led by it, they're guilty by association, which can and will lead others to the same outcome. Some like the " brotherhood " aspect like the jesuits..some like the stature one can get by being associated, look at the big universities, charities, banking, foundations, and churches involved with such ... But if some understand the wrong then they are complacent...God knows the heart, not my job...

[bobbywaves]

For those of you who question if God listens to us, check this out:

I agree this thread is reserved for God, but SBR...

http://www.sportsbookreview.com/forum/players-talk/3304200-men-going-see-springsteen-tonight-philly-my-70th-show.html

[brainfreeze]

For those of you who question if God listens to us, check this out:

I agree this thread is reserved for God, but SBR...


http://www.sportsbookreview.com/foru...70th-show.html

The audacity to put that in this thread ... As if God made it come to pass, was this Gods will or phillyguy? ...as i was saying, don't think bobs perfect, but I don't know his heart or where he is, that's Gods job to know the intent and discernment of men...moving on

[BigDofBA]

Bobby said there is no sin that is "too big that God can't forgive it".

That means you could kill someone and still goto heaven yet someone could live a good loving life and not get in if they don't profess their allegiance to God....

Really guys?

So I could do everything right, help others, be a good productive member of society and donate to charities but I'm not going to get in and the dude serving life in prison for rape or murder is going to heaven because he "suddenly found God" after he got locked up?

Really guys? You're supposed to be members of the same religion and you both interpret it differently.

Then I have Muslims, Jews, Budists, Mormons, etc. telling me even crazier things. Then within Islam Sunnis and Shias don't agree and kill each other over it....

How is one supposed to know the rules to live by if people within the same religious sects can't even reach an agreement?

This is more evidence to me that it's all BS to control the weak minded. Depending on where you are born most likely depends on which bowl of shit you are fed. Just my two cents.

It's like "Hey, here are 4000 different religions. You have free will to choose one but if you choose incorrectly you're going to hell forever. Good luck buddy!"