Obama Releasing Birth Certificate Right Now

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  • rsnnh12
    SBR MVP
    • 09-26-10
    • 3487

    #281
    Originally posted by crustyme
    sure, just like when you claimed ford had turned it around without any gov't help, even though they had lost $17 billion from 2008-2009 and didn't turn a profit until obama implemented 'cash 4 clunkers'.

    or

    when you claimed cheney had no connections to haliburton when he was still on their payroll as vice president and held stock options worth millions.

    So losing money in the biggest recession in decades means they weren't turning it around?? They made the necessary changes to profit when the economy turned around, and without govt help.

    And again, he wasn't "on their payroll". He would have received that no matter what happened to Halliburton! What are you not understanding about this? "On their payroll" implies he's actively helping them, and only getting paid if Halliburton makes money. And, yet again, every penny of the stock options was donated to charity, EVEN THOUGH HE WAS NOT REQUIRED TO DO THAT. And he didn't hold the options... a 3rd party was in charge of them. Again, ignoring the facts, I'm shocked

    See, philswin? This is the stupidity you are dealing with.
    Comment
    • philswin
      SBR MVP
      • 04-18-07
      • 1279

      #282
      Originally posted by crustyme
      yet you keep putting the bulk of the blame on cuomo and fannie mae when evidence says otherwise.
      I stated that is where is really started re-read - Cuomo put out a huge 100 - 200 pages doument when he took over at HUD making new rules for Freddie and Fannie. It set alomst unattainable mandatory goals with huge fines attached. I was one of the first people to read that doument and worked on a lot of the Govt reporting and system modifications. Setting arbitrary goals for lending does not make any sense as you force Lenders and Purchases Freddie and Fannie to make loans to people who do not qualify. Housing agencies in almost every city and community groups like ACORN sprouted up during this time to recruit borrowers regradless of qualification so Fannie and Freddie could meet Coumos goals and avoid massive fnes and threats to pull their charters. If the person was not minimully qualified they assisted them in falsifying data and info to get them qualified. Law Suits sprung up that crushedl enders who denied borrowers, many times because someone with similiar qualification was approved. Automated Underwritng systems were in place to determine qualification and they should of then and now be used to determine qualification wih no exception. Our Financial system does give a perso the opportunity torebuild there credit but it takes and we have seen the consequences of allowing un-qualified buyers to purchase loans

      Fannie Mae embraced Cuoumos quotoes early and their trilion dollar commitments to serve under-served borrowers was another way of allowing un-qualified borrowers to get mortgages. Freddie was slow to come aboard and was fined and threatened by Cuomo, they thought the way to increase home ownership was with Education and outreach, they invested a lot of money on education borrowers on Credit, savings and Home Purchases. Their HQ office was protested numerous times by community groups. They blocked the entrances and chanted crap all day about racist Freddie etc etc etc. HUD won that battle

      And that was the beginning of the sub-prime debacle
      Comment
      • crustyme
        SBR Posting Legend
        • 09-29-10
        • 16896

        #283
        losing $17 billion in 1.5 years is turning it around? their largest loss in company history btw.

        the only reason they turned a profit in 3qt 2009 was thanks to the record sales they benefited from 'cash 4 clunkers.' and last time i checked 2009 was still a recession, wasn't it? at least according to all you neocons we're still in one.

        what part of cheney was on their payroll while vp do you not understand? they wrote those checks to him didn't they, and he cashed them didn't he?? doesn't matter that he donated the money. if you were making a donation, wouldn't you rather donate $8 million than $300k? he did that by awarding haliburton a $7 billion no bid contract. plus he said he wouldn't claim any tax deductions yet did so in the tune of $1 million, taking advantage of a loophole in the tax break for hurricane katrina victims. what a slimeball.
        Comment
        • crustyme
          SBR Posting Legend
          • 09-29-10
          • 16896

          #284
          Originally posted by philswin
          I stated that is where is really started re-read - Cuomo put out a huge 100 - 200 pages doument when he took over at HUD making new rules for Freddie and Fannie. It set alomst unattainable mandatory goals with huge fines attached. I was one of the first people to read that doument and worked on a lot of the Govt reporting and system modifications. Setting arbitrary goals for lending does not make any sense as you force Lenders and Purchases Freddie and Fannie to make loans to people who do not qualify. Housing agencies in almost every city and community groups like ACORN sprouted up during this time to recruit borrowers regradless of qualification so Fannie and Freddie could meet Coumos goals and avoid massive fnes and threats to pull their charters. If the person was not minimully qualified they assisted them in falsifying data and info to get them qualified. Law Suits sprung up that crushedl enders who denied borrowers, many times because someone with similiar qualification was approved. Automated Underwritng systems were in place to determine qualification and they should of then and now be used to determine qualification wih no exception. Our Financial system does give a perso the opportunity torebuild there credit but it takes and we have seen the consequences of allowing un-qualified buyers to purchase loans

          Fannie Mae embraced Cuoumos quotoes early and their trilion dollar commitments to serve under-served borrowers was another way of allowing un-qualified borrowers to get mortgages. Freddie was slow to come aboard and was fined and threatened by Cuomo, they thought the way to increase home ownership was with Education and outreach, they invested a lot of money on education borrowers on Credit, savings and Home Purchases. Their HQ office was protested numerous times by community groups. They blocked the entrances and chanted crap all day about racist Freddie etc etc etc. HUD won that battle

          And that was the beginning of the sub-prime debacle

          you can keep saying this till you're blue in the face but FACTS don't prove you right.

          Fact One: Fannie and Freddie’s primary business of subsidizing conventional loans was not a driver of the housing the bubble.

          Indeed, conventional loans represented less than a third of all mortgage originations during the peak price acceleration years.
          This was a phenomenon of private-label non-conventional loan securitization.
          1.1 Peaking in 2006 at a third of all mortgages originated, the volume of Alt-A and subprime mortgages was extraordinarily high
between 2004 and 2007. In 2005 and 2006, conventional, conforming mortgages accounted for approximately one-third of all
mortgages originated
          [ . . .]
          1.2 Private-label issuers played a large role in securitizing higher-risk mortgages from early 2004 to mid-2007 while the Enterprises
continued to guarantee primarily traditional mortgages.



          Fact Two: Fannie and Freddie lost market volume during the boom.

          That is, during the boom not only did the fraction of loans securitized by Fannie and Freddie fall, but the absolute number fell. At the same time the absolute number of private-label securitizations rose.
          There is a simple and obvious reason for this. The development of structured products meant that for many consumers the free market offered a more attractive loan than the government subsidized one.



          Fact Three: The major losses to Fannie and Freddie came through their expansion into guaranteeing non-traditional loans, not through their portfolio.


          That is, yes like every other financial entity Fannie and Freddie were buying subprime packages in the secondary market. However, these losses were relatively mild.
          The Investments and Capital Markets segment accounts for $21 billion, or 9 percent, of capital reduction from the end of 2007 through the second quarter of 2010. Losses in the Investments and Capital Markets segment stemmed from impairments of private-label securities, fair-value losses on securities, and fair-value losses on derivatives (used for hedging interest rate risk).

          Fact Four:The key change in the Fannie / Freddie business model was their expansion in the types of loans they willing to guarantee. In particular moving into the Alt-A and Interest-Only categories.

          As we can see these loans began to seriously underperform as the economy
          deteriorated. These loans were not a part of the original “crap hidden by structure” subprime business. Fannie / Freddie borrowers on had on average credit scores above 710 and equity (or down payment) of above 25%.


          Fact Five: The higher number of Alt-A and Interest Only loans combined with ultimately higher delinquency rates have meant that a plurality of losses have come from these two categories.

          These loans were vulnerable not because the borrowers were poor low-credit individuals that the government was taking pity upon but because the loan concepts were predicated on rising or at least stable housing prices.


          Fact Six: Areas with the largest collapse in home prices have accounted for most of Fannie and Freddie losses.
          Refer to the same graph above. This is further evidence that it was the collapse of the bubble and not betting on people who were poor credit risks that induced major losses at Fannie and Freddie.




          Comment
          • rsnnh12
            SBR MVP
            • 09-26-10
            • 3487

            #285
            Originally posted by crustyme
            losing $17 billion in 1.5 years is turning it around? their largest loss in company history btw.

            the only reason they turned a profit in 3qt 2009 was thanks to the record sales they benefited from 'cash 4 clunkers.' and last time i checked 2009 was still a recession, wasn't it? at least according to all you neocons we're still in one.

            what part of cheney was on their payroll while vp do you not understand? they wrote those checks to him didn't they, and he cashed them didn't he?? doesn't matter that he donated the money. if you were making a donation, wouldn't you rather donate $8 million than $300k? he did that by awarding haliburton a $7 billion no bid contract. plus he said he wouldn't claim any tax deductions yet did so in the tune of $1 million, taking advantage of a loophole in the tax break for hurricane katrina victims. what a slimeball.
            You sho am smart. Cheney doesn't award contracts, the Army Corps of Engineers does. And yes, they wrote him checks, but he had no incentive to help them turn profits, as his paychecks would have been the same amount no matter what. So where's the financial interest that he supposedly had?

            Got a quote for Cheney claiming he wouldn't take tax deductions on it? Any response to this post without a quote from Cheney saying that will be ignored, because you'll just continue on to other stupid, incorrect points
            Comment
            • philswin
              SBR MVP
              • 04-18-07
              • 1279

              #286
              [quote=crustyme;9804493]you can keep saying this till you're blue in the face but FACTS don't prove you right.

              Fact One: Fannie and Freddie’s primary business of subsidizing conventional loans was not a driver of the housing the bubble.

              Indeed, conventional loans represented less than a third of all mortgage originations during the peak price acceleration years.
              This was a phenomenon of private-label non-conventional loan securitization.
              1.1 Peaking in 2006 at a third of all mortgages originated, the volume of Alt-A and subprime mortgages was extraordinarily high
between 2004 and 2007. In 2005 and 2006, conventional, conforming mortgages accounted for approximately one-third of all
mortgages originated
              [ . . .]
              1.2 Private-label issuers played a large role in securitizing higher-risk mortgages from early 2004 to mid-2007 while the Enterprises
continued to guarantee primarily traditional mortgages.




              Fact Two: Fannie and Freddie lost market volume during the boom.



              That is, during the boom not only did the fraction of loans securitized by Fannie and Freddie fall, but the absolute number fell. At the same time the absolute number of private-label securitizations rose.

              There is a simple and obvious reason for this. The development of structured products meant that for many consumers the free market offered a more attractive loan than the government subsidized one.









              Fact Three: The major losses to Fannie and Freddie came through their expansion into guaranteeing non-traditional loans, not through their portfolio.




              That is, yes like every other financial entity Fannie and Freddie were buying subprime packages in the secondary market. However, these losses were relatively mild.

              The Investments and Capital Markets segment accounts for $21 billion, or 9 percent, of capital reduction from the end of 2007 through the second quarter of 2010. Losses in the Investments and Capital Markets segment stemmed from impairments of private-label securities, fair-value losses on securities, and fair-value losses on derivatives (used for hedging interest rate risk).





              Fact Four:The key change in the Fannie / Freddie business model was their expansion in the types of loans they willing to guarantee. In particular moving into the Alt-A and Interest-Only categories.



              As we can see these loans began to seriously underperform as the economy

              deteriorated. These loans were not a part of the original “crap hidden by structure” subprime business. Fannie / Freddie borrowers on had on average credit scores above 710 and equity (or down payment) of above 25%.








              Fact Five: The higher number of Alt-A and Interest Only loans combined with ultimately higher delinquency rates have meant that a plurality of losses have come from these two categories.


              These loans were vulnerable not because the borrowers were poor low-credit individuals that the government was taking pity upon but because the loan concepts were predicated on rising or at least stable housing prices.







              Fact Six: Areas with the largest collapse in home prices have accounted for most of Fannie and Freddie losses.



              Refer to the same graph above. This is further evidence that it was the collapse of the bubble and not betting on people who were poor credit risks that induced major losses at Fannie and Freddie.



















              I really do not have the time to educate you any further. You can find a lot of bias articles of the internet repubs blaming Dems blaming Repubs. People also make decisions and politicians never admit fault the facts will be twisted and turned. We live in a bias country, you are too bias to learn anything, maybe when you can change later in life but you are 100% bias, no matter what happens you turn the argument Dems are right, repubs are wrong. There was never a good indicator of Market share many of the deals were AOT deals which were underwritten and issued as private label. These went through Freddie and Fannie and not counted in Market share (Neither Freddie or Fannie formally announced market share during the time) There is also no formal definition of ALT-A and Subprime anyone cam report any loan as ALT_A or Subprime or convential a lot of the stuff coming through Fannie/Freddie was considered Convential just based on the fact Fannie bought which was the generally accepted definition at the time. Unqualified people in Mortgages was the primary driver of the crisis, many things contributed to that. HUD sets the standards for the Mortgae Industry throug Freddie/Fannie, Lenders use there system to detrmine qualifications whether they sell to them or not
              Comment
              • crustyme
                SBR Posting Legend
                • 09-29-10
                • 16896

                #287
                so cheney had no influence on their decision?

                why did bush enforce a little known law to bypass the bidding process for the iraqi job?
                why were haliburton's competitors turned away by bush administration with claims that they had "no intentions to invade" when they were already in talks with haliburton for a month to put out iraqi oil well fires?

                oh and this:


                Cheney Coordinated Halliburton Iraq Contract: Report

                WASHINGTON - A Pentagon e-mail said Vice President Dick Cheney coordinated a huge Halliburton government contract for Iraq, despite Cheney's denial of interest in the company he ran until 2000.

                US Vice President Dick Cheney. A Pentagon e-mail said Cheney coordinated a huge Halliburton government contract for Iraq, despite Cheney's denial of interest in the company he ran until 2000. (AFP/Robert Sullivan)
                The March 5, 2003 e-mail, from an Army Corps of Engineers official, said that top Pentagon official Douglas Feith got the job of shepherding the contract, according to the newsweekly Time that hits newsstands Monday.
                Feith had approved the multi-billion-dollar deal "contingent on informing WH (the White House) tomorrow. We anticipate no issues since action has been coordinated w(ith) VP's (vice president's) office," said the e-mail obtained by Time.
                The newsweekly said it was three days later that Halliburton won the contract, although no other bids had been submitted.
                "As vice president, I have absolutely no influence of, involvement of, knowledge of in any way, shape or form of contracts led by the Corps of Engineers or anybody else in the federal government," Cheney told NBC's "Meet the Press" in September, Time said.
                Cheney had been Halliburton's CEO until 2000, when he accepted the vice presidential spot.
                Cheney's spokesman Kevin Kellems told the magazine that since 2000, the vice president "has played no role whatsoever in government-contract decisions involving Halliburton."
                The e-mail was sent "in anticipation of controversy over the award of a sole-source contract to Halliburton, we wanted to give the vice president's staff a heads-up," a Pentagon spokesman said. Under Secretary of Defense for Policy Douglas Feith was handed the job of coordinating the contract by his boss, Deputy Secretary of Defense Paul Wolfowitz, Time said. Feith, Wolfowitz and Cheney, along with Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld and Cheney's Chief of Staff Lewis "Scooter" Libby, form the core of Bush administration "hawks" who pushed for the war in Iraq.
                © Copyright 2004 AFP




                as for the tax deductions, i already previously cited a senator's website which said cheney's lawyer professed that cheney would never use a tax deduction, yet did. the fact that he used a tax loophole for katrina victims is both shameful and immoral.
                Comment
                • crustyme
                  SBR Posting Legend
                  • 09-29-10
                  • 16896

                  #288
                  Originally posted by philswin
                  I really do not have the time to educate you any further. You can find a lot of bias articles of the internet repubs blaming Dems blaming Repubs. People also make decisions and politicians never admit fault the facts will be twisted and turned. We live in a bias country, you are too bias to learn anything, maybe when you can change later in life but you are 100% bias, no matter what happens you turn the argument Dems are right, repubs are wrong. There was never a good indicator of Market share many of the deals were AOT deals which were underwritten and issued as private label. These went through Freddie and Fannie and not counted in Market share (Neither Freddie or Fannie formally announced market share during the time) There is also no formal definition of ALT-A and Subprime anyone cam report any loan as ALT_A or Subprime or convential a lot of the stuff coming through Fannie/Freddie was considered Convential just based on the fact Fannie bought which was the generally accepted definition at the time. Unqualified people in Mortgages was the primary driver of the crisis, many things contributed to that. HUD sets the standards for the Mortgae Industry throug Freddie/Fannie, Lenders use there system to detrmine qualifications whether they sell to them or not

                  who am i going to believe? investigations from highly respected publications, professors, economists, etc. or some random biased guy on the internet????

                  hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm................ that's a tough one.

                  Comment
                  • 8ArIvd5
                    SBR MVP
                    • 04-24-10
                    • 3175

                    #289
                    dumb people can't even agree to disagree.
                    Comment
                    • kmarinouofm
                      SBR Hall of Famer
                      • 01-26-09
                      • 8437

                      #290
                      who cares... its not like he is the real president..

                      guy is about as important as the Prince and Queen of England
                      Comment
                      • philswin
                        SBR MVP
                        • 04-18-07
                        • 1279

                        #291
                        Give up you lose. You do not understand the subject matter at hand. Do you do this every night? defending Democrats on a website by searching for any info you can find on the internet blaming Repubs. Ignoring anything that may counter them. Dont you have classes to study for or something more value added to do. You can find tons of articles on the internet claiming Dick Cheney ordered the 9-11 attacks to. I guess you believe that.
                        Comment
                        • crustyme
                          SBR Posting Legend
                          • 09-29-10
                          • 16896

                          #292
                          democratic sites? lol

                          that's what biased neocons always claim when confronted with FACTS.

                          Comment
                          • falconticket
                            SBR MVP
                            • 09-05-10
                            • 3414

                            #293
                            haha crustyme still spewing his bs.
                            Comment
                            • falconticket
                              SBR MVP
                              • 09-05-10
                              • 3414

                              #294
                              Fukkin Bush was responsible for everything since the civil war, you didnt know that.
                              Comment
                              • rsnnh12
                                SBR MVP
                                • 09-26-10
                                • 3487

                                #295
                                Originally posted by crustyme
                                so cheney had no influence on their decision?

                                why did bush enforce a little known law to bypass the bidding process for the iraqi job?
                                why were haliburton's competitors turned away by bush administration with claims that they had "no intentions to invade" when they were already in talks with haliburton for a month to put out iraqi oil well fires?

                                oh and this:


                                Cheney Coordinated Halliburton Iraq Contract: Report

                                WASHINGTON - A Pentagon e-mail said Vice President Dick Cheney coordinated a huge Halliburton government contract for Iraq, despite Cheney's denial of interest in the company he ran until 2000.

                                US Vice President Dick Cheney. A Pentagon e-mail said Cheney coordinated a huge Halliburton government contract for Iraq, despite Cheney's denial of interest in the company he ran until 2000. (AFP/Robert Sullivan)
                                The March 5, 2003 e-mail, from an Army Corps of Engineers official, said that top Pentagon official Douglas Feith got the job of shepherding the contract, according to the newsweekly Time that hits newsstands Monday.
                                Feith had approved the multi-billion-dollar deal "contingent on informing WH (the White House) tomorrow. We anticipate no issues since action has been coordinated w(ith) VP's (vice president's) office," said the e-mail obtained by Time.
                                The newsweekly said it was three days later that Halliburton won the contract, although no other bids had been submitted.
                                "As vice president, I have absolutely no influence of, involvement of, knowledge of in any way, shape or form of contracts led by the Corps of Engineers or anybody else in the federal government," Cheney told NBC's "Meet the Press" in September, Time said.
                                Cheney had been Halliburton's CEO until 2000, when he accepted the vice presidential spot.
                                Cheney's spokesman Kevin Kellems told the magazine that since 2000, the vice president "has played no role whatsoever in government-contract decisions involving Halliburton."
                                The e-mail was sent "in anticipation of controversy over the award of a sole-source contract to Halliburton, we wanted to give the vice president's staff a heads-up," a Pentagon spokesman said. Under Secretary of Defense for Policy Douglas Feith was handed the job of coordinating the contract by his boss, Deputy Secretary of Defense Paul Wolfowitz, Time said. Feith, Wolfowitz and Cheney, along with Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld and Cheney's Chief of Staff Lewis "Scooter" Libby, form the core of Bush administration "hawks" who pushed for the war in Iraq.
                                © Copyright 2004 AFP




                                as for the tax deductions, i already previously cited a senator's website which said cheney's lawyer professed that cheney would never use a tax deduction, yet did. the fact that he used a tax loophole for katrina victims is both shameful and immoral.
                                Lol so 1 vague email, which isn't even shown, is your proof Cheney was behind it?

                                You said Cheney said it... now you're saying 1 senator heard Cheney's lawyer say it... where's the proof the lawyer said it? Lol do you see how absurd this is?
                                Comment
                                • philswin
                                  SBR MVP
                                  • 04-18-07
                                  • 1279

                                  #296
                                  Originally posted by falconticket
                                  Fukkin Bush was responsible for everything since the civil war, you didnt know that.
                                  And give Crusty 10 minutes and he will find an article on the internet to prove it. He would be lost in a bar trying to make these arguments without his internet searchs. I hope he has a good smartphone
                                  Comment
                                  • kmarinouofm
                                    SBR Hall of Famer
                                    • 01-26-09
                                    • 8437

                                    #297
                                    I love lamp
                                    Comment
                                    • crustyme
                                      SBR Posting Legend
                                      • 09-29-10
                                      • 16896

                                      #298
                                      a top pentagon official involved in awarding the $7 billion to haliburton saying, and i quote "contingent on informing WH (the White House) tomorrow. We anticipate no issues since action has been coordinated w(ith) VP's (vice-president's) office" is too vague for you?

                                      talk about a neocon kook.
                                      Comment
                                      • crustyme
                                        SBR Posting Legend
                                        • 09-29-10
                                        • 16896

                                        #299
                                        Originally posted by philswin
                                        And give Crusty 10 minutes and he will find an article on the internet to prove it. He would be lost in a bar trying to make these arguments without his internet searchs. I hope he has a good smartphone

                                        i dont need the internet to know you are wrong. i only did it to show everyone how nutty and clueless you were about everything.
                                        Comment
                                        • rsnnh12
                                          SBR MVP
                                          • 09-26-10
                                          • 3487

                                          #300
                                          Originally posted by crustyme
                                          a top pentagon official involved in awarding the $7 billion to haliburton saying, and i quote "contingent on informing WH (the White House) tomorrow. We anticipate no issues since action has been coordinated w(ith) VP's (vice-president's) office" is too vague for you?

                                          talk about a neocon kook.
                                          Yea, it is vague. "Action has been coordinated w VPs office" could mean they already let the VPs office know about their decision, and they talked to Bush/White House officials. There is ZERO context given... you are making assumptions about what is being said.

                                          Lol @ no response to Cheney not saying anything about tax exemptions
                                          Comment
                                          • philswin
                                            SBR MVP
                                            • 04-18-07
                                            • 1279

                                            #301
                                            Go to bed you have class in the morning
                                            Comment
                                            • Win
                                              SBR Rookie
                                              • 04-26-11
                                              • 6

                                              #302
                                              Ron Paul 2012
                                              Comment
                                              • jarvol
                                                SBR Hall of Famer
                                                • 09-13-10
                                                • 6074

                                                #303
                                                Originally posted by Win
                                                Ron Paul 2012


                                                And for the record the Gramm-Leach-Bliely bill passed the Senate 90-8 and the House 362-57 on 11/4/1999. Bi-partisan indeed. Crusty just keeps on taking a beatdown.
                                                Comment
                                                • scratbandit
                                                  SBR Wise Guy
                                                  • 09-07-09
                                                  • 548

                                                  #304
                                                  pretty amazing all this stuff.
                                                  Comment
                                                  • crustyme
                                                    SBR Posting Legend
                                                    • 09-29-10
                                                    • 16896

                                                    #305
                                                    Originally posted by rsnnh12
                                                    Yea, it is vague. "Action has been coordinated w VPs office" could mean they already let the VPs office know about their decision, and they talked to Bush/White House officials. There is ZERO context given... you are making assumptions about what is being said.

                                                    Lol @ no response to Cheney not saying anything about tax exemptions

                                                    "contingent on informing WH (the White House) tomorrow. We anticipate no issues since action has been coordinated w(ith) VP's (vice-president's) office"

                                                    con-tin-gent: likely but not certain to happen

                                                    co-or-di-nat-ed: To work together harmoniously

                                                    nice attempt at a spin.


                                                    The Vice President has attempted to fend off criticism by signing an agreement to donate the after-tax profits from these stock options to charities of his choice, and his lawyer has said he will not take any tax deduction for the donations. Valued at over $9 million, the Vice President could exercise his stock options for a substantial windfall, benefiting not only his designated charities, but also providing Halliburton with a tax deduction.

                                                    Comment
                                                    • rsnnh12
                                                      SBR MVP
                                                      • 09-26-10
                                                      • 3487

                                                      #306
                                                      Originally posted by crustyme
                                                      "contingent on informing WH (the White House) tomorrow. We anticipate no issues since action has been coordinated w(ith) VP's (vice-president's) office"

                                                      con-tin-gent: likely but not certain to happen

                                                      co-or-di-nat-ed: To work together harmoniously

                                                      nice attempt at a spin.


                                                      The Vice President has attempted to fend off criticism by signing an agreement to donate the after-tax profits from these stock options to charities of his choice, and his lawyer has said he will not take any tax deduction for the donations. Valued at over $9 million, the Vice President could exercise his stock options for a substantial windfall, benefiting not only his designated charities, but also providing Halliburton with a tax deduction.



                                                      And what does the 'action' mentioned in that email refer to? Go ahead, please tell me how you know, because it isn't mentioned there.

                                                      Again, do you have a quote from Cheney or his lawyer saying that?? Its just hearsay if someone else says they did. That means its not proof.

                                                      So, yet again, do you have anything from CHENEY OR HIS LAWYER SAYING THAT? That senators word means nothing without proof
                                                      Comment
                                                      • falconticket
                                                        SBR MVP
                                                        • 09-05-10
                                                        • 3414

                                                        #307
                                                        hopeless
                                                        Comment
                                                        • ttwarrior1
                                                          BARRELED IN @ SBR!
                                                          • 06-23-09
                                                          • 28456

                                                          #308
                                                          OBAMA and his “SUPPOSED” LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE
                                                          WHAT ABOUT OBAMA’S
                                                          INDONESIAN CITIZENSHIP?
                                                          Obama is ‘not’ Constitutionally Eligible
                                                          to be President
                                                          (Lafayette Hill, PA – 04/28/11) - Philip J. Berg, Esquire, the first Attorney who filed suit against Barack H. Obama on August 21, 2008 challenging Obama’s lack of “Constitutionally Eligibility” to serve as President of the United States stated that Obama’s release of this document that Obama calls his long form Birth Certificate raises further questions of the legitimacy of the document itself. Moreover, even if it were a legitimate birth certificate, which it is not, it still does not answer the question of Obama’s Constitutional Eligibility.

                                                          Berg said, “The Birth Certificate issued by Obama on national Television, have missing factors: Mother’s address; length and weight of baby; and where the signature of Stanley Ann Dunham appears, it says “mother or informant”. Additionally, the authenticity of the document itself is already being questioned for many reasons”

                                                          Berg continued, “Even if Obama could produce a long form Birth Certificate, which is highly doubted, it fails to answer the questions into Obama’s adoption in Indonesia.”

                                                          Berg said, “I have received many calls claiming Obama couldnot have lost his U.S. citizenship by his mother’s acts of expatriation. In part this is true, however, he Nationality Act of 1940, revised 1952, Section 318(a) states, “A former citizen of the United States expatriated through the expatriation of such person’s parent or parents and who has not acquired the nationality of another country by any affirmative act other than the expatriation of his parent or parents may be naturalized upon filing a petition for naturalization before reaching age of Twenty-Five [25] years and upon compliance with all requirements of the naturalization laws with the following exceptions: (b) No former citizen of the United States, expatriated through the expatriation of such person’s parent or parents shall be obliged to comply with the requirements of the immigration laws, if he has not acquired the nationality of another country by any affirmative act other than the expatriation of his parent or parents, and if he has come or shall come to the United States before reaching the age of twenty-five years. (c) After his naturalization such person shall have the same citizenship status as if he had not been expatriated.”
                                                          Berg continues, “Renewing an Indonesian Passport after the age of 18 is an affirmative act, as you are swearing allegiance to another Country. Soetoro/Obama renewed his Indonesian Passport when he traveled to Pakistan that is why he had to stop in Indonesia first. Remember, in 1981, Dunham was divorcing Soetoro in Hawaii and was not in Indonesia. Obama/Soetoro admits to traveling to Indonesia first and then onto Pakistan. Soetoro/Obama claims in his book “Dreams from my father” that he stopped in Indonesia to visit his mother. But again, his mother was not in Indonesia, she was in Hawaii with Maya, divorcing Lolo Soetoro. In addition, the State Department has stated in response to a FOIA [Freedom of Information] request that they do not have a U.S. Passport application on file for Barack H. Obama.”
                                                          Berg said, “Despite the above however, Indonesia required Obama/Soetoro to do a bit more upon his 18th birthday. In fact the Indonesian law gives until the age of Twenty-One [21]. Soetoro/Obama would have had to sign an Affidavit relinquishing his Indonesian citizenship and said Affidavit had to be sent to the Indonesian Government before reclaiming any U.S. citizenship he may have once held.
                                                          When it comes to the citizenship of individuals in other countries, we are prevented from interfering, Hague Convention 1930. During the late 60′s all the way up until 2006 Indonesia did not allow dual citizenship. In 2006, Indonesia changed their laws to permit dual citizenship; however, Indonesia has had its battles with enforcing their new law permitting dual citizenship.
                                                          From the legal research we have done, it appears that Soetoro became an Indonesian citizen. When Soetoro/Obama was approximately four [4] years old his parents divorced and thereafter, Soetoro/Obama’s mother, Stanley Ann Dunham, married Lolo Soetoro, a citizen of Indonesia. Evidence points to the fact that Lolo Soetoro either signed a government form legally ‘acknowledging’ Soetoro/Obama as his son or ‘adopted’ Soetoro, either of which changed any citizenship status Soetoro/Obama had to a “natural” citizen of Indonesia.
                                                          At the time Barry Soetoro was in Indonesia, all Indonesian students were required to carry government identity cards or Karty Tanda Pendudaks, as well as family card identification called a Kartu Keluarga. The Kartu Keluarga is a family card which bears the legal names and citizenship status of all family members.
                                                          Soetoro/Obama was registered in a public school as an Indonesian citizen by the name of Barry Soetoronot allow foreign students to attend their public schools in the late 1960’s or 1970’s, and any time a child was registered for a public school, the child’s name and citizenship status were verified through the Indonesian Government. Seeno way for Soetoro/Obama to have attended school in Jakarta, Indonesia legally unless he was an Indonesian citizen, as Indonesia was under tight rule and was a Police State. See Constitution of Republic of Indonesia (Undang-Undang Dasar Republik Indonesia 1945), Law No. 62 of 1958. These facts indicate that Obama/Soetoro is an Indonesian citizen, and therefore he is not eligible to be President of the United States. and his father was listed as Lolo Soetoro, M.A according to the Indonesian school records. Indonesia did Constitution of Republic of Indonesia (Undang-Undang Dasar Republik Indonesia 1945), Chapter 13, Law No. 62 of 1958 (all citizens of Indonesia have a right to education). There was
                                                          Under Indonesian law, when a male acknowledges a child as his son, it deems the son, in this case Soetoro/Obama, an Indonesian State citizen. See Constitution of Republic of Indonesia, Law No. 62 of 1958 concerning Immigration Affairs and Indonesian Civil Code (Kitab Undang-undang Hukum Perdata) (KUHPer) (Burgerlijk Wetboek voor Indonesie).
                                                          Furthermore, under the Indonesian adoption law, once an Indonesian citizen adopts a child, the adoption severs the child’s relationship to the birth parents, and the adopted child is given the same status as a natural child and the child takes the name of his step-father, in this case, Soetoro. See Indonesian Constitution, Article 2.
                                                          The Indonesian citizenship law was designed to prevent apatride (stateless) or bipatride (dual) citizenship. Indonesian regulations recognized neither apatride nor bipatride (stateless or dual) citizenship. Since Indonesia did not allow dual citizenship; neither did the United States (since the United States only permitted dual citizenship when ‘both’ countries agree); and since Obama/Soetoro was a “natural” citizen of Indonesia, the United States would not step in or interfere with the laws of Indonesia. Hague Convention of 1930.”
                                                          As a result of Soetoro/Obama’s Indonesian ‘natural’ citizenship status, Soetoro/Obama could never regain U.S. ‘natural born’ status, if he in fact he ever held such, which we doubt. Soetoro/Obama could have only become ‘naturalized’ if the proper paperwork were filed with the U.S. State Department, after going through U.S. Immigration upon his return to the United States; in which case, Soetoro/Obama would have received a Certification of Citizenship indicating ‘naturalized’.
                                                          Berg continued, “Regardless, we have been unable to locate any records indicating that Soetoro/Obama attempted to and/or actually did take the proper steps through the State Department in order to be here in our Country legally”
                                                          Further, there is no evidence that Soetoro/Obama ever ‘legally’ changed his name from Barry Soetoro to Barack Hussein Obama – therefore his legal name is still ‘Barry Soetoro’.
                                                          Comment
                                                          • ttwarrior1
                                                            BARRELED IN @ SBR!
                                                            • 06-23-09
                                                            • 28456

                                                            #309
                                                            Obama’s Hawaii Certificate
                                                            By Bishop Ron McCrae
                                                            The document released by the White House as Obama’s Certificate of Live Birth appears to be a fake! And a poor one at that. It doesn’t take a forensic specialists to see serious problems. After reviewing the form released in comparison to the earlier released Susan Nordyke Certificate, there is a real problem, for Obama’s appears to be duplicated directly from the Nordyke document. I call your attention to the obvious errors:
                                                            • Note the Hour block NO. 5b on Line 2 at the far right and you will see that the typed P.M. is the identical one from the Nordyke document, with the M below the line in the exact same place as the Nordyke document.
                                                            • The date of 8-7-61 in block No. 18b is the exact, identical written date copied from the Nordyke document, even though on the Nordyke document the signature of the parent is slanted backwards.
                                                            • Also note that on the Nordyke document, the parent signed the document on the supposedly same day that Ann Durham signed Obama’s, but the dates of the Attendant’s signature and the Local Registrar’s signature are the very next day; whereas on the Nordyke document, the signatures were affixed and dated four days later.
                                                            • In block 7g on both documents appears the identical hand written No. 2 in the very same place.
                                                            • In Block No. 3 appears identical hand written “x’s” in the same place on both documents.
                                                            • Also, the released photo of the Nordyke document shows the coiled slightly in the upper left hand corner, though laid onto what appears to be carpet or cloth. The Obama document has the identical coiled upper left hand corner, but the herringbone legal cross stitched pattern to the paper carries over into the background of the photo, though the upper left hand corner is blackened out. If you hold both up together, the curvatures in the lines are exactly the same. If you look closely at the herringbone legal print of the background on both the left and right side margins, the printed document is superimposed onto the legal background and not original.
                                                            • On the left side margin, there is a vertical margin line running up the entire side, with additional horizontal lines exposed to the left of the margin in the coiled down fold of the document. In those unidentified blocks are identical hand written marks that match identically to the Nordyke document.

                                                            I believe the document has enough errors to warrant a forensic expert and digital imagery technician’s full inspection, because it appears to be faked directly off the Nordyke certificate, and that done very poorly.
                                                            By the grace of God alone,
                                                            Ron McRae
                                                            Presiding Bishop
                                                            Anabaptists Churches Worldwide

                                                            Johnstown, Pennsylvania 15935
                                                            VULTUS IMAGO DEI
                                                            “Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?” -Romans 6:3
                                                            Comment
                                                            • JOHON8
                                                              SBR Hall of Famer
                                                              • 01-28-10
                                                              • 7712

                                                              #310
                                                              I love it. Right in the face of all those baseless, rhetorical racists.

                                                              The funniest part is he slow rolled all of them, it's like he had the Aces and waited until it stung the most. Look at all those republican commentators running into their caves now.
                                                              Comment
                                                              • kingdom
                                                                SBR Posting Legend
                                                                • 07-25-10
                                                                • 10099

                                                                #311
                                                                Originally posted by SpeedPro
                                                                Why in the world would anyone think that a man could make it all the way to the US presidency without meeting the requirements. That's the first thing they check!
                                                                best comment on this thread period!!!! you can't even get a job without a background check but he becomes president right under everyones noses??
                                                                Comment
                                                                • BiffTFinancial
                                                                  SBR Posting Legend
                                                                  • 01-29-09
                                                                  • 22670

                                                                  #312
                                                                  Originally posted by ttwarrior1
                                                                  Obama’s Hawaii Certificate
                                                                  By Bishop Ron McCrae
                                                                  The document released by the White House as Obama’s Certificate of Live Birth appears to be a fake! And a poor one at that. It doesn’t take a forensic specialists to see serious problems. After reviewing the form released in comparison to the earlier released Susan Nordyke Certificate, there is a real problem, for Obama’s appears to be duplicated directly from the Nordyke document. I call your attention to the obvious errors:
                                                                  • Note the Hour block NO. 5b on Line 2 at the far right and you will see that the typed P.M. is the identical one from the Nordyke document, with the M below the line in the exact same place as the Nordyke document.
                                                                  • The date of 8-7-61 in block No. 18b is the exact, identical written date copied from the Nordyke document, even though on the Nordyke document the signature of the parent is slanted backwards.
                                                                  • Also note that on the Nordyke document, the parent signed the document on the supposedly same day that Ann Durham signed Obama’s, but the dates of the Attendant’s signature and the Local Registrar’s signature are the very next day; whereas on the Nordyke document, the signatures were affixed and dated four days later.
                                                                  • In block 7g on both documents appears the identical hand written No. 2 in the very same place.
                                                                  • In Block No. 3 appears identical hand written “x’s” in the same place on both documents.
                                                                  • Also, the released photo of the Nordyke document shows the coiled slightly in the upper left hand corner, though laid onto what appears to be carpet or cloth. The Obama document has the identical coiled upper left hand corner, but the herringbone legal cross stitched pattern to the paper carries over into the background of the photo, though the upper left hand corner is blackened out. If you hold both up together, the curvatures in the lines are exactly the same. If you look closely at the herringbone legal print of the background on both the left and right side margins, the printed document is superimposed onto the legal background and not original.
                                                                  • On the left side margin, there is a vertical margin line running up the entire side, with additional horizontal lines exposed to the left of the margin in the coiled down fold of the document. In those unidentified blocks are identical hand written marks that match identically to the Nordyke document.

                                                                  I believe the document has enough errors to warrant a forensic expert and digital imagery technician’s full inspection, because it appears to be faked directly off the Nordyke certificate, and that done very poorly.
                                                                  By the grace of God alone,
                                                                  Ron McRae
                                                                  Presiding Bishop
                                                                  Anabaptists Churches Worldwide

                                                                  Johnstown, Pennsylvania 15935
                                                                  VULTUS IMAGO DEI
                                                                  “Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?” -Romans 6:3
                                                                  religious people truly are the stupidest and most gullible people on the fkn planet. operating a church comes with a tax exemption, but it's a real shame that it doesn't come with a clue.
                                                                  Comment
                                                                  • philswin
                                                                    SBR MVP
                                                                    • 04-18-07
                                                                    • 1279

                                                                    #313
                                                                    Originally posted by BiffTFinancial
                                                                    religious people truly are the stupidest and most gullible people on the fkn planet. operating a church comes with a tax exemption, but it's a real shame that it doesn't come with a clue.

                                                                    Religously Agnostic and Politically Independant Liberatarian leaning = Is freedom to think intelligently
                                                                    Comment
                                                                    • BiffTFinancial
                                                                      SBR Posting Legend
                                                                      • 01-29-09
                                                                      • 22670

                                                                      #314
                                                                      Originally posted by philswin


                                                                      Religously Agnostic and Politically Independant Liberatarian leaning = Is freedom to think intelligently
                                                                      5* comment. there's no such thing as autonomy when you allow someone else to own you...
                                                                      Comment
                                                                      • ByeShea
                                                                        SBR Hall of Famer
                                                                        • 06-30-08
                                                                        • 8105

                                                                        #315
                                                                        Originally posted by crustyme
                                                                        wait, aren't you the moron who thinks obama is to blame for the crackdown on offshore gaming when it was your fellow neocons who passed the unlawful internet gambling enforcement act back in 2006? gee, a dumb neocon supporting one of his own, what a shocker.
                                                                        Dickhead: Obama is to blame for the crackdown on offshore gaming.

                                                                        There's no better way to gauge the businesses health then by its affiliate activity and US affiliate activity has ground to a screeching halt over the past 5 months. When affiliates walk away from the game you don't even need to hear an operator's sentiment.

                                                                        It was not like this under Bush, it was not like this earlier in Obama's administration.

                                                                        The Obama DOJ is applying the heat. Maybe you can ask players and sportsbooks how they are now vs. 2006 or 2008?

                                                                        And this topic you bring up is not a judgment on Obama, but a judgment on you being an amusing asslicker.
                                                                        Comment
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