Jordan vs Kobe

**The Madcap** · 03-31-11, 11:25 PM

Originally posted by crustyme

if bird played without mchale for 5 seasons and never recorded a winning season, wouldnt that tarnish his legacy?

your analogy is faulty because both jordan and kobe got a chance to show what they are made of without their "sidekicks." and while kobe won championships , jordan won 1 playoff game.

Your entire argument is faulty because you brought up the name George Gervin.

Why don't you go read how many games Jordan actually got to play with Mr. Gervin before he broke his leg that season.

You are obviously just some dumbass kid who never saw Jordan play. Shut up and let the adults talk.

**crustyme** · 03-31-11, 11:29 PM

Originally posted by The Madcap

GEORGE GERVIN?

You fukking idiot.

Just stop now.

yes, iceman george gervin who scored 16.2ppg with the bulls in just 25mins per game.

**crustyme** · 03-31-11, 11:33 PM

Originally posted by The Madcap

Your entire argument is faulty because you brought up the name George Gervin.

Why don't you go read how many games Jordan actually got to play with Mr. Gervin before he broke his leg that season.

You are obviously just some dumbass kid who never saw Jordan play. Shut up and let the adults talk.

you didnt even know george gervin was jordans teammate.

what about oakley, paxson, woolridge, hamilton, stackhouse and dailey?

**sparkyasu** · 04-01-11, 12:58 AM

Originally posted by crustyme

if bird played without mchale for 5 seasons and never recorded a winning season, wouldnt that tarnish his legacy?

your analogy is faulty because both jordan and kobe got a chance to show what they are made of without their "sidekicks." and while kobe won championships , jordan won 1 playoff game.

jordan wasnt in his prime during the first half of his career and he didnt have a dominant HOF in his prime as a teammate

**The Madcap** · 04-01-11, 01:22 AM

Originally posted by crustyme

you didnt even know george gervin was jordans teammate.

You are officially the dumbest poster I've ever met at SBR.

George Gervin played one year with the Chicago Bulls. It was MJ's second season in the NBA. The one where he broke his leg.

Children like you are the reason fathers walk out on their sons.

You obviously have no frame of reference.

So like I said, shut the fuk up and let the adults talk.

**crustyme** · 04-01-11, 01:39 AM

Originally posted by sparkyasu

jordan wasnt in his prime during the first half of his career and he didnt have a dominant HOF in his prime as a teammate

he had his best season 37ppg without pippen. i would say he was in his prime yet couldn't win more than 1 playoff game.

**crustyme** · 04-01-11, 01:46 AM

Originally posted by The Madcap

You are officially the dumbest poster I've ever met at SBR.

George Gervin played one year with the Chicago Bulls. It was MJ's second season in the NBA. The one where he broke his leg.

Children like you are the reason fathers walk out on their sons.

You obviously have no frame of reference.

So like I said, shut the fuk up and let the adults talk.

you are full of excuses.

jordan played the final 21 games of the season so he wasn't exactly crippled was he?

and if it weren't for iceman george gervin, orlando woolridge, charles oakley, john paxson and quintin dailey, bulls wouldn't have made the playoffs that season.

**sparkyasu** · 04-01-11, 01:51 AM

Originally posted by crustyme

he had his best season 37ppg without pippen. i would say he was in his prime yet couldn't win more than 1 playoff game.

wow wont a moron. Having ur highest ppg does not mean your in prime. what a ******* moron

**DeluxeLiner** · 04-01-11, 01:54 AM

Crusty that list of 4's better than Gasol is a joke. Kevin Love?

**crustyme** · 04-01-11, 01:59 AM

at 23 he has his best productive season ever and he's not in his prime? lol

**crustyme** · 04-01-11, 02:02 AM

kevin love 20.3ppg 15.3rpg
pau gasol 18.9ppg 10.3rpg

**DeeWizzle** · 04-01-11, 02:09 AM

Crusty give it up aIready....

**8ArIvd5** · 04-01-11, 02:13 AM

Kevin Love 2.5apg 0.4bpg
Pau Gasol 3.4apg 1.7bpg

choose the stats you want to build your case, but ask any coach in the nba, including phil jackson, and they'd take jordan over kobe >85% of the time.

**crustyme** · 04-01-11, 02:15 AM

give what up?

that jordan was 1-9 in the playoffs without pippen?
that jordan never had a winning season without pippen in 5 seasons?
that jordan never won an mvp, defensive award or championship without pippen?
that jordan was surrounded by talent throughout his career yet never advanced past 1st round of playoffs without pippen (pippen carried the bulls past 1st round without jordan though)?

just stating facts.

**Zuon** · 04-01-11, 02:15 AM

Originally posted by success

I saw this video on Youtube created by a Jordan fan.
http://www.youtube.com/user/theblitz.../7/xGbuEjt-KIc

two great players.

But Jordan is Jordan!

**crustyme** · 04-01-11, 02:19 AM

Originally posted by 8ArIvd5

Kevin Love 2.5apg 0.4bpg
Pau Gasol 3.4apg 1.7bpg

choose the stats you want to build your case, but ask any coach in the nba, including phil jackson, and they'd take jordan over kobe >85% of the time.

maybe, maybe not.

jordan is so hyped up and overrated that most people do not know about his failures without pippen.

**8ArIvd5** · 04-01-11, 02:20 AM

crusty, how many people collect kobes? and how many people collect jordans? do you think there's a reason for that?

**DeeWizzle** · 04-01-11, 02:21 AM

Originally posted by crustyme

give what up?

that jordan was 1-9 in the playoffs without pippen?
that jordan never had a winning season without pippen in 5 seasons?
that jordan never won an mvp, defensive award or championship without pippen?
that jordan was surrounded by talent throughout his career yet never advanced past 1st round of playoffs without pippen (pippen carried the bulls past 1st round without jordan though)?

just stating facts.

So are you saying that Pippen made that team what it was and he was better than Jordan?

**sparkyasu** · 04-01-11, 02:23 AM

crusty is an idiot who thinks stats tell the entire story

**8ArIvd5** · 04-01-11, 02:25 AM

Originally posted by crustyme

maybe, maybe not.

jordan is so hyped up and overrated that most people do not know about his failures without pippen.

Jordan is over-rated? How can I explain this...

Imagine your dream girl. Bangin ass, perky

, long legs, hazel eyes, no tonsils, whatever you're into. When you meet a girl, this image is what you compare her to. That's what Jordan is to up-and-coming stars. When you ask can this person be the GOAT, you compare him to Jordan.

Do you understand what I'm saying?

**crustyme** · 04-01-11, 02:27 AM

Originally posted by 8ArIvd5

crusty, how many people collect kobes? and how many people collect jordans? do you think there's a reason for that?

collect what?

kobe has been #1 in the world in jersey sales for many years.

**8ArIvd5** · 04-01-11, 02:29 AM

Originally posted by crustyme

collect what?

kobe has been #1 in the world in jersey sales for many years.

Collect what? You don't remember when the new jordans would come out and the nightly news would show lines 2 blocks long of people waiting the night before to get em?

You're hopeless, kid.

**crustyme** · 04-01-11, 02:30 AM

Originally posted by DeeWizzle

So are you saying that Pippen made that team what it was and he was better than Jordan?

didn't say pippen was better.

just that pippen led the bulls past 1st round while jordan was retired, yet jordan was never able to lead them past 1st round without pippen.

**the_mathman** · 04-01-11, 02:30 AM

Originally posted by crustyme

give what up?

that jordan was 1-9 in the playoffs without pippen?
that jordan never had a winning season without pippen in 5 seasons?
that jordan never won an mvp, defensive award or championship without pippen?
that jordan was surrounded by talent throughout his career yet never advanced past 1st round of playoffs without pippen (pippen carried the bulls past 1st round without jordan though)?

just stating facts.

20 years of success are 20 years of success.
Only an idiot can believe that a star carrier can't must have any flexion.

Jordan forever n.1 !!!

**DeeWizzle** · 04-01-11, 02:32 AM

Originally posted by crustyme

give what up?

that jordan was 1-9 in the playoffs without pippen?
that jordan never had a winning season without pippen in 5 seasons?
that jordan never won an mvp, defensive award or championship without pippen?
that jordan was surrounded by talent throughout his career yet never advanced past 1st round of playoffs without pippen (pippen carried the bulls past 1st round without jordan though)?

just stating facts.

Again, you forget to mention that PhiI Jackson was not there those five years....

And how many rings did kobe win without PhiI Jackson??????

**crustyme** · 04-01-11, 02:32 AM

Originally posted by 8ArIvd5

Jordan is over-rated? How can I explain this...

Imagine your dream girl. Bangin ass, perky

, long legs, hazel eyes, no tonsils, whatever you're into. When you meet a girl, this image is what you compare her to. That's what Jordan is to up-and-coming stars. When you ask can this person be the GOAT, you compare him to Jordan.

Do you understand what I'm saying?

that's why he was overhyped and not as good as people think he is.

without pippen, he would have 0 mvps, 0 titles, 0 playoff series wins, 0 defensive awards.

**crustyme** · 04-01-11, 02:37 AM

Originally posted by DeeWizzle

Again, you forget to mention that PhiI Jackson was not there those five years....

And how many rings did kobe win without PhiI Jackson??????

phil didn't win a championship every season. in fact, 8 seasons without a title.

**8ArIvd5** · 04-01-11, 02:44 AM

Originally posted by crustyme

that's why he was overhyped and not as good as people think he is.

without pippen, he would have 0 mvps, 0 titles, 0 playoff series wins, 0 defensive awards.

You're saying Jordan's over-hyped and over-rated because he's the epitome of greatness?

GTFO!!!!

**crustyme** · 04-01-11, 02:45 AM

Originally posted by 8ArIvd5

Collect what? You don't remember when the new jordans would come out and the nightly news would show lines 2 blocks long of people waiting the night before to get em?

You're hopeless, kid.

fans waited in line for kobe shoes also.

http://theshoegame.com/articles/aston-martin-x-nike-basketball-event-recap.html

**The Madcap** · 04-01-11, 02:46 AM

Originally posted by crustyme

you are full of excuses.

jordan played the final 21 games of the season so he wasn't exactly crippled was he?

and if it weren't for iceman george gervin, orlando woolridge, charles oakley, john paxson and quintin dailey, bulls wouldn't have made the playoffs that season.

Sweet Jesus. You have no fuking clue what you are talking about.

You keep listing these names like they really mean anything. Gene Banks and Sid Green were bigger players on that team than Oakley or Paxson. Oakley was a goddamed rookie for crying out loud. And Paxson was only in his 2nd or 3rd season.

Gervin was old and on bum knees. It was his last pro season. That's why he only played 25 minutes a game. And the Bulls were terrible that season without Jordan. Something like 20-40. They only made the playoffs because when Jordan came back they went on a mini winning steak to close out the season and squeaked into the last playoff spot by a game or two.

Their prize was a first round match-up with the Boston Celtics. The 1986 Boston Celtics. Regarded by many to be one of the greatest teams ever in the NBA. So yeah, 1.3 year pro Michael Jordan and his ragtag bunch of washed-up players and fresh faced yougins lost the series to one of the greatest NBA teams EVER. But not before MJ dropped 63 on them in the Garden and had Bird shitting his pants.

Kobe has never faced a team remotely as good as that one. And he has consistently had a better supporting cast.

Are you really trying to tell me John Paxson was better than Byron Scott or Eddie Jones or Glenn Rice?

Do you really think Jordan losing to the Celtics is worse than Kobe missing the playoffs? Are Lamar Odom/Caron Butler not better than Oakley/Paxson?

Lamar Odom has a similar skill set to Pippen but with greater size. He's never been as good as Pippen because Kobe doesn't know how to utilize his teammates like Jordan did.

I'm sorry you were born too late to witness the greatest basketball player of all time, but you don't need to go around crying about Kobe being the best just because you did. Accept it.

Kobe's not even top 5 all time. Deal with it.

**McBa1n** · 04-01-11, 02:47 AM

Ya know, I think Jordan, himself, ruined the NBA. Kobe is an excellent player, don't get me wrong, but without Jordan, Kobe is a top player amongst others. You see, with rule changes to help Jordan (the hand checks and that b.s. half-circle around the basket), you see, the NBA did all it could to help one of the most talented and hard working players to ever play the game, be their best.

Comparing Kobe to Jordan is uncomparible. Jordan had over-elite talent, whilst the league made rules to help his game. I won't say either player is crap, but I think without Jordan, Kobe norst Lebron exist. Kobe is as hyped an athlete we have seen that has been traded for a 'solid' euro center ever in Vladie Daddie. Jordan is something else, on the court. If he played, back in the day, with Magic/Bird/Dr J, I'm not so certain there is a Jordan. Jordan never passed norst made the players around him all that great like, ya know, greats like Oscar Robison, Magic, Bird, or a dickload of others.

But that's how sports evolve. Some massive HYPE machine takes it over. I about figure if Jordan played in the primes of the proper Worthy/Magic/Kareem days (yes, I was a HUGE Lakers fan - and I'm white), he would've got wrecked. Jordan, to me, is a hard-working Vince Carter or Allen Iverson. To me, AI has the BEST basketball skills I've ever seen (yeah, even better than Isiah, who was incredible back in the day). Jordan talks about how hard he "works" and he scored a dickload of points... But I about figure if you take 30 shots a game, you COULD average 20 points, just sayin.

Jordan and Kobe could've dominated in ANY era with NBA rule changes. It's stupid to compare the two. Both are multi-champions. But only one made the NBA that millions watch more-so than Magc-Bird. Without Magic-Bird, Nike does not exist. Without marketing, your "King" James does not exist. Jordan's skill and effort made the NBA, and Kobe, whom is an all time great, can't hold his jockstrap. But just sayin - I am not so certain Jordan could score like he did versus a Magic or Bird in their primes. I really don't. The NBA was ready to fold prior to Magic/Bird. Since those 2, it's been all marketing. That's why the NBA sucks. That's why pro hoops are dead to a REAL fan of basketball. The NBA, on the surface, USED to be about competition, now it's about marketing hype. I'd rather watch competitive hoops, and that's why I watch the Big East. F the NBA.

The NBA is NOT about competition anymore - if you go live to watch a game, it takes over a half for a game to really get going. It's not about proper hoops, it's about marketing.

**8ArIvd5** · 04-01-11, 02:48 AM

Originally posted by crustyme

fans waited in line for kobe shoes also.

http://theshoegame.com/articles/asto...ent-recap.html

You're right, Kobe's the Greatest of All TIme. I'm sorry I bothered.

And FYI, those people weren't there for the shoes. They were there for a sweepstakes. When the line's at a sports store, not the Staples Center, talk to me.

**tony_come** · 04-01-11, 02:49 AM

Give some respect Jordan is the godfather

Kobe is my son

**crustyme** · 04-01-11, 02:50 AM

Originally posted by 8ArIvd5

You're saying Jordan's over-hyped and over-rated because he's the epitome of greatness?

GTFO!!!!

without pippen, he'd be known as just another high scorer like elgin baylor with no team success.

**DeluxeLiner** · 04-01-11, 02:55 AM

Originally posted by crustyme

kevin love 20.3ppg 15.3rpg
pau gasol 18.9ppg 10.3rpg

Gasol plays for a team that is stacked and has a superstar and a legit rebounding center. Options 3,4, and 5 are pretty legit for the Lakers.

Love plays against the opponents deep bench at the end of games because his team is terrible and gets to play a ton of garbage time in which stats are complied.

You can't just take stats to prove your point. They were complied in two different situations.

crusty is an idiot who thinks stats tell the entire story

yes.