Is LeBron James The Biggest Bust Ever?????????

[Ghenghis Kahn]

2-5 in the finals isn't a bust to you? For a guy who promised his super team fan base 8 titles?

you don't know what bust means... anyone that calls him a bust doesn't know basketball.

[JArrieta49]

you don't know what bust means... anyone that calls him a bust doesn't know basketball.

He's not a bust like Adam Morrison or Kwame Brown if that makes you feel better.

He's had a disappointing career IMO. He should have more titles with his talent level... but diva behavior and poor picking of his situations and teammates and poor play when he is needed most has left him LUCKY to have 2.

[Eddy Munny]

To be fair, it seems Lebron can never take a night off in the playoffs and have his teams still thrive. Curry and Klay both took the night off last night, and Golden State still ran away with the victory. Hell, Jordan took a whole year off and the Bulls still almost made the Finals. In fact, in Jordan's absence the Bulls tallied only TWO fewer regular season wins than the year before.

Furthermore, people routinely pile on Lebron for "bad games" that are actually very good games. Again, one could point to last night... far from Lebron's most dominating performances, but not a dismal effort by any stretch. It's just that Lebron is held to such impossible standards, that if any hairline crack in the armor shows, his detractors come out in full force to storm the castle.

The burden of expectations that Lebron has had to shoulder for his career are unlike that of any other player in the history of professional sports. If he's not single-handedly putting an entire franchise on his shoulders and winning titles year in and year out, that's somehow spun to be "failure."

Just the fact that someone can even seriously consider James a "bust" in any capacity shows how jaded the public is, and how skewed the criteria is for calibrating James' career versus any other flesh and blood being.

[DUBnation]

To be fair, it seems Lebron can never take a night off in the playoffs and have his teams still thrive. Curry and Klay both took the night off last night, and Golden State still ran away with the victory. Hell, Jordan took a whole year off and the Bulls still almost made the Finals. In fact, in Jordan's absence the Bulls tallied only TWO fewer regular season wins than the year before.

Furthermore, people routinely pile on Lebron for "bad games" that are actually very good games. Again, one could point to last night... far from Lebron's most dominating performances, but not a dismal effort by any stretch. It's just that Lebron is held to such impossible standards, that if any hairline crack in the armor shows, his detractors come out in full force to storm the castle.

The burden of expectations that Lebron has had to shoulder for his career are unlike that of any other player in the history of professional sports. If he's not single-handedly putting an entire franchise on his shoulders and winning titles year in and year out, that's somehow spun to be "failure."

Just the fact that someone can even seriously consider James a "bust" shows how jaded the public is, and how skewed the criteria is for calibrating James' career versus any other flesh and blood being.

Definitely true. The public's standards for Lebron have always been way too high, but I guess that's what happens when you're dubbed the new face of the NBA when you're 16-17 years old.

[JArrieta49]

To be fair, it seems Lebron can never take a night off in the playoffs and have his teams still thrive. Curry and Klay both took the night off last night, and Golden State still ran away with the victory. Hell, Jordan took a whole year off and the Bulls still almost made the Finals. In fact, in Jordan's absence the Bulls tallied only TWO fewer regular season wins than the year before.

Furthermore, people routinely pile on Lebron for "bad games" that are actually very good games. Again, one could point to last night... far from Lebron's most dominating performances, but not a dismal effort by any stretch. It's just that Lebron is held to such impossible standards, that if any hairline crack in the armor shows, his detractors come out in full force to storm the castle.

The burden of expectations that Lebron has had to shoulder for his career are unlike that of any other player in the history of professional sports. If he's not single-handedly putting an entire franchise on his shoulders and winning titles year in and year out, that's somehow spun to be "failure."

Just the fact that someone can even seriously consider James a "bust" in any capacity shows how jaded the public is, and how skewed the criteria is for calibrating James' career versus any other flesh and blood being.

Lebron is the one who voluntarily turned himself into player, GM, and coach... but shouldn't take the blame when his teams lose?

Please. If Lebron would have been patient and allowed a team to build around him like the Bulls did with Michael Jordan, then he would have won more titles staying in Cleveland. I guarantee that.

But that isn't what happened. He bolted Cleveland because he couldn't win there, then joined forces with 2 top PER players in Miami, made them worse players, brought in all of his ring chasing buddies, won 2 titles, and then decided he needed to win in Cleveland too. So now all of his buddies follow him to Cleveland he tells them Wiggins for Love.

Lebron is the puppet master of every team he plays for. He controls who plays with him, who coaches. How could anything not fall on his shoulders?

[lakerboy]

Bottomline is james cries too much. He picked this team. If he let the coaches coach and the managers manage he would be better off. His careful planning ideas backfire a lot. He can't be generous in defeat without taking shots at curry. Now the warriors are a "team" all of the sudden. Curry was the Mvp on stats but not most valuable. James comes across as very ignorant and self centered. If he had a coach like phil jackson he would have turned out different, instead he wants to be the coach/gm /ref and player.

[Eddy Munny]

Lebron is the one who voluntarily turned himself into player, GM, and coach... but shouldn't take the blame when his teams lose?

Please. If Lebron would have been patient and allowed a team to build around him like the Bulls did with Michael Jordan, then he would have won more titles staying in Cleveland. I guarantee that.

But that isn't what happened. He bolted Cleveland because he couldn't win there, then joined forces with 2 top PER players in Miami, made them worse players, brought in all of his ring chasing buddies, won 2 titles, and then decided he needed to win in Cleveland too. So now all of his buddies follow him to Cleveland he tells them Wiggins for Love.

Lebron is the puppet master of every team he plays for. He controls who plays with him, who coaches. How could anything not fall on his shoulders?

Then you could well argue that Lebron is a lousy GM/coach and you probably won't get any opposition from me... But how exactly does that bleed over into him as a player? Are you going to allow your views of him concerning extraneous matters taint your opinion of him as a player? It should carry absolutely no weight whatsoever if you're intent on objectively assessing Lebron James, the basketball player.

[JArrieta49]

Then you could well argue that Lebron is a lousy GM/coach and you probably won't get any opposition from me... But how exactly does that bleed over into him as a player? Are you going to allow your views of him concerning extraneous matters taint your opinion of him as a player? It should carry absolutely no weight whatsoever if you're intent on objectively assessing Lebron James, the basketball player.

I mean, this seems like a semantics argument. If we're talking about his career, then it definitely needs to be known that he's sabotaged himself because he's arrogant enough to believe that he's as intelligent as he is talented.

[lakerboy]

No question he is a great player. He keeps getting bad advice from his entourage. Just play lebron.

[Eddy Munny]

Larry Bird was not a great coach. Michael Jordan is not a great GM and a terrible baseball player. Let's reevaluate everything we know about those two players based on this very fact... or we could just acknowledge that they are two of the greatest players to ever lace it up, while ceding that they have shortcomings in other arenas. Big deal.

[Eddy Munny]

I mean, this seems like a semantics argument. If we're talking about his career, then it definitely needs to be known that he's sabotaged himself because he's arrogant enough to believe that he's as intelligent as he is talented.

It's not a semantics argument. Personnel decisions that are made behind closed doors have nothing to do with Lebron's value in sneakers and shorts. He is a phenomenal basketball player.

Could his teams have been better had he not moonlighted as the general manager? Perhaps. This does nothing to alter my opinion of him as a basketball player though.

[jjgold]

Series is over..GSW won it in game 1

Bottom line

[Walulu]

Munny is money on this one. And whoever said throw him on a team out west and he doesn't make 6 finals in a row is crazy. Right, let's put him on GSW, OKC or SAS and see what he would of done or would do for that matter. He'd likely be 6-0 in the finals. And for anyone who says he rode D Wade's coat tails is similarly crazy. Without Lebron and Shaq I don't think DW wins any finals; actually he hasn't and he's been there without them.

[JArrieta49]

Munny is money on this one. And whoever said throw him on a team out west and he doesn't make 6 finals in a row is crazy. Right, let's put him on GSW, OKC or SAS and see what he would of done or would do for that matter. He'd likely be 6-0 in the finals. And for anyone who says he rode D Wade's coat tails is similarly crazy. Without Lebron and Shaq I don't think DW wins any finals; actually he hasn't and he's been there without them.

People have short memories about Lebron.

It was Lebron that had 2 terrible turnovers to make the Spurs a 99.8% chance to win the Finals that year.

The fact that the Spurs choked doesn't absolve Lebron of his basketball chokage. It was Ray Allen that saved the Heat, not Lebron.

[pavyracer]

Like people said Lebron could have been 0-7 in finals. The NBA made sure the refs gave him a couple rings else it would have been a disaster financially for the NBA brand. Lebron could not make starting 5 in Spurs, Thunder or Warriors. Not a team player.

[Ghenghis Kahn]

just stop... ask any gm in the league if they think lebron is a bust. he's such a big bust, all of them would want him in a second, even at 31.

but i agree, he needs to stop being hollywood and fukking play the damn game.

[TheMoneyShot]

Personally I thought he played a decent Game 1 against Golden State. His teammates hung him out to dry.

But for the most part... his entire NBA legacy is much hype.

[pavyracer]

Here is the problem. When you play the Raptors and the Hawks scoring 23 points will do the job. But when you play the Warriors you need to score 45 to win the game. He got outscored by his teammate. Did Pippen outscored Jordan in the finals? Robert Horry outscored Kobe? Jason Terry outscored Nowitzki?

[sando]

To be fair, it seems Lebron can never take a night off in the playoffs and have his teams still thrive. Curry and Klay both took the night off last night, and Golden State still ran away with the victory. Hell, Jordan took a whole year off and the Bulls still almost made the Finals. In fact, in Jordan's absence the Bulls tallied only TWO fewer regular season wins than the year before.

Furthermore, people routinely pile on Lebron for "bad games" that are actually very good games. Again, one could point to last night... far from Lebron's most dominating performances, but not a dismal effort by any stretch. It's just that Lebron is held to such impossible standards, that if any hairline crack in the armor shows, his detractors come out in full force to storm the castle.

The burden of expectations that Lebron has had to shoulder for his career are unlike that of any other player in the history of professional sports. If he's not single-handedly putting an entire franchise on his shoulders and winning titles year in and year out, that's somehow spun to be "failure."

Just the fact that someone can even seriously consider James a "bust" in any capacity shows how jaded the public is, and how skewed the criteria is for calibrating James' career versus any other flesh and blood being.

Oustanding analysis as usual Eddy. I think the main reason Lebron is so polarising is because despite his undeniable greatness he truly does seem to be just a plain old wanker (asshole). He loves to flex his biceps and posture when he embarrasses his opponent but can't hack it if someone was to do that to him. He has demonstrated horrible sportsmanship on countless occasions. He has rarely if ever shown the heart possessed by guys like MJ, Kobe, Garnett. He has "the chosen one" tattooed on his back, loves when people call him the King and has been known to refer to himself in the 3rd person. No doubt he has been spoon fed his entire life & surrounded by "yes men" but regardless the truth remains - Lebron for all his supreme greatness, talent & athletic ability is still a dick, an arsehole, a kunt even.

[TheMoneyShot]

Oustanding analysis as usual Eddy. I think the main reason Lebron is so polarising is because despite his undeniable greatness he truly does seem to be just a plain old wanker (asshole). He loves to flex his biceps and posture when he embarrasses his opponent but can't hack it if someone was to do that to him. He has demonstrated horrible sportsmanship on countless occasions. He has rarely if ever shown the heart possessed by guys like MJ, Kobe, Garnett. He has "the chosen one" tattooed on his back, loves when people call him the King and has been known to refer to himself in the 3rd person. No doubt he has been spoon fed his entire life & surrounded by "yes men" but regardless the truth remains - Lebron for all his supreme greatness, talent & athletic ability is still a dick, an arsehole, a kunt even.

Good post.

That's why in comparison... when your MONEY IS ON THE LINE... best NBA athlete to go get it for you was Kobe Bryant.

Not too many times... Kobe was ever BEATEN DOWN.

Lebron needs to learn how to... GO AND GET IT! Guy is like a pu$$y in disguise.

[JArrieta49]

Oustanding analysis as usual Eddy. I think the main reason Lebron is so polarising is because despite his undeniable greatness he truly does seem to be just a plain old wanker (asshole). He loves to flex his biceps and posture when he embarrasses his opponent but can't hack it if someone was to do that to him. He has demonstrated horrible sportsmanship on countless occasions. He has rarely if ever shown the heart possessed by guys like MJ, Kobe, Garnett. He has "the chosen one" tattooed on his back, loves when people call him the King and has been known to refer to himself in the 3rd person. No doubt he has been spoon fed his entire life & surrounded by "yes men" but regardless the truth remains - Lebron for all his supreme greatness, talent & athletic ability is still a dick, an arsehole, a kunt even.

Lebron also called his wife a side kick... he thinks of himself as a super hero, on and off the court.

MJ may have been an arrogant asshole, but he didn't hide it and just took what he wanted. Lebron, on the other hand, has a mental condition where he thinks the world actually revolves around him.

It's a different kind of arrogance. Hard to explain it.

[Ghenghis Kahn]

Guy is like a pu$$y in disguise.

well, typical when you don't have a father figure. i don't think the guy ever met his father. kinda feel bad for the guy actually. couldn't imagine my life without my father being in my life, let alone never meeting the guy.

[Ghenghis Kahn]

Lebron also called his wife a side kick... he thinks of himself as a super hero, on and off the court.

MJ may have been an arrogant asshole, but he didn't hide it and just took what he wanted. Lebron, on the other hand, has a mental condition where he thinks the world actually revolves around him.

It's a different kind of arrogance. Hard to explain it.

let me guess, you're from chicago? and obviously you're not biased...

since you're bringing up everything about lebron's life, how about bringing up jordan getting his father killed? or kobe's infidelity? for a guy that was raised by a single mom with all the hype, i say lebron turned out alright.

[TheMoneyShot]

well, typical when you don't have a father figure. i don't think the guy ever met his father. kinda feel bad for the guy actually. couldn't imagine my life without my father being in my life, let alone never meeting the guy.

But Kahn.... James acts like he's the best... runs his mouth like he's the best. Well there's your COURT and go kick some ass. The guy never comes through. He has his chance right now.

Every time G.S. went on a run.... James looked like he wanted to go and hide somewhere. Guy can't handle Oracle arena with everyone breathing down his neck.

Wish the dude would back it up. Guy always runs and hides when he knows he's out numbered.

[JArrieta49]

let me guess, you're from chicago? and obviously you're not biased...

since you're bringing up everything about lebron's life, how about bringing up jordan getting his father killed? or kobe's infidelity? for a guy that was raised by a single mom with all the hype, i say lebron turned out alright.

There's no evidence of that with Michael Jordan's father. And you know that.

But regardless, I already said Michael Jordan was an arrogant asshole. But do you think he would have been posting deep in thought bathroom selfies if he grew up in the social media age? Not a chance in hell.

As I said, Lebron thinks the world revolves around him. On and off the court. He thinks he's the best basketball player on earth, and he also thinks he's the smartest person on earth. Good news is, he's a very good basketball player. Bad news is he's not very smart, even compared to the average human being.

Add in a touch of insecurity and you get the magic that is Lebron, the gift that keeps on giving.

[thetrinity]

Lebron is a great player no doubt. The reason he won in Miami was riley ran the show and he didn't listen to james. James came to the cavs and this year he assembled his own team and he is about to get clowned again. The warriors would beat the cavs without curry. Do NOT be surprised if the heat win a title before the cavs.

Something like this, wants to be a GM as well which he sucks at. Has blatt fired for this clown lue. Love is a guy who never even made the playoffs as the man. Irving is weak and gutless. Jr Smith is a complete head case. These all are guys James wanted. These aren't championship type players, his heat teams had some guys with balls, not just dwade.

[Ghenghis Kahn]

There's no evidence of that with Michael Jordan's father. And you know that.

But regardless, I already said Michael Jordan was an arrogant asshole. But do you think he would have been posting deep in thought bathroom selfies if he grew up in the social media age? Not a chance in hell.

As I said, Lebron thinks the world revolves around him. On and off the court. He thinks he's the best basketball player on earth, and he also thinks he's the smartest person on earth. Good news is, he's a very good basketball player. Bad news is he's not very smart, even compared to the average human being.

Add in a touch of insecurity and you get the magic that is Lebron, the gift that keeps on giving.

don't get me wrong, if i had to go to war and i had to pick two people, i'd pick jordan and kobe. but all i'm saying is no one's perfect.

like i said, lebron just needs to stop being hollywood and play the damn game. own the fukking court and stop with all the diva act.

he's a great basketball player, he is the most gifted athlete that's ever step foot on a basketball court. i just don't like all his antics, i stopped being a fan of his when he became a diva. he has the gift, he's just not there mentally. i know everyone can agree on this...

oh as for jordan's father, it's like saying oj wasn't the killer...

[thetrinity]

2 titles hell never be a bust even if he goes 2-10 in the finals, but I think he needs at least 1 more ring to validate just how good he was 20 years from now.

[mikemca]

People have short memories about Lebron.

It was Lebron that had 2 terrible turnovers to make the Spurs a 99.8% chance to win the Finals that year.

The fact that the Spurs choked doesn't absolve Lebron of his basketball chokage. It was Ray Allen that saved the Heat, not Lebron.

I assume you mean game 6 where he had a triple double(his 2nd one that series). That's like criticizing a batter who has 3 home runs and 6 rbis because he struck out in the 9th with a guy on 1st down 8 to 7. Then the next guy up hit a 2 run hr to win the game.

His lines from last years finals

Game 1
44 points - 8 rbs - 6 ast

Game 2
39 - 16 - 11

Game 3
40 - 12 - 8

Game 4
20 - 12 - 8

Game 5
40 - 14 - 11

Game 6
32 - 18 - 9


Flirting with a triple double every game just about. Don't know what more he could have done but the Cavs lost so he is a bum.

[tsty]

It's not a semantics argument. Personnel decisions that are made behind closed doors have nothing to do with Lebron's value in sneakers and shorts. He is a phenomenal basketball player.

Could his teams have been better had he not moonlighted as the general manager? Perhaps. This does nothing to alter my opinion of him as a basketball player though.

It does because they make him seem better than he is

The way he plays the game forces his stats to thrive

Look at yesterday

He was wide open many times but he was scared to shoot because it would effect his fg%

it's digusting

He cares more about his stats than winning

I can almost guarantee that he would rather lose with great stats than win a ring with mediocre stats

[tsty]

Look at what he did to Kevin Love

he made the guy a penetrating role player

a spot up shooter

The offensive plays for cavs generally go something like this

LeBron gets the ball

drives then either goes for the shot or passes to the spot up shooters around him

He literally makes his team mates garbage

His usage percentage is disgustingly high

selfish as they come

I always giggle when people say he makes his team mates better

[Eddy Munny]

I assume you mean game 6 where he had a triple double(his 2nd one that series). That's like criticizing a batter who has 3 home runs and 6 rbis because he struck out in the 9th with a guy on 1st down 8 to 7. Then the next guy up hit a 2 run hr to win the game.

His lines from last years finals

Game 1
44 points - 8 rbs - 6 ast

Game 2
39 - 16 - 11

Game 3
40 - 12 - 8

Game 4
20 - 12 - 8

Game 5
40 - 14 - 11

Game 6
32 - 18 - 9


Flirting with a triple double every game just about. Don't know what more he could have done but the Cavs lost so he is a bum.

Exactly... and this idea that Ray Allen saved Lebron's hide is so shortsighted and obviously tilted to fit the narrative from a hater's perspective. We get it. Other players have to come through to win championships. Basketball is a team sport, but if I'm not mistaken, that was a seven game series. A single basket cannot win a series.

Ray Allen's shot may have been a dramatic highlight, but what about the other 335 minutes of that series? Did those three points nullify Lebron's contributions to the Heat's title? I mean that was game 6 where Allen hit that shot, so it wasn't even a walk-off series win. There was another game two days later. The Spurs got a mulligan but couldn't win the do-or-die game 7, the one in which Lebron had 37 points and 12 rebounds.

I guess we won't talk about clutch shots from Paxson or Kerr to seal Bulls' championships during Jordan's era, because that might reinforce the notion that basketball isn't tennis or golf.

[lakerboy]

Let's leave him alone. We can laugh at him in a week or so.

[Eddy Munny]

Look at what he did to Kevin Love

he made the guy a penetrating role player

a spot up shooter

The offensive plays for cavs generally go something like this

LeBron gets the ball

drives then either goes for the shot or passes to the spot up shooters around him

He literally makes his team mates garbage

His usage percentage is disgustingly high

selfish as they come

I always giggle when people say he makes his team mates better

How good are the Cavs when James is on the bench?

[JArrieta49]

I assume you mean game 6 where he had a triple double(his 2nd one that series). That's like criticizing a batter who has 3 home runs and 6 rbis because he struck out in the 9th with a guy on 1st down 8 to 7. Then the next guy up hit a 2 run hr to win the game.

Comparing a strikeout to 2 turnovers in a close season on the line game in the final 2 minutes... That's as intellectually dishonest as it gets.

2 turnovers in that short of a time frame when every possession is crucial to your team's title hopes would be closer to Buckner letting the ball roll through his legs. Not a simple strikeout.

Lebron had the ball in his hands twice and turned it over when a turnover was almost certain to hand the spurs the game, which gave HIS team almost 0% chance to win. A historically awful collapse by the Spurs kept Lebron from miserable failure, but it still happened, and it still speaks to what kind of player he is when everything is riding on him.