Ben Henderson new champion!

Rubber Guard · 02-07-12, 01:48 PM

I honestly don't see where Bendo wins.

Frankie out-struck BJ Penn twice.

He handled the wrestling vs. the best wrestler in the division.

He has proven to have a chin and cardio for days.

He has proven to have some of the best boxing/footwork in the UFC.

Where does Bendo win? He is bigger...so it everyone Frankie fights. Where is his other advantage?

I think Frankie beats up Bendo on the feet and wins with quickness and footwork. I think Frankie can take Bendo down too if he wants.

The Fobfather · 02-07-12, 02:35 PM

I am a huge Bendo fan but I think FE takes this. Don't think Ben can get him down and while he does have great recovery he tends to get dropped. I think it will be a war, but FE will win with a late round TKO.

Giblets · 02-07-12, 02:52 PM

I have a slight lean towards Bendo but I've underestimated Frankie too many times. If either guy gets above +120 again I'll probably put some money down.

Vaughany · 02-07-12, 02:56 PM

Originally posted by Rubber Guard

I honestly don't see where Bendo wins.

Frankie out-struck BJ Penn twice.

He handled the wrestling vs. the best wrestler in the division.

He has proven to have a chin and cardio for days.

He has proven to have some of the best boxing/footwork in the UFC.

Where does Bendo win? He is bigger...so it everyone Frankie fights. Where is his other advantage?

I think Frankie beats up Bendo on the feet and wins with quickness and footwork. I think Frankie can take Bendo down too if he wants.

Firstly, I don't disagree with u on most points. However, Frankie didnt really handle the wrestling as such. Yes in the first fight he did well when Maynard did rarely attempt a takedown (and also got a couple takedowns himself). But in the second fight I dont recall Maynard even attempting a takedown?...but maybe I need to watch it again.

Where is Henderson's other advantage? Well, the difference between Henderson and Edgar's previous opponents is that Henderson knows how to implement a gameplan and stick to tht gameplan....something that BJ Penn and Maynard failed to do both times. I doubt tht Henderson will get carried away with just looking to KO Edgar which is pretty much what both BJ and Maynard did in all four fights. They both just kept taking the centre of the octagon and tried to catch Frankie as he buzzed in and out around them, and as we saw Maynard did actually catch Edgar in both fights but couldn't put him away. Henderson is the type of fighter that will realise this, and especially since the Pettis fight, Henderson has gone back to using his grappling to control and win fights. I agree tho that I don't see Henderson repeatedly taking Frankie down, but he may do enough to show "octagon control" and eek out a decision - especially if he grabs a hold of Frankie against the cage and pressures him there for periods of each round - which I expect him to try and do.

Finally, his other advantage is leg-kicks - something which were pretty much non-existant in BJ's and Maynard's mode of attack.

Rubber Guard · 02-07-12, 03:07 PM

I think if Maynard believed he could wrestle him he would have tried more. I think the few times he tried to wrestle, he felt no advantage. And hit him hard a few times on the feet. I think he thought he had a better shot at KOing him than wrestling him to a win.

That in itself sort of shows how good Frankie is with his wrestling.

All I know is I won't underestimate Frankie again. I did in both Penn fights. I didn't vs. Maynard. Frankie is the total package and seems to get better each fight. I see no advantage for Bendo. If he can wrestle Frankie for 5 rounds I will be very surprised. I take less from that Miller fight than I originally did. Miller said he was fighting a kidney infection and other things. He isn't the kind of guy to make that up. It totally explains how bad he looked in that fight.

Guida had Bendo in some tough positions a few times. Guida isn't half the fighter Frankie is.

I may be underestimating the leg kick point. I'll just hope another guy doesn't win on leg kicks. I think Frankie is too quick and can avoid most of them with his in and out style.

Vaughany · 02-07-12, 03:13 PM

Originally posted by Rubber Guard

I think if Maynard believed he could wrestle him he would have tried more. I think the few times he tried to wrestle, he felt no advantage. And hit him hard a few times on the feet. I think he thought he had a better shot at KOing him than wrestling him to a win.

That in itself sort of shows how good Frankie is with his wrestling.

All I know is I won't underestimate Frankie again. I did in both Penn fights. I didn't vs. Maynard. Frankie is the total package and seems to get better each fight. I see no advantage for Bendo. If he can wrestle Frankie for 5 rounds I will be very surprised. I take less from that Miller fight than I originally did. Miller said he was fighting a kidney infection and other things. He isn't the kind of guy to make that up. It totally explains how bad he looked in that fight.

Guida had Bendo in some tough positions a few times. Guida isn't half the fighter Frankie is.

I may be underestimating the leg kick point. I'll just hope another guy doesn't win on leg kicks. I think Frankie is too quick and can avoid most of them with his in and out style.

I'd agree with you on tht had I not seen him beat Frankie through mostly superior wrestling before. Yes Frankie had undoubtedly evolved, but if you had beaten a person before with your wrestling, then why would you abandon it the next time you fought? I think the simple answer is that he knocked Frankie down within 3 and a half minutes of each fight which obviously both times filled him with confidence (and perhaps over-confidence) in his striking and power and got caught up in the moment and thought tht he could knockout him out. Somehow he managed to make the same mistake twice!

I'm still pullin for Frankie to win tho...he's my boiii!

GoGoGadget · 02-07-12, 05:53 PM

Maynard fought him like an idiot and played right into Frankie's strengths.

Ben will fight smart and do what Maynard should of done. He will try to negate Frankie's boxing and quickness by grappling him up against the cage roughing him up and going for the take down if its there.

I think it will be a close fight but I see Henderson winning.

Rubber Guard · 02-07-12, 05:57 PM

I think just because he can try to do something different than Mayanrd, doesn't me he can or that it will effective.

Frankie is a pretty squirmy dude, I doubt he will just be able to pin him the fence.

I think anytime they strike Frankie wins those battles. Bendo might do a little cage work, but I think Frankie being that much better standing will win him the fight.

varkolek · 02-07-12, 06:15 PM

I think Frankie is one of the most effective wrestlers out there, if not the best wrestlers. The second fight BJ Penn took him down, but couldn't hold him down. The first fight Maynard took Frankie down repeatedly, and I think Frankie failed on some takedown attempts. The second fight FE took Maynard down a few times, and either avoided or stuffed most of Maynard's take downs. I haven't watched it for a while, but the impression I got is that Frankie basically outwrestled Maynard.

I doubt Henderson can beat FE, I think Henderson's striking may not be good enough. I think Gilbert Melendez may have a better shot.

GoGoGadget · 02-07-12, 06:25 PM

I didn't see Maynard trying to wrestle in the last 2 fights

gabe · 02-07-12, 07:08 PM

V, you gonna arb out with Frankie?

Jordan23 · 02-07-12, 07:10 PM

I'm going big on Frankie. I like Frankie up to -200 honestly

GunShard · 02-07-12, 07:27 PM

Threads like these seem to jinx.

I want to bet on Henderson though.

The HOFF · 02-07-12, 07:49 PM

Originally posted by Vaughany

Finally, his other advantage is leg-kicks - something which were pretty much non-existant in BJ's and Maynard's mode of attack.

If Henderson uses his legs, Frankie won't be able to move in rounds 4 and 5. I think "Smooth" can take this.

mmaed · 02-07-12, 07:50 PM

I think Bendo wins to be honest. He is much larger and has speed. I think he will be able to keep up with Frankie. Maybe I am wrong though. I will have to watch more tape.

SEKTAUR · 02-07-12, 09:18 PM

Its a pretty even fight like the line shows so best to go with your gut. It just seems unless your an elite fighter like a GSP or a Silva its just to hard to hold the belt for very long. I think Vaughany is right Bens legs are crazy big and should do damage against Edgar who hasnt had to deal with someone with leg power like that in his last couple fights.

Rubber Guard · 02-07-12, 09:23 PM

I think if Bendo throws too many kicks, Frankie will just take the takedowns.

Frankie is so well-rounded he can win in a lot of ways. He also has learned to take what he can get. I think if Bendo wants to kick, Frankie will just score points with takedowns. I doubt Frankie will sit and just take the leg kicks like a Diaz or BJ Penn. He has a lot more spring in his step and he is a lot more unpredictable.

I think there is value in Frankie right now. The last 4 lines for Edgar he has been undervalued.

Jordan23 · 02-07-12, 09:45 PM

I think a lot of people are underrating Bendo's ability to grab a hold of a neck! Either way I like Frankie and will be going big on him

sideloaded · 02-08-12, 12:09 AM

dulas

TheCalculator · 02-08-12, 12:11 AM

I'm going to play this one LIVE with live betting. There's a big chance it could flip around in later rounds (Edgar's proven that twice) -- I want to see how they match up the first 2-3 minutes.

Jordan23 · 02-08-12, 12:19 AM

Originally posted by TheCalculator

I'm going to play this one LIVE with live betting. There's a big chance it could flip around in later rounds (Edgar's proven that twice) -- I want to see how they match up the first 2-3 minutes.

Where do you play live betting at?

Vaughany · 02-08-12, 02:47 AM

Originally posted by gabe

V, you gonna arb out with Frankie?

Arb out of what?! I've only got Henderson is a last leg of a couple parlays which will only net me 4 units or something if Henderson wins. I would consider hedging with Frankie by decision.

gabe · 02-08-12, 06:15 AM

Originally posted by Vaughany

Arb out of what?! I've only got Henderson is a last leg of a couple parlays which will only net me 4 units or something if Henderson wins. I would consider hedging with Frankie by decision.

yeah, i meant hedge. my bad. -- yeah, noticed you had condit, henderson, and ellenberger in a bunch of parlays.

Vaughany · 02-08-12, 06:23 AM

Originally posted by gabe

yeah, i meant hedge. my bad. -- yeah, noticed you had condit, henderson, and ellenberger in a bunch of parlays.

ah right yeah, I'll probably just have Fight starts ROund 2, and Starts ROund 3 in a few parlays as backup.

If Henderson got up to +125 or something I'd consider playing him straight up hedged with Edgar by decision, as I dont think Edgar will finish Bendo

gabe · 02-08-12, 06:47 AM

Does anyone on the Fuel card stand out to you? I feel most, if not all of the fights are really tough to call.

Vaughany · 02-08-12, 06:50 AM

Originally posted by gabe

Does anyone on the Fuel card stand out to you? I feel most, if not all of the fights are really tough to call.

Only Herman at moment at -120 or better (got about 17 units on him at -117 and -120).

There are a few I'm interested in if the odds are right (Buddy Roberts, Markes, Salas, but I dont think they'll be what Im hoping for).

sirchadwick1 · 02-08-12, 06:55 AM

Very much a pick'em fight. Hard to call it one way or the other.... but I took Bendo at + money. I wouldn't touch it at the current lines.

SEKTAUR · 03-03-12, 11:20 PM

Just got back from partying in Vegas with the 10gs I won on Bendo! Dam Im good!