What caused the fall of WSEX?

**warriorfan707** · 07-03-11, 11:58 AM

They had sex with a bunch of online sites and werent wearing a condom

**Shifty** · 07-03-11, 12:27 PM

Originally posted by bigbet1234

I seen a show the other day with Jay Cohen on it, where he is now living in Antigua.

He was the biggest tout of this site, and degraded any site that stiffed players. He rode BOS hard back in the day.

Why has he gone silent now?

Great question bigbet. I was in there since the beginning. Was fortunate to get my money out a couple years ago. Processor issues must have started after the UIEGA. Antigua and other Carribean banks stopped servicing gambling sites. It became more expensive to transfer money. I'm sure they got stiffed from some processors but so did other books. Their bookmaking seemed okay, they took a bet and moved the line. If you tried to bet a stale line, they would simply reject your bet. Maybe it was just Steve and Hayden playing golf or out on their yacht when they should have been minding the store.

**TomG** · 07-03-11, 01:40 PM

Without insider knowledge, it's impossible to know for sure as WSEX has never publicly commented on their finances beyond their vague scapegoat catch-all of "processor issues." There are three main rumors.

1) WSEX heavily bankrolled the Antiguan WTO Gambling Decision that failed to bring in any revenue.

2) I can't recall the name, but the largest bank on the island on Antigua went bankrupt and WSEX was rumored to be heavily involved with them (although they did deny this IIRC).

3) Rumors of wasteful spending and poor internal controls.

**obamaismyuncle** · 07-03-11, 02:20 PM

Originally posted by TomG

Without insider knowledge, it's impossible to know for sure as WSEX has never publicly commented on their finances beyond their vague scapegoat catch-all of "processor issues." There are three main rumors.

1) WSEX heavily bankrolled the Antiguan WTO Gambling Decision that failed to bring in any revenue.

2) I can't recall the name, but the largest bank on the island on Antigua went bankrupt and WSEX was rumored to be heavily involved with them (although they did deny this IIRC).

3) Rumors of wasteful spending and poor internal controls.

#3 throw greed in there too

**Monte** · 07-03-11, 03:54 PM

Most likely a mix of getting stiffed themselves, and gambling (maybe on stocks)/bad money management/call it whatever you want.

**minet123** · 07-03-11, 04:37 PM

Originally posted by TomG

Without insider knowledge, it's impossible to know for sure as WSEX has never publicly commented on their finances beyond their vague scapegoat catch-all of "processor issues." There are three main rumors.

1) WSEX heavily bankrolled the Antiguan WTO Gambling Decision that failed to bring in any revenue.

2) I can't recall the name, but the largest bank on the island on Antigua went bankrupt and WSEX was rumored to be heavily involved with them (although they did deny this IIRC).

3) Rumors of wasteful spending and poor internal controls.

Greed
Arrogance
Trusting your business partner

**chance** · 07-03-11, 06:20 PM

I would love a chat with JC. He seemed the most honest guy when I met him. I am amazed it finished the way it did.

**BrianLaverty** · 07-03-11, 07:30 PM

Antigua never stopped with offshore gambling fwiw....they have been on the forefront of challenging the us on its gambling and still welcome any sportsbooks that wanna move there.

**tim0402** · 07-03-11, 07:33 PM

jj gold did.

**Harmy G** · 07-04-11, 01:08 PM

Originally posted by Shifty

If you tried to bet a stale line, they would simply reject your bet.

Not in my experiences...

**relaaxx** · 07-04-11, 01:55 PM

conservative republicans -- holy than thou asses -- and of course the owner's arrogance and stupity to throw what he was doing in the face of the US government.

**Keith Richard** · 07-04-11, 01:57 PM

My guess is that they invested heavily in the stock market just before it went south.

**Hareeba!** · 07-04-11, 04:05 PM

Originally posted by Keith Richard

My guess is that they invested heavily in the stock market just before it went south.

with players' funds ?

**Keith Richard** · 07-04-11, 04:08 PM

Originally posted by Hareeba!

with players' funds ?

Yes. Is that so hard to believe?Of course I have no proof but I base my guess on the fact that they were stock brokers before starting WSEX.

**DeluxeLiner** · 07-04-11, 04:13 PM

Originally posted by Hareeba!

with players' funds ?

They have a whole bunch of money just sitting there and they only have to have a certain amount liquid to pay a guy here or there. Unless there is a run they have a bunch of money to invest

**Hareeba!** · 07-04-11, 04:19 PM

Originally posted by Keith Richard

Yes. Is that so hard to believe?Of course I have no proof but I base my guess on the fact that they were stock brokers before starting WSEX.

No. Not hard to believe. But certainly not acceptable.
It seems too many books seem to believe that player deposits and winnings are their own property.
They remain player funds until such time as the player loses or withdraws them.
They are not unsecured interest free loans to the book.
The book holds them on trust for the player. Not to be spent on operating costs or gambled on the stock market etc. but held only in the securest of deposits and bank accounts.
In any decently regulated environment the directors of a company doing this would be held personally responsible, debarred from being a director of a company and probably in prison.
As Bill has said in another thread they are simply waiting on new player deposits to satisfy old player withdrawals. That is just plain downright fraud.
SBR is guilty of aiding and abetting this fraud by not placing WSEX on the black list.

**chance** · 07-04-11, 04:58 PM

I agree totally. It is shamefull that they are not on the blacklist.

How about a poster poll on this.

**NeedProtection** · 05-27-12, 10:27 AM

Pretty sure that idiot Tom at Matchbook bankrupted them vis a vis BW and The Greek and other originators they had no business trying to book

**Fred Flintstone** · 05-27-12, 10:34 AM

Jay Cohen is the biggest hypocrite every offshore- I highly doubt him, steve and Hayden are broke- sure they live it up- they just don't go into all the profit they made to pay out- biggest threesome of scumbags ever- or maybe top 10- a lot of scumbags offshore- If I ever ran in Jay Cohen on a trip to Antigua I'd bitch slap if for all of you-

And yes- Tom at MB was in over his head- but that is not what cause WSEX issues entirely-

**NeedProtection** · 05-27-12, 04:46 PM

would love to hear from JC. To be fair to him - none of these problems happened on his watch. He was in jail or on probaation or in a halfway house when it all started.

I'm sure he is 1) ashamed and 2) doesn't want to get indicted again so he just shuts up.

I don't think he owes us anything BUT, I do wish we would hear from him and just tell the truth as to WTF happened at WSEX.

The only thing that makes sense to me is Matchbook.

**bookie** · 05-27-12, 06:00 PM

I'm sure these guesses are in the ballpark, but it's still a great unsolved mystery. Maybe in ten years Steve or Jay will spill their guts to a gambling writer and we'll get their version and they'll get to come at least a little clean.

**jackkkk2009** · 05-27-12, 07:53 PM

Originally posted by NeedProtection

would love to hear from JC. To be fair to him - none of these problems happened on his watch. He was in jail or on probaation or in a halfway house when it all started.

I'm sure he is 1) ashamed and 2) doesn't want to get indicted again so he just shuts up.

I don't think he owes us anything BUT, I do wish we would hear from him and just tell the truth as to WTF happened at WSEX.

The only thing that makes sense to me is Matchbook.

yes, Without Matchbook, they started falling..

**Kindred** · 05-27-12, 11:22 PM

Originally posted by TomG

Without insider knowledge, it's impossible to know for sure as WSEX has never publicly commented on their finances beyond their vague scapegoat catch-all of "processor issues." There are three main rumors.

1) WSEX heavily bankrolled the Antiguan WTO Gambling Decision that failed to bring in any revenue.

2) I can't recall the name, but the largest bank on the island on Antigua went bankrupt and WSEX was rumored to be heavily involved with them (although they did deny this IIRC).

3) Rumors of wasteful spending and poor internal controls.

#2 is the Allen Stanford ponzi scheme that collapsed right after Bernie Madoff went public

The ponzi scheme bank collapse fits the timeline the best. They kept running after the WTO case ended without problems. And considering how solid they were for years before I can't see greed or wasteful spending being the cause. Maybe bad investments..not sure anybody knows what happened, at least I don't.

Originally posted by bigbet1234

I seen a show the other day with Jay Cohen on it, where he is now living in Antigua.

He was the biggest tout of this site, and degraded any site that stiffed players. He rode BOS hard back in the day.

Why has he gone silent now?

He is one of the owners of the site.

**djefferis** · 05-29-12, 11:40 AM

Credit, bad mgmt and poor banking mainly.

Failure to pay winners quickly cut incoming funds and created a rush. No free funds due to bag mgmt/banking.

Guys simply had no fallback plan.

I am sure there's more, and perhaps some of it involved faces from other sites, but those are the big 3. Too many takers and not enough givers. Same sad gambling tale of many bookmakers.