1. #1
    thanhquang205
    thanhquang205's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 11-10-11
    Posts: 28
    Betpoints: 180

    Dispute with BETONLINE

    I'm posting this thread to the community to have members in our forum review my case. I also file a complaint form and contact ALEX. I received an email from Lou asking about my CC information and Alex inform that he will review my case.
    I started play poker at BetOnline in September and fortunate to build my account to about 50k, I cashed out about 13k and still had about 37k left in my account. Last week, I received an email from BEtonline state that
    Hello Quang.

    While checking your account, we noticed that you played in the same tables as kenpham84.

    Can you please explain your relation with this username?

    Why are you playing in same tables from same internet connection?

    Best regards,
    Ricky
    BetOnLine Payouts
    payouts@betonline.com


    I explained to the email that I responded to them that" kenpham84" is my friend. I invited him to Betonline 3 weeks ago to play poker. He only played at microstake such at $.25/$50 or $.50/$1.00. I played at the $5/$10 and $10/$20 so we did not play at the same table. Only one time that he came to my house and asked me to transfer to him about $50 because he lost most of his money in his game. I asked him how. He said that just sit down at the head up table and I would able to give him $50. I told him that most of the pokersite wont let 2 player at the same IP address sat down at the same table. He said just tried it because this sportbook website is kind of different. Surprisingly, the software did let us sat down at the heap up table and I was able to transfer him $50. And that's the only time we played at the same table. 3 weeks later, I received an email above and I did explained everything I did. However, they still closed my account and confiscate about 37k for " collusion and sharing information" . My question are:

    1. " I knew that what I did was wrong but why did their software let us sat down at the same table initially, Pokerstar, FTP never let 2 player at the same IP address sat down at the same table" .
    2. I never received an email warning that I should stop doing that transfer.
    3. Their poker manager called me to inform that my account is closed due to" transfer chip, sharing information, collusion" but I never sharing information or we played at a team to take advantage of other player. I just unknowingly dump $50 to my friend to help him keep play at Betonline.

    4. Other than that, I never played with him or played with him as a team to win money from other player, all the money I won at BEtonline is fair and they can review them as many time as they want.
    The reason I post this thread to SBR is I feel that I do not deserve to forfeited 37k in my account due to that small mistake. I can say that I am an very honest player and never had any problem with the pokersite I played. If most of my winning came from collusion or chip dump, I have nothing to say if they confiscate my fund. I just think that money can be transferred from this player to that player because that's what happen to the website I played. I also wanna say that if you decided to deposit at Betonline, think twice because I feel like they just wait for your mistake due to their awful software and took all your money.

    Their customer service is also awful, everytime I called them their poker manager is always not available. The live chat is absolutely no help and untill they make the final decision of account closed permanently, I never had a chance to talk to anybody in poker department. THey called me when everything is done. There is no way that I can involve in the decision making precess.

    Any help with my situation is appreciated. THank you and best of luck to our members.

  2. #2
    SBR Lou
    SBR Lou's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 08-02-07
    Posts: 37,887
    Betpoints: 7038

    We're communicating with management about the complaint.

  3. #3
    thanhquang205
    thanhquang205's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 11-10-11
    Posts: 28
    Betpoints: 180

    Thanks alot Lou.

  4. #4
    SBR Lou
    SBR Lou's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 08-02-07
    Posts: 37,887
    Betpoints: 7038

    In addition to the first violation, the player also admitted inviting other friends of his to BetOnline's poker room. All told, the group's already withdrawn more than its deposited according to information from management. All deposits were made via plastic. More information about the chip-dumps remain available to the player by email.

  5. #5
    big joe 1212
    big joe 1212's Avatar SBR PRO
    Join Date: 06-01-08
    Posts: 15,905
    Betpoints: 164

    So if they confiscate their funds, who gets the money?

    Will all the poor souls who got robbed by the group receive compensation?

    SBR Bash
    Punta Cana
    Attendee 2/4/2017


  6. #6
    wrongturn
    Update your status
    wrongturn's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 06-06-06
    Posts: 2,228
    Betpoints: 3705

    This probably is not about collusion. Perhaps it is about group chip-dump to one guy, withdraw, and charge back.

  7. #7
    thanhquang205
    thanhquang205's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 11-10-11
    Posts: 28
    Betpoints: 180

    I want to make it clear: We are not group, I invited 2 other people but one of them I never played with him at any chance. Only " kenpham84" as I know I did transfer chip to him because he lost at his game. There is no victim who should be compensate for my transfer because that's a head up game. 2 of us never get in the table to play with others player as a group.

  8. #8
    thanhquang205
    thanhquang205's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 11-10-11
    Posts: 28
    Betpoints: 180

    I am not interested in Sport industry. That's why I am not here before. I'm only join this forum because of the problem with me lately. I do not to argue with " Legion36". Only time will tell.

  9. #9
    thanhquang205
    thanhquang205's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 11-10-11
    Posts: 28
    Betpoints: 180

    I am not interested in Sport industry. That's why I am not here before. I'm only join this forum because of the problem with me lately. I do not to argue with " Legion36". Only time will tell.

  10. #10
    thanhquang205
    thanhquang205's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 11-10-11
    Posts: 28
    Betpoints: 180

    Quote Originally Posted by SBR Lou View Post
    In addition to the first violation, the player also admitted inviting other friends of his to BetOnline's poker room. All told, the group's already withdrawn more than its deposited according to information from management. All deposits were made via plastic. More information about the chip-dumps remain available to the player by email.
    Lou,
    I admitted what I have unknowingly done wrong but please note that we are not group. 3 of us never played the same game or sharing any information, I also mention in my thread that I did withdraw about 13k. My account and" kenpham84" account have been suspended but the other guy still playing there.

  11. #11
    pay on time
    pay on time's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 11-08-11
    Posts: 92

    He only played at microstake such at $.25/$50 or $.50/$1.00. I played at the $5/$10 and $10/$20 so we did not play at the same table. Only one time that he came to my house and asked me to transfer to him about $50 because he lost most of his money in his game.
    Damn, this one is tough. You made 50k and they're stiffing you on a 50$ infraction. This would be like if a player made 50k sportsbetting, but 50$ of the 50k was made on a corelated sportsbet, therefore the book claims "rules" were broken and stiff you on 50k. What makes it even worse is the chip dumping you were doing didn't benefit you. You lost 50$ giving it to your friend pham. If the gamelog shows you only played with pham and the others you knew, only once for 50$, you should be paid. Unforunatly, I think you gave the book enough rope to hang you. It's bs.

  12. #12
    thanhquang205
    thanhquang205's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 11-10-11
    Posts: 28
    Betpoints: 180

    Quote Originally Posted by pay on time View Post
    He only played at microstake such at $.25/$50 or $.50/$1.00. I played at the $5/$10 and $10/$20 so we did not play at the same table. Only one time that he came to my house and asked me to transfer to him about $50 because he lost most of his money in his game.
    Damn, this one is tough. You made 50k and they're stiffing you on a 50$ infraction. This would be like if a player made 50k sportsbetting, but 50$ of the 50k was made on a corelated sportsbet, therefore the book claims "rules" were broken and stiff you on 50k. What makes it even worse is the chip dumping you were doing didn't benefit you. You lost 50$ giving it to your friend pham. If the gamelog shows you only played with pham and the others you knew, only once for 50$, you should be paid. Unforunatly, I think you gave the book enough rope to hang you. It's bs.
    That's what I'm trying to say. They're stiffing me for a very small amount of money to confiscate 37k is not fair. I knew that it is not easy for me to get paid now but I just want people from our forum have a deep analysis of my case. They just try to find a " reason" to not paying me. If they accused somebody for chip dump, they should return money to the right place. In my case, I would said they can take the money that I dump to Pham back to my account since he hasn't cashout anything yet, inform the player that it is agianst the rule. Betonline took all the fund, closed account and tell player go away. It is not how to run a poker room.
    Last edited by SBRAdmin3; 06-11-14 at 02:26 PM. Reason: Link Not Working - Removed-)

  13. #13
    pay on time
    pay on time's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 11-08-11
    Posts: 92

    I think betonline is a advertiser for sbr, so you prob. won't get paid. SBR sides with their advertisers quite often. You might wanna think about sending the complaint to osga. I'm thinking about paying the yearly fee of 50$ at osga, to have added protection in cases like these, Also for the fact I'll prob. be banned from SBR in a couple of days. Mods like shari like to stir things up. I've never personally sent a complaint with osga, but it would't hurt to try.

  14. #14
    SBR Lou
    SBR Lou's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 08-02-07
    Posts: 37,887
    Betpoints: 7038

    Quote Originally Posted by thanhquang205 View Post
    Lou,
    I admitted what I have unknowingly done wrong but please note that we are not group. 3 of us never played the same game or sharing any information, I also mention in my thread that I did withdraw about 13k. My account and" kenpham84" account have been suspended but the other guy still playing there.
    If you have actionable information that one of the involved parties is still playing there, the right thing to do would be to share it.

    Though you've said you played innocently against your friend a limited number of times, BetOnline has said that you actually played 53 times against the guy from your household - and that 11 of those games involved other players. Can you comment?

  15. #15
    pay on time
    pay on time's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 11-08-11
    Posts: 92

    Quote Originally Posted by SBR Lou View Post
    If you have actionable information that one of the involved parties is still playing there, the right thing to do would be to share it.

    Though you've said you played innocently against your friend a limited number of times, BetOnline has said that you actually played 53 times against the guy from your household - and that 11 of those games involved other players. Can you comment?
    Ouch, this would be a game changer!

  16. #16
    prop
    prop's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 09-04-07
    Posts: 1,073
    Betpoints: 236

    53 games is one hour of play Lou. Your response on these threads are quite disturbing but I guess its better than ignoring them.

    So far what I've seen from your posts there are now two things for BetOnline to do:

    1) take $50 from this players account and move it to his friends account.
    2) take profits from those two account in those 53 games and set them to the side. The player who were colluded against are entitled to those funds.

    With $37,000 in question there is a LOT more money BetOnline has STOLEN here. There have been numerous cases of collusion as respectable poker rooms where those colluding were paid what was legitimately theirs and then banned, including high profiles cases. Some sites don't use a zero tollerance policy - what they do is suspected colluders are blocked from ever playing at the same table again - whether or right or wrong this is never removed and the players aren't even warned or questioned until there are several accounts they've blocked.

    Only in Costa Rica or Panama would a company attempt to profit in the way BetOnline does. Their software invites collusion and their policies entice to scammers. This is for reasons of incompetence or intent. There is a damn good reason that BetOnline never appears on SBR news feeds - but if you reported the facts what BetOnline is actually doing here would become apparent.

    For the record I know none of the alleged scammers, have never even conversed with them on forums, and have no financial interest in this matter.

  17. #17
    FourLengthsClear
    King of the Idiots
    FourLengthsClear's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 12-29-10
    Posts: 3,809
    Betpoints: 476

    Quote Originally Posted by pay on time View Post
    Ouch, this would be a game changer!
    It would but how the hell could that be allowed to happen in the first place?
    BOL should be perfectly able to detect this, why would they wait until a withdrawal request to take action?

    No legitimate player in their right mind would play at a poker room run like that.

  18. #18
    KEdge2k
    KEdge2k's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 01-11-09
    Posts: 240

    Very interested to see how this one develops

  19. #19
    SBR Lou
    SBR Lou's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 08-02-07
    Posts: 37,887
    Betpoints: 7038

    Quote Originally Posted by FourLengthsClear View Post
    It would but how the hell could that be allowed to happen in the first place? BOL should be perfectly able to detect this, why would they wait until a withdrawal request to take action? No legitimate player in their right mind would play at a poker room run like that.
    I understand that point of view, but it's important to put in perspective that there's not a machine that spits out all the answers. These people are very good and clever. It takes a thorough audit to piece everything together - things happen very fast. Sometimes the audit will show innocents being caught in the crossfire; from what BetOnline has documented that's not the case here.

    The player remains free to email either BetOnline or SBR to discuss further.

  20. #20
    Al Masters
    Al Masters's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 04-29-06
    Posts: 5,532
    Betpoints: 5519

    Poor quang and yalli between them almost 50k swallowed,this industry is in shambles.

    So happy i got Pinnacle and a good local.

  21. #21
    runner5k
    runner5k's Avatar SBR PRO
    Join Date: 04-08-11
    Posts: 2,680
    Betpoints: 506

    Quote Originally Posted by prop View Post
    53 games is one hour of play Lou. Your response on these threads are quite disturbing but I guess its better than ignoring them.
    .
    53 hands or 53 separate games? Hands would be an hour of play... games is a whole different ballgame all together

  22. #22
    relaaxx
    relaaxx's Avatar SBR PRO
    Join Date: 06-15-06
    Posts: 3,177

    very interesting thread - can't wait to see how it is handled by betonline and what SBR thinks of how they handle it.

  23. #23
    Legions36
    Legions36's Avatar SBR PRO
    Join Date: 12-17-10
    Posts: 2,896
    Betpoints: 1326

    Quote Originally Posted by FourLengthsClear View Post
    It would but how the hell could that be allowed to happen in the first place?
    BOL should be perfectly able to detect this, why would they wait until a withdrawal request to take action?

    No legitimate player in their right mind would play at a poker room run like that.
    Every poker room is run like that, sometimes the computer program picks it up if its blatant but in poker rooms even Starz they don't pick it up until u try to cash thats when a full scan of every hand u play gets audited, pretty standard with all the rooms.

  24. #24
    Legions36
    Legions36's Avatar SBR PRO
    Join Date: 12-17-10
    Posts: 2,896
    Betpoints: 1326

    [QUOTE=thanhquang205;12400255]That's what I'm trying to say. They're stiffing me for a very small amount of money to confiscate 37k is not fair. I knew that it is not easy for me to get paid now but I just want people from our forum have a deep analysis of my case. They just try to find a " reason" to not paying me. If they accused somebody for chip dump, they should return money to the right place. In my case, I would said they can take the money that I dump to Pham back to my account since he hasn't cashout anything yet, inform the player that it is agianst the rule. Betonline took all the fund, closed account and tell player go away. It is not how to run a poker room.


    Just to make this clear u will probably get back your money if it was like u say only those couple times and why not just do the normal heads up play chip dump then? why because u losers were trying to cheat people and collude with each other also tell each other each ones cards thats why u did what u did. To be honest for cheating peole like that u should in my eyes never see a dime, i hate scum like that who try to cheat like that and guess what u cant beat me anyway doing that sh-it.
    All in all SBR they will not keep the $ themselves had they cheated all those players the $ will go back to the players that were cheated but it does take time because they have to go threw each hand, so guys don't blame Betonline for this actually for them to take these things serious u have to think they are doing a good job at keeping poker play safe.

    Also another note for this thread Op was also sticking up for a guy in the other thread Greg who i also being accused of cheating for the same sh-it, something to keep in mind. Sounds to me like these guys were playing high limits to cheat people out of thousands. I cant wait until SBR comes out with the whole story.
    Last edited by SBRAdmin3; 06-11-14 at 02:26 PM. Reason: Link Not Working - Removed-)

  25. #25
    C.S.
    C.S.'s Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 10-23-09
    Posts: 239
    Betpoints: 1915

    Legions,
    Thanh said he played high stakes and his friend low, not really a cheating scenario. I haven't seen that disputed. Also, if you know anything about the Vietnamese american community, you know you can have an entire house full of guys that all play sports and poker and it is not unusual. Not all of them collude.

  26. #26
    thanhquang205
    thanhquang205's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 11-10-11
    Posts: 28
    Betpoints: 180

    Quote Originally Posted by Legions36 View Post
    Just to make this clear u will probably get back your money if it was like u say only those couple times and why not just do the normal heads up play chip dump then? why because u losers were trying to cheat people and collude with each other also tell each other each ones cards thats why u did what u did. To be honest for cheating peole like that u should in my eyes never see a dime, i hate scum like that who try to cheat like that and guess what u cant beat me anyway doing that sh-it.
    All in all SBR they will not keep the $ themselves had they cheated all those players the $ will go back to the players that were cheated but it does take time because they have to go threw each hand, so guys don't blame Betonline for this actually for them to take these things serious u have to think they are doing a good job at keeping poker play safe.

    Also another note for this thread Op was also sticking up for a guy in the other thread Greg who i also being accused of cheating for the same sh-it, something to keep in mind. Sounds to me like these guys were playing high limits to cheat people out of thousands. I cant wait until SBR comes out with the whole story.
    I have nothing to say to you. Once again, I do not cheat on other people. Let's wait until SBR comes out with the whole true story. I was mad after reading ur post and I dont know if you work for Betonline or not but I will ignore what u said from now on and just focus on the case.

  27. #27
    eavesdropper
    eavesdropper's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 01-10-08
    Posts: 37

    Quote Originally Posted by big joe 1212 View Post
    So if they confiscate their funds, who gets the money?

    Will all the poor souls who got robbed by the group receive compensation?
    Exactly

  28. #28
    thanhquang205
    thanhquang205's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 11-10-11
    Posts: 28
    Betpoints: 180

    Quote Originally Posted by SBR Lou View Post
    If you have actionable information that one of the involved parties is still playing there, the right thing to do would be to share it.

    Though you've said you played innocently against your friend a limited number of times, BetOnline has said that you actually played 53 times against the guy from your household - and that 11 of those games involved other players. Can you comment?
    Firstly, we are not the same household. I live in Lawrence, KS and he live in Wichita. Sometimes, I drove to Wichita to hang out with them in the weekend and only one time I played the same table with him at the same internet connection when I was in Wichita. I guaranteed no more than 4 hands and I dumped $50 to him. Lou said it is 53 game ( I assume it is 53 hands) and 11 hands involved other player. We are not from the same internet connection on the 11 hands that involve other players. As you played poker, you know that 11 hands is just 2 round. I do not even know that I sat down the same table with him because on that night, Betonline did not have the limit I played and I have to sat down at the lower limit table. I was multi tabling and dont even aware we were at the same table. I quickly left the table when I saw him because I dont want to play against him. As of 11 hand involve other player, my played was just normal. I'm sure Betonline already reviewed the hand involve other player and saw no collusion on it. As I sad Lou, 11 hands is just about 15 minute and I dont even know him was playing at my table. How can it make sense of 2 people collude in about 11 hands involve other player for the 2 month I played over there. Only 1 session unknowingly sat down at the same table is not collusion. If me and him sat down everytime I played at the same table, it make more sense to say that we are a team.

  29. #29
    thanhquang205
    thanhquang205's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 11-10-11
    Posts: 28
    Betpoints: 180

    Quote Originally Posted by eavesdropper View Post
    Exactly
    No body hurt for the action that I took. We' re played at the headup table and there is no other player. If you played at reputable pokersite they have a " transfer fund" option in which you can instant transfer to your buddy. I made a mistake by not transfer person to person but try to dump chip at head' up table. That's it.

  30. #30
    mtneer1212
    mtneer1212's Avatar SBR PRO
    Join Date: 06-22-08
    Posts: 4,618
    Betpoints: 2353

    If the alleged action took place on a heads up table, I see no harm at all. If there were other players involved, then sorry, you cheated.

  31. #31
    thanhquang205
    thanhquang205's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 11-10-11
    Posts: 28
    Betpoints: 180

    Quote Originally Posted by mtneer1212 View Post
    If the alleged action took place on a heads up table, I see no harm at all. If there were other players involved, then sorry, you cheated.
    I totally agreed. That's why I'm try to convinced people that I'm not cheating because I only transfer money at the head up table. If they found an evident prove that I played as a team with him, I 'm more than willing give them 37k.

  32. #32
    thanhquang205
    thanhquang205's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 11-10-11
    Posts: 28
    Betpoints: 180

    Any update about the audit??

  33. #33
    thanhquang205
    thanhquang205's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 11-10-11
    Posts: 28
    Betpoints: 180

    Quote Originally Posted by SBR Lou View Post
    BetOnline tells us that Yalili is part of a chip-dump ring that involved 8 other players. The scam was to move bad money via plastic and withdrawal from the clean account. Yalili deposited $1,000 & received $5,000 back - so he's withdrawn more than he's deposited. As far as we know, no legitimate players were affected so there is nobody to look at refunding but we're asking for a double-confirmation of this.

    If Yalili decides that he would like to refute any of this, he can write to BetOnline and CC help@sportsbookreview.com to formally request the hands/player usernames involved.
    Hi lou,
    I do not know about this case, but dont u think that 8 other players are too many. Are they at the same location. I think that chip dump case is about 2 to 3 player involved. JUST A THOUGHT.!

  34. #34
    prop
    prop's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 09-04-07
    Posts: 1,073
    Betpoints: 236

    sorry you cheated does not justify a $37,000 theft. Collusion gives a players a very tiny advantage and is not easy to prove. Sites take measures against it - no legitimate poker sites use it as an excuse to steal and profit. You can provide proof of who the refunds went to issue them and ban the player. Any remaining funds are rightfully his - and allowing sites to confiscates them sets a dangerous precedent where those wrongfully accused could become victims of BetOnline cash grabs. All these complaints even in ones where fraud or collusion might have taken places (reserving all judgement there) reflect on the the fact BetOnline is Rogue. All other sites work to prevent collusion, not run a site that allows it without even the slight safe guards to prevent it and just cash grabbing from players who win. BetOnline = SCAM!

    I'm a long time player advocate and don't run around calling sites scams lightly. I've made tons of posts defending BetOnline, supported their website for a long time - but in the past month I watched all the fact starting with a bias that they were a legit company, these were just support issues etc. I have never been completely turned and whether it's due to a lack or experience and ignorance or a well conceived plan it does not change the fact BetOnline is scam site.

    If you have money there heed the warning and get it the **** out until all these issues are resolves they've proven their competence by fixing the poker room and got a solid six months without a major complaints. They are D- level in this scenario. I'd rather roll the dice with SBG or WagerWeb (not that would, but true that I'd rather) than with BetOnline as things stand now.

  35. #35
    prop
    prop's Avatar Become A Pro!
    Join Date: 09-04-07
    Posts: 1,073
    Betpoints: 236

    Quote Originally Posted by thanhquang205 View Post
    I totally agreed. That's why I'm try to convinced people that I'm not cheating because I only transfer money at the head up table. If they found an evident prove that I played as a team with him, I 'm more than willing give them 37k.
    This sounds like: "I did it, you can't prove it, so pay me my money."

    Still everything i just posted before reading this about BetOnline i still mean.

12 Last
Top