The Thing I do Not Like About Betfair

**FourLengthsClear** · 01-14-11, 08:48 PM

Many in game traders/market makers are using software with historical minute by minute data so the lines will be about right.

If not, of course, there would be great value in laying (betting against) the team that is leading, no?

**Ace_of_Spades** · 01-14-11, 08:51 PM

Betfair is not built for American sports.

**jjgold** · 01-14-11, 08:52 PM

I guess, I am not experienced with this stuff

Knicks losing by 4 at half time and they are 1.29 to win game on ML

How is that a good bet? Tons of action on game too

**Hareeba!** · 01-14-11, 09:03 PM

Originally posted by jjgold

I guess, I am not experienced with this stuff

Knicks losing by 4 at half time and they are 1.29 to win game on ML

How is that a good bet? Tons of action on game too

if it's bad value lay it , or back the other side
surely it's close to a 100% market?

**FourLengthsClear** · 01-14-11, 09:03 PM

I don't do NBA in game, so I wouldn't really know.
4.20 (+320) for Sacramento looks quite good to me too!

**Hareeba!** · 01-14-11, 11:07 PM

Originally posted by Ace_of_Spades

Betfair is not built for American sports.

would you like to elaborate on that opinion?

how is an American sport any different to say a cricket match or a golf matchup?

**Optional** · 01-14-11, 11:14 PM

Originally posted by jjgold

If a team even has a small lead they odds are un bettable of ML Favs

Most games in running are like 1.03 to like 1.3 or so and there is heavy action all the time even with soccer

Bettors must just be taking big shots to win small amounts of money, volume is there even for NBA

In-play betfair is driven by emotions. It's easy pickens once you nail down the time points people lose their nerve on your sport.

**jjgold** · 01-15-11, 08:16 AM

Betfair might not be geared for Americana sports but they take much more action on American Sports than matchbook does

I guess you have to outguess these Euro Punters

**Ace_of_Spades** · 01-15-11, 08:24 AM

Originally posted by Hareeba!

would you like to elaborate on that opinion?

how is an American sport any different to say a cricket match or a golf matchup?

They don't ever change the lines. If the Knicks open up at +3.5 and its moves to 5 or 5.5 Betfair won't change it, and you always have to bet games with the hook cos they are greedy. Same thing with baseball totals.

**Optional** · 01-15-11, 08:29 AM

How can any exchange change the line once bets have been taken? How does Matchbook handle it?

**Ace_of_Spades** · 01-15-11, 08:50 AM

Originally posted by Optional

How can any exchange change the line once bets have been taken? How does Matchbook handle it?

They can't be.

Thats why you need a sportsbook for American sports, due to the line movements.

**wtf** · 01-15-11, 09:20 AM

an exchange will just add a NEW line , impossible to change a line once wagers traded

jj your point is ridiculous

the swings opens opportunities for huge gains

**FourLengthsClear** · 01-15-11, 09:22 AM

Originally posted by Optional

How can any exchange change the line once bets have been taken? How does Matchbook handle it?

Matchbook will generally open up a new market with a new line but have the old line as an alternative.
Betfair will do this but generally only if they are requested to.

Both approaches have advantages and drawbacks. Where liquidity is thin (pre-game) I generally prefer not to have too many separate markets/lines. I have suggested to Betfair in the past that they structure these markets in the same way as they do their Asian handicaps for soccer.

**Resler** · 01-15-11, 10:30 AM

JJ,
How did you get an account at BetFair? No Americans right?

**Hareeba!** · 01-15-11, 01:54 PM

Originally posted by Ace_of_Spades

They don't ever change the lines. If the Knicks open up at +3.5 and its moves to 5 or 5.5 Betfair won't change it, and you always have to bet games with the hook cos they are greedy. Same thing with baseball totals.

ok, I understand
but line movements aren't just a US sports thing
bookies' lines move in all sports
they are a challenge for any exchange
personally I think it's best to leave the original line as the liquidity becomes too fragmented once they start opening new markets like Matchbook do and you rarely stand any chance of getting your offer accepted at an old line

**chance** · 01-16-11, 12:11 AM

I think your thread should read the "things I like about betfair". Your thread praises their liquidity

**lukahh** · 01-16-11, 06:45 AM

Originally posted by Hareeba!

ok, I understand
but line movements aren't just a US sports thing
bookies' lines move in all sports
they are a challenge for any exchange
personally I think it's best to leave the original line as the liquidity becomes too fragmented once they start opening new markets like Matchbook do and you rarely stand any chance of getting your offer accepted at an old line

indeed it's the liquidity issue. if it's only couple points difference, it shouldn't matter too much. but sometimes when it's 10 pts difference due to game development, that's when line becomes mostly useless.

**Jaug** · 01-16-11, 09:23 AM

What you should hate about betfair is 5% commision

**Karayilan9** · 01-16-11, 10:51 AM

Last minute of one possession NBA games can be a goldmine, huge odd swings, was on the right side of a 100/1 swing on washington a few weeks back.

**mminkovski** · 01-16-11, 12:34 PM

You should actually like these live odds. US sports do not attract much interest and sometimes I can find great value in "forgotten" bets.

**Hareeba!** · 01-16-11, 01:55 PM

Originally posted by Jaug

What you should hate about betfair is 5% commision

Yes, I would too if I were paying 5% commission but I don't

do you ?

**chachi** · 01-16-11, 02:03 PM

I'm not overly happy with 3.6 - 3.8% that I end up paying but given their odds are 7-10% better than the books I can easily live with it.

SMarkets is a new startup in the UK and their commission is tiered by volume to bring in small market-makers, I may be giving them a shot for European football if the promising 2% level is indeed true ...

**FourLengthsClear** · 01-16-11, 02:26 PM

Originally posted by chachi

I'm not overly happy with 3.6 - 3.8% that I end up paying but given their odds are 7-10% better than the books I can easily live with it.

SMarkets is a new startup in the UK and their commission is tiered by volume to bring in small market-makers, I may be giving them a shot for European football if the promising 2% level is indeed true ...

I am afraid that SMarkets has the makings of another WBX. Hope I am wrong but I just don't see that they have the depth of markets to generate any sort of volume.

**Hareeba!** · 01-16-11, 02:30 PM

Originally posted by chachi

I'm not overly happy with 3.6 - 3.8% that I end up paying but given their odds are 7-10% better than the books I can easily live with it.
.

that's the real point
4% even may sound high but just figure out what (hidden) comm. you are paying elsewhere - even at -105, -105 you are paying more
can you get better net odds most of the time betting elsewhere?
and never forget that if accepting offers at Matchbook you pay win or lose, whereas at Betfair you pay only when you win.

**chachi** · 01-16-11, 02:32 PM

Yep ... but at least the SMarkets guys seem to have the requisite background and depth of experience in the financial trading arena. I had a very long chat with Jason the MD about things before they revamped their commission structure - their display is showing risk levels not stake, so seeing say £1200 on a 1.2 shot means you can lay 6k at the price if so inclined ...

And that's hitting the nail on the head Hareeba, everyone here happily bets -110 or -105 lines without blinking, but God forbid you pay 4-5% commission on a win to take +105

**sweethook** · 01-16-11, 02:41 PM

iam same way

**chachi** · 01-16-11, 02:55 PM

GL tonight sweethook ... I lived in NJ for a couple of years back in the 90s, pound them into the turf, repeatedly, please ...