Full Tilt Poker is a Scam

[obama our lord]

http://ripoffreport.com/reports/0/427/RipOff0427781.htm

I had a problem with Full tilt poker (FTP) about 2-3 weeks ago, since then I found out they do use bots, and when I demanded my money back for doing so, they quickly deleted my account, and will not refund the money in my balance.

Be AWARE, FTP is a scam of a website, and if you dig deep enough, find out enough info, they will quickly delete you so you can no longer use there site, and keep the balance of your own money. FTP will not respond to my emails demanding my balance be returned to me. This is not bonus money, this is my own hard earned money. They will not respond; they are scammers.

Naturally, not everyone has noticed, but if you ask certain questions they respond with comments like: 'we will not discuss this' This is a 'nuisanse' of an issue, please read our terms & conditions, which I did plenty of times, it makes it clear players, human players(customers) cannot use bots, but no mention about FTP using bots, that was my question. They then stop responding to my questions completely. I then threaten to file suit, within an hour they send me an email that my account is closed and no further emails from me will be responded to. I have a balance in my real money account, but cannot get to it. They explained my balance is now FTP's. The money I had in it is gone, and they will not explain themselves.

Do not sign up to FTP, if you already have, do not play with real money. The moment you have a problem, if it's to much of a problem they will close your account, and keep your money that's in it. They give you no warning about doing this. This is just another scam of theres to take regular people's money. The whole issue started because my account would not allow me to withdraw the money I had in my balance. I then called 'tilt pay' there billing company, and they told me they will not help me take out money, they only help if people want to deposit money, I emailed support, no help. I filed a complaint to KGC which is FTP only oversight.

The problems that FTP gives far out-weighs the fun in playing cards. There are plenty of other online sites, some of which I am already a member of. None, absolutely none, have been as bad, as irresponsible, uncooperative, and a pure scam like FTP is. Look elsewhere if you want to play poker online. If you want to find out for yourself without losing money, email support@fulltiltpoker.com and ask for the name of the owner/ceo (it's Bitar) but they will not tell you. Ask for a phone number in case you have a problem, they will not give it to you.

Any company that has to hide this information from it's customers is a company you should steer clear of, especially FTP. What are they hiding from??? If they were fair, honest and reputable then they shouldn't have an issue with giving out this info. They know exactly what kinds of scams and schemes they have going on, and the few who dig deep enough, they cut off their account. Then there is no way to get a hold of them.

Tiltware is the parent company to FTP.
I would stay away from Tiltware as well as any sub company of it, I simply have no faith in any of them and they give me no reason to do so.

[wtf]

i always wondered about bots and online poker

when i posted this issue some retards replied "if you cannot beat a bot then u shouldnt play" i dont know what the fuk that means. what if half the table are bots? statistically they will get the best hands.

playing poker online is a bizarre endeavor in my opinion

[raydog]

jesus, i had to go and do a re-look at who started the thread. this is Shanty material. im actually shocked he didnt write this.

[VegasDave]

Bots are very easy to beat.

Once you notice their patterns they are very easy to exploit.

[cobra_king]

Even if this is 100% accurate, it's really hard to take this guy seriously.

[krk1030]

I dont play there, or really care, but i hear a lot about them taking peoples money. Doesn't seem right to me. If you close an accoutnt fine but it's their money.

[bettilimbroke999]

FTP sucks!

They literally close peoples account and steal their money for whatever reason they want, I mean its amazing, what if a sportsbook sent you an email and said you were betting steam so they're closing your account and confiscating your balance, no doubt they would immediately be a F- book, FTP is crap

[LVHerbie]

Why don't you post all your emails back and forth between fulltilt and yourself (preferably unedited)? Also, since this is a sportsbetting forum, you might get a better response by choosing one that focuses on poker (such as 2+2... although I would be prepared to get flamed pretty hard if you post things there similar to what you post here)... Not saying you story isn't true (although I highly doubt that any bots exist that are actually sanctioned by fulltilt) but given your past posts kindof help raise doubts in my mind for some reason...

[InTheHole]

People...he's is posting an article.....not his experience

[wtf]

Bots are very easy to beat.

Once you notice their patterns they are very easy to exploit.

what if half the table are bots? how will u exploit that mr genius?

[LVHerbie]

People...he's is posting an article.....not his experience

Ahh... I guess I should have studied up more on his posting techniques before making a reply... Sadly, I usually don't make it past the first few sentences before searching for something that demonstrates more scholastic relevance to gambling (such as a JJ or Sammy video...)

[LVHerbie]

what if half the table are bots? how will u exploit that mr genius?

He has already given you half the answer to this puzzle...

http://forum.sbrforum.com/players-talk/162697-poker-instruction-video-parody.html

Although exploiting a table half filled with bots is probably an advanced technique and would require skills slightly modified from the ones demonstrated above... Hopefully this will be covered more deeply in the second video in the series...

[FatFrank]

Calling BS on most of this...

FTP has sent me several checks over the last 12 months... No problem.

[MonkeyF0cker]

what if half the table are bots? how will u exploit that mr genius?

So what? If a bot is predictable, which the vast majority are, how is that any different than playing against a table half full of predictable players?

[VegasDave]

what if half the table are bots? how will u exploit that mr genius?

Obviously if the bot is programmed very well, it would pose a problem.

But generally speaking, bots are just built to play a basic optimal strategy, only play certain hands, raise x amount of pot based on what they have, x amount based on other players at the table, etc. Since by and large there are plenty of fish in the sea, having bots at 4 tables playing your set optimal strategy is bound to be +EV.

I'm just saying that I've played in some SnG's where as the table dwindles down, you start to notice patterns that are automatic and textbook every single hand. If they raise 2x the BB and you reraise, they will instafold. If they raise 3x the BB and you call, they will blind check the flop. Etc etc.

Once you identify the bots quarks, you just beat the hell out of it.

[reno cool]

I doubt that VD knows what he's talking about.
My understanding is that some bots in head up games are absolutely impossible to beat. The best you can do is tie. That is lose the vig. My guess is beating bots at full tables is a lot harder than beating players.

[MonkeyF0cker]

There are always ways to beat any programmed entity.

[bettilimbroke999]

Bots that some random jackass came up with might be easy to beat, but a heads up bot or a limit poker bot programmed by talented programmers would be nearly impossible to get an edge on. Would you really want to play limit poker or heads up poker with a bot, hell one of the best advantages in poker is when a player is drunk or on tilt they fuk up and play like shit and give away their money, if u play perfect mathematic limit hold em there is almost no way for a player to get an edge on you if you never tire or go on tilt. All the weak players would feed the bots while the good players would struggle to break even

[Pajda]

http://ripoffreport.com/reports/0/427/RipOff0427781.htm

I had a problem with Full tilt poker (FTP) about 2-3 weeks ago, since then I found out they do use bots, and when I demanded my money back for doing so, they quickly deleted my account, and will not refund the money in my balance.

All poker rooms make money by collecting the rake not by using bots

[konck]

Figures who wrote this thread hahahhahaha the Obama clown. Oh yeah let me be very carefull not to cuss in here or he will run to his fat mother an tell on me hahhahahhaha. But any ways who doesnt know online poker is a toy of the underworld. The have no laws .....oh wait yeah the online gaming commission hahhaha which they made themselves. Play on line poker you may be one of the few super acct. But if your not well be like me...Hope Obama makes it legal and lets the big companies run it the gaming companies. That way its legit an we can tax the crap out of it like it should be. If that happens let me know ...I will play then...until then you guys play its fake suckerrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

[MonkeyF0cker]

All the weak players would feed the bots while the good players would struggle to break even

Why would you assume that only the bots would get a piece of the weak players?

[MonkeyF0cker]

Figures who wrote this thread hahahhahaha the Obama clown. Oh yeah let me be very carefull not to cuss in here or he will run to his fat mother an tell on me hahhahahhaha. But any ways who doesnt know online poker is a toy of the underworld. The have no laws .....oh wait yeah the online gaming commission hahhaha which they made themselves. Play on line poker you may be one of the few super acct. But if your not well be like me...Hope Obama makes it legal and lets the big companies run it the gaming companies. That way its legit an we can tax the crap out of it like it should be. If that happens let me know ...I will play then...until then you guys play its fake suckerrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

I made my living off of FTP for years.

[bettilimbroke999]

Why would you assume that only the bots would get a piece of the weak players?

Play at a table full of bots and one weak player, what do you think is going to most likely happen, the bots are going to break the weak player then you're going to struggle with the bots and theyll prolly break you

[Shortstop]

I made my living off of FTP for years.

You are my new hero!

[MonkeyF0cker]

Play at a table full of bots and one weak player, what do you think is going to most likely happen, the bots are going to break the weak player then you're going to struggle with the bots and theyll prolly break you

What makes you think bots have an advantage over me?

[MonkeyF0cker]

You are my new hero!

Simply refuting idiotic posts. Much like yours. My point was that it is possible to make money playing on FTP and many other offshore poker sites.

[pico]

i stop playing online cuz i realized it is pretty sad to scream at the computer screen once a while. real people is more fun because you can call them names after a bad beat until you get thrown out.

[Shortstop]

Simply refuting idiotic posts. Much like yours. My point was that it is possible to make money playing on FTP and many other offshore poker sites.

I'm an idiot for calling you my new hero?

[bettilimbroke999]

What makes you think bots have an advantage over me?

In limit poker the bots absolutely have an advantage over you there is no thinking about it, in NLHE you could perhaps hold your own against them but lately bots that routinely beat some of the best pros have been developed and they are only going to get more advanced. Similar to how a chess computer can beat any human bc it can analyze things at a rate so much more accurate and faster than a human mind can and then make perfect mathematic decisions 100% of the time without ever getting tired or emotional about a bad beat, etc. If poker is a game of skill then a computer can be programmed to play it far better than a human its just a fact, thats any mental game of skill, checkers, chess, tic-tac-toe, etc.. In the future analyzing other players play and determining how to react to individual playing styles as well as analyzing thousands of a players past hands in a second to determine how he/she plays will no doubt be programmed, throw on top of that that you have no idea which players are bots and which are real players so its very hard to "target" the computer programming of a bot bc number 1 you dont know what that programming is and the level of its complexity and number 2 you dont even know if its a bot at all

[MonkeyF0cker]

Shorty, this aside is almost worth my time. Almost. Not really.

[jjgold]

Anyone playing online poker should have their head examined. All poker is rigged somewhat. If you are going to play poker I would only play live.

[MonkeyF0cker]

In limit poker the bots absolutely have an advantage over you there is no thinking about it, in NLHE you could perhaps hold your own against them but lately bots that routinely beat some of the best pros have been developed and they are only going to get more advanced. Similar to how a chess computer can beat any human bc it can analyze things at a rate so much more accurate and faster than a human mind can and then make perfect mathematic decisions 100% of the time without ever getting tired or emotional about a bad beat, etc. If poker is a game of skill then a computer can be programmed to play it far better than a human its just a fact, thats any mental game of skill, checkers, chess, tic-tac-toe, etc.. In the future analyzing other players play and determining how to react to individual playing styles as well as analyzing thousands of a players past hands in a second to determine how he/she plays will no doubt be programmed, throw on top of that that you have no idea which players are bots and which are real players so its very hard to "target" the computer programming of a bot bc number 1 you dont know what that programming is and the level of its complexity and number 2 you dont even know if its a bot at all

First off, you may want to look into Kasparov's record against super computers in chess. He has a winning record against "bots" that were designed by some of the best teams of AI development in the world. Not some guy tinkering in his free time. Secondly, chess is a game of knowns. Everything is there to analyze. There are no unknown variables such as your opponent's hole cards. Third, the math in poker is not complex. If you've been playing long enough, you know the math in any situation like the back of your hand. Fourth, when you've been playing the game for years as your source of income, you never go on tilt. Bad beats are commonplace. Fifth, I can change my game up in an instant to counter my opponent's playing style. How spontaneous can a bot designed for profitability do that? Sixth, playing only by math at higher stakes is actually usually -EV. Deception is far more important. Most if not all players at a higher stakes table know the math. If you're playing by the book it's quite simple to put that person on their hand. There are plenty of reasons that bots can be beaten...

[MonkeyF0cker]

And it doesn't matter if you know whether your opponent is a bot or not. A player is a player. You adjust to exploit their tendencies just the same.

[MonkeyF0cker]

Anyone playing online poker should have their head examined. All poker is rigged somewhat. If you are going to play poker I would only play live.

What does "rigged somewhat" mean? How does the house profit from this exactly?

[bettilimbroke999]

Go win the WSOP then , clearly you can outstrategize every poker player on earth and play absolutely flawlessly so that even a computer programmed in every element of game theory for creating perfect strategy so that no strategy you could use would be able to attain an advantage over it will be easy pickens, I'll pay your buy in for half your winnings if you can guarantee a win, hell if u can even guarantee a cash