This is an offensive TD correct? Seems common sense to me, but just want to be sure its not considered special teams.
FG fake (offense or Special Teams TD?)
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propSBR MVP
- 09-04-07
- 1073
#1FG fake (offense or Special Teams TD?)Tags: None -
Justin7SBR Hall of Famer
- 07-31-06
- 8577
#2Weird. Offensive TD seems like the best answer. Is there a rule page for this prop?Comment -
propSBR MVP
- 09-04-07
- 1073
#3No, just asking in general. I'd assume offensive TD but an old database I purchased years ago and was just taking a look at its usefulness today has these listed as special teams which I assume is wrong and was going to fix, but then wanted to ask and make sure.
Another odd question:
New Orleans QB has a pass picked off by Redskins
Redskins player while returning INT fumbles the ball.
New Orleans recovers fumble and returns it for a TD.
Is this an offense or defensive score? That's one I am less sure about. The score was made by the team who started the play as the offense. At the time the recovery was made they were playing defensively.
Is this considered and offensive or a defensive TD? Again my guess is offense because it was scored by New Orleans offense but not entirely sure that is correct because they were no longer the offensive team once the interception was made.Comment -
LT ProfitsSBR Aristocracy
- 10-27-06
- 90963
#4Not even debatable, it is an offensive touchdown. Since the ball was never kicked, it is considered an offensive play.
The ONLY touchdowns that are considered special teams touchdowns are on plays started by a kick (kick-off return, punt return, return of a fumbled kick-off, return of a fumbled punt, blocked punt return, blocked field goal return).
I think those are all the "special teams touchdown" possibilities.Comment -
Justin7SBR Hall of Famer
- 07-31-06
- 8577
#5I believe the second one is a defensive score. But I'd get a second opinion on that one.Comment -
dwaechteSBR Hall of Famer
- 08-27-07
- 5481
#6I would say defensive TD for that second one as well. 99% sure.Comment -
LT ProfitsSBR Aristocracy
- 10-27-06
- 90963
#7No, just asking in general. I'd assume offensive TD but an old database I purchased years ago and was just taking a look at its usefulness today has these listed as special teams which I assume is wrong and was going to fix, but then wanted to ask and make sure.
Another odd question:
New Orleans QB has a pass picked off by Redskins
Redskins player while returning INT fumbles the ball.
New Orleans recovers fumble and returns it for a TD.
Is this an offense or defensive score? That's one I am less sure about. The score was made by the team who started the play as the offense. At the time the recovery was made they were playing defensively.
Is this considered and offensive or a defensive TD? Again my guess is offense because it was scored by New Orleans offense but not entirely sure that is correct because they were no longer the offensive team once the interception was made.Comment -
pavyracerSBR Aristocracy
- 04-12-07
- 82741
#8How about a fake punt that scores for a TD? Is this the same as FG fake.
And what if after the completed pass on a fake punt the receiver fumbles the ball and the other team returns the fumble for a TD? Is it special teams or a defensive TD?Comment -
LT ProfitsSBR Aristocracy
- 10-27-06
- 90963
#9Yes, it is treated as a normal offensive play because there was no kick. Therefore, the last part would be a defensive touchdown.Comment -
propSBR MVP
- 09-04-07
- 1073
#10Thanks for response LT. The first one makes complete sense (FG/Punt Fake) because all that changes was their formation. They went out on field and made an offensive play despite lining up as if they'd do something different.
The second one I'd like to know for sure. Are you 100% certain that is still an offensive TD?
Thanks for the conversation guys.Comment -
propSBR MVP
- 09-04-07
- 1073
#11It appears different because there was a change of possession. Lets say it was 4th and 10 on that play the ball was picked off 4 yards from scrimmage he advanced ball back 3 yards fumbled it where it was recovered by the team that started on offense. on 4th and 10 the ball advanced only 1 yard from where the play started. It would still be 1st and 10 for that team, correct? because possession changed.Comment -
JonthemanSBR High Roller
- 09-09-08
- 139
#12"New Orleans QB has a pass picked off by Redskins
Redskins player while returning INT fumbles the ball.
New Orleans recovers fumble and returns it for a TD."
That has to be an offensive TD in any sensible reading of the play. Don't see the relevance of there being 2 or 10 turnovers on the play; the offence lined up at scrimmage and the end result is that they got the ball in the endzone. They can achieve that any way they like as long as no penalty is involved. I'd say that "passing" to the opposition cornerback and then flattening him so that he fumbles it back to you is as valid a way to score as any other way for the offence. I'd play merry hell if a book didn't grade it that way for me.Comment -
LT ProfitsSBR Aristocracy
- 10-27-06
- 90963
#13"New Orleans QB has a pass picked off by Redskins
Redskins player while returning INT fumbles the ball.
New Orleans recovers fumble and returns it for a TD."
That has to be an offensive TD in any sensible reading of the play. Don't see the relevance of there being 2 or 10 turnovers on the play; the offence lined up at scrimmage and the end result is that they got the ball in the endzone. They can achieve that any way they like as long as no penalty is involved. I'd say that "passing" to the opposition cornerback and then flattening him so that he fumbles it back to you is as valid a way to score as any other way for the offence. I'd play merry hell if a book didn't grade it that way for me.
If the team that snapped the ball at the beginning of the play scores, it is an offensive touchdown no matter how many change of possessions there were within the play.Comment -
LT ProfitsSBR Aristocracy
- 10-27-06
- 90963
#14It appears different because there was a change of possession. Lets say it was 4th and 10 on that play the ball was picked off 4 yards from scrimmage he advanced ball back 3 yards fumbled it where it was recovered by the team that started on offense. on 4th and 10 the ball advanced only 1 yard from where the play started. It would still be 1st and 10 for that team, correct? because possession changed.
I get what you are saying that the offense becomes the "defense" after the initial change of possession, but the scoring rules don't see it that way. If they did, there would be no such thing as a defensive touchdown because whoever gains possession of the ball would always instantly become the offense.
Rather, who gets credit is determined by who is on offense/defense at the start of the play.Comment -
Peregrine StoopSBR Wise Guy
- 10-23-09
- 869
#15this is some cool stuff and actually quite relevant for prop pricing.Comment -
LegitBetRestricted User
- 05-25-10
- 538
#16Nice job LT,
Two points here
One, it makes sense that the team that started the play as offense is still offense, as a fumble or pick 6 is considered a defensive TD, and it makes sense that there cannot be two defenses on the field at the same time.
Also you mentioned the importance of kicking the ball . The change of possession could occur after a failed 4th down conversion.
Now in college blocked extra point can be run back fo a TD, same rule?
How about a punt that gets fumbled and returned for a td?
Doesn't the moment the kicker's foot touch the ball, possession changes, thus the offense turns into defense, since the receiving team becomes offense at that point?Comment -
LT ProfitsSBR Aristocracy
- 10-27-06
- 90963
#17Now in college blocked extra point can be run back fo a TD, same rule?
How about a punt that gets fumbled and returned for a td?
Doesn't the moment the kicker's foot touch the ball, possession changes, thus the offense turns into defense, since the receiving team becomes offense at that point?
If a punter fumbles a snap and the defense picks it up and scores without it actually being punted, it is a defensive touchdown.
If the punter's foot makes contact with the ball legally at any point, it is considered a punt and becomes a special teams touchdown.
If the punter's foot makes contact with the ball illegally at any point (i.e., an intentional backwards kick), it is a penalty, and if the play ends in a score and the penalty is declined, it is a defensive score.Comment -
LegitBetRestricted User
- 05-25-10
- 538
#18If there's a loop hole i'll find it. Got you LT on the college expample..)
It was because if me that The Greek prop wording for NBA how many fouls will a player get was changed to exclude tech fouls, several years ago.Comment
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