Yeah can't wait should be a good fukkin fight!!Originally Posted by Vaughany
Siyar The Great @SiyarTheGreat
Hey @stungunkim or should I say WaterPistolKim? Quit crying about no footage on me. There won't be any footage after our fight either!
Obviously has not watched Pudz "throw hands" over in Poland MMA........or watched him turn purple after a round in the rung with Tim Sylvia.The fact that you think that MMA is in any way representative of actual fighting invalidates your opinion to dome degree, but I'll humour you.
There are a lot of routes this discussion could take, but really, it all boils down to this: do you believe that a professionally-trained cage fighter can defeat, in a street fight, a man who is immeasurably stronger and has a massive weight edge? I think that the idea that Shogun, at around 215 lbs, could beat a man who is almost twice his weight, multiple times his strength and would only need to lay one hand on him to end the fight is ridiculous, but there's nothing quantifiable here; the truth is, what side of the argument you fall on rests upon how you answer the above question. There's really nothing solid to go on, although I do believe to some degree that the opposing opinion is a bit silly. To each their own.
Comedy at its finest
This is what happens when its an off week for the UFC.
no you penetrating dumbass
what you should be asking is whether a guy that trained his whole life to fight could beat a guy that trained his whole life to lift weightsyou're a penetrating idiot MD
i would bet my life that shogun would kick the shit out of every strongman that has ever competed
are you sure you should be betting mma?? do you know how fighting works?Your mother must have been raped by a strongman while your 155 lbs dad tried to shoot single legs and pissed himself in fear.do street fighters have more hands or legs?? do they throw punches differently because its on the street? does fighting technique go away because they are wearing shoes? are you a penetrating idiot?
You don't seem to understand my point, and as I've said multiple times, Pudz hasn't competed in WSM in over three years, he has cut down on his physique significantly in order to compete in MMA, and most importantly, he is competing against people who are his own size. A WSM competitor would have a massive size and strength edge over pretty much every MMA fighter in the world. How a WSM competitor would do if he came to MMA is not the question.Obviously has not watched Pudz "throw hands" over in Poland MMA........or watched him turn purple after a round in the rung with Tim Sylvia.
No....but THE Mr. Strongman, you know the one that has won more of the damn events than anyone else......switches to MMA and has dedicated MMA training camps and still throws hands like a girl. But you think any of these strongmen are just gonna walk through MMA guys. I'll give you Mighty Mouse having a problem against one of your keg tossers.....but just get us up to lightweight, just a puny little lightweight, say Donald Cerrone,.....put him in a bar fight against one of your stone lifters.....and I'll take Cerrone to win most of the time. I would bet my money and just have to fade the chance that a random nearby keg gets tossed at him.
You don't seem to understand my point, and as I've said multiple times, Pudz hasn't competed in WSM in over three years, he has cut down on his physique significantly in order to compete in MMA, and most importantly, he is competing against people who are his own size. A WSM competitor would have a massive size and strength edge over pretty much every MMA fighter in the world. How a WSM competitor would do if he came to MMA is not the question.
You just completely ignored everything I said and re-stated your point as if I never said it. Incredible.No....but THE Mr. Strongman, you know the one that has won more of the damn events than anyone else......switches to MMA and has dedicated MMA training camps and still throws hands like a girl. But you think any of these strongmen are just gonna walk through MMA guys. I'll give you Mighty Mouse having a problem against one of your keg tossers.....but just get us up to lightweight, just a puny little lightweight, say Donald Cerrone,.....put him in a bar fight against one of your stone lifters.....and I'll take Cerrone to win most of the time. I would bet my money and just have to fade the chance that a random nearby keg gets tossed at him.
There is really no great debate here.......
Strongmen are in a weight class higher than UFC heavyweights, fighters in a higher weight class will always prevail if skill level is similar. If the lighter person is SIGNIFICANTLY more skilled than the heavier one, they will be able to offset this edge.
As far as I'm aware Shogun has significantly more fighting experience than any WSM competitor, even at 210ish he'd destroy one. If you gave a WSM 12 months intense training in all aspects of MMA, he'd be a lot less skilled than Shogun, but would be well matched.
Frankie Edgar couldn't defeat a WSM with even minimal training as the skill gap wouldn't be large enough to offset the weight advantage.
I really can't believe you guys are buying into this...
In the end it all depends on the situation but overall, an MMA fighter would destroy anyone who competed for WSM. Trust me, I'm from the midwest and we have TONS of those big guys here, big enormous incredibly strong people. Ask BigDay, Brock Lesnar was big but he wasn't even close to the biggest. See some of these farm-boys from the UP or Northern Wisco/Minnesota, those guys are ENORMOUS and incredibly strong (one of them I know never lifted weights in his life and could instantly bench over 300lbs with good form.
These guys come into the local MMA/Boxing gym here and they do terribly. They can't punch hard, their muscles hinder their movements and they get tired extremely quickly. MD, your point works against you as well though.
These MMA fighters no longer have to abide by rules or sportsmanship. Imagine Jose Aldo landing one of his trademark leg kicks directly into your unprotected groin, I'm fairly sure he world burst your testicles. How many WSM know how to block a head-kick?
Frankie Edgar would DESTROY a WSM. He'd just teep him once or twice to the knees and they'd be down. Unless he knew to keep that knee bent (which I bet he'd try and stand as tall and intimidatingly as possible) and Frankie would hyperextend his already overtaxed knee. Not to mention you guys are forgetting it's hard to get used to being punched, it takes a while. Most WSM will flinch hard when punches are coming while an MMA fighter will still close his eyes and such (basic instinct) but they're calm and measured for the most part.
Then again Bob Sapp didn't exactly have good form and he still was able to knock people out with pure strength and athleticism. Then again, Roger Huerta knocked out a former D-1 linebacker in a few seconds.
Can't believe i actually wrote all of that shit. Jimmies rustled.
Getting upset about my unquantifiable opinion, on the internet, contrasting with your unquantifiable opinion, on the internet? Didn't you post an image about this recently?I really can't believe you guys are buying into this...
In the end it all depends on the situation but overall, an MMA fighter would destroy anyone who competed for WSM. Trust me, I'm from the midwest and we have TONS of those big guys here, big enormous incredibly strong people. Ask BigDay, Brock Lesnar was big but he wasn't even close to the biggest. See some of these farm-boys from the UP or Northern Wisco/Minnesota, those guys are ENORMOUS and incredibly strong (one of them I know never lifted weights in his life and could instantly bench over 300lbs with good form.
These guys come into the local MMA/Boxing gym here and they do terribly. They can't punch hard, their muscles hinder their movements and they get tired extremely quickly. MD, your point works against you as well though.
These MMA fighters no longer have to abide by rules or sportsmanship. Imagine Jose Aldo landing one of his trademark leg kicks directly into your unprotected groin, I'm fairly sure he world burst your testicles. How many WSM know how to block a head-kick?
Frankie Edgar would DESTROY a WSM. He'd just teep him once or twice to the knees and they'd be down. Unless he knew to keep that knee bent (which I bet he'd try and stand as tall and intimidatingly as possible) and Frankie would hyperextend his already overtaxed knee. Not to mention you guys are forgetting it's hard to get used to being punched, it takes a while. Most WSM will flinch hard when punches are coming while an MMA fighter will still close his eyes and such (basic instinct) but they're calm and measured for the most part.
Then again Bob Sapp didn't exactly have good form and he still was able to knock people out with pure strength and athleticism. Then again, Roger Huerta knocked out a former D-1 linebacker in a few seconds.
Can't believe i actually wrote all of that shit. Jimmies rustled.
Anyway, counter argument: WSM contestant lays one hand on one article of Frankie Edgar's clothing, picks him up and slams him into the ground over and over until he is literally dead. As he would do with almost any MMA fighter. There aren't many MMA fighters I'd think could do well against top WSM competitors consistently; maybe less than 30 (keeping in mind that there are more than 10x that amount of fighters in the UFC alone).
I read someone talking about a person in the gym who did powerlifting was almost impossible to arm bar, but he got literally climbed by a person (who wasn't a black belt) about 150 lb and choked out. Also read about a small wrestler who got picked on by a 200 lb plus football player at a party and repeatedly took him down.Anyway, counter argument: WSM contestant lays one hand on one article of Frankie Edgar's clothing, picks him up and slams him into the ground over and over until he is literally dead. As he would do with almost any MMA fighter. There aren't many MMA fighters I'd think could do well against top WSM competitors consistently; maybe less than 30 (keeping in mind that there are more than 10x that amount of fighters in the UFC alone).
Urijah Faber has dropped bouncers on concrete so they broke their collar bone. When campaigning as a featherweight Jeff Fenech knocked out a 220 lb bouncer.
There's also a program called Last Man Standing, where a bunch of men visit all these tribes and compete in various sports. In a recent series there was a strongman competitor, probably not internationally ranked though. In wrestling comps he was easily taken down by a much smaller Senegalese wrestler who was a local champ. And in Mongolia was easily beaten by wrestlers who probably had limited strength training in comparison.
Also, Brock Lesnar was literally throwing Big Show around on one occasion. Apparently Big Show weighs 400 or 500 lb, I can't remember. Anyway, Kurt Angle got in the ring and took Lesnar down at will.
Any experienced MMA wrestler, in the heavier divisions at least, would probably take down and control a WSM competitor at will. Shogun is a strange example since he doesn't have great TDD, but if taken down would probably sweep, and if standing he has hard hooks. I imagine he'd just knock out a WSM competitor, especially one without training who would probably turtle worse than Lesnar after the first punch. Someone like Machida who has awesome TDD, has trained Sumo, and has a striking style that is suited to bare knuckle, would barely even get touched by a WSM. Being 300 lb wouldn't be a factor. Besides, I haven't seen any of Pudz's fights except against Bob Sapp, but wasn't he much worse earlier in his career? Can't see how being 50 lb heavier and having absolutely no fight training would help.
Last edited by varkolek; 12-21-12 at 03:35 PM.
lol what a retarded debate
Fact of the matter is Gabe would fuuck any of those fools up
If you want to hype yourself up for sports betting, just listen to this on repeat while imagining Gabe piledrivering Frank Mir over and over.Fact of the matter is Gabe would fuuck any of those fools up
I've been doing this since before I even knew who Gabe was.
Absolutely agree about Machida. He's a stylistic nightmare for a large, slow man who's looking to overpower him. One of the people I had in mind who would handle most WSM competitors.I read someone talking about a person in the gym who did powerlifting was almost impossible to arm bar, but he got literally climbed by a person (who wasn't a black belt) about 150 lb and choked out. Also read about a small wrestler who got picked on by a 200 lb plus football player at a party and repeatedly took him down.
Urijah Faber has dropped bouncers on concrete so they broke their collar bone. When campaigning as a featherweight Jeff Fenech knocked out a 220 lb bouncer.
There's also a program called Last Man Standing, where a bunch of men visit all these tribes and compete in various sports. In a recent series there was a strongman competitor, probably not internationally ranked though. In wrestling comps he was easily taken down by a much smaller Senegalese wrestler who was a local champ. And in Mongolia was easily beaten by wrestlers who probably had limited strength training in comparison.
Also, Brock Lesnar was literally throwing Big Show around on one occasion. Apparently Big Show weighs 400 or 500 lb, I can't remember. Anyway, Kurt Angle got in the ring and took Lesnar down at will.
Any experienced MMA wrestler, in the heavier divisions at least, would probably take down and control a WSM competitor at will. Shogun is a strange example since he doesn't have great TDD, but if taken down would probably sweep, and if standing he has hard hooks. I imagine he'd just knock out a WSM competitor, especially one without training who would probably turtle worse than Lesnar after the first punch. Someone like Machida who has awesome TDD, has trained Sumo, and has a striking style that is suited to bare knuckle, would barely even get touched by a WSM. Being 300 lb wouldn't be a factor. Besides, I haven't seen any of Pudz's fights except against Bob Sapp, but wasn't he much worse earlier in his career? Can't see how being 50 lb heavier and having absolutely no fight training would help.
As for your examples, while I appreciate the idea behind them, most of them are invalid. Your first two examples, respectively, are in a gym, no one is trying to hurt anyone else; we all know that anyone can be choked out, and in regards to a football player who, whilst larger, is not even a bodybuilder, by any stretch of the imagination.
A lot of the best MMA wrestlers at heavyweight and some at LHW could probably take down and control a WSM competitor, I agree with that.
Last edited by MD; 12-21-12 at 07:18 PM.
