Betting exchanges are a losing business

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  • User2731
    SBR Rookie
    • 12-01-19
    • 19

    #1
    Betting exchanges are a losing business
    Why has everything been so bad with betting exchanges in recent years? Why didn’t anyone create a worthy alternative to Betfair while it does everything to scare customers away from its exchange?
    It would seem that the owners of betting exchanges are in a privileged position compared to classic bookmakers: you do not risk anything, but simply cut your commission with the winnings of customers who make and accept bets from each other. A win-win option ... excluding operating expenses.
    But, as it turns out, the proceeds from this commission do not even cover them. The British bookmaker Smarkets reported annual losses of 10 million euros against a profit of € 7.7 million a year earlier: despite a 46% increase in turnover (the sum of players on the exchange) over the same period, the company's revenue fell by 42%, and proceeds from the commission - by 20%.
    Strange as it may seem, the reason for such a paradoxical result is called, namely, increased popularity, which is why the spread - the difference between the odds for “back” and “back” (lay) in the same market — has decreased to the minimum size, thereby reducing the "base" from which the commission is taken. That is, the growth of the customer base of the exchange exchange rates leads to a decrease in its income! It turns out just a disadvantageous business per se.
    Because of this, Smarket is now forced to introduce a commission from ... lost bets of 3%, so far only for those players who have won clean over 25 thousand pounds for the previous 12 months. Surely for the same reasons, Betfair is trying to limit the “population” of customers on its betting exchange.
  • Optional
    Administrator
    • 06-10-10
    • 61357

    #2
    I have wondered for a long time why Betfair did not turn out to be a license to print money.

    But I'm struggling to see how a tighter spread affects their rate of commission that much. 42% swing. Must be something else in effect there.
    .
    Comment
    • PunterLog
      SBR Rookie
      • 02-22-19
      • 48

      #3
      Weren't Smarkets seeding their own markets? That explains the reason for their losses and it's no wonder they introduced a new commission rate of 3% on both wins and losses for winning punters.

      I'm sure Betfair does it too to some extent which is why they introduced the PC to deter winning players from playing.

      There is no "Pure exchange" in the market and i don't see it coming any time soon due to all the geographical restrictions in place.
      Comment
      • Ruifgalmeida
        SBR MVP
        • 04-23-08
        • 2024

        #4
        Exchange are dying , Betfair, Betdaq and Matchbook , will be out of costumers soon with so many restrictions and rules, liquidity is getting down every year
        Comment
        • dealer wins
          SBR Wise Guy
          • 02-03-09
          • 816

          #5
          This year I have noticed a marked increase in liquidity on Betfair, especially since they introduced the new 2% commission. My use of them has gone up sharply also. This follows many years of declining liquidity.

          The fact that Betdaq cut their commission to 2% and now 0% on many sports means hopefully that Betfair wont get greedy again within the near future.

          Regarding Smarkets I have read too many negative and rogue things about them voiding perfectly good trades etc, so I refuse to use them and cant see them becoming a threat to Betfair any time soon.

          Matchbook IMO has also gone rogue, also read too much about them voiding perfectly legitimate trades, including recently a thread on here where people lost many thousands trading a tennis match taking perfectly OK odds.
          Comment
          • rodneytrotter
            SBR Hustler
            • 10-21-11
            • 89

            #6
            Smarkets and Matchbook trade on their platforms, and take on bookmaker price boosts from arbers who want lay off. When results don't go their way they can suffer big losses, as they don't balance their books
            Comment
            • jjgold
              SBR Aristocracy
              • 07-20-05
              • 388179

              #7
              Most exchanges markets all seeded
              Comment
              • mark50
                SBR Rookie
                • 12-26-19
                • 1

                #8
                With smarkets now charging 3% commission per each individual matched bet that settles ,winning bets and losing bets ,if you have earned more than £25,00 in a calender month.
                Are these numbers correct?
                I place a £200 back bet at 10.0 , then i place a lay bet on the same horse for £222.22 at 9.0 gving me profit of £22.22 .

                The horse wins the race,
                Back bet wins £200 x 10.0 = £1800 profit , smarkets takes £54 commission
                Lay bet loses = £1777.78 loss, smarkets take £53.33 commission

                Final profit/loss
                £22.22
                -£54
                -£53.33
                = -£85.11
                So a profitable trade now becomes a loss?
                Last edited by mark50; 12-26-19, 04:11 PM.
                Comment
                • Poisec
                  SBR MVP
                  • 07-22-18
                  • 1216

                  #9
                  Originally posted by PunterLog
                  Weren't Smarkets seeding their own markets? That explains the reason for their losses and it's no wonder they introduced a new commission rate of 3% on both wins and losses for winning punters.

                  I'm sure Betfair does it too to some extent which is why they introduced the PC to deter winning players from playing.

                  There is no "Pure exchange" in the market and i don't see it coming any time soon due to all the geographical restrictions in place.
                  I always thought (naively) that the big liquidity was mainly from other UK bookmakers holding a corporate account with Betfair but that's a personal belief based on nothing, you may be right about Betfair funding the market liquidity themselves. Dangerous business indeed.
                  Comment
                  • Alfa1234
                    SBR MVP
                    • 12-19-15
                    • 2722

                    #10
                    Originally posted by Poisec
                    I always thought (naively) that the big liquidity was mainly from other UK bookmakers holding a corporate account with Betfair but that's a personal belief based on nothing, you may be right about Betfair funding the market liquidity themselves. Dangerous business indeed.
                    99.9% of all liquidity on "exchanges" comes from market makers. Most of them their own. Why do you think Betfair introduced their premium charges and other exchanges have introduced something similar recently? They are bookies and don't like long term winners, nothing else to it.
                    Comment
                    • rodneytrotter
                      SBR Hustler
                      • 10-21-11
                      • 89

                      #11
                      Betting Promotion, a Swedish company, used to supply a lot of exchange liquidity but they were taken over by a Chinese company, so who knows what's going on there now.
                      Comment
                      • ZAMAZA
                        SBR Hustler
                        • 05-27-19
                        • 69

                        #12
                        Originally posted by User2731
                        Why has everything been so bad with betting exchanges in recent years? Why didn’t anyone create a worthy alternative to Betfair while it does everything to scare customers away from its exchange?
                        It would seem that the owners of betting exchanges are in a privileged position compared to classic bookmakers: you do not risk anything, but simply cut your commission with the winnings of customers who make and accept bets from each other. A win-win option ... excluding operating expenses.
                        But, as it turns out, the proceeds from this commission do not even cover them. The British bookmaker Smarkets reported annual losses of 10 million euros against a profit of € 7.7 million a year earlier: despite a 46% increase in turnover (the sum of players on the exchange) over the same period, the company's revenue fell by 42%, and proceeds from the commission - by 20%.
                        Strange as it may seem, the reason for such a paradoxical result is called, namely, increased popularity, which is why the spread - the difference between the odds for “back” and “back” (lay) in the same market — has decreased to the minimum size, thereby reducing the "base" from which the commission is taken. That is, the growth of the customer base of the exchange exchange rates leads to a decrease in its income! It turns out just a disadvantageous business per se.
                        Because of this, Smarket is now forced to introduce a commission from ... lost bets of 3%, so far only for those players who have won clean over 25 thousand pounds for the previous 12 months. Surely for the same reasons, Betfair is trying to limit the “population” of customers on its betting exchange.

                        There's something that doesn't fit.
                        Gambling houses can benefit from winning players.
                        Comment
                        • kkkkk
                          SBR Wise Guy
                          • 03-30-09
                          • 523

                          #13
                          I dont know how this come thru but since 2-3 days bevor Christmas and after that i see huge liquidity on betfair. its a huge surprise as we read that another agent accounts were closed in last month continuing the trend in the last 2 years.

                          i havent seen such thing for over 2 years to be exact. for example :

                          australian basket hit 220 k volume while it never was over 30-40 k of what 25 k was on 1.01 and around regularly

                          Turkish basket buyukmece vs fenerbahce 150 k turnover - normaly 15 k

                          korean volleyball - 50 k turnover against normally 50 (!) - 1500 turnover

                          german basket Alba also hit 120 k

                          well its normal that about christmas there are less events and this can lead to concentrating the money on single games but such liquidity is not seen for more then 2-3 years, even on christmas days in the past
                          Comment
                          • ZAMAZA
                            SBR Hustler
                            • 05-27-19
                            • 69

                            #14
                            That's excellent news.
                            Comment
                            • Optional
                              Administrator
                              • 06-10-10
                              • 61357

                              #15
                              Originally posted by kkkkk
                              I dont know how this come thru but since 2-3 days bevor Christmas and after that i see huge liquidity on betfair. its a huge surprise as we read that another agent accounts were closed in last month continuing the trend in the last 2 years.

                              i havent seen such thing for over 2 years to be exact. for example :

                              australian basket hit 220 k volume while it never was over 30-40 k of what 25 k was on 1.01 and around regularly

                              Turkish basket buyukmece vs fenerbahce 150 k turnover - normaly 15 k

                              korean volleyball - 50 k turnover against normally 50 (!) - 1500 turnover

                              german basket Alba also hit 120 k

                              well its normal that about christmas there are less events and this can lead to concentrating the money on single games but such liquidity is not seen for more then 2-3 years, even on christmas days in the past
                              Interesting.

                              Any other regular betfair users noticed this?
                              .
                              Comment
                              • littlekona
                                SBR Hall of Famer
                                • 11-19-15
                                • 5242

                                #16
                                The betfair UK horse markets still produce many 500k+ per race at the major tracks even w it being hurdles/chase season and backing is still available at orbitx...i heard from odyssey88 that betmantra will be reopening soon and crossing fingers for lay bets to return
                                Comment
                                • winnerloser
                                  SBR Hustler
                                  • 11-17-16
                                  • 72

                                  #17
                                  fuk exchanges
                                  Comment
                                  • littlekona
                                    SBR Hall of Famer
                                    • 11-19-15
                                    • 5242

                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by winnerloser
                                    fuk exchanges
                                    So where can you make lay bets esp on horses mr poddy mouth?
                                    Comment
                                    • LRBC
                                      SBR Rookie
                                      • 09-12-17
                                      • 29

                                      #19
                                      SBO and IBC effectively don't exist anymore, this could be why market in exchange is going up
                                      Comment
                                      • lotuspod
                                        SBR High Roller
                                        • 06-03-17
                                        • 204

                                        #20
                                        Just more evidence that decentralization is the way forward, especially in regards to the end-users.

                                        The online gambling industry as a whole is well on its way to becoming what's effectively an oligarchy of a few giant networks that have consolidated, at quite overvalued prices too...and then they have to appease their investors somehow. Look at all of the recent M&A's, and the valuations on them - it's become more about networks (and other gambling-focused companies) trying to sell out to the few giants for as high of a price as possible.

                                        It's pretty safe to say that the end-users are the farthest thing from any of their minds.
                                        Comment
                                        • ZAMAZA
                                          SBR Hustler
                                          • 05-27-19
                                          • 69

                                          #21
                                          Gambling is just a business.
                                          Comment
                                          • Ruifgalmeida
                                            SBR MVP
                                            • 04-23-08
                                            • 2024

                                            #22
                                            Originally posted by LRBC
                                            SBO and IBC effectively don't exist anymore, this could be why market in exchange is going up
                                            My personal opinion , sbo and Ibc dont have the same client that play on exchange.
                                            Last edited by Ruifgalmeida; 01-09-20, 07:17 PM.
                                            Comment
                                            • Vyasports
                                              SBR Hall of Famer
                                              • 01-27-19
                                              • 4946

                                              #23
                                              Originally posted by User2731
                                              Why has everything been so bad with betting exchanges in recent years? Why didn’t anyone create a worthy alternative to Betfair while it does everything to scare customers away from its exchange?
                                              It would seem that the owners of betting exchanges are in a privileged position compared to classic bookmakers: you do not risk anything, but simply cut your commission with the winnings of customers who make and accept bets from each other. A win-win option ... excluding operating expenses.
                                              But, as it turns out, the proceeds from this commission do not even cover them. The British bookmaker Smarkets reported annual losses of 10 million euros against a profit of € 7.7 million a year earlier: despite a 46% increase in turnover (the sum of players on the exchange) over the same period, the company's revenue fell by 42%, and proceeds from the commission - by 20%.
                                              Strange as it may seem, the reason for such a paradoxical result is called, namely, increased popularity, which is why the spread - the difference between the odds for “back” and “back” (lay) in the same market — has decreased to the minimum size, thereby reducing the "base" from which the commission is taken. That is, the growth of the customer base of the exchange exchange rates leads to a decrease in its income! It turns out just a disadvantageous business per se.
                                              Because of this, Smarket is now forced to introduce a commission from ... lost bets of 3%, so far only for those players who have won clean over 25 thousand pounds for the previous 12 months. Surely for the same reasons, Betfair is trying to limit the “population” of customers on its betting exchange.
                                              interesting...ive always wondered about that myself...
                                              so ...does that mean we do not really have any "real" exchange platform? now it makes sense why we get so many complaints these past few years regarding exchanges...look at online poker (rake)....
                                              they get a % for every poker hand played and yet there are so many players who have come to the conclusion that online poker are rigged ....
                                              Comment
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