[Optional]

Optional I can assure you this isn't true at all.

In live betting on pinnacle, the line will change every couple seconds, and reset even after max bets. The line was moving as if the scoreline was 2-1 and moved as it should.

I think OP knew what he was doing here. The real value of getting pk with the fave up 2-1 in the 80th minute was probably in the -5000 range. This shouldn't even be a debate.

I can assure you it is true Rangerz.

The odds would have been no different for this bet if the score was 2-1 or 0-0 (well slightly different but the current score is not very relevant to the odds)

The problem was simply a bet listing error. They told players the current score was 0-0 when it was 2-1. It really sucks for the OP who sounds very much like he bet in good faith to lose out on a technical error. But with that odds movement it appears the bulk of money went on the logical side to take a shot, and Liverpool backers would have complained.

[cashin81]

I can assure you it is true Rangerz.

The odds would have been no different for this bet if the score was 2-1 or 0-0 (well slightly different but the current score is not very relevant to the odds)

The problem was simply a bet listing error. They told players the current score was 0-0 when it was 2-1. It really sucks for the OP who sounds very much like he bet in good faith to lose out on a technical error. But with that odds movement it appears the bulk of money went on the logical side to take a shot, and Liverpool backers would have complained.

What about the real bettors, they have a much bigger reason to complain. They won and arent being paid. The odds were fair and not out of line.

The liverpool argument is that they didnt actually know the score of the game they are betting on, they bet the rest of the game from 0-0 - real score a goal - they would have lost regardless. But they expect a refund?

[Optional]

What about the real bettors, they have a much bigger reason to complain. They won and arent being paid. The odds were fair and not out of line.

The liverpool argument is that they didnt actually know the score of the game they are betting on, they bet the rest of the game from 0-0 - real score a goal - they would have lost regardless. But they expect a refund?

I agree with the first line.

Unfortunately us humans want fairness but wont give it if it affects us badly. Morally, the OP should win his money and the Pool bettors should lose. But as everyone wont agree to that, we have to work by the rules.

If the bet listing is misleading or incorrect, the rule is all bets are void. And that is the fairest way overall.

[moojoo]

Lets be honest guy knew result and was 2:1,they had techical error but is there big difference between any result,since he placed bet real won remaining 10 minutes.He bet Asian Handicap +0 starting that moment,no matter what result was before.
They should show good faith and pay him. He is experienced bettor and he place bet knowing true result and odds being right,he didnt try some stunt as i was thinking at first place.
Nobody could persuade me he would bet 21000 playing on card of technical error in case result after 90 minutes was 2:2,so he could complaining he was thinking 0:0 was result.

Pinnacle pay the guy, there in no excuse to void bet!

[cashin81]

I agree with the first line.

Unfortunately us humans want fairness but wont give it if it affects us badly. Morally, the OP should win his money and the Pool bettors should lose. But as everyone wont agree to that, we have to work by the rules.

If the bet listing is misleading or incorrect, the rule is all bets are void. And that is the fairest way overall.

Not really. The fairest way is to pay the guy at correct odds.
And to give the liverpool bettors a free bet - as not many would expect a refund if they bet liverpool and real score in front of their eyes.

thats how it works with the uk books, score is not to be relied on.

[rangerz2478]

I can assure you it is true Rangerz.

The odds would have been no different for this bet if the score was 2-1 or 0-0 (well slightly different but the current score is not very relevant to the odds)

The problem was simply a bet listing error. They told players the current score was 0-0 when it was 2-1. It really sucks for the OP who sounds very much like he bet in good faith to lose out on a technical error. But with that odds movement it appears the bulk of money went on the logical side to take a shot, and Liverpool backers would have complained.

Optional, I was simply commenting on your point that money was coming in on the other side based on the line movement. We don't know that.

As someone who bets on live betting every single night on multiple sites, I know how pinnacle operates their live betting. I can tell you the odds will drop when someone places a max bet on a certain side, for sure. BUT then a couple seconds later once the line resets, the new line will not be impacted by previous bets. So just because the odds went in the direction they should have, does not mean people bet the other side. We don't know if they did or not. For example, I can make a max bet, wait for the line to reset, and make another max bet seconds later.

[rangerz2478]

The line is asian handicap.

It says 0.0 with the score also (wrongly) at 0-0

asian handicap 0.0 is draw no bet for the rest of the game.... so draw the last 10 - money back... liverpool win he loses, real wins he wins.

no way he should stand here.

Right and I get all of that for sure. But if the bet was graded at the way it was wrongly written, he would have WON if the last 10 was a draw. Correct?

That's a bad line no matter how you slice it.

As far as intent goes, it just comes down to what OP thought he was betting. If he thought he was betting PK for the entire game, then he was clearly taking a shot. If he thought he was betting -1 for the entire game, then he did nothing wrong and it just sucks to lose out because of the pinnacle line error.

[cashin81]

Right and I get all of that for sure. But if the bet was graded at the way it was wrongly written, he would have WON if the last 10 was a draw. Correct?

That's a bad line no matter how you slice it.

As far as intent goes, it just comes down to what OP thought he was betting. If he thought he was betting PK for the entire game, then he was clearly taking a shot. If he thought he was betting -1 for the entire game, then he did nothing wrong and it just sucks to lose out because of the pinnacle line error.

no theres no way he would have won if it was draw.
the only way to win was if real won the rest of the game.
nothing is wrong with the way the bet is written, only the score is wrong.

[Alfa1234]

Right and I get all of that for sure. But if the bet was graded at the way it was wrongly written, he would have WON if the last 10 was a draw. Correct?

That's a bad line no matter how you slice it.

As far as intent goes, it just comes down to what OP thought he was betting. If he thought he was betting PK for the entire game, then he was clearly taking a shot. If he thought he was betting -1 for the entire game, then he did nothing wrong and it just sucks to lose out because of the pinnacle line error.

It would have been a void if the last 10mins were a draw. The line was obviously correct, I also believe Pinnacle should pay this...the line was fine. There was no doubt about the actual score at the time...

[rangerz2478]

I had a live baseball bet on pinnacle last month. Score was 8-2 and I was trying to bet under 10.5 bottom 9 as I was arbing with another book. The under won, I check my pinnacle account and they voided all bets. I couldn't understand why until I saw the unders were placed at under 9.5 instead of 10.5. 2 things here:

1.) Pinnacle DID fairly cancel both sides of the wager, even mine who couldn't possibly win.

2.) I lost a ton of money on it because the over part of the arb lost on the other site and I was stuck with the one losing bet.

In this scenario, I was grateful pinnacle correctly cancelled both sides, but was pretty pissed off that I lost a good amount of money because them messing up the line directly caused me to lose a bet I never would have made without the pinny side. Massively sucked, but nothing I could do about it. Wish I could've asked pinny to pay the under bet as if it was 10.5 but I knew that was a lost cause. Just had to blame myself for not catching their mistake.

[rangerz2478]

It would have been a void if the last 10mins were a draw. The line was obviously correct, I also believe Pinnacle should pay this...the line was fine. There was no doubt about the actual score at the time...

But the score IS built into the line, so how can you say it was fine if the score is wrong? Of course there is no doubt about the score, but the same could be said about my baseball example above. Do you think they should have paid those? I sure as hell hope the answer is yes because it cost me close to $2k.

[rangerz2478]

Sportsbook	728479083Baseball 2018-05-19 01:30:57	Under 10.5 Tampa Bay Rays -vs- LAA Angels LIVEGame OU MLB @ 2018-05-18	-174 A	Base:846.00 (1,472.04)	0.00	0.00	VOID
98	Sportsbook	728479069Baseball 2018-05-19 01:30:53	Under10.5 Tampa Bay Rays -vs-LAA Angels LIVEGame OU MLB @ 2018-05-18	-181 A	Base:846.00 (1,531.26)	0.00	0.00	VOID
99	Sportsbook	728481367Baseball 2018-05-19 01:30:31	Under10.5 Tampa Bay Rays -vs-LAA Angels LIVEGame OU MLB @ 2018-05-18	-256 A	Base:2.00 (5.12)	0.00	0.00	VOID
100	Sportsbook	728479000Baseball 2018-05-19 01:30:23	Under10.5 Tampa Bay Rays -vs-LAA Angels LIVEGame OU MLB @ 2018-05-18	-265 A	Base:56.50 (149.73)	0.00	0.00	VOID
101	Sportsbook	728478943Baseball 2018-05-19 01:30:09	Under10.5 Tampa Bay Rays -vs-LAA Angels LIVEGame OU MLB @ 2018-05-18	-239 A	Base:196.00 (468.44)	0.00	0.00	VOID

[rangerz2478]

Above didn't format great but here:

https://imgur.com/a/2t5sGSE

Score was 8-3 I meant to say. Line should have been 11.5 but they posted 10.5. Cost me 1946 euros.

[Alfa1234]

But the score IS built into the line, so how can you say it was fine if the score is wrong? Of course there is no doubt about the score, but the same could be said about my baseball example above. Do you think they should have paid those? I sure as hell hope the answer is yes because it cost me close to $2k.

The score is NOT built into the line...all Pinnacle soccer handicaps start from a 0-0 score (as you can even see in the bet screenshot of the OP). This bet was on an asian handicap 0 meaning a void if the remaining 10mins were a draw and a win if Madrid had scored 1 more time than Liverpool had in those remaining mins. The actual score at the time was irrelevant. The line would have been the same if the score was 0-0, 3-0 or 2-1...doesn't matter.

[rangerz2478]

The score is NOT built into the line...all Pinnacle soccer handicaps start from a 0-0 score (as you can even see in the bet screenshot of the OP). This bet was on an asian handicap 0 meaning a void if the remaining 10mins were a draw and a win if Madrid had scored 1 more time than Liverpool had in those remaining mins. The actual score at the time was irrelevant. The line would have been the same if the score was 0-0, 3-0 or 2-1...doesn't matter.

Yes, I get the line would have been the same if the score was 0-0, 3-0, or 2-1 at the time. But if you are looking at JUST the ticket...

0-0 pk means pk for the game.
2-1 pk means -1 for the game.

[moojoo]

Yes, I get the line would have been the same if the score was 0-0, 3-0, or 2-1 at the time. But if you are looking at JUST the ticket...

0-0 pk means pk for the game.
2-1 pk means -1 for the game.

Doesnt say Pk it is A.

[rangerz2478]

Doesnt say Pk it is A.

You mean the A under price? Don’t know what the A means but 0.0 is obv pk.

[Optional]

Doesnt say Pk it is A.

You mean the A under price? Don’t know what the A means but 0.0 is obv pk.

Asian Handicap of 0.0 (or just 0) is the same bet as American PK

The A under odds stands for "Asian Handicap" (I think)

[Optional]

Not really. The fairest way is to pay the guy at correct odds.
And to give the liverpool bettors a free bet - as not many would expect a refund if they bet liverpool and real score in front of their eyes.

thats how it works with the uk books, score is not to be relied on.

Sorry Cashin. But UK books would all grade a listing error like this the same way Pinny has usually.

There may be occasions where they have paid both sides as you suggest, after glaring errors on their part, but I doubt any have ever done that with a live bet listing error.

[cashin81]

Sorry Cashin. But UK books would all grade a listing error like this the same way Pinny has usually.

There may be occasions where they have paid both sides as you suggest, after glaring errors on their part, but I doubt any have ever done that with a live bet listing error.

The only way you push with hills is if something has already happened, like a late bet. For example you bet over 2,5 (or under 2.5) and the score is 3-0.

If its just the SCORE that was wrong but the odds were right, then the bet stands. For example it says 5-0 on site but the actual score is 4-0 and you bet over 5.5 - Bet is good:

Although we make every effort to ensure all Live In-Play and Notifications displayed are correct, information (such as score and time of game) is intended to be used as a guide and we assume no liability in the event of any information being incorrect.


If the odds were completey out of line, but it isnt a late bet - then you get paid at correct odds.

"

1. In the event that we make an obvious error, which occurs when the odds/terms offered are materially different from that available in the general market and/or are clearly incorrect given the probability of the event occurring, we reserve the right to amend that error and settle bets at the correct odds/terms available when the bet was struck."

[cashin81]

The only other thing is the op says he bet on 80th min, so he bet 80,81.82 and they score on 82:40?

that doesnt look great - maybe they were late bets.

[Optional]

It was nothing to do with the odds or probability and the don't rely on in-play notifications is talking about the live score reporting, not the actual bet listing.

You may be right and WH might have graded it differently this time but in my experience they void Listing Errors the same as just about all books. Especially when it's a temp live in-play error.

[Optional]

The only other thing is the op says he bet on 80th min, so he bet 80,81.82 and they score on 82:40?

that doesnt look great - maybe they were late bets.

Although the OP sounds genuine, he could just as easily have been taking a shot himself, and now trying to get paid for it. We or the book can't know.

Whatever they did, someone would be unhappy here. And if there was suddenly a lot more action on the listing error than previously, there was no way they were going to reward people for that by paying both sides.

[cashin81]

i dont know what you mean by "listing error"

from what i can see, the score was wrong and the odds were (roughly) correct

[cashin81]

just ask hills, show them this thread..........

[Optional]

i dont know what you mean by "listing error"

from what i can see, the score was wrong and the odds were (roughly) correct

The way the bet offer was worded.

It could be confusing to some bettors saying they were getting PK from when the score was 0-0 is the reason listing errors usually end up voided.

[moojoo]

Optional do you really think somebody would take a shot and throw 21000. If he did what i was thinking at begining without reading its AH,then he would be taking a shot.
Only 1 thing standing between him getting payed and Pinnie voiding the bet is if really bet after third goal for Real,but i really doubt it.

Rangerz Pk is full match bet (Winner), and AH is bet for remaining time in match from that minute.

Would be interesting how did Pinnacle settle -0,5 and -0,25 or -0,75 if they had that Asian Handicap.

SBR should get involved and give as full story on this. If problem is only displayed result at the moment of bet,then it is outrageous to cancel bet.
Maybe if somebody could find data from that minute with all possible bets at Pinnacle live,or screenshot just to see what odds were for Real to win 1X2.

[cashin81]

The way the bet offer was worded.

It could be confusing to some bettors saying they were getting PK from when the score was 0-0 is the reason listing errors usually end up voided.

the way the bet is offered is correct. The wording is correct. the line was indeed AH 0.0..

The score was wrong which is why i gave examples to what wh do when the score is wrong.

[Optional]

The score is part of the bet offer in the context of a live AH bet.

[cashin81]

The score is part of the bet offer in the context of a live AH bet.

Im saying pinnacle knew the score. but the displayed score was wrong. so the line was good. That can happen a lot.

the AH 0.0 would have been like that the whole game. it wouldnt be -0.5 or -1. for the rest of the game it would always be 0.0.

its not like the line should have been -0.5 but he won his bet on 0.0.

anyway thats me done for this thread.

i think it was late bet personally ,

[Pedro]

Although we make every effort to ensure all Live In-Play and Notifications displayed are correct, information (such as score and time of game) is intended to be used as a guide and we assume no liability in the event of any information being incorrect.
"

1. In the event that we make an obvious error, which occurs when the odds/terms offered are materially different from that available in the general market and/or are clearly incorrect given the probability of the event occurring, we reserve the right to amend that error and settle bets at the correct odds/terms available when the bet was struck."

Above, pinnacle is basically saying that the score displayed is "intended to be used as a guide" therefore it should have no relevance whether the correct score is displayed or not.

Now, if -148 were erroneous at the given time in the game then the bet should be cancelled, though I am not sure if pinnacle is actually saying that.

If pinnacle is saying that the bet was cancelled because the score displayed was 0-0, then I think the bet should stand, since pinnacle themselves are stating that the score displayed is only "intended to be used as a guide".

What is pinnacle exactly saying? Why was the bet exactly cancelled?

Btw, personally I have nothing against pinnacle. I think they have always been great and top notch.

Pedro

[Pedro]

Adding to the above, it's possible that pinnacle's system came up with the -148 odds based thinking that the score is 0-0 therefore the odds provided were based on incorrect info, which would lead to the odds being erroneous giving them a reason to cancel the bet.

To be honest with you -148 seems like the correct odds to me given the state of the game at the moment, but pinnacle might think otherwise.

Pedro

[moojoo]

Pedro it says they are not responsible if information is incorect.
Even if odds is slightly off they could settle at -170 at worst for OP. Pinnacle need to pay,they didnt offer +150,it was -150.

[cashin81]

Pedro it says they are not responsible if information is incorect.
Even if odds is slightly off they could settle at -170 at worst for OP. Pinnacle need to pay,they didnt offer +150,it was -150.

I was giving examples for how uk books would settle, that quotes are from willhill.

[Optional]

If pinnacle is saying that the bet was cancelled because the score displayed was 0-0, then I think the bet should stand, since pinnacle themselves are stating that the score displayed is only "intended to be used as a guide".

What do they do about bettors who took Liverpool 0.0 who now claim their bets should now either be winners or void as the Bet Offer Listing says they got AH 0.0 when the score was 0-0?



And the line about scores only being used as a guide is 1) not from Pinny terms (WillHill) and 2) is referring to the live score and match time reporting on the site. It's not meant to refer to the bet offer wording. If the bet offer wording is wrong/confusing, its a void whether it is to do with the score, spelling or any other error.