1. #36
    moojoo
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    Yes. That is arbitrage. They are giving you hard time. Because that model,your friend is limited everywhere. They will pay you out eventually,if you are legit(not duplicate acc).

  2. #37
    ambush12345
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    Quote Originally Posted by Optional View Post
    The Gibraltar regulator. Scroll to near the bottom of this page for info https://www.gibraltar.gov.gi/new/remote-gambling

    What are you going to complain about though? That your friend didn't get a PVC but you did?

    That Bet365 should not be aloowed to investigate your account?

    That they should have to explain why its being investigated?
    I didnt sew this part till now.

    The complain is that my friend that is gamler and lose money got PVC in 5 days, like thay claim it on bet365 website. But i didnt get PVC not even in 28 days. And no letter travels in EU for 28 days, this is just same crayzi statement o wait 28 days

    Of course bet365 can investigate my account no problem. But on live chat every time i go they tell diferent story. It was Ok for me to wait 28 days for investigation like thay told me to wait. After 28 days, I went again to live chat and thay told me that thay need 28 days to ivesigate, like i was never before on live chat. They never respond to my mails that I send, like i dont exsist.

    I dont care what thay investigate at all, i never asked this. Like I see ther only intention is to pay very very slow. Becouse I see giblartar.gov needs 60 to solve the problem. And I need my money to continue betting on other bookies. Be sure Optional I will poste if i get the money out. And when I get my money out this will prove only that I was right all that I told here

    Of course one out of 1000 bets I made could be also fixed. But becouse one out of 1000 maches thay may be fixed you cant hold peoples money. If I maybe bet 5€ on fixed mach out of 1000 bets this is nothing.
    I made my deposit of 600€ almoste one year ago. Than I withdraw several thousents of euro from bet365, and never had a problem. My account was verified. Why they locked it? The fact is becouse I won too much. I acept that tha ydo not wish me any more as a costumer, but thay treat me like a fool. I understand if investigation would go on for several mounths. But I cant accept why thay didnt send me PVC first time like thay say. Becouse of this PVC bad situation, I know thay play stupid games with me.

    Legaly thay can say that they may investigate my account for 1 or even 2 years. Maybe thay have this right under some law. But thay can say this just becouse this way thay can avoid to pay for next few years. You find his corect atitude? I clearly wrote what I do, and I didnt bet anythink against the law. All my documents were acepted

    My only complain is to get money out as soon as posible

  3. #38
    ambush12345
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    Quote Originally Posted by moojoo View Post
    Yes. That is arbitrage. They are giving you hard time. Because that model,your friend is limited everywhere. They will pay you out eventually,if you are legit(not duplicate acc).
    Of course I am legit, this was never a question or a problem. You think is honest from tham to give hard time to me becouse of this that I bet on? Thay just take me money so till I dont get my money I cant continue my buisnes on other bookmakers. In the world of busnes who dont deliver money or goods in time need to pay extra penalties or fees. And bet365 of course is excluded from this

    Bravo bet365

  4. #39
    Optional
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    Quote Originally Posted by ambush12345 View Post
    I didnt sew this part till now.

    The complain is that my friend that is gamler and lose money got PVC in 5 days, like thay claim it on bet365 website. But i didnt get PVC not even in 28 days. And no letter travels in EU for 28 days, this is just same crayzi statement o wait 28 days

    Of course bet365 can investigate my account no problem. But on live chat every time i go they tell diferent story. It was Ok for me to wait 28 days for investigation like thay told me to wait. After 28 days, I went again to live chat and thay told me that thay need 28 days to ivesigate, like i was never before on live chat. They never respond to my mails that I send, like i dont exsist.

    I dont care what thay investigate at all, i never asked this. Like I see ther only intention is to pay very very slow. Becouse I see giblartar.gov needs 60 to solve the problem. And I need my money to continue betting on other bookies. Be sure Optional I will poste if i get the money out. And when I get my money out this will prove only that I was right all that I told here

    Of course one out of 1000 bets I made could be also fixed. But becouse one out of 1000 maches thay may be fixed you cant hold peoples money. If I maybe bet 5€ on fixed mach out of 1000 bets this is nothing.
    I made my deposit of 600€ almoste one year ago. Than I withdraw several thousents of euro from bet365, and never had a problem. My account was verified. Why they locked it? The fact is becouse I won too much. I acept that tha ydo not wish me any more as a costumer, but thay treat me like a fool. I understand if investigation would go on for several mounths. But I cant accept why thay didnt send me PVC first time like thay say. Becouse of this PVC bad situation, I know thay play stupid games with me.

    Legaly thay can say that they may investigate my account for 1 or even 2 years. Maybe thay have this right under some law. But thay can say this just becouse this way thay can avoid to pay for next few years. You find his corect atitude? I clearly wrote what I do, and I didnt bet anythink against the law. All my documents were acepted

    My only complain is to get money out as soon as posible
    I suggest that you try to stick to that point then. That they told you 28 days. It has taken more then 28 days already and all they tell you still is that it takes 28 days.

    The Gibraltar regulator might query them about that for you.

    I'd leave out all the stuff about PVC codes and friends and what you think laws should allow. As that will just cloud the issue.

  5. #40
    ambush12345
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    Quote Originally Posted by Optional View Post
    I suggest that you try to stick to that point then. That they told you 28 days. It has taken more then 28 days already and all they tell you still is that it takes 28 days.

    The Gibraltar regulator might query them about that for you.

    I'd leave out all the stuff about PVC codes and friends and what you think laws should allow. As that will just cloud the issue.
    On 7/3/2018 I sent PVC to bet365, thay told me to wait for account review 28days
    On 4/4/2018 I contact bet365 again, thay told me that review started on 4/4/2018 and I need to wait 28 days for account review

    Why bet365 didnt made review of my account till 4/4/2018 like thay say?

  6. #41
    Optional
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    Quote Originally Posted by ambush12345 View Post
    On 7/3/2018 I sent PVC to bet365, thay told me to wait for account review 28days
    On 4/4/2018 I contact bet365 again, thay told me that review started on 4/4/2018 and I need to wait 28 days for account review

    Why bet365 didnt made review of my account till 4/4/2018 like thay say?
    Would you like me to guess like you are? Ok, I'd guess they have caught you and your friend out trying to scam somehow and its taking so long as they are giving him the correct amount of time to respond to their queries. Which you he can't, so you are trying a last ditch attempt to rant and rave here.

    Your turn to make the next guess...


    And sure, don't take my advice then. Good luck continuing to rant about the PVC. Of course the regulator wont confuse you for one of the numerous scammers who do the same thing to them. Just please don't return here afterward to complain how surprising you found it if the regulator ignores you.
    Last edited by Optional; 04-08-18 at 09:17 PM.

  7. #42
    ambush12345
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    Quote Originally Posted by Optional View Post
    Would you like me to guess like you are? Ok, I'd guess they have caught you and your friend out trying to scam somehow and its taking so long as they are giving him the correct amount of time to respond to their queries. Which you he can't, so you are trying a last ditch attempt to rant and rave here.
    And sure, don't take my advice then. Good luck continuing to rant about the PVC. Of course the regulator wont confuse you for one of the numerous scammers who do the same thing to them. Just please don't return here afterward to complain how surprising you found it if the regulator ignores you.
    Would I be so stupid and mention my friend in my poste? If I would have any conection with him and somthing suspisiouse, I would never mentioned any friend. I would try to hide this in public of course, dont you think?

    I read a lot of forums when bet365 dont send PVC also for 6 mounths, just avoiding to pay to profitable players. But at the end thay pay.

    I am not here woried that I did somthing iligal. I am here just to tell to people how dirty bet365 is if you beat tham in legal way.
    I am 100% bet365 will pay me. But thay will delay payment as long as thay legaly can. Probalbly under some law bet365 have right to hold my money for 2 years. I am sure thay can find an excuse to hold the money. This is sure legal but not etical.

    And every time that i go on live chat thay told me a litle bit diferent story. PVC story is probably not somthing i can argue on cort, but is somthing that shows to me that thay will make evrything to pay very very slow

    Ther should be a law if you hold peoples money and you dont find nathing suspisiose at the end you need to pay penalties to the costumer. This would be etical to do

    I am 100% thay will pay me, becouse they have laws above tham self. And when this will hapened ther will be a profe that thay did somthin non etical at all. And as soon as thay pay i will be here

  8. #43
    Optional
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    Quote Originally Posted by ambush12345 View Post
    Would I be so stupid and mention my friend in my poste? If I would have any conection with him and somthing suspisiouse, I would never mentioned any friend. I would try to hide this in public of course, dont you think?

    I read a lot of forums when bet365 dont send PVC also for 6 mounths, just avoiding to pay to profitable players. But at the end thay pay.

    I am not here woried that I did somthing iligal. I am here just to tell to people how dirty bet365 is if you beat tham in legal way.
    I am 100% bet365 will pay me. But thay will delay payment as long as thay legaly can. Probalbly under some law bet365 have right to hold my money for 2 years. I am sure thay can find an excuse to hold the money. This is sure legal but not etical.

    And every time that i go on live chat thay told me a litle bit diferent story. PVC story is probably not somthing i can argue on cort, but is somthing that shows to me that thay will make evrything to pay very very slow

    Ther should be a law if you hold peoples money and you dont find nathing suspisiose at the end you need to pay penalties to the costumer. This would be etical to do

    I am 100% thay will pay me, becouse they have laws above tham self. And when this will hapened ther will be a profe that thay did somthin non etical at all. And as soon as thay pay i will be here
    It's good that you are that confident of being paid. It shows you are probably honest, and if so, it is almost sure you will be paid once they are finished. I hope to see you post it here when you do get paid as well.

    But there is some real reason it's taking so long. It's really not just to delay paying you. As annoying as it is there really isn't much you can do to hurry it up though. Just write the regulator and tell them Bet365 said 28 days and it's taken longer than that and they will hopefully reach out to Bet365 for an explanation. That's your best chance of hurrying things up.

  9. #44
    ambush12345
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    Quote Originally Posted by Optional View Post
    It's good that you are that confident of being paid. It shows you are probably honest, and if so, it is almost sure you will be paid once they are finished. I hope to see you post it here when you do get paid as well.

    But there is some real reason it's taking so long. It's really not just to delay paying you. As annoying as it is there really isn't much you can do to hurry it up though. Just write the regulator and tell them Bet365 said 28 days and it's taken longer than that and they will hopefully reach out to Bet365 for an explanation. That's your best chance of hurrying things up.
    thanks for nice advice

  10. #45
    barba
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    I have mine account locked, PVC is not coming for almost 2 months.
    Live betting, no arbitrage.
    My friend who bets similar like I do, reported he had his account locked a month ago.
    On chat they say every time other thing regarding PVC.
    They are laying.
    Last year pure profit was more than 500 mil. and they started to steal from the players.
    Why the whole betting community is not writing about this as I spoke with some other players and some had similar situation or they heard for similar cases.
    Btw, Optional, I am just wondered, off course you don't need to answer. How much bet365 pays you to defend them?

  11. #46
    Gaze73
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    A lot of bookies say in the terms and conditions that they only accept "recreational players/gamblers". When you're value betting/arbing you're obviously not recreational, you're doing it for profit only.

  12. #47
    lonnie55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaze73 View Post
    A lot of bookies say in the terms and conditions that they only accept "recreational players/gamblers". When you're value betting/arbing you're obviously not recreational, you're doing it for profit only.
    This is a stupid rule and just one out of many rules that would not be declared legal in front of a court.

    What is the legal definition of a recreational player?

    Every player looks for profit, doesn't he? What is the difference between a recreational and a pro player? If you still have a regular job but you're doing arbing with small money in your free time to earn some extra money are you a pro player then? Does it depend on the method how someone makes his profit or on the stake size or on his intentions (earning money vs having fun)?

    Obviously any book that limits players is a recreational book for sure. But no book did ever define what a recreational player is.

  13. #48
    ambush12345
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    I just cant belive how some guys defend bookmakers. This was the top coment i ever read:

    A lot of bookies say in the terms and conditions that they only accept "recreational players/gamblers". When you're value betting/arbing you're obviously not recreational, you're doing it for profit only.

    hahhahaah what a funy boy wrote this? Are you seriouse? On bookmakers like bet365 is forbiden to win and bet on ther wrong odds? This think on a cort my friend have not a chance. This is pathetic what you wrote. If bet365 dont wish wining players than thay should have only casino games wher you cant win long term in legal way.

    It looks like I am not the only one who have this problem. Maybe more people will came here and tell as similar stories as barba. I am very happy that I am not alone who show what behavior bet365 start to implemnted. I just cant swolow ther reaction, how thay treat me just becouse i win... And i dont understand no one who is agnst me, like you would suport a criminal act

    OF course some guys asume i did that or that. But i clerly discribe my story (you can or cant belive it, its up to you,). But dont asume thinks like I bet together with my frend, I tooke some bonuses,... I just beat tham 101% legaly And the money on my account from bet365 will profe that bet365 start to become shady. Also betdsi and 1xbet maybe once were good bookmaker, but ther is no guarenty that bet365 can go to that level one day.
    Try to do what I did guys bet what I bet on(I told how I bet), and come back here in one year. Than I am sure you will face tha same problem as I do. After that, say how honest bet365 treats you and how good thay are. People do you realy like that bookie can treat as like sh*t, just becouse we win?

  14. #49
    ambush12345
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    Today has pased 73 days since my account is locked, and I need to wait 23 days more that thay finish my review. This will be 96 days at the end. And since day one I provide tham all documents thay asked imideatly. This is almoste 1/3 of the year. And in this time whit the money thay hold I know I could made with my formula 3-4k€ on other bookmakers. Will bet365 cover money I lost?
    If thay found I am legit, they should cover the cost, but of course the law is on ther side, becouse the laws about gamling wrote a layer and not a mathematician or betting expert who is expert on this field. The law should be writen in good for people not in good for companies, espacialy gembeling companies wher almoste all people lose ther money. And I am maybe one out of 100 that wins. And than bookis say, lets fu*k the guy for some time, just becouse we can.
    Of course I understand that some people have to protect the best rated bookmakers. But be sure that in future bet365 A++++ status will drop.
    For example I did the same think with marathonbet, thay asked me for some extra documents, but than thay pay fast like thay promise. Like this should every bookmaker work. It is sad that as castumer I need to faith to get my money out. Bet365 not even spend a second to wrote me any mail when thay blocked my account.

    Bet365 be ashamed what bookmaker you become

  15. #50
    moojoo
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    Stop using your "formula" if you dont want have more problems with other books.

  16. #51
    ambush12345
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    Quote Originally Posted by moojoo View Post
    Stop using your "formula" if you dont want have more problems with other books.
    It is ilegal what I do?

  17. #52
    moojoo
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    Quote Originally Posted by ambush12345 View Post
    It is ilegal what I do?
    No,but when books catch you they give you hard time like that.
    They also void winnning bets(Not Bet365).
    Imagine you put 1000e at 2.05 at 1 book and 1000 at 2.05 at other. Your losing bet is setteled accordingly and winning is voided. You lost 1k euros...

  18. #53
    ambush12345
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    Quote Originally Posted by moojoo View Post
    No,but when books catch you they give you hard time like that.
    They also void winnning bets(Not Bet365).
    Imagine you put 1000e at 2.05 at 1 book and 1000 at 2.05 at other. Your losing bet is setteled accordingly and winning is voided. You lost 1k euros...
    Thanks for polite advice. But I dont do what you describe.Why would I bet on bouth sides if I know which side is wrong?
    You think is right that bookmakers give hard time to players that win this way you describe?
    Last edited by ambush12345; 04-09-18 at 03:27 PM.

  19. #54
    moojoo
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    You said you lay at betfair,and bet opposite at bet365.

    Yes i think they should give hard time to arbers because they make it harder for other bettors.

  20. #55
    ambush12345
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    Quote Originally Posted by moojoo View Post
    You said you lay at betfair,and bet opposite at bet365.

    Yes i think they should give hard time to arbers because they make it harder for other bettors.
    I never said i lay on betfair I said I use betfair as a model

  21. #56
    jbayko
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    Quote Originally Posted by moojoo View Post
    You said you lay at betfair,and bet opposite at bet365.

    Yes i think they should give hard time to arbers because they make it harder for other bettors.
    To be fair, he didn't say that. Actually, I was confused as to why you were calling what he was doing "arbing" earlier in the thread, but now it's clear. He's using what he believes to be a sharp book(s) to find inefficiencies at soft ones and playing those edges. He's not playing the other side for a guaranteed profit - just expecting a positive ROI over the long haul due to this edge.

  22. #57
    ambush12345
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbayko View Post
    To be fair, he didn't say that. Actually, I was confused as to why you were calling what he was doing "arbing" earlier in the thread, but now it's clear. He's using what he believes to be a sharp book(s) to find inefficiencies at soft ones and playing those edges. He's not playing the other side for a guaranteed profit - just expecting a positive ROI over the long haul due to this edge.

  23. #58
    jtoler
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaze73 View Post
    A lot of bookies say in the terms and conditions that they only accept "recreational players/gamblers". When you're value betting/arbing you're obviously not recreational, you're doing it for profit only.

  24. #59
    barba
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    Bet365 earned 2 billion euros until now.
    Yes, I wrote number correctly.
    And some bast**s here defend Bet365 and says that it's ok that they BLOCK (not limit) accounts of customers who makes profit there.
    Hypocrites.

  25. #60
    moojoo
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    Quote Originally Posted by ambush12345 View Post
    betfair is perfect matematical model that show thru odds. IF you get a lay odd on betfair 2,00, you know that thru chances to win is 50%. If you see the odds on bet365 for same bet 2,10, than your advantage is 0,10 or 5% on long run
    Jbayko what did he wrote here?

  26. #61
    moojoo
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    Quote Originally Posted by ambush12345 View Post
    Thanks for polite advice. But I dont do what you describe.Why would I bet on bouth sides if I know which side is wrong?
    You think is right that bookmakers give hard time to players that win this way you describe?
    I really dont get it. You see 1 bookmaker have at 2 and other at 2.10 so you bet without researching that match.
    Its like martingale in roulette.

  27. #62
    bithko
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    Me I bet only to lose money because I like it, that's my favorite hobby...after throwing my money in the fire

  28. #63
    ambush12345
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    Quote Originally Posted by moojoo View Post
    I really dont get it. You see 1 bookmaker have at 2 and other at 2.10 so you bet without researching that match.
    Its like martingale in roulette.
    Better you stop coment on this becouse you dont get it....

  29. #64
    jbayko
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    Quote Originally Posted by moojoo View Post
    Jbayko what did he wrote here?
    I actually still read that the way I explained it in my last post. The key for me are the first and last phrases of his post: "betfair is perfect matematical model that show thru odds." and "than your advantage is 0,10 or 5% on long run". To me, this implies that he's talking about using a sharp book to find an edge at a soft one rather than arb. However, I can definitely see why someone might interpret it as you did. I actually had to read it twice this time to re-establish where I stood on his post Communication in this thread has been a bit challenging at times since English seems to be second language for OP.
    Last edited by jbayko; 04-09-18 at 11:28 PM.

  30. #65
    ambush12345
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbayko View Post
    I actually still read that the way I explained it in my last post. The key for me are the first and last phrases of his post: "betfair is perfect matematical model that show thru odds." and "than your advantage is 0,10 or 5% on long run". To me, this implies that he's talking about using a sharp book to find an edge at a soft one rather than arb. However, I can definitely see why someone might interpret it as you did. I actually had to read it twice this time to re-establish where I stood on his post Communication in this thread has been a bit challenging at times since English seems to be second language for OP.

  31. #66
    ambush12345
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    Following a review of your account I can see that at the point in which we received all of the required documentation such as Alternative ID, Face and ID and your Postal Verification Code, the account was sent over to be reviewed by the relevant department on the 04/04/2018.

    This bet365 answer to me thru
    resolver today. I send tham all documents on 27/2/2018 and on 7/3/2018 I send tham PVC. Now thay claim thay recive all documents on 4/4/2018. This is just unbeliveble. I cant belive a bookmaker on this level can lie.... I am without words.....

  32. #67
    barba
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    They think they are big enough now to do what ever they like. Until they will start loosing customers they will probably behave like this. And it's not problem to buy people on forums to discredit those who wrote against them.

  33. #68
    leovegas
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    you are a very small minority who is a pain to the bookmakers who sponsor websites like SBR, so it's possible you are in for a very long wait

  34. #69
    ambush12345
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    Todaj I got 1826,34€ from bet365. And becouse I am honest I poste it here. So the problem is solved for me.

    But this proved to all of you who crytisize me what i do, that i should not arb, valuebet, that I took some bonus, that I had some duplicate account. All this speculation were bull sh** This only prove to all of you how dirty bet365 can play with wining players.

    Bet365 is UK global bookie in 21century, and not some Hiltler personal bookmaker in 1943. All of you guys who were on bet365 side be ashamed of yourself. If you wish some dirty comunety go in North Korea
    1826.34 EUR11
    1826.34 EUR

  35. #70
    ambush12345
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    Dear Mr Kocevar,

    Thank you for your email regarding the review of your account.


    I would like to apologise that you are unhappy with the time it did take in order to complete the review. I understand that the documents that you sent in including the PVC were sent in by the 07/03/2018, however; the details of the account were sent over at this point, but the review may not have begun on the same day. As such, the review we aim to complete within the 28 days that has been advised to you.


    I can confirm that this review has now been fully completed on the account and as such, the remaining balance within the account of €1826.34 has been withdrawn back to the Neteller account that was registered to your bet365 account. The Neteller withdrawal can take up to 12 hours to be received. For the account, this will remain suspended with no option to reopen.


    Once again, please accept my apologies in the delay within this process and thank you for your continued co-operation in this matter.

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