1. #1
    zikko
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    Void bet because line moved after I placed my bet: Goldenvegas.be wants to steal me

    Hello everybody. My story on Goldenvegas:
    I bet on the basket ball match Bourg/Antibes, handicap -6.5 Bourg, 1580 price 1.85
    Final result 94-81 so my bet win. But Goldenvegas decide to void my bet saying it was a line error.

    1. I received an email from Goldenvegas in which they confirmed my bet was accepted. I can provide a screenshot.

    2. I did not receive an email from Goldenvegas in which they they would have announced the cancellation of the bet. And they can not prove that they sent this email since they did not send it.

    Those points 1 and 2 are not surprising. It is just dishonest, and a lot of books do as well. That is why point 3 is very important.

    3. It is not a line error. Please go on Oddsportal site: http://www.oddsportal.com/basketball...3#ah;1;-6.50;0
    As I can prove with the email I received, my bet was accepted at 7:04 pm with price 1.85
    And as you can see on Oddsportal, Pinnacle opened this market with price 2.29
    At 7:05 pm, one minute after I placed my bet on Goldenvegas, Pinnacle price was 1.68
    Other examples: 188bet 1.79 at 6:50 pm, Asianodds 1.68 at 7:07 pm, Bwin 1.75 at 7:16 pm, Betonline 1.85 (same than Goldenvegas) at 6:43 pm.
    With Pinnacle, we can clearly see the beginning of the price decrease at 6:43 pm (from 1.92 to 1.81). From 6:43 pm to 7:04 pm when I placed my bet, Goldenvegas traders were sleeping.
    This explains their small delay for the adjustement of the price.
    But it was just a small delay, not a gross line error with price 3 or 4 for example.
    Bookmakers can not void bets simply because lines/prices moved after the placement of a bet and they were sleeping at that moment !
    They want to punish me for their incapacity to supervise the markets ?
    It is clearly a steal. And when they say "it was a line error", it is unfair, it is a lie.
    The screenshot I took from Oddsportal clearly proves the price I placed my bet with Goldenvegas was totally correct at the moment I placed it. The fact is there was the start of a movement of price at that moment and they were not fast enough to adjust their line with Pinnacle for example, that is as simple as that.
    My bet is completely valid, it must be paid.
    It seems that I can not add screenshots in my post. But I will post complaint on SBR and I will of course forward these screenshots to SBR team so that they can observe that indeed there was no line error at all and I hope they can contact then goldenvegas to fix the issue. Normally Goldenvegas is quite a reliable bookmaker, they are regulated by the "Commission des jeux de hasard belge", so I think they should accept to admit the truth and pay me if SBR contacts them.
    Please help me.

  2. #2
    relaaxx
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    file a complaint here at SBR
    Last edited by relaaxx; 10-07-17 at 08:33 AM.

  3. #3
    Alfa1234
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    You were chasing steam and beat them by a few seconds... (Betconstruct bookie). While I don't agree with anyone voiding a bet after it's placed and confirmed, the line movement was huge and you knew exactly what you were doing when you bet the line. Goldenvegas is always just a few seconds (15 to 20) behind the Pinnacle move, as are all Betconstruct bookmakers. Betconstruct is known to void bets like this every now and then...and there is nothing you can do to change their mind if Goldenvegas themselves are referring to their 'traders' (some Betconstruct bookies will actually reverse the void themselves if they are in a good mood). If you had bet only a few hundred you probably would have been fine.

    I suggest shaking it off and moving on...no point in putting a lot of energy into it as the money is gone.
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  4. #4
    Optional
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    As Alfa said above, Betconstruct are hot on steam chasers.

    Did they void it before the match started?

    If so you are probably out of luck here. If not SBR can try arguing for at least the adjusted odds to be paid out on.

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  5. #5
    Albator
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alfa1234 View Post
    You were chasing steam and beat them by a few seconds... (Betconstruct bookie). While I don't agree with anyone voiding a bet after it's placed and confirmed, the line movement was huge and you knew exactly what you were doing when you bet the line. Goldenvegas is always just a few seconds (15 to 20) behind the Pinnacle move, as are all Betconstruct bookmakers. Betconstruct is known to void bets like this every now and then...and there is nothing you can do to change their mind if Goldenvegas themselves are referring to their 'traders' (some Betconstruct bookies will actually reverse the void themselves if they are in a good mood). If you had bet only a few hundred you probably would have been fine.

    I suggest shaking it off and moving on...no point in putting a lot of energy into it as the money is gone.
    Are you sure you're not making confusion with another bookmaker called "Goldenvegas" too??Are you really talking about Goldenvegas.be, belgian bookmaker?? I've been using them for about 1 year now, and saying they are always just a few seconds (15 to 20) behind the Pinnacle move" seems quite humoristic to me! They regularly are some minutes behind the Pinnacle move! That is not rare that they need a quarter or more to adjust their lines on some markets! And as far as i'm concerned, i've been regularly using them for arbing for the last year and i never had any bet that was void/cancelled because line moved after i placed my bet! What a joke ! Lines move, that's part of the game, and bookmakers can't void bets just because a customer took them a good valuebet! Some bookmakers may do it, but that's totally unfair. Let's take an example: that is as if i bet, pre-match, cleveland odd 3.00 vs Goldenstates. Then some hours later, one learns that Stephen curry and Kevin Durant injured during training, and Cleveland odd drops to 1.8. Woud the bookmaker i used to place my bet be allowed to void my bet because i bet at odd 3 and it then decreased to 1.8?? Sometimes lines considerably move but that doesn't mean at all there was error line at the moment bet was placed. If bookmakers could void any bet simply because there was a move of line then , one couldn't leave computer after placing a bet , one would have to stay in front of computer 24/24 to be sure bet was not cancelled ..Let's be serious..LOL
    Goldenvegas behaviour is just scandalous in the situation the customer describes. When looking at the oddsportal historic for that match one can observe line was normal at the moment he placed bet . That will make me be more careful with that bookmaker in the future. I agree on one point, that's certainly the amount of the bet that they didn't "appreciate", but that 's not a reason to void a bet that was totally normally placed and valid at the moment it was placed. Don't let things in that situation Zikko. Goldenvegas are regulated by Belgian commission, you must complain they clearly try to abuse you.
    Last edited by Albator; 10-08-17 at 01:54 AM.

  6. #6
    lonnie55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Albator View Post
    Goldenvegas behaviour is just scandalous in the situation the customer describes. (...) That will make me be more careful with that bookmaker in the future.
    They voided my bets 3 days after the bets were graded as won.

  7. #7
    piterp
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    Quote Originally Posted by lonnie55 View Post
    They voided my bets 3 days after the bets were graded as won.
    Better withdrawn money from them its typical behavior for scam bookmakers

  8. #8
    zikko
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alfa1234 View Post
    the line movement was huge
    Are you serious ? Did you look at the history of Oddsportal ?
    Goldenvegas price: 1.85
    Pinnacle price: 1.68
    This is a "huge movement" for you ?
    And this is not the problem: bookmakers have to supervise the lines.
    That is their job. It is not my fault if they are not reactive.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alfa1234 View Post
    Goldenvegas is always just a few seconds (15 to 20) behind the Pinnacle move
    I think you are joking.
    As Albator explained, Goldenvegas offers surebets that often stay for hours.

  9. #9
    lonnie55
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    Quote Originally Posted by piterp View Post
    Better withdrawn money from them its typical behavior for scam bookmakers
    It's a year ago. My account has been limited after that. I sued them. The trial takes place in February 2018.

    I can not say much about the current proceeding but a funny thing is that their lawyers are accusing me of match-fixing because the result was unusual and therefore the sportsbook is legitimated to void bets whenever they want.

  10. #10
    piterp
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    They can tell you what they want but without evidence its only empty words

  11. #11
    zikko
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    Quote Originally Posted by Optional View Post
    As Alfa said above, Betconstruct are hot on steam chasers.

    Did they void it before the match started?

    If so you are probably out of luck here. If not SBR can try arguing for at least the adjusted odds to be paid out on.
    The problem is that I can not know when they canceled the bet since they did not send me an email. During the game, I saw that my money was returned but in my bet history the status was "open". So, impossible to know if my bet was accepted or rejected. It is a fraudulence.
    And now my bets are blocked at 0 € !
    There is 1580 € on my account but I can withdraw only 400 € because my bonus rollover is not finished.
    I can not bet and if I withdraw, I still lose 1180 €.
    It is a disaster.
    Where is my fault in this story?

  12. #12
    lonnie55
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    you have to make the rollover in the casino now

  13. #13
    zikko
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    Quote Originally Posted by lonnie55 View Post
    you have to make the rollover in the casino now
    What ????????????????????????????

  14. #14
    zikko
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    Quote Originally Posted by relaaxx View Post
    file a complaint here at SBR
    The link does not work. Where is it please ?

  15. #15
    lonnie55
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    Quote Originally Posted by zikko View Post
    What ????????????????????????????
    Well, there is always the risk to get limited before you fulfill the rollover requirements when you take a bonus. In the future you should be aware of that.

    BTW: There is virtually no sportsbook which informs the customer by e-mail when they void bets. AsianConnect does it (-> Singbet) but this is a broker.

  16. #16
    zikko
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    How do I submit a complaint please ?

  17. #17
    Alfa1234
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    Well, you're right that sometimes the lines don't move fast, but in general when we're talking about steam moves like basketball they move only a few seconds behind Pinnacle.

    They even do voids (well, Circus.be does...same odds and odd supplier) at their physical machines when you have a betting ticket printed out. There is absolutely no way to know if it has been voided without going to the machine and checking the ticket again before the game.

    I'm not sure it's legal to do that at a physical machine...have never checked but I do know other bookies honour even palp bets at these machines (even when a line is reversed or so).

    I had a bunch of golf outright bets on the Fiji open voided this way a few weeks back by circus when I bet them on a machine. They all lost so I didn't mind in the end, but you should always check your tickets even when they lose. You're correct they remain as "open" in your betlist online so it's not a big problem there. I don't think you can fight this, as it's Betconstruct that does these things.
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  18. #18
    lonnie55
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    Quote Originally Posted by zikko View Post
    How do I submit a complaint please ?
    https://www.sportsbookreview.com/sportsbook-complaint/
    Points Awarded:

    Optional gave lonnie55 2 Betpoint(s) for this post.


  19. #19
    zikko
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    Thank you.

  20. #20
    zikko
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    Quote Originally Posted by lonnie55 View Post
    Well, there is always the risk to get limited before you fulfill the rollover requirements when you take a bonus. In the future you should be aware of that.
    They can not force me to a loss of 1150 € if I ask for a withdrawal. And they can not force me to use their casino. They take back their bonus (250 €) and that's all. No ?

  21. #21
    lonnie55
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    Quote Originally Posted by zikko View Post
    And they can not force me to use their casino.
    Of course they can. If you believe that's not legal go sue them. That's the only way to find out. The Belgian Gaming Commission will not help you with that. In my case they didn't even answer one single time so I decided to contact a lawyer.

  22. #22
    Alfa1234
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    Quote Originally Posted by zikko View Post
    They can not force me to a loss of 1150 € if I ask for a withdrawal. And they can not force me to use their casino. They take back their bonus (250 €) and that's all. No ?
    You must have used the bonus money for betting...so they take back the bonus and the money you won with that bonus money.

    Go to their casino, check online which slots in their casino have a high payout rate of 98 to 99% and use those to complete the rollover.
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  23. #23
    zikko
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    This is a folly.
    I only placed an insignificant bet. Result: they owe me 1343 and now I can still lose 1180 . I repeat: where is my fault ?

  24. #24
    lonnie55
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    Quote Originally Posted by zikko View Post
    This is a folly.
    I only placed an insignificant bet. Result: they owe me 1343 € and now I can still lose 1180 €. I repeat: where is my fault ?
    Alfa1234 has already answered this question.

  25. #25
    zikko
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    Quote Originally Posted by lonnie55 View Post
    Alfa1234 has already answered this question.
    You mean I have to play on their casino ?

  26. #26
    Alfa1234
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    Yes. As I said above, check their slots and then search online for the payout rates they give. If you have to roll over another 5 or 6k and find a slot with a payout of 98%, you should only lose 120€ or so in the process.
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  27. #27
    Optional
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    Quote Originally Posted by zikko View Post

    The problem is that I can not know when they canceled the bet since they did not send me an email. During the game, I saw that my money was returned but in my bet history the status was "open". So, impossible to know if my bet was accepted or rejected. It is a fraudulence.
    And now my bets are blocked at 0 € !
    There is 1580 € on my account but I can withdraw only 400 € because my bonus rollover is not finished.
    I can not bet and if I withdraw, I still lose 1180 €.
    It is a disaster.
    Where is my fault in this story?
    You're not at fault :\

    This operator just knows well how to use their rules to beat you.

    Hopefully an SBR dispute agent can get somewhere for you but Lonnie and Alfa have extensive experience wit books from this group and their advice will probably turn out to be the only/best way to get the hell out of there with most of your money.

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  28. #28
    zikko
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    Quote Originally Posted by Optional View Post
    You're not at fault :\

    This operator just knows well how to use their rules to beat you.

    Hopefully an SBR dispute agent can get somewhere for you but Lonnie and Alfa have extensive experience wit books from this group and their advice will probably turn out to be the only/best way to get the hell out of there with most of your money.
    Thank you for your reply, I have a little hope now.
    But they did not beat me. I beat them. And easily. Too easily, and that is why they did not appreciate. I was faster than them, it is simple this history. But if they have the right to cancel a bet when a prize moves a bit, then yes they beat me and they will always beat me. But, winning by cheating is not winning, right ?
    So I beat them, even if they steal all my money !
    Points Awarded:

    Optional gave zikko 2 Betpoint(s) for this post.


  29. #29
    Optional
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    Yes Zikko. You did win. You were too smart for them and they use this to stop you. Frustrating and sad but listen to guys like Lonnie and Alfa, they know how to play the game so these books don't prevail over them.

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  30. #30
    zikko
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    I have to point out that Goldenvegas has restored my normal betting limits. This is a good news and this proves that they can be understanding.
    Now, I hope they will pay my bet unfairly canceled ...

  31. #31
    zikko
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    Quote Originally Posted by Optional View Post
    This operator just knows well how to use their rules to beat you.
    This is the problem. The rules are there, okay.
    But here, what rule can justify to cancel a bet at a price of 1.85 when the market average is 1.70 ? So now they will cancel all my bets when there will be a small price move ?

  32. #32
    Alfa1234
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    Surely you see the difference between betting something seconds before the price changes and doing this consistently (I presume this is not the first time you bet a steam move) and having an edge on the closing price? It's their way to discourage arbers from betting there.

    There is no point in arguing here...they will not change their ways and we all agreed it's not right.
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  33. #33
    sheepgotwool
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    Any bitcoin books that have the betconstruct lines ? If you are in USA cannot bet with this book.

  34. #34
    piterp
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    Its very popular way from scam bookmakers to make money from players -offer better odds than another to attract people if player lose they make profit if player won they avoid bet because of arbing so in simple words they all always winners.

  35. #35
    dealer wins
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    And all these "arbing guide" sites make it sound so simple lol

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